T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Avieta: 'do we really have free will?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yawn' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Amorok turns cowlike eyes on you, chews his cud, and moos plaintively. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts is looking for a coward. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari raises his hand. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what's new?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not much, western media getting all uppity at Russia troops in Crimea' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'same old hypocritical fake offence-taking' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'russia... They doing what people with guns are sapposed to be doing' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what might that be?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'shooting people? or starting wars?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'i dont know? Starting wars? ' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no war has started, no violence has been had' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'no war? Crap....' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'sorry, i don't read much world news, national news is messed up already. what happened?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Ukrainean protests, their president sent packing and a pro-EU government containing many fascists and bankers has been instated. Russia already had military bases in Crimea where the population is predominantly Russian, which used to be part of Russia until 1957, have quietly taken over most of the infrastructure there and is digging in' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'thanks.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't think there's any blame here - if the people of west/central ukraine rise up against their government out-of-band, then it cannot be fair that other governments recognise that transition as legitimate and not at the same time respect the wishes of Crimeans to want an alternative arrangement' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'why are we manufacturing weapons if we talk keep saying "were at peace"? Are we preparing for WWIII or another war of some sort?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who is manufacturing weapons?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'because we're paranoid and cynical.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you mean the US, it has been in a permanent state of emergency since the 1970s' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Weapons are needed to defend against terrorists (= Ron Paul, conservatives, libertarians, christians, constitutionalists)' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'oh, and veterans, of course' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might want to read up on what a state of emergency allows the federal government to do which it couldn't do otherwise' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we all know how violent that christian faith is, Tinada' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada nods. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'so*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who how unlawful and criminal those people who believe in the constitution are' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'devil-worshippers, the lot of them' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so what?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'christians are not so dangerous anymore' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'really?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'no... not the ones i see... its the extreamists we must be keep watching' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, you don't understand, all those groups tinada mentioned ARE the extremists, terrorists to be watched and victimised' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not our opinion, that is the intelligence of your government' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you must remember, the first priority of government security/intelligence apparatus is NOT to protect the population, but to preserve/insure/expand the power of the government' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'never mind if the people need it, will it keep them in power?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'blatantly obvious, at least on my end.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not sure about all countries.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's true in many western countries, though many don't have the american tradition so such strong overt measures aren't necessary' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the important part of the process is to get as many of the public as possible dependant upon government to live' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'in the end even the best systems fall to human flaws.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what was meant to give power to the people is still in the end twisted to other ends.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'do we realy need the goverment?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, amorok' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'even in a small group there is a leader.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'whereever you have a population large enough that they interact, you need some sort of governance to arbitrate between them' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'see the social contract.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'otherwise there will be chaos as the people fight amongst themselves for their own benefit.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'You're in charge of an independant nation. Do you side with Russia or Ukraine?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'neither.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'Justify?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: '1/5 of Ukraine sides with Russia..' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'best to steer clear of these problems.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'as being dragged into them doesn't tend to bring good results to the nation.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Since I'm generally on the side of rights to self-determination, I'd have so support an orderly breakup if that's what people want' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i think that if Crimea itself has a majority that wants to leave ukraine, i'd say go for it.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'as otherwise would only incite hatred amongst people who don't want to be a part of the group, and causes later problems.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'Hm. You've rendered the devil's advocate thing pretty moot. Do you think Russia will be happy with just Crimea?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: '"happy"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the idea is that i won't participate, but my personal opinion is for the people's majority.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'a country ought not be ruined by a single man's personal opinion.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'Mm. I get that. A nice meeting with tea where Crimea votes to become part of Russia and the rest get to join the EU would be the best thing to happen. It seems as if Russia's threatening more, and thus virtually every other country seems to feel like they need to dust their guns off, though.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'You ever look around at the people around you and go 'Wow. Stuff would be so much better if we were the world's leaders'?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'Not since I was in High School' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'no, for power will corrupt me, i refuse to lead a nation when i know i can be corrupted.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'when a country should never be governed by a singular person, nor a group of similar people ' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the Crimean people should decide Crimea's fate.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'Meh. I dunno you, but I find it hard to believe that every sensible person would power mad and then not see a terrible decision when it came up.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'neighbours may mix their communities but that doesn't mean that the state must be divided. russia is a bully, always been. and they will continue acting that way if they are allowed to.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'if you're talking about the idea that Russia will never settle for otherwise. i'm sorry, i speak ideals, for that is what you are asking for, what i would ideally hope for.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'No, it's fine. It's still interesting to hear.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'Hwuai, a large majority of the Crimean Pennisula is virtually Russian.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'sometimes i think politicians are more interested in being re-elected and having more authority than they are interested in working for the people that elected them' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'and by sometimes, i mean "100% of the time)' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'time"*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'acknowledged.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'im not an expert of ukraine's history. now is the time to look into it i guess. cant say anything now:p' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it's very much so, because to be elected, they nominate themselves, it's not about the cointries future, rather the thirst for power.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'ukraine was gifted crimea some 40? 50? years ago' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'debate Err.. '54, it was turned over.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'which begs the question, what was it originally? whose right? i think that if you look back long enough, all the world was undivided, so no one has rights to anything cause they owned it first, unless stipulated in original agreement.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'for instance Taiwan.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'we should really just give 1/3 of asia back to mongolia, amirite?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'meh.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aweyn: 'I have to go, actually. Thanks for saying things at me. do pobachennya' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what about Babylon and alexander.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'see you.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'well, crimea was more or less independant from ukraine anyway. now russia is taking it. simple' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'should russia take it cause it's independent from Ukraine? What gives them the right?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'and the ethnic russians are like 54%. wikipedia:p. so, its not enough' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'what's a similarity here? unrest in china leads to british forces to show up in hong kong?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'similarity between?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'firstly, ethicnity is hard to define.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'trying to think of a situation similar to the one we're discussing, so parrallels could be drawn' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'secondly, wikipedia doesn't always show accurate/up-to-date info.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'I thought wikipedias word was gold' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not entirely, best to look for multiple sources.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: '54% russians doesnt mean they all agree being a part of russia. might be 30%.. or something. who knows?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'are you suggesting that crimea, which was gifted to Ukraine with no say in the matter, should not be reacquired by russia while ukraine is in collapse?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'i know, jopari' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'i used ":p"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'just because there are (probably) 54% of russians doesn't mean the other 46% completely disagrees either.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'this isn't exactly something you stop and run a gallop poll on...' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'scars, honestly, i think it's up to Crimea, Russia should not force temptation onto weak people.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it's akin to the devil.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'are you certain crimea didn't request it?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'thats what sucks. but russia is a bully. and if they LET them do that, there will be no end' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'all nations with power are bullies to nations without power, that's how it works anymore' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i wouldn't be sure, since i don't pay a lot of attention to world news, laughing to hard at national news.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'true scars' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'that's how it's been since the dawn of mankind Scars.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'example... america sides with rebel forces in syria... we tempt syrian rebels to continue' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'that's for personal profit really, America got it's fortune through war.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the question is somewhat a matter of "should" a nation with power offer up assistance to the side they want to win? and that answer is purely a matter of perspective' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'spin it however you want *shrug* ... doesn't change the story, really' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'while pondering...don't forget to realize that during the American Revolution we had people come to our aid' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'spinning it? you're the one who said it's a matter of perspective.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'because they didn't like Britain, yeah.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'doesn't change the fact' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'without the french fighting the brits back in europe, and without the germans training and supplying our troops in north america... there's zero chance we win that war' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'but why did the germans help? we paid them.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'why did the french help? they hated the brits.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'are those good reasons? depends on perspective.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i pretty much emphasized that it's a matter of choice among the populace of Crimea, how that managed to spin things is beyond me.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'there you go with perspective again.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'in a sense, everything is true.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'i missed 'the perspective' part' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'how do you propose we get a feel for what the crimean populace wants?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'how? that depends.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'do you not think there would be consequences for choosing one side over another?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'do you suggest we defer to the crimean government... since i'm sure those politicians would be interested in representing their people and not self preservation' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'there would of course be, but then you're asking which side they should be on?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i don't know what side they *should* be on' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'you don't know, i know that, but you are asking right?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'defer to the government, dubious choice at best.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i'm asking you how we are to find out what they want, since you think it's their choice, how should they articulate that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i could say door to door questioning, i could say polls, and the hundreds of methods in between. but i'm not going to, because i'm talking about an ideal, which is impossible to obtain.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'door to door answers could be changed, polls could be rigged, etc, etc,etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'ah, i guess i didn't realize we were just pondering shit for the hell of it ... i think we were discussing current events and our opinions as to what pragmatic and realistic solutions should be on the table' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'each solution contains another problem.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'my fault :) carry on' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i thought***' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'nuke them from orbit then shoot anything that moves (they will glow in the dark at that point so easy to see).' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'mob rule and uninformed decision making as always be the ideal way to solve problems' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'pragmatic and realisticly, i say let them duke it out, it'll go either way.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'so we want to ignore america's interests in having russia v ukraine win that fight?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'correction: it'll go russia's way if no one intervenes.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'why do we care honestly?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'natural gas prices?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari shrugs helplessly. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'we, as in america, or we, as in western europe?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'we as in america' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'then i got no say in this.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I know why europe could care' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but not why the US should be the heavy handed world cop for europe's interest' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'america cares both because of europe and russia....friend v foe' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'usually shit like this is explained by something like "we need to help serve the interests of our allies, for that's the interests of america"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nod' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'ukraine is hardly our friend' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'western europe cares, therefore america cares' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's not ukraine who's the friend...it's europe' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'although that relationship isn't exactly reciprocated' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if the EU wants to have it's way then the EU should do something about it' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'EU lacks military force, would have to turn to NATO' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'or the UN' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'EU lacks military force?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'and america == NATO, UN' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'UN has no soldiers of it's own.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'EU has something like 10 times as much military force as all of europe did when it launched world war 2' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'and the aftermath?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'there was a RIF.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'just because the US has more military force than the next 16 countries combined does not mean that noone else has any military' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the EU military is effectively a gentlemen's agreement of EU nations to work together... which ahs yet to be tested' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i'm not saying europe has no military, i'm saying the entity that is the European Union has yet to call it's military up to work on something' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'thats not true the EU has sent military to several places (granted not in the numbers it would take to intervene in the Ukraine issue.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'can you point to one where the EU banner was taken? i'm not finding one very quickly' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I don't see this being resolved militarily' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'according to the interwebs there have been 34 to date' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'found a wiki link on it, we're seeing the same thing... my fault then' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'money is the root of the problem' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'http://www.csdpmap.eu/mission-chart' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'if europe wants america's help, they'll pull some NATO shit on this' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'of course none of those are on the scale that ukraine would be' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'how so?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is some argument to be made that if EU went into ukraine it would start WWIII' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'then UN would supposedly step in before that step was taken.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'i'm not nec comparing them...but it is reminiscent of Hitler's first move.......and no...I don't think Putin is Hitler and this is the start of WWIII' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the UN is a waste of goddamn time and money imo' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'true story.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'as a cynic i would agree.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it's hard enough to get two different races to get along well.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'getting two religions to get along isn't exactly a cake walk' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it hasn't succeded yet.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'America has been at war for 13 years... i participated personally in 4 years of that... i really, really hope that IF something crazy happens in Ukraine... we let Europe figure it out' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not to mention splinter religions.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'but i know better...' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'my guess is if europe tries to do something the US will end up having to clean it up in a year or two' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's what I mean when I don't think it'll be resolved militarily.....I can't see us at the moment (USA) putting fighting troops on the ground there' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'they want to make it known their heavyweights.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'all we need to do is choose who we want to win, and then show up and kill the other guys' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that all scars?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'they're not their please' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'they're*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'doesn't always happen that way, remember Vietnam?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'sorry emm, i made a slight typo.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'you realize that the reason we "lost" vietnam was because of events in america, not in vietnam?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not sure that's entirely true either' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'but the events in america were because of Vietnam' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'vietnam was incredibly complicated scars' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'to say it was because of events in america is to grossly oversimplify the world political situation' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the events in america caused public support for the war to completely die off, and the politicians acted in self preservation and ordered the troops to fully withdraw' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'hippie movement, national guard killing some college kids, etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and the fact that the various forces arrayed against "us" in north vietnam made the "war" a much less one-sided victory walk certainly had something to do with it.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'but there's no gaurantee that we would have 'won' even if events in America hadn't existed' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'none of that was the enemy beating america, it was america beating america' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari is agreeing with that Creestux person again... T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'wars of attritution do not guarantee victory....we learned that in Vietnam' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the reason america fought america was because the war was getting drawn out and people were sent home in coffins or not at all.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'we lost more people in just the european theatre of ww2 than we did in all of vietnam' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'guerilla warfare was especially proven there.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'yet we still decided to see that war through to the end because it didn't take as long' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'yes but Vietnam was not WWII' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and because it had greater consequences' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'WW2 had more at stake' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'comparing the two is apples and oranges in the scope' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'valid point in regards to support though' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'undeerstand what mean' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'what i'm pointing to is the human loss... vietnam did not cost us nearly as many lives as ww2 in just the european theatre... and the vietnam took place over a much longer period of time' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there was a much bigger war propaganda machine for WW2 as well' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'had ww2 had embedded journalists showing carnage at night every day... showing people d-day invasion horror at 8pm news... then what?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'scars, the Vietnam war is not at a sufficient scale to campare to WW2' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'war propoganda gets the public to look away from young men crying out for their moms, missing limbs... and look to "battle of the blah" was won! america presses forward!' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'well...didn't get the carnage of the vietnam war that was shown....that's when the media truly became part...Korea to an extent before that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the stakes were different, the people saw the war as a waste of time.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the vietnam war was not intially unpopular' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it became so when they realised it wasn't their war and that they're soldiers were dying at a high rate compared to the Vietkong proportionately' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'sorry emm their*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...and as you mentioned...guerilla warfare changed the landscape' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'in WW2, why did america go to europe? the war in the pacific was ours... the japanese attacked us, we fought back (and then some...)' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'exactly, superior tactics needled the opposition beyond what they were willing to lose.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'was the european theatre really "america's war" ?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's a debatable question....lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'because "holy shit, they're taking over ALL of Europe", and what would be next?...which is a lot easier to support than "Let's help these poor south vietnamese from the danger to the north"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'Should Germany have won, they'd have proceeded to attack America.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'we now know that Hitler had interests in America' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'self-preservation ran rampant ' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'so if the domino theory had been correct, would it have taken until indonesia to justify american intervention?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'but I'd go with the answer of money' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nothing gets people involved like money' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'or the loss thereof' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'honestly, vietnam wasn't intending world domination.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'vietnam was all about the cold war' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'domino theory suggested thta communism would continue to spread throughout SE asia if vietnam fell to it' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'fight of communism' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'right creestux' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'therefore, they felt threatened, but in the end the people didn't see it as a war against communism' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'if communism had spread, due largely to chinese influence at the time, to SE asia... and the domino theory had been correct, at what point does america step in? would it ever be appropriate?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'so that would justify to the citizens that their children ought to die in mass numbers proportionate to the Vietcong?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'to prevent it from growing/spreading to our shores, yes' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there's no question about that...scars is just asking "when?"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Scars nods at you in agreement. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'complicated....it's more than the idea of communism at that point....it's about the nukes......had nuclear weapons not been introduced into the picture we may not have had a lot of 'fight' in us to address communism like we did' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'teh answer at the time... "when" = Vietnam' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i'm asking what your answer hypothetically would have been' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'Vietnam? Laos? Singapore? Thailand? Indonesia? Australia?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'India?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the fact that the USSR cld introduce nuclear weapons into a friendly communist country is ultimately why we railed against communism' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'hypothetically, it would have been difficult to conclude a time, but i would wonder why a talk on comparing ww2 to vietnam, which stemmed somewhere else, is now branching off into an unrelated direction' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'we seem to have gone way off topic.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i brought up ww2 to demonstrate how the human cost of a war can be ignored/accepted' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nature of the beast' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'we didn't lose as many people in vietnam as many seem to think' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'what unrelated direction? hes's showing that the response of "WW2 is way different in scope to vietnam" isn't necessarily the case' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'communism was brought up re vietnam' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'right, then it was said that europe had better justification' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'and i'm saying that fighting communism was, at the time anyway, valid justification' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it did have better justification, simply because the question of "when" didn't happen to come up after we pulled out' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'alright i need to draw a branching of the debate on a piece of paper, clear my head.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if they steamrolled south vietnam and kept going, then we'd seriously reconsider' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'too late Jopari...you've lost your seat at the UN' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'whereas Germany DID steamroll France and was about to get England to surrender' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari falls down laughing. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's even worse than you think, jopari...it also branched into immtalk totally separately' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the french were fighting the vietnam war before america did' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'm guessing because both channels are default red' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'wait, how would vietnam fall cause communism to conquer the world again?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'sorry then' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'momentum' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'elaborate.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if they decided to keep going, which was the big fear' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'same as in korean war' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'paranoid Americans to a degree' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'why was vietnam trying to go communist -> chinese influence' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and in lots of almost-wars since' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'no, how would the momentum carry, what would the momentum be?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'just that another country 'falls' to ....' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'who's next?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it could've gone the way of Germany in WW2...what was the momentum with every country he conquered?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'that communism was better? that a country turned because of China' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'success begets success? fewer resources spent nation-building in one country means you have more resources to nation-build the next' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'military might, alarming effectiveness in his military endaevors.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods...it was a 'ours is betters' vs them situation' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'then i fail to see how winning a fight shows that there are less resources spent nation building.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'but then you throw the threat of nuclear weapons on top of that and it grows' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and being able to concentrate that military in particular spots and no longer have to worry about other spots' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'at which point, the citizens refuse to serve the governments's ego' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's sometimes easier said than done when dealing with communism' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the individual lacks resources' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'thereby showing a reason why the vietnam war was stopped by the populace' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and the USSR military of the time rivalled WW2 Germany's in effectiveness' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'but it wasn't just an individual.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'who recieved resources from outside' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'elaborate, i don't quite get it, Abelinc.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'Let's put it this way...have you ever played Risk?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'good game' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not really.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I guess we know where scars went' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'but i know the concept.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it demonstrates this quite clearly...as has every major power that has come and gone in the past 6,000 years' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: ';)' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'Creestux, where?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the gq win' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'ahh' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'was referring to...' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nod' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'as the roman empire took over one spot, they used conscription to make their might greater, to reduce the now-homeland opposition' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'sorry, Abelinc, stuck here.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'as Napoleon did the same, the same outcome' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'all of this stemmed from the ukraine situation... so i'm gonig to bring this full circle and say that Ukraine will probably cause EU v Russia war' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I'm guessing we'll just see a lot of sanctitions and the like' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'so there will be a war with ukraine then?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sorry, not sure how much differently I can describe the repeated history of the entire world and how it could have played out exactly the same way :P' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'a war over ukraine, not necessarily with ukraine' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'which may or may not grow into WW2' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'ww3*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'alright, i get it Abelinc.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'well that was a very roundabout way to do prove the point.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'as I said earlier, it is reminescent of Hitler.....large population of supporters who identify with Russia....use to be part of....etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'gah, i need to gain wisdom, what do you mean Creestux?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, ukraine should've done this back when Georgia was having their thing' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'was referring to part of Czech...sudentland or however you spell it' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'large German populace' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'ahh, i get it, thanks.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's obviously more involved than that lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'but at least i understand the concept.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'essentially....shld be part of Germany because of ancestry/populace etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'ancesry is dubious, as it depends how far you look.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'true true' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'history has often been bent for personal gain.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'here it's even worse.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but it's how the people identify themselves, not really that you can just point them to ancestry.com and say "See? You're really this over here"' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'our government kinda rewrites history.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods...it become as much cultural as anything else' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i could argue that you were once african, since scientific studies suggest that mankind started in africa.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'careful now....lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'gotta do a whole propaganda campaign "Hey, remember how badly you were treated by xxx?", and some people will remember being treated badly even if they weren't, etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'that's about right.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'thereby disenfranchising them from the party you don't like' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: ''we faught the nazis'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'we is 'we'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'doh...who is 'we'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari grins evilly. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: ''we' are us.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'they are them?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'clearly' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'indeed' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'oversimplification, which a lot of people will take.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'since no one likes complicated stuff' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'too bad we can't live in the now, as that's problematic too.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not to start a whole political mess...try to avoid the actually 'politics' of it...but i've heard people complaining about Obama already....I'm not saying those are warranted or unwarranted....leaving politics out of it....what would you have our President do?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I don't think anyone wants troops on the ground' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not at liberty to say, don't know about american politics too much.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i've heard bad things about him, but hearsay is never reliable' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's tricky....America and our politics....' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the only person who wants troops on the ground is the guy that has never been in battle.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'most times your damned if you do and damned if you don't' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'most soldier will attest that they don't want to fight another war.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I was just curious....seems like people like to complain about things more than anything else' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'of course, human nature to complain' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'didn't know what viable options people were behind....again, wasn't making politics the subject but rather the recourse' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'this could've been done better, that was the wrong choice.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'etc,etc,etc.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I understand Russia's concern' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and perhaps we're misreading the intent' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'in a sense, everything is true' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'quote (the dictionary of bullshit)' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'anyone know how much money Russia has actually handed over? not pledged but actually given' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'handed over to Ukraine that is' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'where's abelinc and scars?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'other channel probably' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i honestly wouldn't know.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'and i don't trust wikipedia.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'same...I'll have to go looking at some point' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'wiki prob ok starting point....they've gotten better imo' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'got to follow on from there though' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'wiki's always been fine for what it is, a tying-together resource...just gotta follow the citations [27]' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'rofl re 27' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'indeed' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I agree....it gets some undue criticism' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's not a primary source, but it's often the best place to GET a primary source' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'oh well, i guess i'll google, wiki and read up on some news' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods....usually general knowledge that you branch from' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'saw where they were asking about opinions for paying editors the other day' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not sure how I feel about that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'paying editors?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not sure i'd like that, who is to say the editor hasn't personal agendas, then again, everyone who edits it has a personal agenda, meh, leave it.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods...it's double edged' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can never get rid of agendas out of publications, wwhether media, political, or scientific' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I agree to an extent' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'keeping it minimal is the goal....not sure how money would influence that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'we're all biased as individuals, the best way to organizationally combat it is to attempt to not have one bias outweigh another' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'or you can try to make your beliefs as explicit as possible and argue in favour of them, then switch and argue against etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'for on-staff editors, the question is whether those editors are just devoting more time to the effort, or whether they have more pull in what gets put in' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'playing devil's advocate is always good' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'after 3-4 switches I don't really care anymore..' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari raises an eyebrow. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you don't care about the discussion in particular, but you still have a personal bias...' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'subconscious, since machines can't edit stuff...yet' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Completely eliminating bias is not a practical goal, but you can minimize it by switching back and forth and trying to step outside your method' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'for discissions like here, I'll usually just start out being on the side of whatever comment I find most interesting that catches my eye' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'that's about as good as it gets' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'common sense isn't so common anymore imo' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: '..and rather better than your typical scientist' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I will never talk about my politics/religious beliefs, merely about politics and religious beliefs' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'good rule....you're never suppose to talk about either in 'polite company'.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'm never in polite company :P' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'ditto' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'surely in the US you can talk about your opinions as long as they are PC opinions..' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'we don't care if pc or not' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'meh, i just need to make sure i can't be traced when i say it.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and we'll actually argue about that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'we do like to argue' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'this is the debate channel.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'Americans' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'that reminds me I was going to make a list of conventional wisdom/political correctness' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'the majority is always wrong, after all' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'This isn't the debate room, this is the insult room!' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'meh, i need to finish my chemistry or die tommorrow, see you all.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada comforts Jopari. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'just exactly what kind of project you got going there? Should we call national security?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Arnica hopes Jopari knows how to waft T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i am still in school, NSA can rest assured.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'DEA? cooking meth?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'Sarah Palin: 'I told you so on Ukraine'.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i must confess, i've always wondered how it feels to get high.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'crickets' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'complaining about obama on grounds of what?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's so much to complain about, was interested to know what about' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'reaction' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'how would people have him respond' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'to what?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'ukraine' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that's quite easy' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'saw pple complaing already' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...but didn't want to get all political....wondered what pple considered options' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'big business/gop will want him to throw nukes, libertarians and proper thinkers will want him to stay out, democrats will want him to open the brders' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...and there's the politics I was trying to avoid' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he's the president, please tell me how he is going to avoid the politics' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or are you asking, what SHOULD he do?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'He should consult the Grays' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'phone' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'sec' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you're asking what he SHOULD do in the interests of the US, Ukraine, and the wider world (in that order) then i'd say (other than NOT spending 5 billion dollars over the last 20 years trying to ferment regime change there) get out, stay the fuck out, and leave it alone - possibly side wit Russia with splitting off Crimea as part of a permanent settlement' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'then we have something akin to england with the vikings, permanent, yeah right.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'permanentish' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'crimea was russian and is ethnically still russian' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'bak' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the gift that keeps on giving' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'yes he's our President and thus it is inherently political....but that doesn't mean you have to bring the political party fighting and pointing into the discussion of what options should be on the table' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'as I said before, American politics is becoming more and more 'damned if you do, damned if you don't'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'never going to make 100 percent of the people happy though....I understand this' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and yes Crimea was Russia.....but Russia gave it away' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'is it free season to take back what you've given away?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'history depends on perspective, namely how far you look back.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'get that chemistry homework done!' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Creestux prods Jopari into action! T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'couple of calcs, yeah, i guess i am.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'are we still discussing ukraine.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: '?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'hello?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'hello?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what's going on?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'shrug....was afk' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'meh.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i see tha channel is back to normal.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it works in spurts' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'this is where i get most my general knowledge.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that is not good......lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'on other countries at least, since we have so many varying opinions.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'ah....follow' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'current events come up a lot' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'my own national news i can easily note, world news, not so much.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'ah' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'besides, national news leaves me too angered or laughing to continue' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's not uncommon anywhere I imagine' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what's new on your side?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'are you procrastinating by any chance?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Creestux grins evilly. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'hmm, let me check the dictionary, and i'll get back to you.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'not really, what would i delay?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'you may what to on that one .... i'm jesting of course' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'chem?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not 'dieing tomorrow'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the exams the week after, i'll freeze jopari' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'ah..lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...but then you'll have to play with your alt' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'no alt, i get frustrated when i press kob and nothing happens.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari grins evilly. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'dying tommorow is with chem homework, which is bloody tedious.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's what I thought you were logging for' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'calc, calc, calc, ooh, periodic table, calc.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'you thought right.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'you'll use that a lot in life' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol...actually you might but...' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'meh, depends on my ambition, and how deep i need to know.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods....tis why I said 'actually'' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'fact is you might....but majority don't' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'hah, i remember reading national news and coming across an article that said they were revising exams to allow more thought processes.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'yep' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i saw they're questions, absolutely no thinking required, nothing required, and i just happened to be the last year of student to use the original exams.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'their*' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'was going to say something related a minute ago.....while you might not use the info, doing the processes and understanding is just as important' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari sighs. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the process itself' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'you're right, understanding is useful in education' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'but our education system is based on remembering, and now, no thinking is really required, nor knowledge.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'probably a reaction to all the 'teaching for the test' debate going on' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the next generation is screwed.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'you hope it's the NEXT one' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Creestux ducks defensively. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'true, i've heard it said i'm the generation.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol ....you'll be fine' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'time goes on' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'my gen is the one with higher suicide rates, and thos who're disconnected from reality.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'time shall pass, and life will go on.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not saying it's not higher but have to also remember that we're in a 24/7 news era......everything is made news now including those suicides....wasn't always the case though' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'when did we start keeping records.....where they all reported....etc' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'heh, true, but we now have problems with internet addiction.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'again, not saying it's not higher....i expect it to be higher just based on our fast paced world compared to the past' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'people need to slow down' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'the greatest problem today is that science collects knowledge faster than society collects wisdom.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there's some truth to that for sure' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'can't remember who said that, but true.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I get so aggrevated over the state of education in the US' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what's it like?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'really not sure anymore' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'as to the actual classes/classroom' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'been a while....but what should be common accepted knowledge isn't always' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'earth is flat test?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'perhaps' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's just disheartening' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'frustrating as well' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i've seen news on seriel killers who have absolutely no remorse and kill for 'fun'.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'sociopaths' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'education is what brings society to become human, not simply knowledge.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i remember debating a topic on violent video games yesterday.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'like aardwolf?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'in school, debate society.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'missed that' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'violent video games ......aardwolf...was a joke' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari grins evilly. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari falls down laughing. T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Purple HazeKnight: 'What on earth are you two debating exactly?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'nothing, just kinda talking.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'education, sociopaths, next generation, etc.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'you have a topic?' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'didn't want to leave J talking to himself' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'first sign of madness.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's when you start answering yourself' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i think i honestly would.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'eh....madness is all relative' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'talking to ones self is the only guarantee of a sensible answer' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'true in a sense, but talking to others is the only way to get newaterial and gather philosophies and convincing arguments.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol...at least perceived' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '..and therein lies the madness' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'just because a thousand peopke have the same vices doesn't make them virtues.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'vice versa though' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thus you discover the flaw in true democracy' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'true.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'no, i discover the flaw in all mankind's machinations.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Purple HazeKnight: 'No, the only flaw in mankind's machinations is refusing to take responsibility for an action' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'for the vices and perception of madness leads us to always destroy that which was meant to help.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'depends on what those actions are' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i doubt it's the only one.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'mankind's machinations are many, and all share flaws in design or implementation.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'well, i can call that attempt to start debate as failed.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i think i'll go to sleep now, it's 2a.m. night.' T3/r7/2014-03-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lats' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so, western media accuses Russia of "invading" Crimea' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and then came the threats of sanctions, quickly backpedalled by the UK government when they figured out it would hurt them more than the Ruskies' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'this was actually predicted by that know-nothing Sarah Palin before Obama won the presidency.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what was, Ukraine breakup?' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Russia invading Ukraine.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Democrats said it wouldn't happen, it was too far-fetched.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's because democrats on the whole are retarded' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they also said unchecked immigration would benefit the country and that obamacare wouldn't raise your premiums. They said you could keep your plan and your doctor' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they also think that you can reduce pollution by closing down tightly regulated coal power stations in the USA and instead import the energy from Mexico where coal power stations are less regulated' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they also think the constitution is something that only applies when it's convenient for them' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and they're lame' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'did you hear how the finance experts are panicking over stocks again? They're trying to sell the idea that we're heading to another great depression.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well stock panic benefits one class of people - stockbrokers/hedge fund managers' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'well, technically not another GD, but they claim what we saw a few years ago isn't over nor is it the worst we'll see.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'stock markets are priced in local currency, so while you keep printing money and devaluing the dollar, so the stock market will remain buoyant' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'upwards of 50% loss of wealth for the average person.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doesn't mean stocks are worth any more in real terms' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'from what? a crash?' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'yeah, they're scared we'll become a bigger Greece or Nigeria.' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you will, eventually, but you'll be among the last to go' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there'll probably be world wars before you need to worry about that' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though you might just have open rebellion before either of those two' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'anyone under the age of 40 who doesn't already have land in the countryside has no future already' T3/r7/2014-03-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not worth worrying about much after that' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'any predictions on how everything will play out in ukrain?' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vost: 'I am sure that Tigernuts knows' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, crash tests have shown that external air bags reduce damage to vehicles by up to 35 %.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lyrion: 'Does anyone here live in Russia? If so, I genuinely want to learn how the whole Ukraine situation is seen from the point of view of the average Russian.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i see the media is still hyping the indefensibly hypocritical stance nato is taking over Crimea' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in other news, England chief medical nazi demands a sugar tax' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'How come UKers do so badly at the Olympics ?' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vost: 'UK did well' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'geneology' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vost: 'the UK Olympic Committee was aiming for 3 medals' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vost: 'and won 4' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they're more concerned with who they're related to.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'winter olympics? we have no snow in winter and no mountains' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and they won 1 or 2 in the last winter olympics.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'neither does Jamaica.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and how many medals did Jamaica bag?' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Scotland has hills.....' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'exactly zero' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'generally we're too impoverished and browbeaten to have spare time and money to waste on gay winter games' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'aside from the year that Cool Running was based on, dunno. They did take a medal that year, though.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i fail to see the point, then :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'His point should have been Belarus' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'not sure they made it to Sochi on account of a lack of sponsorship, but they still had a bobsledding team.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Canada does well inthe olympics.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts says there are no mountains in Scotland, and may've insulted the Scotts wearing kilts by calling the Winter Olympics gay (loosely paraphrased)' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'South Park gay!' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they're not mountains, they're highlands.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'moonshine is getting popular again in the US....outside of the appalachian area where it has always been popular.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Texas just added a new sales tax to mixed drinks in the state, on top of the alcohol tax that is on per gallon, and the distribution tax on alcohol sales.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'a gallon of good well made 180 proof moonshine.....$100 if made from corn....$150 or more if fruit was used.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Texas intends to drive the alcohol business out of the state' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nah, the black market will take over, like with drugs.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'alcohol taxes are a major ripoff in the US.' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your alcohol taxes are neglible' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you guys always complain about how high your taxes are when in reality they're a pittance compared to much of europe' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'vote democrat again and see how high they can really go' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they* not th' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mis' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'fermented bean curd' T3/r7/2014-03-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'should the US get involved in Ukraine?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Glockster: 'sup' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mner ner' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ftse is down, dow is down. socks are up, pants are down' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'has John Kerry been on telly tonight yet running around in circles going "pbbbbtt, moomm!! Putin started it! he smells of poo!"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'think that's a week from Saturday.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he does seem to do it a lot' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he's like the USA's Kim Jong Un' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or the USA's former Iraq Information Minister under Saddam Hussein -remember him?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'How can the government deny the benefits of medical marijuana even as it holds a patent for those very same benefits?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'because just like a lightsaber or blaster gun there are far too many idiots who would do something stupid with it.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I am talking about long run effects' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'oops' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'and besides, would mari be as desirable if pain relief didn't come with a side effect of getting hi?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'of course it would, as medicine....there are 2 major chemicals in marijuana....one that dulls pain and helps you, and one that makes you high.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'hm.. honestly. every chill drug is bad. even if its completely harmless. hippies are the lowest type of human beings' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'you can reduce the thc that makes you high, and increase the other that doesnt.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baell: 'I OBJECT' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baell: '...what we talkin about?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'hippies know caps lock i see' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baell: 'i am not a hippie' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'i am. i hate myself' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'then there's the whole smoking thing. By and large those who are pro-mj and anti-tobacco still seem to think smoke inhalation is a bad thing. We could get around that by marketing a kid-friendly pot in, say, pill or gummy form.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baell: 'this thing is used more then music channem=l' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'because pot isn't bad.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baell: 'chanel*' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not sensible for kiddies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'someday we will have chewing gums and candies laced with the chemicals in marijuana, except low levels of the THC chemical that makes you high.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they have smokeless marijuana now. Not sure if it's injected or just a liquid form, though.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'You can buy foods laced with liquid marijuana right now, but it is of the normal THC marijuana plants.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i fail to see the point of contention' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they have medicinal varieties that don't get you high at all.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that's no good :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they keep getting swept up in the "misunderstanding" surrounding street pot and the types of pot that get you high.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'pretty big difference' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mind you, big difference here between street pot and decent organic strains' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that wasn't the point, Tiger. The relationship made in my comment was that mj legislation was not making the distinction between high pot and unhigh pot' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'someday when you drinkyour gatorade, it willhave marijuana chemicals in it....or your power drinks.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, hans, it's dumb, but then, it should be removed from the bad drugs list' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I really doubt even the pot enthusiasts will be willing to ever claim pot is a health food.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'i always hesitate to smoke one. i think if it helps a lot when there's a lot of stress but if its fine, then its overkill and really wasted. speaking about the high and the morning after that.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but the main point was, the US Govt owns a patent on a chemical treatment for concussions and other traumas using marijuana......and yet says there are no known medical uses for marijuana which is why it is a schedule 1 drug.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'and what about the secondhand smoke? Californians have gone absolutely bonkers over secondhand smoke, but with pot it's okay?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'second hand smoke legislation is a seriously big crock of shit' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as is the schedule 1 thing' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we all know why it's schedule 1 and it has nothing to do with harm, actual or perceived' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'you don't think there is any potential effect of second hand smoke tigernuts?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the samereason why alcohol wasbanned during prohibition, or why hemp was banned.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Follow the money.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the link is at best tenuous, certainly not worthy of the hypochondriac obsession they have with it' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are far worse things out there needing legislating, like industrial pollution of the water supply and biosphere' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but if there is any effect at all shouldn't you have to contract with everyone who will come in contact with your second hand smoke or be in violation of the non-aggression principle?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'like the dumping of rat poison in your water supply' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts speaks as though a callous chronic-polluter' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you could say the same about having bad breath, Emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I could, and I do' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or having a cold' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'smoking around non smokers should be a social faux par, the law needn't be involved' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is some question of whether having a cold is a voluntary action though' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'so you aren't a libertarian then' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Actually, the reason the govt bans smoking in public is not for your health from inhaling second hand smoke.....it has to do with control, govt wants keep making moeny from tobacco taxes, but wants to control it todeath to keep people smoking at home.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't subscribe to absolutes, Emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'either you subscribe to the non-agression principle or you don't.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i subscribe to using a bit of common sense' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'so if there was a 1 in 1000 chance of everytime you smoked in public someone would die as a result' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there isn't' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Many governors have already said in public that they hate smoking, and want it banned completely,but it makes so much money in taxes that it cant be banned, so smoking in public has to be banned to prevent kids from smoking.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'would that be enough to make it necessary for you to get permission from anyone who is exposed?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I am not saying that there is' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rizgoth speaks as though another callous polluter, attempting to spiout lies on the reasons of Government policies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'although there certainly is SOME risk' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't smoke, by the way' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, there isn't' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I just want to know what level of risk you are okay with exposing people to without their permission' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'What about e-cigs ?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I never do' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'oops' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Plain old nicotine isnt going to killyou. :p' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not something that could be quantified' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it can be quantified and has bene' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(actually, it can, Rizgoth)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'ecigs are the electric cars of smoking. Plain chemicals with a byproduct of water.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I can cite the studies if you would like' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those that smoke in public desrve to be convicted of attempted murder and publically flogged until almost dead' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'you have a greater chance of dying from breathing than from actually dying from nicotine from a cigar or tobacco product.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's pretty weird that they want to ban ecigs, claiming a health issue.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'both lab experiments with mice and monkeys, and statistical studies based on enacments of the bans' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the weight of medical evidence is shows that the increase in cancer due to second hand smoke is -barely- mathematically significant' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the ecig thing is based on speculation not science' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rizgoth lies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the ecig ban has nothing to do with health' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there have been NO studies showing any increase in mortality or other health effect from second hand exposure to eliquid vapor' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's to do with a bunch of do-good fucknuts who want to micromanage your life' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernutd lies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts lies and lies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'thats probably true tigernuts (about the do-good fucknuts), but that doesn't change the science' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'there have probably been no studies that show e-cigarettes are safe.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is a statistically significant correlation between exposure to second-hand cigarette smoke and total life expectancy, cancer mortality rates, and several other conditions' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it is small but significant.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Who wants to invest in my new e-tobacco juice company ? We are going to have all kinds of flavors.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'like i said, there are far bigger things to obsess over, emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I don't disagree that there are, I just disagree that that is a good argument against the stupid laws.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the thing about large statistical populations is that since you're only sampling the population you need only find the subset that matches what you're expecting to find. A legitimate sample size in a population of 100 is, what, 10? 20? Given privacy concerns, it seems like a pretty easy way to skew results to your liking.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it doesn't require legislation' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I think the argument to be made is that forcing businesses to ban smoking does more economic damage than the value of the lives it saves' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like you don't need a law banning people from putting their arm in a blender' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'since the likely economic effect is in the billions per year and the lives is likely in the single digits per year' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or a law banning people from waving their cock about on main street on the second thursday of every month' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'erm, how do you get an economic impact from a smokeless environment?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'both of those things are illegal in every jurisdiction I am aware of' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'bar sales primarily' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'putting your arm in a blender is not illegal here' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I'm not sure about the billions, Some people are more likely to visit resteraunts that don't allow smoking, thus it can have a positive economic impact.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'again I can point you to the studies if you would like to see them' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'adopting an smoking ban in bars and resturaunts strongly correlates with declining gross sales in those businesses in the jursidiction' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'when you chronically smoke nicotine or marijuana in the presence of humans that dislike nicotine or marijuana, you desrrve to die horridly ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he's a cheery soul, isn't he?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'on private property the property owner should have the right to decide and those that don't want to be exposed have the right to not frequent the establishment' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'public property bans are completely legit' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the only reason it's reasonable to ban it in bars/restaurants is the workers' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'put Tigernuts arm into a blender - second-hand blendering' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'again the workers can choose to get jobs at places that ban it' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is no reason the government needs to be involved there' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can't guarantee no coersion, and can't counteract insurance' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I favour banning smoking for the sake of the workers.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'public places, or places serving a public function ban away' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's an imperfect solution, but we live in an imperfect world where sometimes ideology has to compromise with pragmatism' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'private property bans are violations of liberty' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade avoids restuarants that permit polluting the customers inside T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'somewhere (LA? Definitely it was somewhere in California) they tried to make it a fine offense to let your secondhand smoke travel onto someone else's property. Dunno if that ever passed.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and they are violations of the takings clause' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like a typical piece of democrat bullshittery to me, Hans' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it already is it is called trespass and nuisance laws' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but its not criminal its just civil' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I can absolutely sue you if your smoke is entering my property and actually causing me harm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'if similar laws were to gain steam, I don't really seeing health inspectors allowing exceptions should they detect unacceptable levels of secondhand smoke on the premises of places not allowed to have any.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's unlikely you would be able to prove it, Emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'be that as it may' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: '"Oh, false alarm, guys. This isn't your secondhand smoke."' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'forensics!' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'well time to go home be back on in 30 minutes or so' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'forensics is also detecting the crimes of pollution after the fact' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you try a civil lawsuit based on that, you're probably very rich' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and probably retarded' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'or incarcerated.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade contemplates getting rich $$$kaching$$$ and beggaring chronic polluters T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'planning on prosecuting yourself, Zade?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade prosecutes Tigernuts T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'find it vaguely amusing that the people you see that are the most voiciferous about pollution and fake-green issues tend to be the very same people that have the highest pollution impact on the world (people with consumerist lifestyles, throwaway celebrity culture, having lots of kids)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'fishing for information in the dark, eh .. tsk tsk' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'The US has reduced its co2 emissions from 2005 to current, while european countries that adopted expensive pro green policies have not.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade disbelieves Rizgoth T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'natgas is changing the co2 outlook in the US, frak em high!' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'don't stir up the conspiracists' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the oceans are burping up more methane than realized.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Germany is spending $32 billion a year subsidizing its solar energy program.....and it just said that it cannot afford to do it any longer so the program is being cut.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'wouldn't that solar energy make up for the costs by reducing the costs of other power sources?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the money needs to go into r&d...not plants' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'plants are important' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the German govt buys the power from the solar panel installers as it is produced.....it now costs the govt $32 billion over the cost of natgas energy. per year.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the new solar plant that just went online in California went obsolete as soon as the ribbon was cut.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Tigernuts thank the British Intelligence for more for making the NSA look good, if you don't want to e-mail them just hold a note up to your webcam for five minutes. :)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'with a subsidy, crooks eventually attempt to defraud the subsidy -- so reducing the subsidy is smart' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'well then the Germans went backwards since World War II' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'on top of that, the company that took the dive to make that plant a reality sank similar money into another project that probably won't even open because of changes in technology making that particular path a dead-end.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the problem was, the solar program in Germany was super popular.....they installed millions of watts of solar panels each year on german roofs.....now the bills are coming due.....:p' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and here we are in the US with a 100+ year supply of new natgas because we invested in natgas drilling technology rd.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'now some of that r&d needs to go towards solar tech' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so Rizgoth is almost suggesting there is natgas underneath the European landmass' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'solar is booming in the US, though.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'it also doesnt help that Germany is abandoning its nuclear program, and replacing them with big coal plants.....which means their co2 levels will be going up even faster....at least 50% higher last year.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'There is shale gas almost everywhere.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'but as I recall solar and wind energy require a whole lot of those things in order for them to supply enough energy' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'wind is crap imo' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Europeans likely do not want polluted ground water from frak accidents' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'better than nothing I suppose' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Right now, there are 32 known shale natgas deposits under the US.....and new ones are being found every year.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'still....long term potential is way below solar' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'all energy sources have negative side effects making them crap in a way.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I have fracking on my land, and my water is fine, no bubbles at all...was hoping for some good bubbly water :(' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'one of these days they should make bigass factories with a lot of treadmills or stationary bikes, where thousands of people run or ride in alternating shifts to generate energy. The end of jobless people world wide and a clean and free energy source.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade suspects that Sargeras did not do a feasibiliy study on that seeming nonsense T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a motionless solar panel with no overhead (a deliberate pun) produces electricity, and if those are not earning enough money, a gym full of freeloading cyclists and treadmill runners is not going pay for even the overhead' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'no no I mean like bigass factories of humans generating power' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those factories are not cheap to run, and the CEO salaries alone are going to bankrupt the project' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'yeah. In South Africa these morons constantly strike for more and more and more money. Our economy is falling apart because they stop mining to demand more. So those energy clean ways won't work here' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so the african natives want more money (pennies?) to mine the mines to make the europeans (that stole er appropriated the mines) richer' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'whaaat? Europeans got there before 'muricans to exploit other countries national resources? Are them yanks getting slow?!' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'white europeans seem to believe that treasures and minerals in Africa and South America belong to white europeans, as though the natives did not own any mineral or treasure rights -- ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those treasure hunter movies are disturbing' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: '''The meek shall inherit the earth, but not it's mineral rights''' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they got to California before the Spanish, but Queen LizI didn't want to start a war with them yet so she told Drake not to rap about it.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'well most minerals weren't used by natives, the Europeans wanted those minerals and would stop at nothing for profit. Spain grew quite rich out of the loot it got from the Central America natives. The Aztecs were obsessed with gold.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so is the fact that the Spanish are not yet ruined and obliterated a proof that there is no god, or is the smiting yet to come (at say Armegeddon). Perhaps the Spanish were commissioned by some (false) god to do the dastardly in South America. Some say god uses or permits the wicked to ravage and destroy the wicked. ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'rhetorically speaking .. if there is a god, why is there so much wickedness ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'who says god is all good?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the major religions' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '*gasp*' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'debate and more importantly who says your definition of wickedness and god's is the same?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'no higher power is involved. The human race is but a plague that destroys the very ground that sustains it.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'people have been using religion for thousands of years to explain things they could not understand. Alot has been cleared by science but many still cling to old ways.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'maybe the native people of south america offended god by their idolatry and human sacrifices and the spanish were sent there to punish them' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'how would that be inconsistent with a god that will send you to be tortured for eternity for having insufficient charity' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'the Aztecs and Mayans pleased THEIR gods by sacrificing.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'see, better bet on the right horse ;)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'which is why pascals wager is a suckers bet' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and perhaps the Spanish by being extremely wicked Catholics (The Inquisition) were permitted to condemn themselves further by more wickedness in Souh America' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'trully there is no right horse. Every culture has it's own beliefs and each of them think they are correct.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'the Inquisition thought themselves the hand of god. Religion is as strong a weapon as anything else.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'god is nothing and everything. He is neither good nor evil, he is both good and evil.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'well that is moral relativism sargeras which is demonstrably false' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is no good and evil only power and those too weak to take it.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'greed is good my friends' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Gorun: 'God is good on a level that we cant comprehend' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'god is a figment of your imagination' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'true that Emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Gorun: 'heh' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, he is not. We can understand him just fine, because we are he.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if someone's figment turns out to match reality then so be it, but debating it is as pointless as tits on a steer.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'so we are gods now? That's what Anton Levey's Satanism teaches us. Are you a Satanist?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'Religion has been debated for centuries' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade the grammar-balrog says: use punctuation (as when say (mis)quoting famous sayings) T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'its also the teachings of the cult of the universal subconcious mind' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, I am God. In collaboration with my fellow humans, I lend my strength to his image to bring comfort to others.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'He is made in my image.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'yeah that sounds more like satanism hanslanda' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and personally I prefer modal sheets not satin ones :)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'Satin and Satan aren't the same' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'says you' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'you think Satin sheets will choke you in your sleep?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'santa clause is how the devil dresses up to confuse mortals and lure them into committing the sins of greed and envy' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade mangles a famous lie: "There is neither good nor evil. There is powah, and those too weak to take the powah!" T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'alot of people point that out' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I bet if we lifted Emm's skirts she'd have woolen granny panties on.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'define powah?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'awesome moves on the dance floor, driven by a techno beat.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I bet if you lifted my skirts I would shoot you in the head a whole bunch of times.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'this is a debate channel. If you can't debate without getting offended it's not for you.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'who got offended?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'serious discussion is only allowed to continue here if it doesn't get out of hand. Mostly this channel is for having fun.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'the bloke insulting ye 'olde undergarments' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'surely not Annie Oakley' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'then the term of Debate is lost in this place' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'annie oakley is one of my heroins ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Shirley is not Annie Oakley' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, but games are never a good place to voice serious concerns.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'res ipso loquitor zade' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'this channel is for serious debating' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'this channel is for whimsical smokeblowing' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'are we going to debate the purpose of the debate channel?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'that's a start' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'shouldn't some serious channels remain serious for those who seriously need it's seriousness?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I like to use it to voice arguments to see if ... intellectually challenged ... individuals like Zade can poke holes in them' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'in the prior "whimsical" debate, Emm used the "red herring" of the RCC? false god which allegedly sends victims to be tortured for a long while for insufficient charity' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'if you ain't nice enough you'll burn at some point right?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the interesting rhetorical connundrum is "who says the decent human definition of wickedness and god's is the same."' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'isn't that what I said about 30 minutes ago zade?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'you did not yet expand on that rhetoric' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'is there need for expansion?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if so I refer you to the Euthypro' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: '(I think I misspelled that badly)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'is it good because god loves it or does god love it because it is good.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'looking at the past several hundred lines of debate, that was the only interesting .. almost insight' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'spiffy I had an almost insight' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'frankly religion isn't that interesting to me, but it was the subject of the day so i jumped in' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if that is the direction that Euthypro went, then the connundrum is not answered' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I am much more interested in the appropriate role of Article I, section 8, on the application of patents to plants that necessarily involve new generations and new patents every year or two' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'which is to say since monsanto has a defacto perpetual patent on corn and other grains does that violate the "for a limited time" clause of article I section 89' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'which is to say since monsanto has a defacto perpetual patent on corn and other grains does that violate the "for a limited time" clause of article I section 8' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'would a reasonable person still consider an entity as human (and thus inheriting all associated rights and priveleges) if, outside of some rare disease, it had claws and fur?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sargeras: 'perhaps a new sub-species?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the interpretion may depend on whether monsanto is able to bribe and or coerce the politicians, (either with money and or other incentives and disincentives)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'practically that might be true, but in principle it isn't zade' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'my question is, does ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'my question is, does "for a limited time" have any force or effect' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'is that schoolwork or an actual case' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'at what point should SCOTUS say, this is not "a limited time"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I don't think anyone has ever argued the "for a limited time" question in front of the supremes' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'SCOTUS is crook and corrupt' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'they might have in copyright law, but not in patent' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there was a case where a company applied for trade dress protection for an expired utility patent where SCOTUS disallowed it on other grounds' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but you can read between the lines in the opinion that they didn't like the idea of a patent stopping competitors from using an invention for 20 years and then trade dress stopping them from using it forever after' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I would argue that case could have been decided on article I section 8 "for a limited time" grounds' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'patents are supposed to expire' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'they do expire, 7 years for some, 10 for some, and 20 for most' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but a patent on a plant that changes from generation to generation and is repatented every few years defacto does not expire' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'as evidenced by the fact that the vast majority of the corn grown in this country for the past 60 years has been "round up ready" patented corn' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the SCOTUS was likely superior, as then perhaps both apply: "limited time" and "denial of trade dress"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'leaving aside the anti-trust issues, there is a problem with what amounts to a patent that extends forever' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unless you are hinting that usage of "denial of trade dress" did not sufficiently uphold "for a limited time" (but in fact did)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'as i said before, human patents are supposed to expire' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a twenty year patent is too long' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I think they should be based on a reasonable recovery time for the industry' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'a 20 year patent on something that takes 15 years to bring to market is reasonable, a 20 year patent on something that is not useful to anyone 2 years later is not' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope, the company is supposed to factor in the expiry date of the patent, and not be greedy' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if a product takes 15 years to bring to market, the patent holders were slacking' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'pretending that companies should make decisions on any grounds besides their own long term economic self interest is ignorant' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'courts/congress should determine what a reasonable length of time for each form of IP and each industry and set them there' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'i'm sdaying that companies are not to expect continued profits past the expiry date of the patent' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'so a patent on perinial plants should last 2 or 3 years at most, but patents on a new kind of scotch should last 40 years' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the current debate aside, i dislike the patenting of the *obvious* on a firstcome-firstserved basis -- those patents are to be disallowed' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'well technically according to section 103 all patents must be "non-obvious" in order to issue.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the patenting of gnome sequences is a crook and extremely corrupt' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but myriad stretches the concept of non-obviousness to the breaking point' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'genome' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'we don't patent gnomes as far as I am aware' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'except maybe the plastic lawn variety' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the myriad case says patents on "isolated and purified" gene sequences are not patentable because they are not patentable subject matter' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but they should have said none of this crap is patentable because it is all obvious' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'ick cp tp in db' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the patenting of gnome sequences was supposed to be done by Governments and government-funded universities on a public-domain basis (that is "no patents permitted" on genome sequences), not by private companies' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'please please please call them genome sequences not gnome sequences zade' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it just sets my teeth on edge to see them called gnome sequences' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what is in a genome sequence is fixed and thus "obvious" ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'i flash a picture of a bunch of the expedia gnomes getting patented' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there is nothing wrong with patenting man made genome sequences' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if they are literally created by man and have never existed in nature' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'assuming they are also useful' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'novel, non-obvious, and useful, those are the pillars' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if it exists in nature it fails on both of the first two' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but if like chakrabati you create a new sequence by splicing dna from different species, or otherwise chemically altering the structure' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'you have made something that is novel, and probably non-obvious' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'so as long as it is useful the patent should issue' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'even if, as in the case of chakrabati the government won't let you ever make any more because they are afraid it will eat all the oil in the world' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(if) chakrabati eats oil spills -- interesting' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'chakrabati is the scientist, his bacteria eats oil, whether it would ever work in as chaotic an environment as an oil spill remains to be seen' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but the USG won't let him use it anyway and his patent has long since expired' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the possibility that the relatively frail version he created could mutate into a hearty version that would then "infect" every oil reserve in the world and decimate them was to catastrophic of a possibility to entertain' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'even though the liklihood was probably on the order of 10^60' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'there was a much better chance that the LHC would create a runaway blackhole that ate the solarsystem' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'what do you mean nope?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'runaway black holes are a fiction' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: '"Life always finds a way.", Emm.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'says who?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'zade I would really like to see your source on the impossibility of a runaway blackhole' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'my understanding is that it is not only possible but we now have a pretty good idea of the size of a supercolider it would take to make one' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'mind yout it is one the size of jupiter so its kind of a pointless distinction' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'LHC never had enough power to create black holes, but even if it could their size would mean they could never gobble up enough material to stick around for very long nor could they ever significantly impact their environment (a la the "traditional" black hole of astronomical size) beyond perhaps subtle damage of the LHC tunnel.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I agree hanslanda, but we didn't know that for sure until we ran the first LHC tests' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'no "we" there' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'we were betting everything on an untested theory of a dude in a wheelchair who talks like a robot' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Actually, Hawkings doesn't believe in black holes. at least not in the way most physicists do' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the wheelchair guy likely went senile' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the fact that hawking is the smartest guy in the world notwithstanding' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he recently changed his stance on them, he didn't ever not believe in them.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'wtf does that mean madcatz' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'i am pretty sure every scientist believes in blackholes since we can detect them easily nowdays' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if you just mean he thinks they follow different rules than everyone else that I will buy.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it means he thinks they're portals to other dimensions (the whole black hole<-->white hole thing).' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'most people define a black hole by their presence of a event horizon' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'when the wheelchair guy was talking of small black holes existing (on earth), that was senility speaking -- may've repented and recovered since that senility' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'hawkings claims that there's no such thing as an event horizon' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'that is ridiculous' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'at least, not a permanent one' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'show me a source' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: '"not a permanent one" is a huge difference' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'just google Hawking apparent event horizon.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'he released his notes on his talk that he did in August of last year' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'but yeah, I'm sure google can find them for you' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'of course there isn't a permenant one since they shift based on the mass' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ronda: 'http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/technology&id=9407566' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: '"not permanent" as in "only produces temporary effects that are observable with a telescope"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'i have no problem believing he said there isn't a permanant event horizon, I have a real problem with the assertion that there isn't one ever' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'but not actually having the properties of an event horizon' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the cliff notes of it is that while from way back here we can see the event horizon and all that it does/effects, if you were to actually go there and cross over you wouldn't see or otherwise notice anything.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and the whole white hole, black hole thing is just bunk' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"no event horizon" - that is interesting -- good concept to demolish those science-nutters that believe 3d images may be mapped onto event horizons (the "no informatuion is lost" crap-theory)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'other than the fact that gravity would have killed you well before you got htere?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that was a Hawking theory, Zade, one that nearly cost Hawking his career.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so he repented and recanted' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'no zade he gathered more data and updated his theory' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, he didn't, actually. Hawking finally won that debate. Something like 30 years later.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so he hornswaggled them with gooblededook ?!?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'a "black hole" is so called because nothing (or, in particular,) light can escape from any point inside the event horizon.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'hawkings is claiming that there is no such point in a black hole from which light can't escape' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'i.e. in laymans' terms, no black holes' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Hawkings may be senile after all' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'but rather, it escapes as radiaion' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'which also happens to solve the information paradox' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Black holes likely do not believe in Hawkings' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'but just that the information contained in the radiation is just indecipherable' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'yes the hawking radiation thing (which we now have some evidence for) is what we were betting on being true to prevent a tiny black hole from growing into a supermassive one' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "no information is lost" theory is a crap theory' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'yes, but he's now claiming that EVERYTHING gets emitted through this radiation' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a tiny black hole is not massive enough to remain existent' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'which is a hugely different claim than it just being there' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a tiny black hole is not massive enough to remain existent as a black hole' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'only if you accept the hawking radiation theory zade' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'without accepting ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'how so?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it is a black hole and nothing can escape from it it can only grow and will never decay' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade doubts whether any micro black holes were created on earth (other that the nucleus of atoms - which are not black holes) T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Xaeris doubts Zade has any scientific background. T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zaeris is wrong' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the only possible options without something being able to escape from the black holes is permanant stability (if nothing can get close enough to enter), and runaway expansion (if stuff can)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'or, like you just said 5 minutes ago, Hawking radiation' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'which causes the black hole to lose mass, not expand' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'first off, what is the minimum size of a blackhole from which no light may escape ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'first off, what is the minimum mass of a blackhole from which no light may escape ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'according to hawking, there isn't one' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'ff' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Emm nods at Madcatz. T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'rephrase, what is the minimum mass of a (stable) blackhole from which most light does not escape' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I would say one plank length in diameter, and two plank-mass in mass' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'whether either of those measurements actually exist is a matter for debate of course' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'But then the radius would be half a plank length' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Madcatz nods quietly to himself. What a wacko. T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'no the radius would be undefined' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'since by definition there can be nothing smaller than a plank-length' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and the mass of this alleged plank length diameter object' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'two plank-mass-units' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'in otherwords if you have the smallest discrete unit of volume, and put two of the smallest discrete unit of mass into it you have a superdense object' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'technically, you can go smaller than a planck length, it just creates a black hole' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'and by "technically", I mean "theoretically", of course' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but of course this makes all sorts of assumptions about the nature of existence that I cannot support execpt with a mathematical model that while internally consistent has no practical connection to reality' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Which is sort of the opposite, but hey' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'which is bigger in size and heavier in mass, the nucleus of an iron atom or a plank-length object posing as a blackhole' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'no zade we are talking about measurements much smaller than those used for protons much less nuclii' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the scientist nutters are positing ludicrous assumptions based on symbolic equations which are likely conjectured in science fiction' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and madcatz I prefer the thoery that plank-length is the smallest discrete dimensional measurement' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and plank-second is the smallest discrete unit of time' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and the two are related by C' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but of course at this stage we are talking about comparing models that may have no connection to reality so the most you can say is, "my model is more aesthetically pleasing, and is internally consistent"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'The value is kind of just arbitrary in my mind, though. If it's the planck length, then we have no way to show that it's the planck length, since any measurement tool (i.e. protons) couldn't have that short of a wavelength' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but if we define it as the distance that something travelling at c travels in a plank-second it all makes sense' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some that small and not massive is not going to do anyhing much' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'because there is a metaphysical limit at that point' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'protons are huge behemoths, did you also mean mesons (electrons, etc)?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'And how are you defining a planck second, then?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'And you can't say "How long it takes something traveling C to go a planck distance"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'll' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'the minimum duration of any constant universal state' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'blackholes the size of photons - likely not on earth except in science-fiction "Zade puts the black hole ray gun on GOBBLE and pulls the trigger"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Again, that's kind of arbitrary. You obviously wouldn't be able to measure it, because doing so would require photons with smaller than planck length protons' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'i.e. a black hole' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'I mean, I understand if you want to define it that way' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'But how do you then place a number on it?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'without just pulling one out of Plancks butt?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the blackhole discussion is "barmy"' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'as though the scientists are silently saying "here is a ludicrous theory, but you guys are not smart enough to see what crap the theory is because of the symbolism and equations used which require a graduate degree to begin to comprehend" (almost like the King's New Clothes, almost)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'too afraid to say "religion", Zade? :P' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'to believe in micro blackholes creatable on earth using colliders is similar to a false religion' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'as opposed to a true religion?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there are no true religions' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'all religions are false' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'then why put the word false in your statement' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'do you believe that with all your heart? There's no hope of anyone ever convincing you otherwise?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'but regardless the two are not at all similiar' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'because believing in the one leads to testable predictions which if they are falsified should lead to an end to the belief' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'while as belief in the other typically requires you to take as a premise that anything that contradicts it is necessarily false.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the ranks of the scientific are filling up with premises we can't really test yet, as one builds upon the other to continue the lines of theory. That's quite a lot similar to religion.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'with scientific logic, "Religion" is able to be proven false' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Science and Religion are different' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'some can be, because they lend themselves to testable predictions, but very few make that mistake' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'although I am not sure what "scientific logic" means' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'is it something different than normal logic?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Religion prefers to rely on hearsay of authors and storytellers, and to disregard the logic of Science' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'religions that limit themselves to metaphysical claims cannot be disproven or falsified' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wrong Emm' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'again wtf is the logic of science' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'logic is logic, science is science they have very little to do with each other' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zade does metaphysical analysis' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'although approaching science in a logical manner is probably the best way to go about it' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: '"scientific" is a pejorative term that transmits the idea of fact and methodicalness to the subject, as though whatever it's being compared to is less than the subject being compared.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'you can definitively answer metaphysical questions?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if so please tell me what preceded the big bang' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'of course, I am God, after all.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'please tell me the proximate cause of the values of the universal constants (like planks)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'not teaching you, Emm. from past conversations, the conclusion is that you seem to be missing decent ethics' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the big bang. Whatever caused it, it generated a flux in temperature that's gradually leeched away as inflation continues.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'congratulations hanslanda you just failed entirely' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and without decent ethics, metaphysical analysis is "different" (and or depraved)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'ethics is about 10 levels of abstraction below metaphysics' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'but some of the things you said are perhaps another subtopic to be analysed further' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'why is there a universe?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'if you can answer that question definitively i will join your church and do anything you tell me to do.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Idom: 'so you think theres only one?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I didn't say or imply that' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I in fact believe that there isn't only one answer to the question so it cannot be answered definitively' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Idom: 'why isnt there a universe then?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'rhetorical (not analysed here): "Are the concepts of 'good' able to be similar from the perspective of a (decent) god and decent humans, and if they are different, how different and where."' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'that one is easy to answer, since the answer is that question relies on a false premise' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and therefor has no answer' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'in other words you have committed a category error' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'when did you stop beating your wife?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Idom: 'why arent you God of your own universe, i guess i mean?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'who says I am not?' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: '"good" is not an absolute. A thing is only good if it presents the least amount of stress on you.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'metaphysical analysis prefers to defer the analysis of the obviously ludicrous until the ludicrous is no longer ludicrous' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Idom: 'if you are, i'd like to see it, teach me how to make one' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so ludicrous conjectures: "what came before the big bang" partial answer: "that conjecture is without relevance" (there are more important conjectures to analyse) ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"the world is heading to Armegeddon, and you are blathering about the what came before a likely fictitious event (the big bang)" - (you may've failed triage)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the world isn't heading to armegeddon, Zade.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'although there is evidence that the Christian religion is a somewhat false religion, the armegeddon conjectures in the book of Revelation are revealing to the discerning' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'of course they are. Armageddon has already happened, and will happen again. This alone clearly shows it's not going to be the end of the world as is popularly claimed.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there are likely a lot of concerned humans seeking to avoid and or defer Armegeddon ' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wrong ther,e Hanslanda' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Armageddon as described in the NT did not happen yet' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that's the whole beauty of the bible. It applies equally well to any time you wish, including ones long before and long after it was written.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'belief in it is strong enough to make history repeat itself.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "foolish" christians "want" Armageddon to happen' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'well, may as well get the foolishness out of the way early so we can claw our way back to the golden age all the sooner.' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'post WWIII is no fun' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'life is fairly decent these days (if no poor)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'life is fairly decent these days (if not poor)' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'ten levels of abstraction between ethics and metaphysics -- Zade suspects Emm is confabulating: state the names of those alleged ten levels' T3/r7/2014-03-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) The Jerk Fiendish: 'george, martha, frederico, sebastian, eric, shauna,...' T3/r7/2014-03-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'anyone else love cpac' T3/r7/2014-03-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'its like buy a bottle of rum, take a half shot everytime you hear jesus,god,gun,constituion' T3/r7/2014-03-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'so much fun' T3/r7/2014-03-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts peers around himself intently. T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Anthine: 'so which is better PS4 or XBox 1' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'ps4' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the one that has the games that you like to play' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Anthine is supposedly seeking to ascertain: (1) if the same game were on both PS4 and XBox1, which is the more enjoyable reliable etcetera hardware, (2) which of the two PS4 XBox1 is more likely to provide more enjoyable games, from the various perspectives of knowledgeable (or at least opinionated) peanut-gallery' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sickerone: 'Sony' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, in North Korea elections, Kim Jong Un wins the vote in his region with 100% of the votes. Other than turnout, sounds suspiciously like the vote here in the UK' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lol, at work I am trying to convince my boss to help me 'confiscate' the Porsche belonging to our pensions adviser owing to some pension theft going on' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(unknown to Tigernuts, the boss may be an .......... or even an .....)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Blackwater troops have been spotted on the ground in Ukraine' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Dear Mr Putin, Please tear John Kerry a new arse, he's having to use his mouth right now. Yours sincerely...' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"Doctors in Britain are being forced to become state snitches and spot 'radical' patients under an NHS initiative that threatens to cut funding if a GP practice fails to take part in the program." .... nice' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's already coming to the USA' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Swalec: 'and at universities' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Amorok: 'snitch?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'snitch. Spy' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'someone who rats out people and reports to the government, often giving incomplete or inaccurate information' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i wonder if anyone thinking of standing for election as US president in 2016 understands that pardoning Chelsea Manning and Edward Snowden would be a vote winner with the youth and libertarian/liberal minded electorate (both groups that often fail to vote at all)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: ''often giving incomplete or inaccurate information' is an opinion' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, no, it's not' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'err, yes, it is' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'look to any authoritarian regime where the use of snitches was popular, such as East Germany, USSR' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...and then look everywhere else' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'North Korea, even here in the UK during the early days' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'informants are notoriously unreliable' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not disagreeing' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then it's not opinion :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's the 'often' that's the problem imo....it's stereotyping snitches...whether we like snitches or not' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's nothing wrong with stereotyping' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'too much stereotyping today' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bollocks' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there's plenty wrong with it' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is nothing wrong with stereotyping provided you understand what it is' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '...and therein lies the problem' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can't legislate stupid' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'amen' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'we do elect it though' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that doesn't change the fact though that some could use it' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, either way, mandating that doctors snitch on patients to the government is bad' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'depends...didn't read the article' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they shouldn't even be telling government -anything- about their patients at an individual level' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there are some circumstances....such as harm to self or others' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a bit of a difference between someone making an overt and specific threat (extremely unlikely) and just generally reporting on possible behaviour' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'agreed....just pointing out some exceptions exist' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'those exceptions already existed and didn't need mandating' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'again...not sure what exactly they're reporting' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'er, starting to report' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'so....what are they suppose to be snitching about?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in the case of this new problem, me complaining to my doctor that his treatment suggestions are informed more by money that effectiveness would be labelled as extremist behaviour and have me reported' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I'd not have a problem with that' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'radicalisation, anti-government stuff' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's basically the same kind of thing that they've been teaching the police in the US that anyone who is a libertarian and/or supports the constitution, gun rights, states rights are terrorists' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or who is a christian, supports smaller government etc' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I'd have no problems explaining complaining about fee/services if someone wants to come follow up..i'd imagine if he'll do it once, he'll do it again....the record will speak for itself' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'too late at that point' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'why?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'think they'll have locked me up?...please don't say yes' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because at that point you're already on a no-fly list, having your communications monitored, your house raided' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'already happens' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'paranoia and fear mongering....guess it's everywhere today' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's neither' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's taking a principle' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how about we put a camera in your bathroom to take video of you every time you go in there and upload it to the government' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'why would you want to put a camera in my bathroom?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'do you have cameras in your bathroom?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'of course i don't' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'cool...didn't think so' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how about we raise your insurance based upon your political beliefs, or your taste in music' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'see....talking about putting a camera in my bathroom sounds like fear mongering or paranoia to me' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's an example of unwanted interference. it's the go-to method to explain people who seem like you unable to comprehend what invasion of privacy is' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'don't ever recall checking any of those boxes on my insurance application' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'we can 'what if' all day' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how about we increase your car insurance based on the style of your driving?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'they alreay do that' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'just get a few tickets and see' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or increase your health insurance based on what you buy at the supermarkets?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'tickets are not driving-style dependant' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nor are they exclusive' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'correlation is not causation' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'but otherwise they don't know your style' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'no ticket, no style' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'at least at the insurance company end' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sure they do, they're going to mandate black box recorders fitted to all cars' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in fact, most cars already have had them since 2005, they're just not recording long term' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'you think they've set up transmittion to your insurance agency?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there's that paranoia/fear mongering' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they haven't for me, but that's the way the market is moving' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'would you rather have cars with potential problems that could have been fixed by analyzing the computer blowing up on teh roads?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'eh?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'you're talking about the car computers' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'black boxes' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'data recorders' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'car computers are a bad idea generally, but no, i won't have a car with such a thing in it' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'until they all do...lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then i'll buy a classic without' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there ya go' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more than half my car failures are caused by excess technology' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'double-edged sword' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but that's a different issue (and has to do with inbuilt redundancy and regulations)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'I think the OBD2 systems log the last few seconds of data anyhow.' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'car?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, ontuct, in the event of an accident' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'yes car' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'anything built in the last 20 or so years' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods....don't know the techincal terms' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not much of a car person period' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'gas, oil, air, water' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some supermarkets already pass across your purchasing habits to insurers' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: ''to insurers' ...not YOUR insurer' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'data' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, not necesarrily' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'pay cash' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods...i know some may actually be connected via there actual company' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i do, ontuct' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'but it's not engineered to take advantages of people's purchases in relation to changing their premiums' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what isn't engineered?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'probably not even same company ....prob third party data collectors' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the sharing of the data isn't engineered' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, loyalty cards were not designed for the purpose of selling the data to insurers, but it's a side effect' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'names are money in today's world' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like car black boxes were designed to provide information in the event of a crash, not to allow governments to spy on you the whole time' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unfortunately, to walk through life believing that things do not have unintended consequences is... naive' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'of course' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so there you go, you call me paranoid, i call you naive :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'be cognizent of the world isn't the same as being paranoid' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'er 'being'' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and staunchly defending privacy and wanting government and "the rest of the parasitic world" to leave you alone isn't paranoia or fearmongering' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'not the notion' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the examples become the problem' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which examples?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and it doesn't matter what it is....someone always twists something into paranoia....what if, what if, what if....we can what if all day' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well in this case, that person is you' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i was merely pointing out the unintended consequences, both real and existing, and possible/inevitble' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'sure...I'm the one with the camera in my bathroom, I'm the one paying higher premiums because of what I bought at the grocery store or how I voted last election' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the higher premiums is a very real thing' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's like slippery slopers.....'oh god...it's a slippery slope'...what if, what if, what if....fact is we live on a slippery slope' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'persecution based on political opinion is also very real' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and they always pick out the least imaginable extreme to make their arguements' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and as it goes, some US schools have been caught fitting cameras to bathrooms/showers' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'only if you have baaad opinions' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"not democrat", Tinada?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sorry, "not establishment"' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I don't doubt that tiger....idiots exist in every group' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, and many of them end up in government' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'stereotyping' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'mutter' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'democrats should be safe, I reckon, they are reasonably well aligned with the religion' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'believe that your national politicians are anything other than creatures of the establishment/their party is naive' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'thinking they're all the type of person who wld put cameras in bathrooms/showers is paranoia' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's just you conflating two very different things' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'sorry...stepped away' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'misread' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'however, being establishment/party creatures means they won't dilligently uphold the 4th ammendment, which leads you further down that slippery slope to bathroom cameras' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'For a reasonable definition of 'the establishment', I think >95% of US national politicians might qualify as creatures' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there's those ridiculous slippery slope extremes...bathroom cameras' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'there are some people who somehow slip through, though' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not a real example, stux' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'nods' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'for a real example, see NSA mass surveillance' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I don't have a problem with it' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'll be actively campaigning against my local MP next election because he supports the snoopers charter' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I can't believe people were actually surprised' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): *Yay!* Go Tigernuts!!! Tinada cheers him on. T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'surprised? no, but people 'such as you' kept saying it wasn't happening and the people 'like me' who said it was were paranoid and fearmongers' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'I never said it wasn't happening' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'since the day you started talking on the phone you should have been aware that the line was never 'private'' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'long before the internet and cell phones I was aware of this' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'however, it was an offence to wiretap at that point' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just because something was possible, does not make it legal, or ethical' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'depends....wiretapping cld be authorized....same way nsa was authorized' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is plenty wrong with that sentence, but the crux is that wiretapping used to be authorised only in specific cases, and come on folks, get your 4th ammendment out and recite what those cases are:' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'the same people complaining about the monitoring would be the first ones complaining should another plane strike a building' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'come on...no one cares that you called your sister today to tell her what you had for dinner last night' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ontuct: 'your mom might' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who said anything about my sister?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'or that you have to work tomorrow...or whatever....it's not like there's a warehouse full of people picking up the line when you do' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what business is it of theirs who i call or what it's about?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'it's not...that's why they didn't listen to your call' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'start talking about bombs and they might though' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: ''they' didn't listen to calls, they record/mine from them' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, you're back to the camera in your bathroom again' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why can't i watch your wife or your daughter undressing?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'fact vs fiction' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who cares/' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'there's no cam in my bathroom' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a cam on your laptop though, and they happily record that' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'and my cams have a piece of paper over them' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do you like your identity being stolen by criminals?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'couldn't say' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'lol' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: '..what if' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do you like having money stolen from your bank account? your credit cards being used by a criminal?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'of course not...point?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so why would you support your government deliberately putting in backdoors into technology to allow them to "spy" on people which then makes that technology less secure and allows hackers to access them?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'phone' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'doh...hangup' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'was just nsa checking if their latest hack is working' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'so your counter is that the government is allowing hackers better access to my information?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unintended consequences' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'that's life' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'something they had no right doing in the first place leads to unintended consequences' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'who said they had no right?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ahh, the old "not my problem, shit happens" argument' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in the case of the USA, the have no right' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you either believe in the rule of law, or you don't :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'relative to overseas individuals?....no right ' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'as far as citizens inside....right' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well the citizens inside is what the whole snowden thing was about, or are you in denial about that?' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'now...that said...' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'anyway, dinnertime!' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'other countries of the world do not abide by the rights of the USA' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'if the other countries of the world are going to do it for insight, then so will the USA so as not to be disadvantaged' T3/r7/2014-03-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Creestux: 'who and where is targeted is up for debate' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'is liam neeson the new steven seagal?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'probably not. I think Gerard Butler edges him out.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'checking..' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'or perhaps that one guy in Bourne Legacy. The one that kicked ass way more effectively than Jason Bourne.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'oh, that guy. butler. he is not the right type.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'what's your type?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'redheads' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that was easy. next question' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I'll put in a word with Shaemus, aka the Human Jar of Mayonnaise. He seems to have a sense of humor, but if you don't want to eat boot I suggest not bringing up anything political.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'no. i meant - neeson is very much like seagal. he also gets beaten up ONLY when it really means something.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'gay' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I figured you were, otherwise I would've suggested Kristi Hemmi.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'this channel is full of trolls' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'confirmed' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'are they gay trolls?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's an Aard thing.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'are you a gay fish?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, i'm a disabled fish' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'game's way too easy, so they get bored and revert to their natural order.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sorry, a disabled feminist muslim fish who votes democrat' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'now stop being racist and go troll elsewhere' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'disabled troll' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'on the internet you can be anything you choose to be, it is unfortunate that so many people choose to be assholes.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'haven't you ever been to New York, Emm? I don't think anyone's being any different on the internet.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'i've been to new york many times and for the most part I have found the people there to be exceptionally nice' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i wouldn't miss new york if it were to be nuked' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'if it gets nuked, its an inside job' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'there's a reason they call it the armpit of America, you know.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: ''ll be' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it would be more of a service to humanity if they nuked London though' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'im pretty sure youngstown ohio is the armpit of america' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not like they'd be killing any brits there' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'this convesation just lit up 300 alarm lights somewhere' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that was the plan, hwuaj, along with filing the patents on the new NSA code blocking software and that chinese satellite mounted rail gun' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'well, who's the dummy who decided to retweet it?!' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nobody, only trolls use twatter' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'let's refer to them as Internet-Savvy Porkjockeys.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, Chinese components found in B-1 bombers and F-16 fighters. Someone needs the sack for that' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'meantime Diane Feinstein wins hypocratic old crone of the year award for her complaints about CIA having snooped at the intelligence committee's computer network without a warrant' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'I thought the CIA wasn't allowed to operate on US soil?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/qx9m5ux' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'dude, we've got North Korean electronics in those things.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it definitely isn't allowed to spy on congress' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'if you didnt notice, america does what it wants' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'CIA generally doesn't care about rules it doesn't get caught breaking.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'CIA needs disbanding' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'someone in the US needs to get a fucking grip already' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'euro votes we disband it, do we have a second?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, keep CIA exactly where it's at. We don't need their stupid infecting the legitimate spy agencies.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ditch it, move foreign spying into the military where it belongs' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's already there, DIA. I'm sure there's an alpabet group for offense, too.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'then be nice so any snooping would make you look awesome to the cia. or nsa. or usa in general. then they feel bad about themselves and cant get their "jobs" done at home' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'if we can ever get our drug policy in check, we will have thousands of unemployed DEA agents' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'hah just kidding, our prison guard unions won't let that happen' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'i doubt its the prison guard unions that are the problem' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unless you have a coupe in either of your political parties, no, you won't get your drug policy in check, neither will you get the CIA to heel' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'k' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'go on emm, what is the problem if its not private prisons' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'government policy is the problem, not private prisons' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'well ur a scary guy beleier, the goverment is always the problem' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'it might be the private prisons that are lobbying for it, but that doesn't remove the blame from congress and the state governments for passing such idiotic laws' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'true' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Hey Tigernuts will you thank British intellegence for me for making the CIA look good, send them an e-mail or hold a sign up in front of your webcam for five minutes :)' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't have a webcam' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'sch1 substance, yet we have medical products out there gentically altered for specific healing purposes..seems legit' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're not interested, they're too busy looking at child pornb' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'my webcam has foil taped over it' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'the new ios is able to suck secret info directly from your brain. even underwater' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they don't need your webcam eyeball, they can already watch what you're doing on-screen and if they need audio there's probably one builtin to the webcam (or you have a separate one plugged in.)' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'best they can manage here is keylog' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'hell, NSA has secret spytech that can hack into a computer that's not even turned on.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or just capture data stream' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'generally that has to be deployed, hans' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and that's Intel Core processors and newer' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's rather limited what they can do with desktops, what's easier to steal is anything on a smartphone' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bob cvrow died aged 52' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'cliff notes?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'one less communist scumbag in the world, i guess' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'tigernuts thinks everyone is a communist' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'thanks obama!' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bob crow -was- a communist, he said so' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-26527325' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'be that as it may, my statement stands on its own merit' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'got an american link? not clicking that uk shit' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well given he's a brit, then 'no;, gruagach' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'is he related to Jim?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'pass.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'sigh' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there you go, gruagach: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Crow' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'wikipedia..pass' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'now you are just being obstenate' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i'll do this myself, thanks' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'anyone can write on wikipedia, how is that fact' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it has references, anyone can check references' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i wouldn't rely on msnbc for facts if i were yo' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is there anyone else left other than Gruagach who hasn't twigged that all news media is biased, and that it's actually worse to avoid sites because of perceived bias than it is to include many sites but understand the nature of the bias and make the necessary corrections' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'u wot m8' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Purple HazeKnight: 'I feel like you just asked the most futile question ever, Tigernuts' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'is there anyone else besides tigernuts who thinks they can comprehend the true nature of the bias in the media?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: '"mirite or am i right guys"' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Purple HazeKnight: 'I dunno, I think he can comprehend Deal or No Deal just fine' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i can't comprehend Noel Edmond's taste in shirts' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'must be a paedophile thing' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://news.yahoo.com/ukraine-wont-intervene-crimea-president-224530588.html;_ylt=AwrBJR7lkh9T9yEAWO_QtDMD' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is that Ukraine basically surrendering?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bad economic figures coming out of china, should mean stocks down tomorrow' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'about a third of all Medicaid eligibles under Obamacare rules are convicted criminals. We're paying to keep crooks healthy. :P' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what are they convicted of?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'anything, violent crimes, possession, etc.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so not evitable criminals' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so much as 'people in prison'' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the implied suggestion was that without Obamacare these people would've been denied coverage, thereby leading them to return to crime.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'didn't you just say they were on medicaid?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, I said eligible (ie, they can now go on medicaid)' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they couldn't before?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'apparently not.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what makes them think insurance coverage will stop them reoffending?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I wonder what percentage of the population has been convicted of a crime.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'better/more access to medication.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's illogical, Hans, what's the link?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2014/03/11/justice-dept-at-least-35-of-people-eligible-for-obamacares-medicaid-expansion-are-ex-convicts/?partner=yahootix' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'criminals commit crime because they don't have affordable healthcare? It's a nonsense, otherwise the UK would have much lwoer crime' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you think criminals shouldn't get healthcare?' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I think I shouldn't have to help pay for it. If they want it, they should work hard and spend their own money.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you're just against ACA altogether' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'very much so.' T3/r7/2014-03-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'personally think you'd have been better off with a government-provided health insurance product as a competitor, with subsidies on it for the less well off, paid for by a tax on health insurance' T3/r7/2014-03-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'weird news: "Parent Appalled Over Essay Asking 8th Graders If Theyd Rather Be Slaves Or Factory Workers"' T3/r7/2014-03-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'latest NSA mass spying plans: https://firstlook.org/theintercept/article/2014/03/12/nsa-plans-infect-millions-computers-malware/' T3/r7/2014-03-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not news to anyone who watched chaos conference this year' T3/r7/2014-03-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'good vids' T3/r7/2014-03-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they were indeed' T3/r7/2014-03-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'heh. a crimean local said that the police is checking peoples passports and rips couple of pages off from the wrong ones' T3/r7/2014-03-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'from whom are those criminal police taking orders' T3/r7/2014-03-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'criminal police take orders from criminal governments' T3/r7/2014-03-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) 2/3 Flying VampireDude: 'abby hoffman or bobby seal? and is that spelling rivht?' T3/r7/2014-03-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'lol, there's a church in South Florida that's putting in a drive-thru for prayer services.' T3/r7/2014-03-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wow, that is so 1960s' T3/r7/2014-03-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'good thing we don't tax churches' T3/r7/2014-03-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'Thirty Years' War: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvdbDw5bXnQ' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'MH370 will probably go down in the books as an example of ignorance and stupidity.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what the hell were the military thinking?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nah, Malayasions are mostly irrelevant, not likely to be in an important history book' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'Perhaps it's of the nations interest not to reveal exactly how good, or perhaps in this case, how poor their radar surveillance is or their air space.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(malasians)' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'of*' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'their not doing too good a job.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i'm laughing just listening to the statements made by our politicians and military.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'maybe the flight mh370 was boarded by those the malasians wanted euthanised ' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'malaysians* zade.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'it has been theorised.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Zade is trolling, Jopari. He dropped the y to twist the moniker into a pejorative.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'ie, defective/bad asians' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari grins evilly. T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Hanslanda is insulting the Malayans by saying that mispellings are perjoratives' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i might've taken offense, but we don't exactly have great representation.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(misspellings)' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'though honestly we must be quite a marvel, highest car pricing, highest corruption rate, smuggling, education screw-ups...etc...' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jopari sighs. T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'so what's up in Crimea exactly? what's with NATO getting dos-ed?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Russia wants to take over. What more do you need to know?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'but lowest land! Almost..' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Smart move! ElFeneri tries to start some discussion about the weather, hoping no one noticed his last mischan. T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Nato is getting DOS (Disk Operating System) ?!? - that is somewhat last century' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'denial of service attacks.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Taokan: 'hello? I'd like to buy the internet, please' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those soviet hackers are acting like terrorists' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'what's your take on it?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Russia isn't doing anything more than the US would have done.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'jumping in w/ military force? then holding it despite protests from others?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'yep.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'maybe, how do you think NATO, britain, etc,etc will react?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jopari: 'i see we have returned to normal.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts chuckles politely. T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'britain will do almost nothing, btw, some minor bitchy visa suspensions that mean nothing' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'given the discovery of this piece of ringwoodite from the mantle transition layer, do you think there's oceans of water trapped 300 miles belowground?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the latest hypothesis says there's potentially as much water trapped there as is in all the oceans of the world.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'hypothetical oceans, 300 miles below, where the magma is - (plays laughtrack)' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there is a remote possibility that the ocean waters cooled the magma there - nah -- likely be steaming hot though, and under a lot of pressure, just waiting for a "what ne worry" human to drill down there' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'so far we haven't been able to drill below 7 miles' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the repuvlican christains: "so that is where all the Noah water went, 300 miles underground!" (snickering laughtrack of atheists)' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Republican christians speaking seriously: "So that is where all the Noah water went, 300 miles underground!" (added laughtrack provided by snickering atheists)' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'zade, you're confusing 'republic christians' with inbred american fuckwits' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I wonder what the recommended daily intake of pot is?' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'recommended none.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'but pot is less dangerous than sugar, and that poison has one.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's almost criminal that we let our kids have so much access to it.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'you can kill yourself by drinking too much water, but I wouldn't recommend going without it.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'marijuana is far more dangerous than sugar' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'especially for children' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'oh, it is? Guess it was just the 25%ers making the claim. They still think the sun revolves around the Earth.' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'an interview with a seal team member suggested that the reason why no pictures of Bin Laden's assasination were posted was because they "riddled" him with bullets post-mortem' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though it's more likely thy didn't want people to realise it wasn't actually him' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'tsk, indecency by USA seal to a dead arabian human body - yeah that be "popular news" in the Arab middle east ( not! )' T3/r7/2014-03-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'they may even demand that Obama return the Peace prize' T3/r7/2014-03-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'if a cop has been arrested several times including dui (2x the limit) assault and battery (on another officer) should they continue to be alowed to be a cop?' T3/r7/2014-03-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'no brainer right?' T3/r7/2014-03-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ooh, Vallejo California is about to go bankrupt' T3/r7/2014-03-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'statistically speaking, it is about 9000 times more dangerous to see a doctor in the US than it is to hang out with gun owners.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) 2/3 Flying VampireDude: 'should catalonia, crimea, texas, and ingushetia be allowed to secede ?' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wow, western media still peddling the myth that Crimean is Ukrainian and that the Crimean referendum was somehow invalid' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'there were 120% more voters than people in crimea.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'All of the reports I have heard from Crimea indicated that the reports question started Pro-Russian versus Pro-Ukranian arguments, and then the result is 97%-3% seems unlikely.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'military occupation, voter intimidation, and no free press = no free election' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the referendum was watched by Austrian poll observers who said it was fine' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'military occupation arguable, no voter intimidation was reported, and no free press is normal' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'lets see a free election in Chechnia and lets see the Russians agree to abide by the results.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the tartars didn't vote, there was 83% voter turnout at a 97-3 vote, even if the 17% voted against, it would have still been a landslide' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'let's see a free vote in the EU' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if nothing else it proves it has nothing to do with perceived legality and everything to do with superpower agenda' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I don't think the level of press freedom in Crimea was normal for the Ukraine.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it is' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Ukraine has been in failed-former-soviet mafia state since it's independance' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'thats true' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Election was also after military intervention, not before.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which makes it 1 election better than in mainland Ukraine who had a regime change at gunpoint' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's nato playing tug of war with russia over ukraine resources and tactical position. -ALL- other issues are secondary or irrelevent' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the nearest equivalent would be Russia funding dissident political groups in Puerto Rico to a point that an armed uprising ousts the democratically elected government' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'yes, NATO wants democracy and freedom for people, it seems be their main goal and causes conflict with Russia' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'NATO couldn't give a flying fuck about democracy and freedom for people' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it cares about maintaining control of it's territory and defending it from outsiders' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'nearest equivalent would be for the US to sieze checnia and pass out ballots.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they already did that in Ukraine, just without the ballots' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the best thing we could have done is not gotten involved' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Puerto Rico has had ballots about its future.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'The Ukranian people should have been allowed to protest. It was a peaceful protest until the government attacked.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and that's different to any western country how?' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'the US had the Occupy movement and in order to get arrested they had to block the Brooklyn Bridge.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'People have died in G8 protests in the UK, many people have been arrested and/or wounded in protests in the UK' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the snipers in Ukraine are of questionable provinence' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Anarchists don't have the right to stop the G8 which is usually what has been attempted.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oh right, so those are anarchists, but ukrainians were 'peaceful protestors'' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Right they didn't try to stop the government from meeting.' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like the nato promotes freedom and democracy, provided it's THEIR democracy voting in THEIR candidates, and provided the freedom doesn't threaten their dominance' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't recall any g8 protest stopping the government meeting' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only reason ukrainian protest didn't stop the parliament meeting was because of the ring of armed forced protecting it' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'after the agreement was breached by the protestors and the president fled, the defenders stood down' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'they have tried to stop the meetings, they haven't succeded because of the military presence protecting 8 world leaders (and whoever they bring with them.)' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i hope very much it comes to blows' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mainly because everyone involved can go fuck themselves' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'somebody with an agenda is (usually) funding (and organising) the protesters' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, zade, and thankfully we know exactly who in this case' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'meantime, here in the UK tomorrow the chancellor reveals the budget for 2015, so i'll be needing to lube up my arsehole and bend over and prepare to be financially raped' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it won't be long before our basic income tax rate is 40%' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'what is it now?' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '20, though the mean tax burden is 39.7%' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'for me it's closer to 60%' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people with kids tend to have a much lower tax burden, because being an overcrowded island with the highest population density of any non-city-state country in europe, our government readily encourages childbirth and immigration' T3/r7/2014-03-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i would say the UK government is dumb as a box of rocks, but I fear nearly all governments are' T3/r7/2014-03-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'result of UK's budget speech today: UK continues to go down the toilet. Yay!' T3/r7/2014-03-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'allegedly a school principle in the USA had her contract not renewed because she'd asked her students to speak English at school' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) 2/3 Flying VampireDude: 'should i do more for spring break.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'funynus are the best stoner food, debate me' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'funyuns although good do not beat out cheetos' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'while close, funyuns provide a unique flavor without all the mess' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'as well as you can put them on your fingers, on your tounge' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'Thats true there are more ways you can play with funyuns' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'they do make your breath smell like ass, and makes gum taste funny..' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'hmmm new product. Funyungum' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'dude' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'million dollar idea' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i like those stoner mix bags, like chex and cheetos and funyons..you ever see those bags, and pretizles' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wars: 'I love the cheatos ones with all the wierd shapes. and munchies are good too doritos pretzles cheetos and cheese nips all in the same bag' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a food or gum that gives users bad breath -- not cool' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a food that results in ass-breath is only likely to be popular anong the gays' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no nuclear war yet. so disappointing' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i'm an economic hit man' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well done, best get on twitter' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'british news is obsessed with that dumbarse missing aircraft' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'everyone is' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'they have licence to make up the whole thing..any senario is likely duurr' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'verge of war on multiple fronts, US congress is in open revolt against the US intelligence services, but as long as there's an aircraft missing that isn't even ours' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'alex jones?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, i'm not Gruagach' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'ON RECORD!' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'conjecture: either the Malaysians or the Vietnamese shot that plane down [unless the British or the USA want to take credit]' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i did see a report out of russia suggesting that it had been diverted via fly-by-wire to Diego Garcia because of 'cargo of concern'' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but quite frankly,i wish it'd turn up crashed so that they can fuck off and stop infecting the news with pointless bollocks' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'maybe it was a blackhole!!' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like an msnbc-level explanation' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'maybe jesus took it' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'he took the wheel' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that sounds like a Foxlevel explanation' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'another conjecture: the US intelligence services are responsible for "disappearing" that plane, so as to distract Congress' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'either way, they're dead, move on' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Or living on Mars.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'One or the other' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Well, the moon. They probably wouldn't have had time to make it to Mars yet.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like a stephen hawkins answer' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'how did they get to the moon tho?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'there wasn't really an MH370 flight. Hollywood created it as a hot teaser for their next big movie.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'maybe they stole the moon, i seen it in a movie once' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'russians stole it, gruagach' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'I would imagine jets have enough thrust to break gravity' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'russians also killed jesus' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'imo aliens took em to mars' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'but jesus can rez..so like did he really die for your sins man' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'russians didn't kill Jesus. He's currently working as a barista for Starbucks.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Stephen King "tvmovie" was a few episodes - ludicrous story - "The Langoliers" (sic) - aired last century - featured a white cast -- unlikely the Malaysians did a recast' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fuck starbucks, tax dodging arseholes' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'yah, only starbucks and walmart avoid taxes' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and google, apple' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'exxon, chevron,shell.bp, target,' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'you know, anyone who does business..' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'any company that has global coverage and multiple offices' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it were up to me i'd set a corporate tax rate of 20% of profits or 1% of revenue' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'whichever is higher' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'tax churchs pls' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, tax free churches is a stupid idea both ways, if you take tax free status as a church you are selling your free speech rights' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'the problem comes when they hold and sell proprtery and never pay taxes on it' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the church "tithes" are already a taxation - no double taxation' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd charge sales tax (20% here) on all property unless it's a residential property and you'r eliving in it' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Juictice: 'tax the rich to help the poor and cure poverty disease' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'how is tithes a tax?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'tax the globalists that are screwing us' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i dont know how it all works, but the only tax should be when you buy stuff' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Juictice: 'tithes are voluntary' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'there should be no random income tax' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'but no one will pay for crack babies milk, so we gotta tax errabody' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'taxes are also voluntary - pay them or else' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'income tax is a necessary evil, just needs to be low and a flat rate' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'taxes.. time to turn off debate' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'tax all income equally..' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it was that or that fucking aircraft, hwua' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i.e stock dividends' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Juictice: 'tax the rich fuckers who cheated and stole their way to the top on the backs of the ninety nine' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'hah 99 what?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you mean the corporatists again, Juictice' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'ows was propted up by unions..you know that right?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'OWS was a waste of time' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'banks got bailed out, we went derp derp' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Juictice: 'im still occupyin' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'ows?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'occupy wank street' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err wall street' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'did you know that unions don't use union labor to man their protests, and that they consider it too expensive to pay such people at union scale?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I so wanted the occupy movement to come up with something useful.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'nothing funded by the koch brothers has ever been useful' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'would have needed them to have a purpose, an agenda, and demands, Malkar' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as it happens it was mostly a bunch of drunk hipsters without a fucking clue' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'you are probably right Gruagach' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the OWS chant: What do we want? We don't know but we're generally unhappy about this sort of thing! When do we want it? At some unspecified time in the future!' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'hahaha tiger made me laugh' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'do i need to kill myself now?' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'please do' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'We will get back to you with our demands after the several thousand of us come to complete agreement.' T3/r7/2014-03-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wouldn't be hard, rip control of your government back out of corporate hands and give it back to the people' T3/r7/2014-03-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'with schools like this, no wonder homeschooling is popular: http://tinyurl.com/q8vhhts' T3/r7/2014-03-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'imagine the fuss if these playgrounds were in the US http://shine.yahoo.com/parenting/the-strangest-playground-on-earth-214600165.html' T3/r7/2014-03-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'umm, do they not let next-of-kin identify dead bodies in RL in the morgue like they do on TV? Some lady spent two days coming to grips that her daughter was dead, only to find out the morgue made a mistake. Said lady was told she couldn't come in to identify because the body was a biohazard.' T3/r7/2014-03-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'naughty biohazard' T3/r7/2014-03-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'if the IRS counts forgiven debt as income and you already owe (and logically if you had that much in backtaxes I suppose you already didn't have enough money to meet all your obligations), wouldn't it be less than a good idea to take advantage of such programs?' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) 2/3 Flying VampireDude: 'does my phone's network signal bars droppinv from 4 bars to zero after every time the word cocaine appears in a text about police efforts in a nearby city cause for alarm? ' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'wassup?' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'this for discussin real life politics or what?' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'I dispute that sir, where is your evidencxe?' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'i dont think i made a statement...' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'I have extensive logs to prove this channel is for the discussion of baloney. Please provide your contrary citations.' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'show me those logs pls, what is baloney?' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'For discovery, you may google Abelinc's logs and search for the term 'debate', as for Baloney, it is a familair term for bologna' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'baloney and logs at http://mikeride.chaosnet.org/abelinc/' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, no reason to google my logs, and no need to search for the term debate, simply look at the debate files...it's all organized :P' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Arnica goes ooOOooOOoo. T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Lemagicien (with the french name from (say) Louisiana) is "talkin'" as though an (illiterate) USamerican politician or a reminiscent imitation of Foghorn Leghorn' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'So not surprised to find this in the debate logs :) 'Thanks, Obama'' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'but did they say "thanks bush"' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'why is Obama to get the "credit"' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'u are taking to much for granted from my name' T3/r7/2014-03-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Lemagicien: 'i have to say im not from the us' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'did anyone in australia listen to question time today?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'are you going to make me talk to myself about politics? :\' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'anyone thing that S&D is taking the fun out of this game?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'think*' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'you can choose not to use it if you think it's not challenging enough' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'gquests are... another matter though' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'that's the problem. also qp earning speed would differ' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'although another problem would be how would you rewrite the rules and enforce it if you don't want S&D style pulgins?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'viva los bots' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'but do you agree with me though? S&D taking out the fun' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'fun depends on the person. many people would/could say that a text-based game is no fun' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'is the debate channel still x-rated?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'dick' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aureolus: 'yeap' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'i thought x-rated would mean we can say penis' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'probably the only reason it's x-rated' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Strr: 'so that we can discuss reproductive parts without having to say 'man part' or 'lady part'' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Don't Bore Xyndor: 'So they declared the plane crashed in the Indian Ocean with no proof of such an event? *shrugs*' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, woman with autistic son often has to be called into his school to deal with him. This time they called her in, she was buzzed in, goes to the classroom sorts out the child - administrator turns up informs her the school has been locked down because she didn't sign the visitor book, cops turn up arrest her take her away' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts claps half-heartedly, clearly unimpressed. T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '+1 for homeschooling' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'which country' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'USA' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'which state' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no issues with autistic kids in the UK, they're all so braindamaged that they get along here' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a moment, i'll look it up for you' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'perhaps sue the school, win enough money to homeschool the child' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'cannot believe the news from "The Onion"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'better than the onion, it was the mail' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it was Missouri' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'originally from local tv station news, KMBV' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'her name is niakea williams and it seems to be legit' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like a grotesque overreaction and jobsworthness' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Niakea" sounds ethnic -- likely racism involved' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'still not as worrying as the camper shot dead by cops' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'quite possibly racism involved as well' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'pretty common for a black woman to be seen as a mouthy black bitch whereas a white/asian woman is seen as a concerned mother, unfortunately' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'regardless of the root cause, however, it also displays an outstanding amount of stupidity on part of the school officials, for butt-covering if nothing else' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, I like the one with the guy who tried to pick up his kids after school, and is told that you can't walk to get them, you must drive up...after the school change the traffic pattern for drive-up pickups to where the line is 2 hours long' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that was great, abe' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and he gets arrested for not leaving his kids' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and for a bit of fun for you: http://www.scribd.com/doc/214240146/DHS-FEMA-National-Exercise-Program-Capstone-Exercise-2014-Scenario-Ground-Truth' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'although that one was more of a protesty thing, he's had dealings with the school in the past and videotaped some of them for youtube posting' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well we have no choice, we must destroy the planet because humanity is too stupid' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "requirement" to drive up to the school indicates the requirement of a vehicle -- perhaps "(class action) suit" against that school' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how does that help when any payout you get comes out of your taxes?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade is in Canada, not the USA T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's like all the lawsuits being won against the police for brutality and false imprisonment over fake gun offences, the money comes out of taxes, so how does it help?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'pass heavier laws against bad police -- long prison sentences' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'probably they want to stop people from walking in between cars to get children, although the way to deal with that is to have walk-ups in a place further away from drive-ups and/or a crossing guard for the walk-ups to get to the parking lots, instead of making ridiculous rules' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I can get children from walking between cars?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada jumps up onto a table and shrieks 'EEEEEEEK!' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'sure tinada, if you have enough candy' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'yuck..' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'seems that in the USA, some in "authority" believe thay may act as abominations with impunity' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'at any rate, the stupidity of people with children around cars cannot be underestimated, there may be a decent reason for that rule being made' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's the nature of authoritarian regimes, zade, and most western countries are going that direction' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'too bad we can't build a device to get energy from stupidity, that would solve a lot of problems' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'about time some citizens volunteered to make an "example" of those abominations' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I've seen people, for example, trying to push a stroller between a large van and the trailer it was towing at the state fair, and others climbing over the hitch while holding children in their arms, meanwhile, the van was waiting for a chance to move and could easily have hurt children' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those seemingly "careless" adults were likely looking to win a lawsuit (at the expense of the children or even themselves)' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'unlikely, more likely they were just too fucking stupid to think about the trailer moving and with a 'ME FIRST' attitude' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more likely the trailer owner will be prosecuted' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the USa is seemingly "populated" with human animals' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wrong Tigernuts, the parents also may be prosecuted' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'far more likely that the parents would sue the fairgrounds/state, who have more money to pay them' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if i were on the jury, i'd deny the claim by those plaintive careless parents' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'as a DA, perhaps charge those careless parents with criminal negligence (unless there were extenuating circumstances)' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'as a "Law & Order" DA, perhaps charge those careless parents with intent to commit criminal fraud through misuse of the legal system' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'good luck with that, I'm just stating that there may be good reasons why the school would make such a rule -- perhaps they had multiple parents walking in between moving cars with their children in tow and were genuinely concerned about an incident' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bumbleton: '-i 10' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there "must" be some criminal charges that may be directed against the administrators of that bad school -- perhaps consult the "Law & Order" scriptwriters for "inspiration"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"While some Free Americans against Socialist Tyranny members are capable of conducting adverse cyber operations, the greatest threat is current government employees sympathetic to their cause," the document adds. "It is believed that there are employees within US Northern Command, U.S. Air Force, U.S. Army, National Guard, and Defense Information Systems Agency that may support Free Americans against Socialist Tyranny doctrine based on individual comments on social media sites. Free Americans against Socialist Tyranny sympathizers may include both former and current members of the military with training on satellite communications, computer network defense, network operations, as well as military command and control."' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(Libertarians and) Republicans seem to be against "Socialist Tyrany"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'republicans and democrats, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this is part of a document prepared by the current government of the USA' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Free Anericans" against "Socialist Tyranny"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i found it slightly disconcerting, but it does reinforce one thing - authoritarian regimes like the USA work to reinforce and insulate themselves from the people' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Free "Anericans against Socialist Tyranny"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the democrats don't see themselves as socialists' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Free Anarchicans" against "Socialist Tyranny"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Free Anarchycans" against "Socialist Tyranny"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you won't get very far if you think the world is divided only into anarchists and tyrants' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Free Anarchists" against "Socialist Tyrants"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts, you supplied the screed with the divisive phrases' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm merely the messenger, direct your anger at your government' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keLRXZJ-yWg&feature=player_embedded' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'socialism can only work if it's voluntary, and socialist governments are not voluntary' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'discuss :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the current USA (Democrat) government is against subversive (Libertarians and) Republicans supporting "Subversive Americans against Socialist Reform"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'words with no meaning, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what you meant to say is that the shadow government will do whatever it takes to maintain their grip on power' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'pfft Tigernuts (statements without substance), since any form of government is (usually) not voluntary' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'People should have the right to make bigotted remarks in a society where free speech is valued. Discuss!' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'damn right they should' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that was a quick end to it :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'oh good - I was afraid noone agreed with me Tiger! :P' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only a complete idiot would disagree with that' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'We have racial vilification laws in this country.. if you make comments of an insulting or basically negative nature in any way - you can be charged at the moment.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the laws here are penned so vaguely that they can basically make it up as they go along' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'While blatent racism is obviously wrong, people should have the right to those opinions.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'an opinion isn't the source of discrimination' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'explain?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'discrimination itself isn't necessarily wrong, either' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'explain? say for argument sake that i said in my opinion women made worse drivers. That isn't discrimination' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'Ok, I understand' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'which oppressive country is Barahir residing' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if as a head of a delivery firm i fired all the women because i believed women to be substandard drivers, that could be considered discrimination' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'Australia' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'Somewhat shockingly to me Tiger, a lot of our employers that require drivers are favouring women locally as they're more likely to take it easy on the vehicles' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Elves are smarter than trolls. As a consequence, you should accept that elves and trolls will have different educational performance, occupations and income. The best outcomes are achieved when policies accept reality, not when they deny it.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'I agree with you.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's technically discrimination, barahir, though if the firms were upfront about their hiring policies, i don't see the harm in it' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i also think it's shit' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'the firms don't outright say it, but they hire just about any female that applies for a position' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'trolls are stronger than elves' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada nods at Zade. T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a lawsuit waiting to happen :-)' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'However, we live in a world which increasingly rewards capacity for symbolic manipulation, since we can use machines to do our heavy lifting.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'this country also has a welfare system that pays you more if you're a native australian than not, ie. of an Aboriginal or Torres Strait Island heritage. That to me is racial discrimination.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Nice for elves, tough luck (relatively) for trolls, although they get the benefit of all the nice elvish inventions.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and you can bet they'll get away with it because they're women. same way as that we all have to have gay culture shoved up our arses whether we like it or not' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts likely formed that misogynist opinion on women drivers after watching the movie "Clueless"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Barahir nods at a bengal tiger. T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'murika is at war with marriage' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'never seen it, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Mostly with the male side of marriage, it seems. Insane post-divorce slavery rules.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's one way to reduce the birth rate of the white race i guess' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'would you like 40 million extra people in the USA?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'depends on which people and what the other effects are..' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'are they black?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some are, gruagach, some are muslim - it's the extra population we have int he Uk that we need to offload to become sustainable' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'no thanks, we need more white people..maybe from iceland or something' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no doubt it would've been lower, but some idiots in charge thought it a good idea to pay out welfare per child' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'wow, thats a horrible idea Tiger. ' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'I was amazed some areas of the UK when I visited last year how few caucasians there were in some places.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'and France.. I'm not sure I met a frenchman in Paris.' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'In London, white caucasians are in the minority' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'we are close here in america' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not so bad in rural areas, but the whole place is bankrupt anyway' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'depending on the cities' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Islam is set to overtake Christianity as the primary religion in the UK within 20 years' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'as a whole not close, but a lot of cities are turning' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more like5 at the current rate' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's weaponised culture for you' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'wake up sheeple!!' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'let me grab my gun' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, don't wake them up' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'sorry, just tuning in... is the sky falling again?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'let them die' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the sky is constantly falling in, that's gravity for you' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but even that's under threat due to global climate change' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i had to take out a mortgage today for new glasses' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thanks to the wonderful way our single-payer government healthcare system works here' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i get to pay twice - once through my taxes, and again when i need the healthcare' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'think of a national health service as one here you pay your monthly insurance fee, get no care and have to pay all expenses' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's an abosolute bargain' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the USamericans are paying far more than twice in the USA -- they pay when a few companies rip out the resources from the ground for next to free, and again when they are unable to earn a decent wage, and again when they suffer from being unable to afford the prices of healthcare jacked up by the rich that robbed 'murika' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thats what you get for entrusting your healthcare to a cartel industry of bankers' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'we actually have people whining that they didnt get to keep their plan that was not deemed suitable for a human' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'and not one question on cost of service, just who should pay for it' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'when you have a captivated market, the cost of service rockets' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you've had it now, though, you've put on the devils underwear' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in teh UK they're privatising the health service by papercuts, net result the same robbing of the system by corporate providers' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i believe the government's best involvement in health care should be to provide low cost competition to a carefully regulated free market' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'whenever i read free market, i just have to laugh' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'show me where free market worked..maybe i'm just stupid' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'free market has always worked' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'okey, name an instance' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'chances are that since you're on the internet, you're benefiting from the free market' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"free market" is diguised socialism and protection for the rich -- the politicians are paid lackeys' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and you're using some form of computer device' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'oh free market, anyone can make a computer' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's because of the free market computers are so cheap' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'okey' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and it's because of the free market computers have continued to innovate' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are plenty of examples of things people believe are free markets, but are not' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'housing, energy' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'healthcare' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'energy was the one i was thinking about' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'here in houston you can choose between 10 companies for electricity.. my rates are higher than my buddy who is in maine who only has one choice' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i bet those 10 companies never collude on price' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and yet if IBM applied more patents etcetera of the first IBM PCs, the computer PC boom may've fizzled, and you'd be paying "Apple" prices on pc computers' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so, are "patents" pro- or anti- "free market"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'can be both, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i feel like i cant argue anything here, i'll just listen' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why can't you argue?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i dont know enough about the topic, i just feel free market never helped anyone but i dont know why' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'never shopped around for something to get a better price?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'never taken advantage of a special offer?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and the concepts of "copyright" -- pro- or anti- "free market"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'yah, and thanks to regulation i didnt buy somethign that exploaded' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do regulation necessarily isn't anti-free market' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'isn't necessarily, even' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'tylerone was into regulation...' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'eep!' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'kinda important, look what happened to the financial markets when you deregulated them, 2008' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'nothing?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the biggest financial crisis in the world?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'you are saying that was caused by deregulation?' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the *numerous* regulations on the food induatry -- pro- or anti- "free market"' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, gruagach, i'm saying exactly that' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it was also exacerbated by lots of other things, but that was the root' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'k' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'eat any roadkill burgers recently' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we all eat roadkill burgers here, we can't afford meat' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'thats enough internet for today for me' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'mmm, ratburgers' T3/r7/2014-03-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'deer and vauxhall bumper burgers' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Brimestone: 'sup' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't ever go camping in new mexico' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'you no like the tarantula?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more worried about random police shooting at you' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they're probably not police. Probably cartel.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'don't they have some satan worshippers there?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who knows' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'did you catch Obama's weird speech about Crimea today?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I don't pay attention to that monkey' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, that's probably wise' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Gorun: 'wow' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wow?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he thinks I'm being racist.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'does he?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what is he, some kind of retard?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's a typical response of the political black person. Race is ALWAYS a factor, even when it's not.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are plenty of politically active black folks that are both intelligent and effective' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama isn't one of htem' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Pumpkin: 'http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024542882' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'this is the basis for my "black people are racist" stance--because they (probably, given their age) live in a world full of racial injustice, they assume that anyone they interact with is racist against them.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's the democrats for you' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigerniys is obviously racist against those of the "Barack Obama" category' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is barack obama a race?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'unfortunately, no. It's enough of all sectors. There are many "celebrity" figures who have either honestly or publicly gotten past the racism stuff, but even among the "uncle toms" (their term for conservative republican-voting blacks, not mine) there are too many who think this way.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'and unfortunately, there's still a lot of racism out there ... as well as a lot of people who blame racism for things that it shouldn't be blamed for' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Barack Obama is an "uncle tom" lackey, but then with the rich supplying the election monies, any president is likely to be a "lackey"' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's criminal what the establishment has done to black culture over the last 50 years' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'speaking of which, what do you think about Nick Cannon's latest antics?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who is he and what has he done?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: '#whitepeoplepartymusic' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that doesn't help' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'dressed in whiteface basically' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'wasn't it?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he's created an alterego to promote his April 1st album release.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so... nothing new there then' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and he probably looked like a twat, so far yet to see a problem' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and he probably looked like a twat, so far yet to see a problem' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'whoops' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'define "twat" - other than a female sexual part' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the response has been fairly muted so far, almost tolerated even. Doing the same with blackface, though, can get you fired, fined, and blacklisted.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well then, that just highlights hypocrisy, which is always a good thing' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=twat' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'there's a horse joke for the taking there, but damn if I can recall how it goes.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'politically-correct abominations dislike blackface and maybe jews (Al Jolsen was jewish)' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'number 5, zade' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Al Jolsen did blackface -- did they blacklist Al Jolsen yet' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i find it difficult to give much of a toss about celebrities' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he didn't just dress up in whiteface, though, he put lots of amateurish effort into acting the part as well.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'especially shit rappers' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'crappers' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more worried about my stupid Uk government NGO's wanting to ditch toxic waste into our water supply' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'didn't they have something in the news recently about the security camaras?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i guess everything must be fine, Gwyneth Paltrow and Chris Martin are to seperate' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'puts ww3, police brutality and world poverty in perspective' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"black culture" as in "crap rap" - that "crap rap" is bordering on "criminal"' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '50 years ago was 1964 -- the world was different then' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more black babies were aborted in NYC than were born' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(last year)' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'excellent -world is overpopulated -- although contraception is to be prefered - blame the repiublicans and the christians' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i disagree, blame the disintegration of society and home life caused by goverments usurpation of a role traditionally taken by religion' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they want the government to be the parent' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the fake femenist movement has a lot of the blame too, but they're created/promoted by the same people' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you realise that next you'll be prosecuted for turning down sexual advances from a person who is of opposite sexuality to you' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're a leaky wet fart's distance away from such things already' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"the government be the parent" is partly a result of (expletive) politically-correct meddlers that criminalise parental behaviour unacceptable to their intolerant opinions - and some of your opinions Tigernuts are defective, so perhaps partly blame the "Tigernuts" category' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what is defective?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and are we using the Zade definition of defective, which is "disagrees with Zade"' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what would Jesus say' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Matthew 7:3 or 7:5 or 7:1-6 ' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Jesus is a submissive homo. He says if someone slaps you you should turn the other cheek.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zade 'd normally supply the scriptures, but the Tigernuts technique is to assume the channel does the lookup (in the NT Bible) [unlikely]' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Jesus Christ was a holy heterosexual, and, being without sin, was neither horny, nor depraved, nor homosexual ' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Hanslanda insult to the Christian religion does indicate the gender preference of Hanslanda' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(playing the part of a submissive Jesus in the soap reenactment is Sheldon Cooper of tBBT)' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'omg..obama made an offhand comment about a nuke going off in new york..and all the teatards are losing their shit' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a new word!: "teatards"' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'another label for the morons living off the government, or are you making an insensitive reference to those babies who have problems latching onto mom?' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"teatards" --> teapartyers' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'teahadist if you will' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Hanslanda, "teetards" is spelt different to teatards' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'the tea party started off with such great foundations... then the social conservatives "take back 'merica!" folks took over :(' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'teet is not a word, Zade.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'backed by the unions and big business..such a great foundation' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the little dangly bit that babies suck on is referred to as a teat.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'but are teapartyer teatards "living off" the government' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'yes.' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'most of the states that support the tea party movement are some of the highest in welfare from the federal goverment' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's probably not a tea party exclusive' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'google image search tax dollars spent vs raised..' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'all red states, outside of texas..all collect more than they put in' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'seems the teaparty movemnent is" less government, less taxes, less services, less everything, except capitalistic taxfree greed and unbridled exploitation' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade is not sure what the teaparty movement is about other than something to do with the boston tea party T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unless the teaparty movement is simply a disguised: "no Obama - he's from Kenya" ' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'but yes edward, canadia is good' T3/r7/2014-03-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unless the teaparty movement is against everything bad -- ordered anarchy!' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'The bible is nothing but rape and slaughter, argues Zade' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Jude 1:13 (loosely paraphrased) "Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own confusion: wandering (wannabe) stars, to whom the storm of darkness is reserved for ever."' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Jude 1:10 "But these men blaspheme whatever things they know not: and what things soever they naturally know, like dumb beasts, in these they are corrupted."' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Jude 1:8 "In like manner, these men also defile the flesh and despise dominion and blaspheme majesty."' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'what do you think about making college mandatory in the US?' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'stupid idea' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'mandatory? not everyone graduates from high school.' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I believe a college education is a good thing, but it shouldn't be mandatory.' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'why so? Keep in mind that the unemployment rate for college grads is 3.4% or so, 6.x% for high school grads, and nearly 10% for dropouts.' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'you can go to tech school for plumbing rather than a college. I don't know any unemployed plumbers.' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'some people don't have the motivation for college and it would be a waste of money for them to go and fail.' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'plenty of opportunities for non-college-grads, and college education offers no benefits for quite a few occupations' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'vegetable-sellers, actors, actresses, waiters, waitresses, toilet-cleaners, janitors, hoes, call girls, mistresses, may definitely do with a college education' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'that way no one hears you' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'reading story on the 2 oklahoma death row inmates suing to know who makes the lethal injection cocktails, worried that they might be conscious but unable to communicate during the execution (they're not challenging their convictions or death sentences)...one of them was convicted of the rape and murder of his girlfriend's 11-month-old daughter' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'fuck you and your rights, I hope you ARE awake through the whole fucking thing, and it takes 3 or 4 tries' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'whats wrong with a baseball bat to the head?' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'hella lot cheaper' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'perfectly humane' T3/r7/2014-03-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kylac: 'i think we should carve their hearts out with a spoon!' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Barahir: 'People have the right to be bigots: discuss.' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'look out, Turkey has become the west's Iran' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bigotry is a matter of perspective' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'I don't see intolerance as a matter of perspective' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bigotry is not soley defined by intolerance' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it can manifest as intolerance, contempt, hatred, distrust, or fear' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but the prejudice itself could be either justified or unjustified' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is nothing inherently evil about justified bigotry - it's just necessarily the most effective or useful manifestation of an opinion' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unjustified bigotry is clearly wrong' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i, for instance hold in contempt the willfully stupid, have a hatred of authoritarians and those who push to micromanage the lives of others, and fear violent tyranny' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that makes me a bigot by the textbook definition' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'well it is having those feelings based on any number of characteristics that are independant of justifying it' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not the case' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can call someone a bigot because they manifest those feelings about people with those characteristics. They might be entirely justified, but because you are unaware of, or don't share that opinion you still call them a bigot when they arne't one' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's your opinion at that point bereft of basis in objective fact. That makes you a bigot for calling someone a bigot' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts said (paraphrased): "those that are justified in their bigotry are not bigots. and to label those justified bigots as bigots is bigotry"' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'basically' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though said badly' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'better to say, those who hold view whom are accused of bigotry whose views are justified, are not bigots, and to arbitrarily label them as such because you disagree or misunderstand their views are themselves bigots' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'to say that "justified bigotry is not bigotry" is almost "murdering" (or at least straining) the english language' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it is' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm sorry, english language isn't my strong point' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'however, if you understand that concept than i consider that good enough' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so better to define bigotry as unjustified prejudice' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do people have a right to be bigots? yes' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope - too flipfloppy' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like they have the right to enjoy crap (digital) music or smell of petuly oil' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'of course they do but they don't have the right to discriminate in employment or market transacations offered to the public' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'generally correct' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Emm: 'and by discriminate I mean on the basis of protected statuses' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unfairly discriminate would be a better turn of phrase' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unless you add the "unfairly", you are immediately demonising the UK government' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'bigotry is bigotry, so justified bigotry is yet bigotry -- no flipflopping on-off the "bigotry" with dubious adjectives and inadequate justifications' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'no unjustified murdering of the english language' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then you must be very careful who you call a bigot, zade, because chances are you're wrong' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'let's just say it used more often incorrectly than not' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'you Tigernuts are a bigot, even if you believe you are justified in your bigotry' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i am not a bigot, but you are for calling me a bigot' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'big bigot' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: 'its soooo stupid: there was "do you like those ads?" yes/no? in youtube recently. so i have clicked 200 "no's", now they are showing ads without the skip button. idiots' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i dont think i've ever been hit with a youtube ad' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'i get them about 1/3 of the videos' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'you just need an ad blocker then you'll see 0 ads' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'must be why i don't see em' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nods, that's what I'm guessing, scars' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scars: 'i've been browsing with adblock for... wow.... i can't remember a time i didn't really' T3/r7/2014-03-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) .... Hwuaijijal: '30 second ads now.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'hi' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ads are nasty' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, FBI cuts ties with the Southern Poverty Law Center, probably a good thing' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'thanks obama' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's still lots of "Russia could invade at any minute" garbage' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Loony Lachdanan: 'to be fair, Russia could invade at any minute...' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'and obama wants to take your guns!' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'if men can marry men and we have no guns, god will not protect us!' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'by that argument anyone could invade anyone else at any minute, lachdanan' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm beginning to suspect that Gruagach is Zade's bitch' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'thats what they want you to beleive' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's the way he speaks through you without his mouth moving that gives it away, that and his hand down your trousers' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i dont even know who zade is so i'm not sure what you're saying..but considering the source i will guess it is just trash and useless' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Loony Lachdanan: 'Zade is a god amongst men' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'zade > gruagach' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but they're pretty similar, both ridicule anyone they disagree with without having ever expressed a cogent thought in their life' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bobolai: 'what are pretty similar?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'so you think obama is tryign to take the guns, okey..' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'well enjoy your entire day on aard, i'll be back in 12 hours, i fully expect you'll still be here' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doubt it' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that it's Obama's goal to disarm the American public is not in doubt' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'has to if he wants to be a signatory to the UN convention on arms' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he can't do that legally because it requires a constitutional ammendment, so he does it illegally through creeping controls' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) 2/3 Flying VampireDude: 'new england clam chowder and boston clam chowder are different.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'but they are' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): 2/3 Flying VampireDude is agreeing with that Princetonwu person again... T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Don't Bore Xyndor: 'suddenly I find myself wanting some clam chowder. origin does not matter.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'i'm eating one now :)' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Don't Bore Xyndor: 'a clam?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'yep ' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'food, on the debate channel -- you are deliberately attempting to ruin debate -- i've seen how irc chat-rooms are ruined on IRC' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Don't Bore Xyndor: 'we cant debate food?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'you were not debating food, you were gluttonising' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'mmm this chowder is SO GOOD' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Don't Bore Xyndor: 'sue me.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'sea food is vile-tasting - reeks horridly -- likely diseased or infected with something' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'what would you consider is edible?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some humans are without a keen sense of smell, and they die sooner' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tylertwo: 'tofu' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'even if the association is there, you have to prove cause-effect :)' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'yeah i dunno i tried to jam the jam but it didnt work' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'crumbs' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bbc news reported that turkey had banned access to youtube because someone had "leaked" a secret recording of their top military brass planning military actions in Syria' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what the bbc didn't point out that this content showed that they were talking about deliberating attacking themselves (a religious tomb monument of significance) trying to make it look like the Syrians in order to justify military intervention' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'd have thought the content was noteable, wouldn't you?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'well calvin told me a hard head makes a soft $ but a hard .i. make the $3x last' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'a hard head makes a soft $' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'hey i cant post certain characters' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'good' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so the Turkey turkeys don't want the Turkey public to be as informed as the nonTurkey world' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, just another NATO ally being caught red handed in dodgy military dealins while hypocritically talking down to Iran and Russia' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Turkeys are attempting to emulate the 1939 Nazis' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'trying to emulate the USA' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tigernuts, you saying that the USA attacked the USA at 9-11' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's likely that they allowed it to happen, what is certain is that USA attacked USA in the Gulf of Tonkin to promulgate the Viet Nam war' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's also certain that USA got Israel to attack USA in order to try and get USA into the war there in the 1960s' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's also widely suspected that intelligence about prior knowledge of pearl harbor was suppressed in order to allow the attack to enable USA to enter WW2' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's a common military tactic, doesn't make it right' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'the humility of peace?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'best thing to do to Turkey is cook it in a warm radioactive bath' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'certainly be time to leave the EU if it joins' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fil?' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'if you're in the EU, just leave if you can.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'don't wait' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not up to me' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'did anyone else read about this ludicrous sentence - a mixture of one year jail and probation for manslaughter? what is the world coming to? http://news.msn.com/crime-justice/ex-famu-band-member-gets-1-year-in-hazing-death' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'hazing automatically make s me thing the person that hdied had a chioce at some point' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'base federal guidelines for involuntary manslaughter is 10-16 months' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'man ive done more time for doing 1000 dollars worth of damage to someones property' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'no idea the specifics of that case, though' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'well if you want to read about it its linked in the comm logs' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'hazing is a worse crime than racism' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'Yeah, who's line is on, so...nope.' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Madcatz: 'whose line*' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'the issue is someone died' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'someone was beaten to death by a bunch of people' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'i dont understand how it was done in the spirit of hazing has any relevance' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the lenient judge on that hazing killing desrves to be hanged drawn and quartered' T3/r7/2014-03-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a mob killing - a murder by hazing' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'looks like Title IX is to be applied to spectation now. What a shame.' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'how is it that Ukraine had combat dolphins but the US doesn't? That's just insane!' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'oh, we do. hmm.' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'HS teacher fired for taking student to ER? Makes me wonder what for. It would be pretty awesome if it were something serious but not entirely 911ish enough to require a speeding amulance, but not-awesome if it were some sort of end-run like Plan B.' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'seems she's paid medical bills for students at the er before, been instructed not to do it, warned, and given suspensions' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'according to the school' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'you know they detain you indefinately in hospitals then charge the government like 1000 dollars a day' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'You can leave AMA.' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'its a huge scam' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'any citation that this is a common occurance ?' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'occurrence ' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'ive been detained in hosptals for as long as 5 months in one setting' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'it varys from 2 weeks to 2 months 3 months sometimes' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'what did they say they were detaining you for? mental issues?' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'medical issues?' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'they said they couldnt discharge me till they had a place to put me' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'were you underage or something? why do they need a place to put you?' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'it doesnt make sense tho - one day in the hospital is the cost of a month of houseing in a halfway house' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princetonwu: 'you cannot leave AMA if you have a 5150 hold' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'no i was like mid s30s' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'if you have private insurance - the insurance refuses to pay for it' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'so where did they put you when they found a place?' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'if you have medicaid they milk you for every dollar' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'most private insurance maxes out at 2 weeks' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'i mean its the billing policy that enables the stay' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'hospitals always check for billing first' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'its how the government gets defrauded out of hundreds of thousands of dollars' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'when i got shot my 1 week hospital stay and 2 week physical therapy was like 130k' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'ive also generated like 150k hospital bills from being held for 5 months for no reason' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'i never asked to be shot - i never asked to be involuntarily detained' T3/r7/2014-03-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Nitzy: 'and yet thats a quarter million dollars' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, you get stopped by the cops now outside washington or colorado states or having a washington or colorado license plate' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no big surprise there' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'NY/PA border used to pay attention to people buying fireworks in the PA shops' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'perhaps you should just have customs posts at the state borders' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'any news on the planned false-flag attack by Turkey to justify military involvement in Syria and the leak of this discussion that led to TUrkey banning all Youtube access in their country?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'earthquake in LA! Must be anthropogenic global warming caused by the public not giving up adequate rights or tax money' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'quickly, pay al gore money' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'manbearpig, mmmm' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'look on the bright side, the EPA is looking to regulate dairy cow farts' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'we could just stop raising dairy cattle all together.' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'but then what would men eat?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'quinoa beans squash? the three sisters' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'men, not their wives..' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they don't care what you eat, provided it costs you more money' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'well you could be a man and hunt' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nope, that's racist' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'no one ever uses that racist comment.. its called a straw man' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'just because you have a crazy idea and people don't agree with it, doesn't mean they call you racist' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that would require a gun which is illegal (or should be) and hunting wild animals is illegal because the animals are of the earth and therefore belong to the state' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'll eat what your masters give you and you'll be satisfied' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'hunting doesnt require guns' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'you can shoot sticks' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'or even bows just your feet' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'thats why we are long distance running animals' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'tiger did you read about the guy who got arrested for having a muzzle and some home made bullets, without primers?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'america is the best' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no no no, you can't hunt animals, it's what rednecks, terrorists and conspiracy theorists do, you're not a dirty right winger are you?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yup, in DC who are in violation of the supreme court' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'i personally dont hunt or eat animals' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'just stating examples' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'you don't eat meat?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'why?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, i eat meat happily. Vegetarianism is a bit daft imo' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'nope or consume any animal product' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'actually been raw last few months too' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'come on, Sorvez, put bunny in the microwave' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'wow..full in huh..' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'plants are alive you know' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'hah my wife threw our microwave over the balcony years ago' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'they grow, they feel' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'sounds a bit crazy, prob the lack of meat' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'screaning death to the cancer machine' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'she is a little more hardcore then me' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i think the past 3 decades have shown that to be a myth' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is a myth? meat causing cancer?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'think he means micros' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'we have people who's job is to work on cell towers and around high power microwave waves... they seem fine' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'from the research i've seen, people who use cell phones heavily are at higher risk of ear-specific tumours, but other than that, a small proportion of people are sensitive to EMF radiation, but that's abou ti' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'there is already strong correlative data that eating more then 4 ozs of meat a day leads to cancer' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'being alive leads to cancer..' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sorvez: 'no hard link yet but im convinced it is proba ly there' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, sorvez, there's also a strong correlative link between those eating more than 4 ozs of meat a day and being fat and unhealthy' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'thats cool man, just as long as you know how crazy it sounds to other people sorvez' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'everything causes cancer' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'practically all the meat is dangerous studies have fatal design flaws and/or are misinterpreted' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'for instance, it is only in the past 2-3 years we've been seeing studies differentiating between actual red meat and products containing heaps of shit + some red meat' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, the episode of "Surviving Jack" the other day, he says something about working with people with cancer...his wife says that he just works with patients, not people with cancer...he replies everyone has cancer, it's just a question of to what degree' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're trying to stick fluoride in our water here, some crackpot corporate health NGO, despite the fact it's been proven time and again that it does not help dental health but does cause brain damage to infants' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'the causes of cancer are complex, but to feed cancer cells properly, it appears that you need carbs and insulin, remove that and they don't stand much of a chance' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'wait..' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a scientific paper doesn't make something accurate' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'i didnt know you were that type of person tigernuts..it all makes sense now' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada points at Tigernuts and yells 'EEEEEEEEEK!' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'next you'll be telling me the peer review process isn't perfect' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they were even talking about pumping statins into the water supply' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'peer reviews aren't perfect...' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the peer review process is useful, but it's still a bunch of people moderating another person's work. If the moderators are fucknuts then dodgy stuff will get through' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'a little bit of bad science + a product = profit :)' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'stock phrase, an uncorroborated "proven time and again", so there! QED!!' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'much like opensource isn't bug-free' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada nods at you in agreement. T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Legendary Gruagach: 'zade, throw in an "on and on and on"' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'and if everyone agrees that the earth is flat, peer reviews/editors/whatever won't like round-ish earth theorists' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I loved the episode of shark tank where the guy came on with the ion wristbands and cuban basically laughed in his face' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the nba ended up getting a contract for similar merchandise so cuban had to sell them anyway at some point' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'stringing the Tigernuts two 'gems' together: "proven time and again", "a scientific paper doesn't make something accurate"' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Vost snickers with Zade about their shared secret. T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how would you like to trim some of my quotes word for word to make something completely new, Zade? MSNBC-style?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'Redryn is convinced that your "invitation" is likely a veiled "insult"' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts peers intently at Redryn. T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'Perhaps MSNBC "style" is leftist ignorance?' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'shh i'm channeling' T3/r7/2014-03-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i might need to 'lean forward' to understand what they're saying' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bobolai: 'so is it a good way of saving money on unemployment?' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bobolai: 'and encourage muricans to work?' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i see' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ooo, long island residents are going to be subjected to warrantless searches/inspections of their house if you are suspected of having an unregistered tenant' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is one thing right with this policy, and two things wrong, hopefully someone can name all 3' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rev 13:17 "And that no man might buy or sell, but he that hath the character, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name."' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'also reminiscent of "registered tenants"' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i was actually less concerned about the tenant registration, living in a country that has an electoral role' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'roll*' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'new study finds women who drink 2 diet sodas a day or more are 30% more likely to have a heart attack and 50% more likely to die early as a result of heart problems' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the evils of aspartame and nutrisweet' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'diet colas are painful to drink - diet colas cause pain and discomfort' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'any soda is painful to drink. What's wrong with water?' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the added chemicals and pollutants in "ordinary" tap water' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'then buy bottled water' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "ordinary" tap water tastes horrid' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'that depends on where you live' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "bottled water" tastes worse - the plastic taste, and the occasionally added poop taste' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'sounds like you should continue drinking soda' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'at least "tap water" is handled less than "bottled water"' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're fine with filtered tap water or natural spring water' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this has to be seen, Obama speaking in Europe, note the rapturous applause he receives at the end' T3/r7/2014-03-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mVFrdWIs2LI'