T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'any liberals here still haven't worked out that Obamacare isn't universal healthcare and is in fact just a tax paid to insurance companies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hey in the bible, in hebrews, where it refers to moses's parents hiding him for 3 months because he was a perfect child...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'does that mean he doesnt have the baser messy habits like diaper soiling and crying, or is it some other sense?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hmmn, i guess nobody has the new testament handy, i ll ask later :('
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bible bashing isn't what it used to be'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baron Von Mortivorous: 'yeah, it's so 2000 years ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, but i didnt bash, i asked about scripture in the book of hebrews'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ask a jew'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'learn to read before tossing bout accusations k thx'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts the jews dont have the new testament'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'neither do christians'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'what jew talking bout willis !?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'all we have is the drivel King James's people wrote'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which doubtless bears little resemblance to the original'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'go read the satanic verses.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'rizgoth why? satanists cant answer me regarding scripture'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm sure the book of hebrews is good enough excuse to go on a holy war'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, well, as much fun as that sounds, what about a simple answer regarding that passage?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like a ridiculous question'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) LordSation: 'well it just seems to say she hid him, not nec that he didnt cry or such. maybe she just didnt take him out'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Hebrews 11:23 "By faith Moses, when he was born, was hid three months by his parents: because they saw he was a comely babe, and they feared not the king's edict." [DRC]'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade ah your translation is different than this one'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'this one calls him a perfect child'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"comely" is different to "perfect"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) LordSation: 'For three months he was cared for in his father's house.. not hidden in some far away place or something. most of these translations - translate into fair/beautiful'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baron Von Mortivorous: 'If I'm not mistaken - Hebrews was a letter sent by Paul, thus what he said could be a direct matter of opinion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'improper bible-bashing is not useful to atheists'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) LordSation: 'Acts 7:20 "At that time Moses was born, and he was no ordinary child. For three months he was cared for in his father's house.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) LordSation: 'sounds like he just wasnt registered - or w/e they did back then - with the pharaoh. like they didnt want anyone to know he was born'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'irrefutable bible-bashing is more useful atheists, so they may stickit to the bible-thumpers and christians'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Acts 7:20 "At the same time was Moses born: and he was acceptable to God. Who was nourished three months in his father's house." [DRC]'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'well, it's not that he wasn't registered, it's that newborn hebrew boys were to be killed...I'm sure moses wasn't the only one hidden :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Acts 7:21 "And when he was exposed, Pharao's daughter took him up and nourished him for her own son." [DRC]'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's why he was later put into the basket to be found and raised by a non-jewish family'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a lot of the Old and New Testament is fiction'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's certainly one popular opinion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'so if they hadnt wanted children, they could've just reported the birth rather than have an abortion or the like?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no such thing as abortions'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc well nowadays they have them'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'post-natal abortions'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'no, just expose the kid instead.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so if only they had a time machine, they could've chosen abortion...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'that does not seem logical -- time-machine (back) to where -- at contraception perhaps'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it makes as much sense as suggesting that us having abortions now does :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc well having abortions now is popular.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'not as popular as marijuana or alcohol, but very popular'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which has a lot to do with the options available to a family thousands of years ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'that's a weird comparison'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it does when it spans a popular motif'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'much like parents nowadays, often single mothers, wishing to avoid having children... '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'the parents back then could perhaps just report the births of the children, and have the problem dealt with'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'a thousand years ago, putting unwanted kids in the forest was a popular option... I call that progress'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the state is killing off families'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the parents now can as well'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr the forest, really?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'forest, plains, whatever, exposing children was not at all uncommon'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'i heard it was rivers back then'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ah. k'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Ranrr, putting unwanted kids in the forest is progress ?!?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'drive to your nearest safe-haven state, drop off the kid at the nearest hospital/police station, forget you ever had it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'so basically, that passage is more of ' his parents wanted to keep him' so he was hidden for 3 months?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'No, abortion is progress compared to "the forest"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'would that also hold religious intonations, such as 'he wasnt born of incest or rape or so on''
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr is it? i think involving society in ones killings is less progress than just hiding them from society'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'abortion shouldn't be necessary, but certainly isn't something that should be being legislated for or against at a federal level'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'abortion is not killing imho'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts is there another level?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'state'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'should be up to states'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr here in the usa, there is a legal belief that it depends at what point of the pregnancy it occurs'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'it should be up to the woman'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i agree, though some would argue that it's murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts it's been a long time since i've heard of states legislation in the news... do they still do it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I know about the debate in the US. It's bullshit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, vd'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts cool.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'but here in america people like to make decisions for other people'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'akuri yes, that's true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'That's religion gone wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'some would say that a mother having an abortion is making a decision for another person'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'personally would like to see the timescale reduced to 8 weeks'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a parasite, not a person'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: '8 weeks is not really enough time for some people to even realize they're pregnant'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and if you leave it as strictly the mother's decision, then IMO the father can simply choose to not be the father and choose to not support the kid at all, as long as that decision is made during abortionable stages'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I'd rather put it at the threshhold for where, if she delivered prematurely, you'd pop it inot an incubator.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc i think that when it comes to children, there should be a streamlining of rules regarding abortion decisions, adoption decisions, AND child support decisions...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if she can choose to not be burdoned, why can't he?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Because life isn't fair.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc exactly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '8 weeks is'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Equality between the sexes is a myth.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'putative father offers to finance abortion in first 8 weeks, mother declines, wishes to bring to term... no child support'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, ranrr, talk about a bullshit answer'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'that seems practical, sure.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Abelinc seems to be advocating that the father be able to force the abortion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'alternate scenario : putative father offers child support and payment of hospital costs, offers to raise child alone, just don't abort his baby!... mother declines... aborts'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nope zade'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'It's the mothers decision because it is her body. '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr it's also the baby's body.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'he can just abort his "half" of the kid'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'A fetus isn't a person. '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'what about plopping the kid in an incubator, or a surrogate mother.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr it's a human according to scientists...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'so whether not all persons are humans, seems to be a distinction without a difference... try again?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'No, it's not VD.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'once we get an artificial womb that the father can offer to transfer to, i'll support his right to raise the kid alone :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr yes, it is. it is one of the stages of the human life cycle, you can look it up in a 6th grade or later science text book'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'first and third decisions to abort is the mothers, the second decision to abort or not support is the fathers'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'That seems fair, I'll agree to that, Majic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'majic what about a surrogate mother, willing to transplant a fetus for pay'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'you have to transplant them very early, vd'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'majic that's a matter of timing and coordination, not one of ethics'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'that's how i read and error-corrected Abelinc's suggestion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'majic i think personally i'd prefer the decision to abort came at the point of consenting to sex, itd be a lot less messy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the world is overpopulated -- more contraception (and more abortions) are required'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade oh? why not just have a war.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'education and contraception needed, not abortion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'In any case, whether a fetus is a human being or person or not, is not a scientific question, it's a question of philosophy and legislation. Since an abortion is not murder according to law, a fetus cannot be a person. At least that's how I see it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'abortion is needed when people are retarded'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr non consenual abortion... is that murder?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts the americans in the 70s just sterilized people like that instead'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'hoping you mean diagnosed retarded, rather than normal use of the term'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, i mean normal use of the term'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade ignores the VampireDude troll
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unwanted pregnancies don't spontaneously occur, you realise'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I don't know how the law would see it, but it would probably fall under som other legislation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade, its not a troll friend, teenagers get pressured in every day'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'and people who assault a pregnant woman and her fetus dies'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'they get charged with manslaughter for the loss of life'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Seems fair.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr how so? if it's not a person?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so start giving people implants'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it's a person if we dont want to abort it with a vacuum, but it's not a person if we dont?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'It's a baby in a few months if the woman wants it to be. If not, it's an abortion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'It's not simple. Don't expect it to be.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr whether its a human or not isnt a matter of individual definition, any more than the question the germans asked about whether or not jews were human is up to the individual person'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'anybody that advocates war as an acceptable form of population-control and population-reduction is either a troll, a terrorist, and or (expletive deleteds) [or an advocate of the apocalyptic wrath of (some false?) God] '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or a government, zade'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'If you want to stop women from having abortions, go ahead. If you think a fetus is a person, where do you draw the line? Is masturbation murder?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'that was included in "expletive deleteds" and "terrorist" '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I draw the line at birth. Before birth, fetus, after, person.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's because of it being difficult to draw a line that they are anti-abortion'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr so if you assault a pregnant woman and her fetus aborts... that's not murder or manslaughter right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'similar argument to doctors killing the elderly, is it murder?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Call it whatever you want, it's just legal terminology.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts that's not the same , the doctor's duty is to treat his patient. the elderly is the patient, therefore he has to take care of them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's legal terminology until it affects you'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'with several hundred million sperm per ejaculation, stimulating male emissions is not murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not true, vd'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr so there's no loss of life... its just legal words?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doctors already kill people to save money'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it will only get worse'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Call it assault or manslaughter, that won't change anything.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts you are drawing conclusions before posing your argument... that's not the right way'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Hell is this? Doctors kill people to save money? I come back from a week of not playing to deal with this crap on Debate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'similarly, menstruation is not murder when the unfertilised egg is ejected'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are having a classic debate on abortion? Sane people logic vs. Insane people logic?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what are yo talking about, Yuna? It's common for treatments to be withheld on the grounds of cost'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'And the doctors make that call?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doctors/insurance companies'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '/health boards'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Try again'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they do here'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Here = ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'U K'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it'll happen in the US too'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'a doctor can go to 'bat' with the insurance companies and health boards if he feels like putting his career on the line for a patient that would ' die without care' but that's a far cry from your contestation that the doctor kills a patient to save money'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'given it already happens, VD, it's not a far cry at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'here in the u.s. in some states, like oregon, people are allowed to be given doctor assisted suicide, which IS a doctor killing a patient for some reason'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Fertilized clumps are not people, abort that shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Just out of curiousity, Tigernuts, what is the U.K. equivalent of the Republican party that you must be a member of?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, that's the tories'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, but that's because the patients WANT to die.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The alternate would be for them to use a more painful method that's not even guaranteed to succeed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna or the patient's kids want their old mother or old father to die and leave them an inheritance'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or, you know, just die reaaaally slowly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna yep, dying really slowly sounds painful too... '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I think killing yourself should be an acceptable practice.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'Im inlove eith Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'for example, cancer in the lymph nodes, and having them removed one at a time, rather than getting chemo, could take years to finally die unless the cancer spreads to a more vital place'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'not you. the real character.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr, here in the u.s. it's not illegal except for the military.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Good to know.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I bet Justa looks up FF pr0n'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, the "real character"...oxymoron much?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'justa, aeris is cooler'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the real made-up thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bunsen and Beakerboy: 'actually, the method that right to die societies are using nowadays is pretty humane.  helium, plastic bag over your head.  death is fairly peaceful'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'not you. the real character.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Aeris was stupid to not even trying to save herself. ANd Cloud was stupider for not Phoenix Downing that shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, he should use ' the original character''
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'So in the US you can go to the doctor and ask him for "one death please"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna that's true, but she was way cuter'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr yep... but he charges a lot for it if you dont have insurance'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I bet Justa would be turned on by a necro scene wherein Yuna has some fun with Aeris' corpse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Depends on what version you're going by. FFVII or AC?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it's a lot cheaper to step in front of a bus or so on.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not quite'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'FFx2 is the best game ever. Yuna is the most beatiful evel'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'FFX-2 is the worst game in the FF-series ever. The battle system was wicked, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'justa x2 seemed way too easy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I like FF2 the best, on SNES'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Well, the US health system is broken, we all knew that. Can't I just ask him to "send me the bill"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'Worst. Why ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr, yep, you can =)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'in some states, with well-documented terminal illness, etc, etc, etc...not quite as easy as "I wanna die, do it nao"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'yea but then our tax dollars go to the screw ups that cant get it right the first time'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Yes, I know, the FF otaku nerds call it FF4, I don't care, it's FF2 to me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'SNes ?lmao'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc its as easy as getting worry-free dentures and having your teeth all drilled out'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Shut up, Justa'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'VampireDude is advocating causing public mayhem (disrupting and delaying traffic)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'VD, my mom fought dentists for 15 years to be able to do that'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Back to the debate on assisted suicide: Assisted suicide is permitted in some jurisdictions when the subject would either die anyway or live less than a semblance to a good life. Maybe they're dying of a horrifyingly painful disease with no cure or they are completely paralyzed, without even being able to breathe on their own.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'I think I know starlings age. '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they all said "But we can save the teeth!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc not to insult your mother, but i think chicks with false teeth are ugly'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And yes, I agree wholeheartedly that assisted suicide is a-OK in such cases.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'then you only meet chicks with crappy false teeth'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, or maybe they're poor, and can't afford a wheelchair.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you'd only know my mom's were false if you saw her with them out'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "completely paralyzed" did you not understand? How are they supposed to control their wheelchairs? Telekinesis?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ixle: 'They have that now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There's no such thing as doctors giving (legal) assisted suicide for people who are simply paralyzed from the waist down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ixle: 'You do have to have concious thought though. At least atm.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna there is if they ask for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'you never know, though, where someone might wish to continue living regardless of what's going on with their health issues.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No there isn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'how long do the flashy white capped teeth of celebities and actors/actresses last'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna we disagree.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no VD, there isn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'a lot of people wouldn't want to live like stephen hawking, but last i heard he did want to continue living.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade about 8 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Show us such a case. Or language in the law where it says that's legal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And you heard this where, Fox News?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but as you're debating on what is currently legal, it's not a matter of opinion for you to be allowed to disagree'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna it comes down to quality of life'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some of those celebities look abnormal and almost ridiculous with those humungous flashy teeth'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, show us a case where someone received assisted suicide for simply being paralyzed from the waist down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bunsen and Beakerboy: 'i was under the impression that switzerland had a pretty permissive assisted suicide law. '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if a person's life will only have quality if they get treatment for a disorder or disease, and a reasonable person cannot expect them to obtain it, then it boils down to how long you want to insist they suffer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You claim it happened 8 years ago. Such a case must've generated a lot of publicity, so it should be easy for you to find an article on the subject.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, i claimed that the veneers of celebrity teeth last 8 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'OIC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Still, I want to see sources for your claim that one can get assisted suicide for being a paraplegic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna do try to read my entire sentence before saying i claimed that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '"Under the law, a capable adult Oregon resident who has been diagnosed, by a physician, with a terminal illness that will kill the patient within six months"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'legs paralyzed won't kill you in 6 months last I checked'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I think we should have suicide booths, Futurama style.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc how long does it take a homeless man to starve?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Me: There's no such thing as doctors giving (legal) assisted suicide for people who are simply paralyzed from the waist down'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You: yuna there is if they ask for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's not an illness, and about 35 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bunsen and Beakerboy: '" In order to avoid conviction, the person has to prove that the deceased knew what he or she was doing, had capacity to make the decision, and had made an "earnest" request, meaning he/she asked for death several times. The person helping also has to avoid actually doing the act that leads to death" - wikipedia for assisted suicide in switzerland'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc what if the man's unable to work because he's paralyzed from the waste down, or schizophrenic, or an alcohaulic?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How are either of those things terminal illnesses?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you "special" or just a troll?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, you're too busy living a comfortable life, indoors.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, beaker, so you won't be convicted if you don't do the act that leads to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'you fail to accept that not everyone has the same mode of living.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What difference does that make?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'has nothing to do with what mode of living someone has'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'in oregon, there are tent villages of homeless people... who also can get sick, and can also require care'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What does that have to do with what can and what can't qualify for medically assisted suicide?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and they also can receive care'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And in Africa people are born with AIDS all the time. Assisted suicide for all Africans?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if a person is too poor to treat cancer, that doesnt mean they suddenly can afford to treat muscular dystrophy, or schizophrenia any more easily'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not right wing, and not the member of a party, for whomever asked'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, AND?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna if an man in south africa has aids, and wants assisted suicide, i could accept that morally, '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They simply do not get treatment for those conditions. That doesn't mean they qualify for assisted suicide.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like someone is trapped in a left-right paradigm'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Whether a disease is terminal or not should not be decided by the wallet size'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'ahh, but we're not discussing morality at the moment'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr in the real world, it is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're discussing the law. Not morality or what you THINK should be legal/illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Only in a country without proper health care, VD.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc a matter of morality and legal framework is what is used for the decisions regarding medically assisted suicide, yes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what country has proper health care, ranrr?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'VD, no'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, then we disagree fundamentally.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Well, in Sweden, anyone can get health care. Even poor people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'doesn't matter what you agree with, VD...the law doesn't take your opinion into consideration'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr, even foreigners?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc it does if i'm the provider, or the patient.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'ranrr, in the US anyone can get healthcare as well'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'here in the UK you can get limited healthcare, provided you have the money'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nope VD, just ask jack kevorkian'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He meant for close to nothing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc true, as long as we're able to pay for it, or beg a doctor to work for free.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc ask his patients.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Unless it's dental care or cosmetic surgery.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna dental plaques can cause heart disease.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Dental surgery is included in the swedish healthcare system.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'necessary care cannot be denied in the US based on ability to pay...the latest wunderdrug is not generally considered necessary'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr, maybe i'll move to sweden.. and check it out'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the statement was who lives or dies, not who pays the bill'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"dental plaques" or "dental plaque"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the worst thing to happen to health was health insurance'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc necessary care to prolong life? yes. to prevent emergency loss of life or limb, sometimes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'tigernuts, you prefer a cash and carry system?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not in Sweden. In Sweden it's free or next to free unless it's cosmetic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, nothing's free in sweden'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'My friend contraceted testicular cancer at the ripe old age of 20.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'full cash system, or a government monopoly'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Could anyone with cancer get years of chemo therapy, for free, in the US?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'as nothing is free anywhere'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It costs him either 150 dollars a month or a year (not sure, I think it's a year) for his post-op drugs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts if my taxes are financing military interventions in the middle east, i'd just as soon be financing health care.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And yes, it's financed by taxes, but you know what I mean.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm sure you would'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i would too'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but that isn't a choice you have, or are even being offered'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'It's free for the person that needs it, not for the society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and neither will it be'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bunsen and Beakerboy: 'it's not free.  your ridivulous taxes are what pay for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'something about trying to get people healthy seems more moral than trying to shoot people that grow opium or sell oil'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And yet our standard of living and level of happiness is way ahead of that of the states'.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I wonder how that works.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'beakerboy, thats just it though, my taxes pay for worse things than healthcare'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In fact, among the countries with the highest standard of living, the Nordic countries, i.e. the Socialized Hell Maffia, all make the Top 10.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna its because in your country, you actually help each other in some way, here it's mostly an every dog for himself game'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'standard of living is quite questionable...happiness is quite subjective'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'BTW, health care in the US is the most expensive in the world. It's not the best though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, because the insurance industry runs it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr i disagree, healthcare in the uae is more expensive than in the us'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna, are you saying that homosexual overstimulation of the male sex-organ with rings and other "tight" paraphenalia causes testicular cancer '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, because we don't have ridiculous costs for simple medical procedures and doctor salaries, our health costs are relatively low no matter who pays for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade, lactene.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna do people still become doctors even though they wont become rich?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I have no clue what the fuck wrong is wrong with you, Zade. My friend is straight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Doctors still rank among the highest paid professionals in Sweden. They just don't make as ridiculous amounts of money as in the U.S.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck at million dollar surgeries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna i see.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'not having to pay zillions of dollars in malpractice insurance and student loans probably helps.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'i wouldnt mind becoming a doctor, would probably allow a lot of access to blood.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yeah, university studies is LITERALLY FREE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You USED to have to pay a mandatory 50 dollar student union fee per semester. Not anymore!'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'majic indeed, if medical school cost the same as trucking school, we'd have more doctors,  more supply would mean a cheaper meeting of demand, and a lower cost to consumers'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Free univeristy studies and free healthcare. Boy, I'd like to live there. Wait, I do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr wow, i want to move there now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And taxes aren't that much higher than in e.g. california.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, I love the term "free" being bandied about'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Unless you go for the private kind, ALL schooling is free in Sweden (and also mandatory 'til graduation from Junior High/Upper Secondary School/9th grade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna here in the u.s. its all about the age of the person dropping out of school / or their equivalent based on testing '
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The day you advocate for the abolishment of free fire fighting, police services and roads and highways is the day you ahve a right to complain about people calling tax-financed health free, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nonsense argument, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Go back to your Fox News. If I remember things correctly, 4 years ago, you whined when I complained about Sarah Palin's complete and utter lack of sanity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, today I have the right to complain about people calling it free...as I don't call those services free'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Didn't take her long to prove me right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc i'd call them free if i wasnt part of the tax base'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'It's free for the person that needs them. That's what free means in this context.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then are you calling for an abolishment of all of those things, Abelinc?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, it's not free for the person who needs them'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not free here, either'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'despite everyone claiming it is'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc it is if they arent fixed to the point of being able to work it off :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Oh, abe, where is the cost?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'just like emergency rooms that take federal funds here in the usa'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if a person never works again afterwards, its free'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the only person to whom it's free is a newborn'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How about you just start taxing religious institutions? That'd give you a bajillion dollars to work with.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'newborns, and the retired.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna seems fair, sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nope, not even the retired'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why would you give religious institutions tax exempt status, anyway? What makes them so special?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna if you tax them, god will smite you'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it was a very liberal interpretation of the separation of church & state'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'although, given mankinds track record, most of us get smited around age 50-80 anyways'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How 'bout we re-interpret that stupid interpretation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'If you get your free education, then move out of the country and never pay any taxes, it was free.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You smirk at his saying.
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr yep, a lot of people get their education free, then move to the usa to become rich'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'religious folk pay tithes and taxes -- to tax the tithes is double taxation'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'its quite nice .'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'why are all social policies discussed from their equitability instead of their impact on society?  Wouldn't the latter be a much more important consideration?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade, if one is a member of the kingdom of god, they should only pay taxes to god's kingdom, not to both'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're not talking about taxing religiosu people, Zade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're talking about taxing the religious institutions!'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might think so, milkshake'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is why i get so cross when people just make it about left vs right politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake no; because society will continue with or without the policies'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're getting all of those tithes tax-free. They get to rent/own their churches and land tax-free. Everything they do in the name of their religion is tax-free.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'its not like mexico, where if you starve the poor they consider selling drugs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'but policies have an impact on society, and thats why we make them'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'A lot of people get their education abroad, pay for it themselves, then move here and start paying taxes, so it evens out.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'pretty sure thats why a lot of people in the US sell drugs too :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr i'd love to get my education abroad, but airline tickets are so pricy!'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'swim, walk, or stow away, vampire'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake really? you don't think they sell because they use?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Of course, if you come from the US to sweden, you will not get free education. We have to draw the line somewhere.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Found your own religious institutionl.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake i cant walk 46 km on water =)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then take a "religious journey" abroad.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I've known many people who sell but don't use, in order to make a decent wage since they are otherwise somewhat excluded from a decent wage for other reasons'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'oh no, ranrr, you'd better tell jaenelle ;-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think Janelle's been living here for so long she's obtained a citizenship by now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'walk up to alaska, vampire, then swim across the straight to russia'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake thats a position i can understand, but why not just sell another product, like cell phones'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'You can get it free by becoming a tax-paying resident.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if the religious institutions were taxed, the religious folk 'd be required to pay higher tithes, and thus indirectly an extra taxation'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake that's 46 kilometers right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, Zade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The INSTITUTIONS would be taxed, not its members.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is English your 29th language?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'my dad's riding a motorcycle across alaska right now :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'no, my 29th language is urdu?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, a lot smarter than doing it in december'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I honestly don't think its goign to be easy to make a decent wage selling cell phones'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'saying "no" does not make it "so".'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and not everyone is blessed with salesmanship skills, and drugs mostly sell themselves'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake they do that because they're addictive'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If the religious institutions then require their members to pay higher tithes, that's their CHOICE. If the members then pay those higher tithes, that's ALSO their choice.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'pot is notphysically addictive, it still sells itself'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna yep, just like a golf club membership'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'nobody's saying ' join this church or i will behead you''
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: '' tithe or i'll behead you ''
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not taxing religious institutions because "Wah wah, religious people would need to pay more moeny to their cult leaders, wah wah" is a stupid reason.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't even know of any religious institution besides Scientology (brrrr) which REQUIRES you to pay tithes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'christianity .'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'taxation of religious institutions is persecution of the religious, you callous nonbeliever'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tithing is one tenth of the income, to the upkeep of the priests/etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'christianity doesn't require it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade, that's also true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I know only of Scientology that REQUIRES tithing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'its better to persecute the religious than to persecute the top 10% of the wealthy americans though'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Even if SOME religions might STRONGLY SUGGEST you tithe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'tithing was commonplace here'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Religious institutions should be taxed the same as any other institution of similar construction. being religious should not be a factor in tax.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it should if you live in a theocracy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What about those Boy Scouts of America? How the FUCK are they tax exempt?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr here in the us we don't have a simple tax system though, we scale it in order to encourage foreign smart people to come here'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because they're run by religious Fundies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna they're not for profit'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or a religious based governmental system'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What's next, tax exempt status to Super PACs run by religious nuts?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'actually, they'd be a 501c3 nonprof if they weren't religious anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Aah, so all non-profits are tax exempt? A valid reason. Also, the BSA ARE highly religious.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, how come there arent enough socially accepted gay children to form a boy scouts that allows gays?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think you even have to swear allegiance to god or something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'because you can't choose to form one without being part of the group, and a religious group won't accept you'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'i see'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it IS religious, at its core and professed as such'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, much like the masons, you just have to affirm belief in a higher being'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Wait, boy scouts aren't gay? Right....'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'then again, YMCA's religious as well'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it can be god, allah, satan, most buddhas, or even zeus.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"tithes" in the purposes of the above discussion also includes  "voluntary financial contributions of the faithful to the officially-registered religious venue of their choice"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'it's still run Christian beliefs and by Christians.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc they were at one point, but its more of a home rule thing, not all ymca's are religious'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'ON Christian beliefs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I think the c in the name gives it away'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'all YMCAs are religious...it's in their name'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they may not be RUN as if they were, but not all churches are either :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc yes. religious in name. not in practice, doctrine, belief, or membership'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'YMCA are homosexual dance studios ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Salvatian Army is run by Christian fundies as well. It's shocking how many non-profits are run by Christians... often fundies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'As long as they don't get any special status because of it, they can be as religious as they want. At least in a secular society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'VampireDude, you're a bit naive, aren't you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, is the salvation army a non profit, they pay pretty well to their management'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't know if the Salvation Army is non-profit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, it's not just nonprofs, it's that they're service organizations'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The BSA, YMCA and Salvatian Army have all come under fire in the past few years for being run by and on Christian fundie logic/rules/laws.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ranrr i think history has shown us that secular societies that dont allow religious institutions a place, will often times oppress the religious'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and the fundies love their charity cases'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They ARE religious. They just don't usually walk around screaming it from the rooftops.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Again, I say, come to sweden and you will see that things are a bit different here.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They can have their places of worship. I just don't want to give them any special treatment.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade trolls: the song "YMCA" seemed to laud the YMCA nostalgically -- so there were bathhouse orgies there ?
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'come to sweden and not be able to buy alcohol except from the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's basically a special club. Have them pay for their own damn maintenance and salaries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'We are actually a secular country, at least we are 95% there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'come to sweden and have to sit down to take a pee'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna the very nature of a place of worship, is that it is a place of special treatment'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, that's heavy liquor. Convenience stories can sell beer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Bars can sell EVERYTHING that's legal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Nah, that's not true, Tiger.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(Also restaurants, discos, clubs, etc.)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How very Fox Newsie of you, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna here in the u.s. each state sets its own limit on the amount of alcohol in beer'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I sit down to pee, unless its a public toilette'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'may as well be in iran for the amount of alcohol in beer someplaces.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I don't sit down to shit in a public toilet'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Vampiredude, the religious can have their special treatment of their own places. The state should not give those places special treatment, however.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sweden has a higher suicide rate than the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Myth.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No it doesn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'impossible, tiger, they're HAPPIER there'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna i think the converse. i don't mind taxing of other grounds, such as the parish homes of priests or ministers'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I heard the happiest place on earth was the netherlands'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, how Fox newsie of you. Find us a single source of your lies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'but for the actual church grounds and offices, those should be specially treated.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and that is not a veiled reference to pot :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I love that everything yuna disagrees with is automatically just a fox news thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'is fox big in the UK?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake, it was iceland, before the currency failure'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'can't get fox in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, you can watch it live online'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '1) Swedish. 2) It's not what I disagree on. It's common lies told by >Fox News.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'interesting that fox is all you watch/listen to then'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'attacking fox watchers is a typical tactic of the loony liberal left'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Such as Sweden being some kind of suicide mecca because we're socialists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because they still believe it's about left vs right'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the religious VOTE -- and currently the religious outnumso attr'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I think fox is in that same boat, tigernuts'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna mecca for example, being a place utilized for worship, would get that special status... yes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'by definition it is'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade its not a matter of numbers, a lot of people don't actually go to vote.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, not really. They can fund themselves. A bajillion pilgrims come there each year and pump billions into the local businesses and religious hallow grounds.-'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I think both MSNBC and FOX are extremist, sure, but fox scares me a lot lot more'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i've seen clips from both and they're both wank'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the religious VOTE -- and currently the religious outnumber the greedy callous atheists, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna sadly, i think that more money is poured into saudi arabia by oil, than pilgrims'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't watch MSNBC. I occasionally watch snippets from Fox News when they tell one of their outrageous lies and people post about them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, do you also watch pravda and al jazeera?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In your home country, maybe Zade. Atheists outnumber Christians in Sweden. Atheists quite possibly outnumber religious people in Sweden.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'shrugs, I read from news aggregates, fox, msnbc, al jazeera, xinhua, everyone gets linked'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'be political suicide to suggest that religious instituions be taxed'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'any media is biased'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'everyone should read from news aggergates :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna is the monarchy in sweden religious?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake, google news?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fox is pro-republican, msnbc is pro democrat'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't even know where Pravda is from (Russia?) and I don't watch Al-Jazeera. I watch ZERO news channels. I watch snippets from here and there whenever they interest me,'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'sometimes, and reuter linking from other places'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And news aggregates, yeah.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'next you'll be saying that Syria's government needs to be toppled because's he's shelling the rebels'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'no, it needs to be toppled because he doesnt sell us oil.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'what REALLY chaps my ass is not that fox news exists, or MSNBC exists, but they both call themselves news channels, if they just labelled it for what it is, the 24 hour editorial channels...I'd be a little happier with that'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Monarchy in Sweden is religious by law. By law, a monarch has to profess to be of the Lutheran faith.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna cool.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'its rare to meet lutherans that arent rich'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and then CNN could call themselves the "sometimes news channel, sometimes hot talking heads with thinly-veiled opinions"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Any other faith (or lack of faith) will cost them their title. This may be true for all members of the Royal Family. I dunno, I just read in an article a few weeks ago that our country's newest addition to the royal line (1st child of the crown princess) would lose their title if she professed a faith other than Lutherism.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake, maybe one day, news channels, like wikipedia, will not be an authority for arguments, but just a starting point for research'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'wait, the princess that married her fitness trainer, or the cute one?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'curiously the Norwegian king insisted on keeping the rule that the king must be a lutheran'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'god I hope so, I have a bit of hope for the newest generation that is growing up with news aggregates and blogs and things like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fitness training-marrying one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Vampire Dude, is Wikipedia a jewish rag'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'even more curious, the politicians caved and did as he asked'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ah ok, thanks yuna... i always thought the other one was way cuter'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Well, yeah. But she isn't the crown princess. She'd 3rd in line (behind her sexy brother)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ah. cool. what's her type... im so glad she broke it off with that weird finance guy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'She has a new boyfriend now. Some American guy. I think he's kind of a celebrity (possibly a sports player).'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'ah, way better than a fitness trainer then'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'important stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Anyway, how about those Texas Republicans? Their 2012 platform is officially to, among other things, remove critical thinking from schools and re-demicriminalize sodomy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna sodomy is just not a good way to raise a horse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'recriminalize? they'd have to replace the current supreme court'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Seems like they are a bit late, critical thinking was removed from schools a long time ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and overturn lawrence vs texas'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yuna's just a rabid democrat'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake or just add the phrase' forcible' in front of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They openly declare their hostility to the LGBT community and declare that they will rescind every single right the LGBT community has right now and block all future attempts to introduce other rights and they're against a whole lot of pro-choice things.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: '' forcible sodomy' would be easy to outlaw'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wants to bring in millions of immigrants, pay them all welfare, pull everything into the ownership of the government, and restrict everyone's freedoms, telling them what to do and what to think'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Doesn't matter what they can and cannot do. Their OFFICIAL PLATFORM is to decriminalize being gay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna that's fair for them to do, they are a sovereign state... and they'll lose a lot of business'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'heh some of them go much farther than that and openly agree with Uganda, Iran, etc. and want to introduce capital punishment for homosexual behavior'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'texas is a sovereign state?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna being gay doesnt mean sodomy, and sodomy doesnt mean being gay...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'although there's a correlation, sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yuna liked both'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'if you DOUBT that a google search is allth ats required :p its not mainstream but it has a pretty good political foothold'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, yep... it's a sovereign state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Actually, I'm not a democrat. Because I'm not an inhabitant of the United States. I'm a Social Democrat (Swedish party).'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna they have a charter that you can look up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, isnt that vladimir lenin's old party?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: ''deluded' would be a better description, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'VampireDude, they want to criminalize gay sex. So if you want to be gay, you'd have to just not have any gay sex.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'however much TX wants to think of itself as a sovereign state, in reality it isn't :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna or just not do it on camera.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't think you understand how the world worked when most countries criminalized sodomy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake on paper, in military strength, and in policy development, it is'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'i've noticed in the past when attempting to obtain controversial data from Wikipedia on jewish-sensitive topics, there was a difficulty getting the pages to save offline to a file, as though Wikipedia was practicing censorship "look but do not save"'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you were suspected of being gay, there'd be investigations launched against you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, here in the u.s. you're innocent until proven guilty'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'texas republicans. Not sane.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, that wasn't the case back when.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if they want to send an fbi agent undercover, to find out if you'll sodomize them... ?maybe that could happen but i doubt it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, well, by law, innocent until proven guilty'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'http://s3.amazonaws.com/texasgop_pre/assets/original/2012-Platform-Final.pdf'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'so if all we're talking bout is adoption or sponsorship of a law... there's no issue?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fast becoming other than inocent until proven guilty'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts in what way?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We believe the current teaching of a multicultural curriculum is divisive, the platform says, adding that it supports teaching common American identity and loyalty instead of political correctness that nurtures alienation among racial and ethnic groups. In Arizona, where Republicans banned multicultural programs, students in those programs actually out-performed their peers. Texas Republicans also believe controversial theories such evolution and climate change  which arent controversial at all  should be taught as challengeable scientific theories subject to change as new data is produced. Theres more: the GOP also opposes the teaching of critical thinking skills because they focus on behavior modification and have the purpose of challenging the students fixed beliefs and undermining parental authority.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it was never innocent until proven guilty.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Whoa there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It supports corporal punishment in schools: Corporal punishment is effective and legal in Texas, the platform states, adding that teachers and school boards should be given more authority to deal with disciplinary problems. Actual research, however, shows that corporal punishment is bad for children and their education. Research shows that corporal punishment is associated with an increase in delinquency, antisocial behavior, and aggression in children, according to the American Psychoanalytic Association, which strongly condemns the use of such punishment. The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that parents and schools use other forms of punishment because corporal punishment is of limited effectiveness and has potentially deleterious side effects.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'More pearls of wisdom from the Texas GOP 2012 platform.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Careful Yuna, you're going to overload Jhav's bot's input buffer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hans, it has been for a very long time, nara.gov has a copy of the paperwork'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your research, like you, is a pile of bullshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Your mom is a pile of bullshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts ok, so on the one hand, there's the national archives and records administration, on the other hand there's you, calling nara bullshit?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not you, vd, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): VampireDude weighs the scale. nara > tigernuts.
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, yuna's just copy pasting'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because? Multiple news sources from all over the U.S. are reporting the same thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'news sources are not statements of fact'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'what's on paper doesn't matter.  If someone wants you to be guilty, they don't need proof--particularly if it's a matter of strong public reaction.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Republican Texas GOP's official platform was released by the GOP themselves.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna so what, texas is texas. if you want critical thinking, why not try athens greece, or vermont?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'news reporting of 'studies' are escpecially dangerous'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the people reporting on them rarely know anything about it, or know so little that they aren't able to make an informed judgement'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts doctors giving placeibos to schizophrenics is dangerous too. a dull butter knife is extremely dangerous'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'else they'd have writtent he papers int he first place'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Go back to your Fox News cave, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'a placeibo taking schizophrenic with a dull butterknife, however is no threat.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'we're critical of the thinking in Athens, Greece, which isn't exactly the same thing as critical thinking.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'go back to your delusional communist paradise, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Seriously, the Texas Republican party's official platform is available for public view.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna indeed it is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'but people don't become republicans for the party platform.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fact that you cannot discern between Socalist and Communist is what makes you a right wing nutso.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'nor do they become democrats for the party platform'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both involve power residing in the hands of government'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, you're the member of a social democratic party, vladimir lenin spent time in sweden, with the social democratic party.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'the problem is texas has undue influence in national politics, so it really does matter what they do there, like cali and nys'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, but there's something to be said about a party officially adoption those goals. And for people who support people who adopt those goals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the only difference is the way that it is spun to the suckers, i mean voters, i mean citizens'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'vampir ethats just specious, lincoln was a republican, but modern republicans are no lincolns :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, whether you call vladimir lenin's involvement with the social democratic party socialist or communist, does not alter history'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, because the Social Democratic party of today is totally the same as it was 70 years ago, VampireDude.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna if it were not true to its charter and ideals, would they not have simply splintered into a new party?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, sources for those claims? I can't find any.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'would you like me to go grab an isbn number?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's enough to know that they believe in nanny state, strict regulation of anything and everything, and are anti-ownership, anti-choice, and anti-freedom'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sure, whatever.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're anti-choice? Anti-freedom? Anti-ownership?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fuck is wrong with you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'all socialists are'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'in the US, it actually happens to be the same and we made the mistake of electing some of them to office recently.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, he's apparently had a bad upbringing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just exactly the same as you're arguing all "republicans" are anti-healthcare, anti-welfare and pro-war'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The supporter of the Party of Tea shouldn't be whining about the opposition being anti-choice.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hans, not me, i voted for the bald pow guy from arizona'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can't pedal bullshit one way and then get all hissy at someone doing the same thing back'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'my point exactly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, "A country with some socialist values" =/= "A socialist state".'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna good point, a country with some democratic values, does not equal a democratic state'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'sweden is not a socialist state, it's a monarchy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Even politically, we're not a socialist country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'and even though the head of the church of england, is the head of state in england, it's not a theocracy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The nerve of a Republican calling the opposition anti-choice. The republicans are the most anti-choice part in the U.S. If they don't like your choice, they're gonna legislate the shit out of it into illegality.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna oh, thats not true'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both parties do that'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Queen Elizabeth is the head of the church of England? I find that hard to believe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'look how nice the republicans were to gay people and black people and women in the 1970s, they even allowed native americans to vote'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Name SOME things the Democratic party has outlawed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'BESIDES the Public mandate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'we want to outlaw big soda drinks in NYC ... :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, queen elizabeth is the head of the church of england. yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'guns :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'state ability to legislate on healthcare, state ability to legislate on pot'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake i want to outlaw the bird in new york :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'that gives me an idea, I'll call fat repubs anti-life when they want to be able to be free to have their 48oz sodas'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They want to make it harder to get a gun license. Not make owning a gun illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'uhh'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna: no'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's something called the american constitution, you'd do well to go read it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'll counter you with "Abortion" and raise you "Gay marriage":'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the USA Republicans are acting like former USSR Commiczars communists -- the rich get special treatment and all the benedfits, the less than rich may die in poverty'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they've had to be struck down by the supreme court a few times because they've passed laws outright banning them'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, i'll counter your abortion and raise you child support'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The American constitution also calls for the legality of owning slaves. I don't see people defending that right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Democrats can to make child support illegal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'heh I think most democrats are for sensible gun control, not gun banning'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade but... poverty in the usa is a lot nicer than poverty in the uk'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake there's either control or there's not.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'democrats have removed people's ability to choose their healtchare'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'USSR Communism was Red Capitalism'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'a toothless gun control law is useless'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yes but control =/= banning'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No they haven't, TigerNUTS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, they have, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake guns bans worked in washington dc didnt they'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They can choose WHATEVER healthcare they wish to choose AS LONG AS they have SOME form of health insurance.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, they cannot'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the supreme court struck down the DC gun ban'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is illegal to NOT have health coverage. You're free to choose who covers you, however.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I'm not familiar with that, vampiredude, and by the tone of your argument, I already suspect its going to be some specious anecdotal crap'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it has to conform to stringent rules, and you can't choose to not have cover'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna what about those of us with entitlement to v.a. hospitals?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's a choice that was removed, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'When, Abelinc?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'do we now have to double up and buy coverage also?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you're saying yuna, you have the freedom to choose, provided we provide you the options'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you just stated it, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your choice is "none of hte above"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts yes, like a democratic election in iran'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'you must vote, but you can vote for either canidate'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'like an election in any country'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You cannot choose not to have healthcare. That's not the same thing as not beign able to choose yoru source of healthcarem, as Tigernuts claimed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is illegal to NOT have health coverage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in this case it is, since you are not free to choose where your healthcare comes from'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'you can choose not to have healthcare, but then you won't get a deduction on your taxes'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'do you not comprehend that that constitutes a removed choice?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'YES YOU ARE'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'you are not forced ot have healthcare'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as i've already said, there are stringent rules on who provides it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You are free to choose where your healthcare comes from. Just not to choose NO health care coverage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'incorrect'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'it is not illegal to not have health coverage, thats a total lie, you just get some higher taxes'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Whatever, Tea Partier.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no taxation without representation'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'nobody is going to be put in jail for not having health care'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'milkshake, that's as bullshit argument as is possible'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, ill be curious about the final rule douglas schuler adopts, because as a veteran i already get 'health care' without needing additional insurance.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I thought it amounted to fines. So it's not illegal, not taxed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'nobody's going to jail for not having it, thats not an argument'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(I didn't mean people would be put in jail, just get fined)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna congress can legally levy taxes for whatever it wants'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'if you make money that year, and don't have it, you'll hav ehigher taxes yes, and you could go to jail potentially for not paying them, but that was always true'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it can only levy those taxes from appropriate sources, but it can spend them on whatever it wants'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's as bad as when I worked at a school district...I could pay X dollars to be in the union...or I could pay X dollars to NOT be in the union'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's not a choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and you've always been able to deduct health care costs from taxes anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc its a choice like auto insurance is a choice, you can drive or not drive.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I haven't checked up on the V.A. thing. So people with V.A. priviliges for full coverage still have to have health insurance under the new laws?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'we also are trending towards debtors' prisons, too'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'or you can pay 12.00 for a drivers license, or pay 12.00 for a state id and not drive'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'VD, I can breathe or not breathe?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hans, debtors prisons are illegal here in the u.s.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can breathe, abelinc, but you'll be taxed for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'abelinc you can pay X dollars to have highways or you can not work and have no dollars? Life often robs you of "choices" and we only bitch when we think we should have that choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and it can only be air of a specific make-up dictated by the state'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna, that's the question... and do we also draw the tax benefit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's called yuna's paradise'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I don't t hink its sufficient to say, well society values this infrastructure and wants to have it and I want to have the option not to have it because I should have options, instea dyou should say why its stupid not to have that choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc, regarding breathing, cap and trade is on obama's platform last election'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'only on the federal level.  If your state has adopted a debtors' prison, the federals aren't going to get involved.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Abelinc, he who supported Sarah Palin's candidacy should just be quiet. I noticed how you didn't refute that argument of mine.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Your ability to judge the eligibility of politicians is clearly non-existent.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that's not very pro-choice of you, Yuna.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's stupid to not have that choice because the highway infrastructure is necessary for me (and everyone else) to get groceries, utilities, etc...my personal healthcare is NOT necessary for me or anyone else to live'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yuna, ad hominens help no one :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Should", not "Must".'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc thats not true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'no ad hominens please on the debate channel, things just deteriorate rapidly'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so one has literally nothing to do with helping the other'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'you can get groceries by boat, or by airmail... you don't need a highway'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But Abelinc, think about those who ride bikes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'the amish can bring in groceries by mule cart.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, I find it amazing that you think you know who I supported for candidacy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'or who live in the bush.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'abelinc: if you agree that we should provide health care to indigents or people without it in emergency situations then we might actually lower our total cost with the ACA'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or who just never leave their homes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'yuna or who are disabled downs syndrome types on a city bus'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'when you're totally full of horseshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'abelinc: moreover, a healthy society might have dramatically increased GDP, meaning you end up getting much much more PPP (purchasing power parity)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'my having health insurance doesn't make me a healthy society'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm pretty sure you told me to shut up 4 years ago when I bitched and moaned about Sarah Palin's stupidity and pretty much declaerd she wasn't a total fucktard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'our country is massively unhealthy'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'abelinc: the variables are really really really too many to know for sure, but I think we need to talk about it while recognizing that its not a zero sum game'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake i'd rather provide basic neccesities to poor people than make them have to break the law to get access to them, and then pay for their prison time and guards'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'comes frmo having social healthare'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And that she was eligible to be Vice Persident.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'courts cost a lot more than food stamps, ya know?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you're pretty sure you're full of shit on what I stated 4 years ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're saying I'm misremembering? Fair enough, I won't pursue this further.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if all it takes to keep people from using and selling illegal drugs, is some food stamps and a tenament house, that'd be a huge economic savings'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I don't have health insurance right now, I probably will within a month because I'm about to ge ta job, but right now my weigh tloss is massively impeded by a health issue I can't see a doctor about, health insurance would absolutely health, it might be a good idea, might'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that being said, she met all criteria to RUN for VP, so I certainly would've stated that if you were claiming otherwise'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and you might profit immensely from people who don't otherwise have access, suddenly having access, just as we believe that we profit by providing a free education through high school'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I didn't mean eligible in teh technical sense. I mean eligible in the "Sane" sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc did she release her birth certificate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'my statement to that effect in no way "backs" her for VP or makes any statements for my political leanings'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so yes, I'd tell you to shut the fuck up if you claimed that she is ineligible'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'vampiredude: heh I totally agree with that one'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake high school isnt a free education for property owners, any more than police departments are free'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'education is not free.  We pay the taxes for it, even if we don't have anyone getting an education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if obama had gone for free universal healthcare, he'd have had my support, but he's owned and paid for by corporate interests, and hence he's going for the system that will hand billions of dollars into the hands of insurance companies and banks'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I was complaining during the live VP debates about how she wasn't actually answering any questions, just spewing talking points and just being batshit insane. Someone, who  Ithought was you, but apparently wasn't, said I was wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's what every politician does during debated'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'vampiredude:I believ eif society deprives me of food, access to food, access to shelter, etc and I committ a crime because its my only option left, that I didn't really commit a crime, fortunately, I'm not likely to be in such a situation'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you must be VERY new to following political candidacies'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Every politican is batshit insane during VP debates?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'very'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'vampiredude: thats exactly my point, we pay for that "free education" because its an investment that profits GDP and thus everyone , and I believe health care is very likely to do the same'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake a feudal state's lord has a requirement to provide for the indigents unable to provide for themselves... here in the u.s. a similar responsibility is held at a county level --> but most counties have to be sued before they bother.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not what you're getting, milkshake'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'She didn't answer a SINGLE QUESTION. She gave non-answers and just changed the subject to spew off talking points. Most politicians don't do that during nationally televised debates for the VP.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'tsk, Yuna requires a doctor to provide weight-loss "advice" (likely faulty) available on the internet (more variety of advice)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes they do, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you illiterade, Zade? I'm not the person who spoke of weight-loss.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'zade, i went to a weight management clinic once for their grand opening, asked if they have weight gain solutions, and they said no, we only do weight loss.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In fact, if I lost any more weight, I'd be underweight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'apparently ' weight loss' is no longer politically correct'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and that's exactly what they've done during nationally televised debates as long as there have been nationally televised debates'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'they didnt even have cookies at their grand opening, what a poor business model =('
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny then how Joe Biden had no problems answering many questions.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'tigernuts: I recognize that its possible that the ACA will be much less efficient than universal health care, and possibly more efficient at delivering health care.  Even if it ends up being inefficient, even if it ends up creating profits for people in an immoral way, it still might be better than this system we've had.  And, I have my suspicions, but I'd like to see ti play out first'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, by "questions", I meant the topics of debate put forward by the MC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'abelinc it does seem like the debates are more of a meet and greet, than a lincoln vs douglass example'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'funny how when you watch with an obvious agenda, you hear what you want'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'but what bothers me more, is that most canidates won't usually take a stance, for fear of alienating any particular retailable group'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and when someone says something you don't want *FOX NEWS*!!!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'ah, milkshake, not Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'having followed it in this country, milkshake, i can safely say that you're going down the wrong route'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'it leaves me feeling like i'm voting for an actor or buying a used car, rather than learning more about the person i may vote for'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it has the potential to make things marginally better for a very few people at the borders of poverty'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'at the cost of making it considerably worse for a huge majority of low and middle income earners'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, with regard to government healthcare, i can assure you that no good would come of it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No you didn't. There were SW's that took you through Bard and then another clan, sure, but they went directly there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'even back then debates were all about giving the people what they wanted to hear.  Once you get into office, you were free to do what you wished (even if your message went entirely opposite of that).'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'if good would come of it, i'd be willing to examine the cost.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'tigernuts: I don't think you can.  I don't know what country you're from, but the variables are not the same, its incredibly hard to tease out cause and effect, and qualitative reasoning is necessary and the plural of anecdotes isn't data :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'preaching to the converted, vd, we've had government healthcare here for 70 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the dribble on debate is hard to follow with detailed attention -- starting to skim past the faulty opinions'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts if a politician can fix the v.a... i'd believe they could do nationwide healthcare someday.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'painful to read this current debate'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they won't'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you fail to see the movement of power, corporations are overtaking soverign nations in terms of power'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you give up that power to corporations, it'll be practically impossible to pull it back'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts if a teenager won't take care of the car they have, would you go buy them a brand new one that cost many times more?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'analogies are super suspect in a system involving millions of individuals and businesses'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'all my best information comes from Debate channel.  I just don't trust the parts of the internet that are outside of Aardwolf.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and geographic, economic, and education realities'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'milkshake its not just forrest gump that joins the military'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you may or may not have noticed that banks and technocrats have largely taken over control of the EU'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts i hadn't noticed that, in fact, i heard many banks there were failing'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, if a bank is not failing, why would it request a bailout?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they made reckless gambles knowing that if it paid off, it'd pay out, and if it failed, they'd be bailed out. Win win'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts ok, so let's open a bank'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not a sector i'd invest in'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts if you pay taxes, you already do'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I don't know, I only do business with local banks now, I never use a credit card, never will, consumers still have power en masse'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'customers are largely irrelevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the deregulation greed of the USA seriously eroded the financial stability of Europe'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts really? then why have customers at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'if all of us stopped putting money into Goldman Sachs, that would not be irrelevant, and they know it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they don't need it, most the money is in government bonds'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'thats...just not true'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I demand link for that statement'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'all customers are not created equal, and banks are realizing that just like any other business they REALLY want to court the customers they do want and get rid of the ones they don't want.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'and i demand a breakeven percentage for the bonds'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'the very nature of the bonds is, if everyone flees into them, their growth won't even track with inflation'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and inflationw ould increase anyway, it doesn't make sense'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'hans, sounds like everyone wants the dream team... but nobody at the schoolyard wants to be picked last do they'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'BoA moreorless just told a quarter of their existing customers to GTFO'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in this country less than 3% of banks balance sheets are made up of end user deposits'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'tigernuts, so all we really need is to take basil 3'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and how much is made up of loans, and CD's, and investments?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and that is suchhhhhhhhhhh a statement crying out for a link anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sw'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fractional reserve banking'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'create money out of thin air'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'oh well, im out of donuts... have fun.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'so banks are ONLY making money off of bond returns is what you're saying?  Because that not only needs a link it appears patently rediculous'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not what i said'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'well what I'm saying is, they absolutely depend on consumers, for loan products, for credit, for depositing money for CD's, for investing through them, for business lines of credit by small businesses, etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and if we stopped using them, they would lose a lot of power very quickly'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'my bank doesn't try to make a profit :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'it tries to have cash flow and liquidity and keep itself treading water and it doesn't lose money'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'banks make most of their money in investment banking, not highstreet banking'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'must be a local bank, then'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'problem is, all those lines of credit pretty much require the banks...advocating local banks/CUs only works if those local banks/CUs would have the capital to be able to handle the load. They don't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I think if we all did that, turned to such local banks, then banks would be dramatically better behaved, and there's definitely a trend happening htere'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if we all did that, the local banks would DIE'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the national banks are definitely in a self-evaluating mode thanks to the recession problems'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'abelinc: the problem with that argument is saying that they couldn't grow to'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'giving a loan to someone only works if you have the cash to give'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they couldn't, milkshake'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they create the cash out of thina ir'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'right, and turning to a local bank, giving them our deposits, letting them take advantage of the reserve rule, they couldn't then also loan a little more?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and new local banks could be created and thrive'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'we don't have the deposits...that's why the banks make money in loans'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'that makes no sense, hwo do the large banks do it then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and if the local banks grow that big, then they are now large banks and nothing has changed'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they didn't care about the type of customer they were collecting, Milkshake.'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yes I understand that, but you give them a deposit and they can loan like...what 9x as much per deposit?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you think all these large banks were crooks from day 1?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'no, you get more local banks'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'or the local banks are non-profits (like mine)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the bible gives reference to it, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so essentially'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and they don't try to get involved in investment banking'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You grin evilly at him.
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'so no its not equitable'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if there's no investment banking, then there's no business...nobody has any money anymore'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'good, off we go then'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'there's no need for there to be investment banking and commercial banking in the same business'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'thats my pt'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the S&L collapse -- were they small banks'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so they'll stay out of profitable business, but they'll grow...got it }:>'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'that is why non-profit is a bit of a misnomer'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'they still make profits'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not in your world'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'where did I say that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'your model doesn't allow for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'why not?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'for the reasons I already explained...'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yeah I don't see how your reasons say that they are not allowed to grow, I thought I addressed each one'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they don't have the capital to sustain what you're telling us to use them for...the way to get the capital, you've just shut them out of'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I disagree with that statement, the large banks loan off of their deposits, why can't we spread that out among many banks?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and I'm not against large banks per se if they're "non-profit" ie, the profits aren't being spread via dividends but are only reinvested or held against a rainy day'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'because thats what non-profit really means yes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the large banks offset their deposits/loans'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the investment banking is what allows them to be solvent'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'then why were they solvent before they were allowed to be both in the 90's?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'why are there large banks not in investment banking still solvent?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'because they were stupid'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'SOLVENT?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'thats chemistry'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'my credit union is actually pretty big, and it isn't in investment banking, and its solvent, and it puts out lots of loans, and interestingly, they tend to give them to credit-worthy people'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'barclays got fined 280million gbp this week'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'so they did wha tyou said wasn't possible, and that makes them stupid?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you can be in the best business in the world, but make some bad decisions and you can still go down in flames'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'yall patrick bateman'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, being stupid made them stupid'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'goldman sachs will post losses of $9bn this year'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'you guys need to be more criminal and more metaphysical at same time'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'yall retarded'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I'd like to see some statistics to show that investment banking is required for you to have a solvent commercial bank'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'arms companies should be a sound investment, given all the false wars they keep starting'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and I'm ashamed of you Abelinc, retreating to ad hominens, you're almost always b etter than that'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'false wars where'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'libya first, now syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'prime targetz lulz'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'inevitably Iran after'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they're real wars, just false pretenses :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dr. Tzara nods.
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, my credit union was quite large as well...of course, its president's family were all indicted and it was restructured'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'para stepped down, no need for mortal alt'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'mis :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'google shopping to censure firearms and firearm accessories'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 're people calling for links about investment banks being mostly on the take from governments rather than earning from consumers'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-06-18/dear-mr-dimon-is-your-bank-getting-corporate-welfare-.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'o-level home economics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-01.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'woops'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) SeanJac: 'how do i start town of solan goal? i already went to the mayor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Eerrtt: 'who thinks that a certain nationality cant endure temperatures'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"That is not the issue," Sen. Mitch McConnell said. "The question is how to go step by step to improve the American health care system. It is already the finest health care system in the world."'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Clearly, this man is in touch with reality and the common man's plight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'permethrin is good stuff...'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'isn't that some antifungal cream?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''German's facing persecution and dehumanizing treatment in Danzig Poland', 'over 17 serious border transgressions in a single night, and 3 more the next day', 'Will not honor a law signed with a gun to the head of the signator, to starve millions of Germans to death', 'The border of France is a permanant one, and will remain a permanant one as long as neutral countries remain neutral', 'Does not and will not ever have any interest in the west' - Adolf Hitler speech from memory, I don't recall hearing him mention the Jews in the first 20 minutes or so'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'when he declares war on poland, apparently britain was unwilling to accept germany's offer of closer cooperation on stuff too'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'interesting he mentions that, since holodomor/dekulakization/great purge is historically reported as having happened in the 10 years previous'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM1h_2ujsvs'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i considered that possibility before i ever heard the speech though'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if it's real anyways, and translated correctly, food for though'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'wouldn't make the allies look too good if they were gone to war to force germany to starve millions of it's people to death, which hitler opposed'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Today in Pigs Flying News, the D.C. GOP added being pro gay marriage to their official platform for 2012. In other news, Hell has frozen over.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'next spam message they'll get a informative video they don't play on history tv i guess, haha'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's like communism in guatemala, only bigger'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so if they went to war with guatemala to destroy democracy and install stalinism in the 1950s, giving them syphallis and turning them into cia drug mules, and they started world war 2 to enforce forced starvation of millions of germans which hitler didn't agree with, then what are all their current war's about?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's about fermenting hatred between islam and the west'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'to prop up and profitise the military industrial complex'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'It ended with the unconditional surrender of the Axis powers. Germany surrendered on May 7th to the Western Allies, and May 8th to the Soviet Union, 1945, about a week after Adolf Hitler had committed suicide. Japan was able to hold out for another few months and was preparing for a desperate and bloody defense in the event of an American invasion of the home islands'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'what is so bad about being a cia drug mule ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'heard the pay is pretty good.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'hitler never declared an end to world war 2, and according to the video was justified in his invasion of france and war on poland'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's nonsense'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did you watch the video?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Hitler invaded Poland after faked attack on a radio station just inside the german border'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'classic false flag'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '1929-1939 russia starves and murders an estimated 30 million people in death camps'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the video hitler's (if it's him) saying that he refused to enact a law signed under duress to starve millions of germans to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'interestingly NATO attempted a false flag with that Turkish plane flying over Syrian airspace'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and that germans were being treated inhumanely in poland'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and also, poland had transgressed the border between them over 17 times in one night'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's in the video, you can interpret it yourself, cause i never heard of it on history tv, they always make nazi's the killers of the jews'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that and hitler a powerhungry satanist'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i imagine russia and the allies injustice is the reason they spent so much effort on blocking german media from their citizens'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'poland goes to obama lengths to deny any hand in the holocaust, i wonder if that has anything to do with the inhumane treatment of germans'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do you think the nazi's would really film their treatment of the jews, with that charismatic and justifiedly sounding speech by hitler showing that war is happening to protect germans from people who want to do that to them?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Nazi's were adept at using film propoganda'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'anyone else noticed that ahmadinejad is like...not insane? dude got demonized hard by the american media it seems like'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'i mean, what i've heard him say in interviews is totally incontrovertible'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it didn't escape my notice. Once you start noticing the propoganda in western media, it makes you laugh because you start seeing it all the time'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Mr. "There Are No gay People in Iran"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't think anyone's ever called him insane (at least not in the media). Just less-than-enlightened on a lot of issues.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'i'm speaking more about his position on israel/palestine, don't know about a lot of his other policies'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'if you had only watched fox news, you'd think he was a diabolical madman'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I don't give a flying shit about the gay agenda, it's about the most overhyped non-'issue' there is'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's Fox News and he's an arab.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What did you expect?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'and certainly with debate actually, he's not an arab'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fact that you call it "the gay agenda" proves what side you're on.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I don't care about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh yeah, I keep getting Iran and Iraq mixed up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I prefer the donkey agenda.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it has little impact on anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Let me rephrase that. He's dark skinned.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's Fox News and Ahmadinejad is dark skinned.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I like persians.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The cats?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no, the people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the world's going to hell in a handbasket, people are dying every day, and you're all obsessed about what someone ELSE thinks about sticking your todger up some blokes arsehole'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then Fox News hates you!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No we're not, Tigernust.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We could care less if you and your cohorts just left us alone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's what the gay agenda does, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not me, it's the fucking liberals'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're making a fool of yourself, claiming to not care, yet calling it the gay agenda and talking about things like "sticking your todger up some blokes arsehole":'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because being gay is all about sex for you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'fudge packers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's exactly what it's about, since it's not about any kind of rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'if you and you bigotted nutbag friends would just not legislate against my rights and not fight legislation giving me equal rights, nobody would care about you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you already have equal rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except we don't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes you do'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'logically consistent position is eliminate all government recognition of marriage'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in many respects you have positive descrimination'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'marrigae is a religious/personal thing, shouldn't be institutionalized'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Let me change my usual subject of debate for a minute and start taking you on headon, Briton.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Marriage is not a "religious" thing. It existed long before organized religion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not interested. It's a non-issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'how do you know he is british ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'hence the /personal'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'he could be your next door neighbor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'point is, you have no righdebsc'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tell me tigernuts, can single people adopt in the United Kingdom?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not as far as i know'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who gives a fuck about "personal", Unforgivable`?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Why would a single person want to adopt ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Some people think interracial marriage is wrong. Personal belief and all that shit. Doesn't change the fact and it's legal and should remain legal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'You would have to be whacko, thus not acceptable to adopt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"It's personal" must be the worst argument I've ever heard for keeping gay marriage illegfal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'at some point in the next few months you might come to the point'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm trying to find sources on adoption in the UK. It's pretty hard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'i wouldn't make that point. the government shouldn't be sanctioning relationships at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And I found it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'modern day marriage can be covered through contract'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Singles CAN adopt in the U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Homosexuals can only adopt as a couple in the U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Same rights my penis.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'that doesn't sound credible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do you know how likely it is for a single man to be allowed to adopt in the UK?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'how could one even tell if a single is hetero or homo, for the law side?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Doesn't matter. Single gays (of BOTH genders, you gender-specific anti-gay bigot) are automatically disqualified from adoption in the U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I am all for gay marriage, boost the economy with more divorces and weddings, and psychological help.  No reason why straight people should get all the disappointment.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they wouldn't be able to descriminate, homer, they aren't allowed to'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Their heterosexual peers are not.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hell, gay marriage would cause a new boom in las vegas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'THAT is not equal rights. END OF STORY.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yuna omg thats terrible, they should move to holland'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'gay elvis marriages.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'except you're wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How so, TigerNUTS?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because they do not exclude homosexuals, either single or otherwise from the process'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they do descriminate against single people'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'they should.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and they do descriminate against single men'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'HomerSimpson: I guess you could lie through your teeth, but you have to go through rigorous investigations to adopt. If an anti-gay fucker finds out you're gay, they could deny your request.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes. They. Do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i agree, they should descriminate against single people'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'As a single man, if you're gay, you can't adopt. END OF STORY. If you're heterosexual, you CAN. It is DIFFICULT, but the possibility exists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That possibly DOES NOT EXIST if you are gay. END OF STORY.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'NOT equal rights. Your argument is invalid. SHUT UP.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yuna, a lot of end of stories here for something you just googled.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'you really make the impression of grabbing stuff out of your arse and calling them facts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I just needed to confirm it. I'm not that big on U.K. politics. I just needed to confirm what I thought was true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'haha, how scientific!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Why would a gay couple or single want to adopt anyways? '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'make a hypthesis, google until you find something that points towards that it's true, BOOM! Fact!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't make a fool of myself by going into debates without the facts, like Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Oh, really?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'no, you make them up first :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Here's an interview with a single gay man who adopted a daughter in the UK -- http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2012/02/24/interview-adoption-for-the-single-gay-man/'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Majic, fake obviously'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm busy reading the legislation'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'didn'y you just hear? It's impossible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yuna said it with such certainty that it must be true ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Styliann: 'Yuna, from direct.gov.uk.... the following people are eligible to adopt, single people (irrespective of their sexual orientation)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hmmm.. I seem to have misread the law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'You seem to have made a fool of yourself ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at HomerSimpson.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Who wants a Duff beer  ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'it's funny too, because it was the very first link that popped up when I googled 'can single gays adopt in the uk''
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The scant sources on U.K. adoption laws are confusing and unclear.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Then why was it so crystal clear just moments ago that homosexuals were discriminated against?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'funny stuff :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm Swedish, our Google(.se) gives different hits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, I could only find sources confirming gay COUPLES could adopt. Nothing on single gays.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I will concede that I was wrong on this issue.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'So because you can only find a source confirming gay couples can adopt, that means that singles can't?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And that, yes, I was a fool of myself.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, but if it mentions gay couples ONLY, it's usually indicative singles can't adopt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'With gay couples it's a lot more obvious they're gay :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'it's obvious that if it's a single'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'then sexual preferences doesn't matter in the first place'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In some countries/states, it's not about being obvious, it's about not thinking a single homosexual person can foster a child.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'hence gay couples are mentioned'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nods, and there ARE states that make that illega, and I think that's wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'it's still hefty to jump to such a conclusion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why I was confused. Adoption laws are very specific in many states/countries. In some, gay couples can adopt, gay singles can't (yet heterosexual singles can).'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'i think that stability is more a primary issue than whether a single person can adopt single or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2002/38/part/1/chapter/3'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sections 50 and 51'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is no restriction on adoption for either a single, or a couple, no restriction on sexuality'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We've already concluded I was wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that was never in doubt'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'The Nox are the best race of people in the stargate sg1 universe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Too bad they fell off the face of the universe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'typical of militant liberals who always think they're being mistreated'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He who is obsessed with gay sex should remain quiet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'odd, i remember starting with the comment that i hated how the media and politicians kept making it an issue when it wasn't actually important'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I'd rather say that the person who has a habit of going off half-cocked and screaming at others without gathering the facts first should remain quiet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i guess you chose to selectively ignore that'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If it's not important, why do you fight it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fight what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The introduction of gay civil rights?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'gays already have civil rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what is it you think they're fighting for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, there's one thing that is a constant in almost all countries: A ban on homosexuals to donate blood. This includes the U.K. (and regrettably Sweden last time I checked)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think it's a sort of democracy to be a community of people not wanting homosexuality normalized in your community, of course the government disagrees and by law they have to accept it - people just don't make decisions for themselves very much anymore'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Rizgoth munches on some peeps.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sterotypes and fear fuel most of the hatred'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'homosexuals can give blood in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some places don't care, that's their choice - when a minority gets themselves enforced on a majority then that's dictatorship, not democracy'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like the gospel states homsexuality is an abomination, but the government declares it must marry same sex people'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'http://www.blood.co.uk/can-i-give-blood/exclusion/'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'But making a national holiday for homosexuals? What makes them so special that everyone that is straight doesn't get a holiday. I thought the holiday was pretty over the line.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're only allowed to give blood if it's been at least 12 months since you last had sex with a man (as a man).'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'funny, i didn't think we included abomination in the state constitution'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I.e., not equal rights.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'yuna, what percentage of new hiv infections occur through male-to-male sexual contact? '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What country has a national hloiday for homosexual?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I think he's referring to gay pride day, which isn't really a national holiday.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Depends on the country and state. Also, who cares?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might as well claim that someone who's had hep-b is being descriminated against because they can't give blood'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at Tigernuts.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You test the blood for diseases.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baalaeron: 'I think the holiday doesnt represent fairness so much as there struggle to be traited fairly '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'because male homosexuality is still a high risk factor for blood-borne diseases, not all of which are easy to test for.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If it's disease free, it shouldn't matter. But it does... if it comse from a gay man.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'they also don't let people (in the us) give blood who've spent too much time in the uk, due to mad cow disease etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'why take excess risks if they're not ultra-short of blood? you want it from people with the fewest risk factors possible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'that's discrimination, Majic!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't mean on a community level homosexuals have no rights in a democracy, government large can still protect human rights, but community could have bylaw against pissing in a public place as they can have same sex expressions of passion, which alot of people don't like to see cause it makes them uncomfortable'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'community by community though'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's also a life ban for those people who injected themselves with drugs! descrimination!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think the idea of removing government marriage is pretty good though, it fits into more my kind of thinking'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You just equated being gay with taking drugs, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Didn't take you that long.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'both are risk factors for AIDS, yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except they aren't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yuna, stop it, you're being silly now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Unprotected sex is a risk factor, not being gay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'it's not about the homosexuality, but the risk factor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Except they bloody well are. Check the statistics for yourself.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like tiger says though, homosexuality is an opinionated moral non-issue compared to the real issues in the world, and is used to mock the importance of the other'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Under the current U.K. laws, a gay couple cannot give blood, even if they ahve been monogamous (and disease-free) for 20 years.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'hence, gays who don't have unprotected sex can give blood, eh? ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I looked it up, in the us over 70% of new hiv infections occur through male-to-male sexual contact. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because, shock, they regularly have sex with each other.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Where, in the U.K.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'can you read? I said where.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baalaeron: 'use a brand new needle every time you will never get aids I guarentee it sex with another male with condom theres feasibly still a chance '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You didn't capitalize "U.S.", so I missed it. I apologize.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, Baalaeron, sex with another male WITH AN STD.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'And this is why gay people should get a donkey.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Having sex with a healthy disease-free man doesn't amgically run the risk of contracting an STD.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'LOL :D'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baalaeron: 'obviously '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, under current UK laws, monogamous gay couples cannot give blood.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Not all tests at 100% accurate in testing, especially if you account for the human variables. If the guidelines were laxed and allowed MSM to donate blood, the risk factor for additional HIV infections would increase, a while back I read about a study that proposed that allowing MSM to donate blood could increase HIV infections by 1 person per year.  Taking into account the false-negative rate and the risks.  I'm not saying I'm okay with not being allowed to donate blood, but I certainly understand why I shouldn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you realise that it's not law, it's NHS guidelines'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's no different to car insurance being refused on someone who is over 80'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're just arguing semantics. It's de facto law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'At least you can still use a golf cart.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'and that's where it crosses the line from 'equal rights' to 'ridiculous'. I certainly agree with things like gay partners being able to visit their beloved in the hospital, have each other automatically as hcpoa, adopt children, et cetera.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not a de-facto law, you are not prevented from doing anything because of your sexuality'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Princess Liathum is agreeing with that Tigernuts person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: '(or single gays, before you go off on me)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, Majic. They don't have many of those things in the U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'all gay people would have to do is sign a power of attorney for eachother......'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are plenty of things that you CANNOT do in the UK that you should be able to that are far more important'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which take time, effort and costs money.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Except, Riz, there are states where a valid power of attorney has been ignored due to local social workers finding a relationship between two elderly men repugnant.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Which is fuckin' disgusting, I forgot the names, but it was California.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'That is ridiculous, Majic. :('
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, Tigernuts, if you and your socially conservative co-horts just didn't fight it, there wouldn't be uch of an issue.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'put the two men in different nursing homes and wouldn't allow visitation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you don't like the fact they don't want your blood, then blame all the promiscious people of the last 30 years that spread it around'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You mean the case where a gay died and his partner got nothing from his estate? They auctioned off his stuff and took the money?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Why are you assuming he's fighting it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'churches are forced to marry same sex people, being based on the bible'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'As far as I've seen, he's just said that he thinks it's overblown. Not that he's fighting it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because he's against gay marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '@majic'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who is against gay marriage?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(Which was made apparent two days ago)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're not? Then there's no issue here.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Chemosh, I'm not aware of a case in the US where a church has been forced to marry a gay couple, but in states where it's legal they ARE entitled to have a civil official perform their marriage regardless of the civil official's personal feelings.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But why do you blame the "liberals" for making an issue out of it then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hello, they are called wills.....I can leave my estate to the Donkey Salvation Army if I want.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'There're some legal hurdles in a same-sex partnership that heterosexual couples don't have to deal with.  Granted, there are legal forms that can be off assistance, but not every couple has the monetary means of having a lawyer draw up the necessary paperwork, not when a simple marriage license would do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There is no such thing as a country or state where religious institutions are forced by law to marry same-sex couples against their will.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why do liberals make an issue out of it? who knows? it's probably all they've got, since none of their stances on anything vaguely important hold any weight'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Yuna, this is another example of you jumping to conclusions based on a hasty reading. What he's saying is that HE thinks fighting for other things is more important, not that he's against it in principle. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Now you can disagree on the importance (and of course you do, we tend to focus on things that are important to ourselves).'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'There are more important things that need to be in the U.S. before the issue of gay marriage comes up, IMO.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Princess Liathum shrugs helplessly.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But that's the thing, Tigernuts. It's not the liberals making an issue of it, it's the conservatives. If the conservatives simply did not fight gay civil rights, there'd be no issue. New laws would be passed painlessly, nobody would care.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nuh uh, it was never about that'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'But some (like donating blood) I agree should be left :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in saskatchewan (where i am) there was'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and i'm not about to get into a left-right paradigm argument about it, both sides should stfu about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sources, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'more HIV cases per year because nobody stops the madness, then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i draw the line at forcing religious groups to conduct gay marriages against their will'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'I agree with it, the risk of additional HIV infections is far too high to reduce the guidelines.  Until HIV testing is better, I'm fine with it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Saskatchewan's top court has decided that proposed legislation allowing provincial marriage commissioners to refuse to perform same-sex weddings on religious grounds violates the constitution. http://www.ctvnews.ca/court-refusing-same-sex-marriage-violates-constitution-1.594565'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In Sweden, when gay marriage was up for vote. Every single party in parliament voted "Yay". A single party, the Christian Democrats, who held 4% of the votes, voted it down. Nobody fucking cared, it was a non-issue, it passed and the Christian Democrats looked bad.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but in terms of legal rights, and a right to use the word, let them have it'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'End of fucking story.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'non-denominational or denomination which accepts it is ok, but here's they're transgressing a church's bible that says homosexuality is wrong and saying because they have the ability to marry ordinary people they must marry homosexuals'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nobody has EVER argued for forcing religious constitutions to marry same-sex couples against their will.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'heh, trying to convince people to use safer practices and avoid unprotected sexual intercourse, especially with multiple partners, would do a lot more to reduce std infections than trying to ban gay marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Actually, yuna, some people have. Be careful with words like 'nobody', they make you look rather foolish.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, Chemosh. Give us a single source for that claim.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Single nutcases do not count.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do you Americans really have a supreme court judge called "Boner"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Princess Liathum giggles at Tigernuts's actions.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Maybe you're confusing a case of a Christian-owned venue being forced to allow a gay couple to rent it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'a source isn't a source cause you didn't look at it, typical'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'must be a quantum source'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sorry, I missed it when you postd it last time. I was busy typing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Saskatchewan's top court has decided that proposed legislation allowing provincial marriage commissioners to refuse to perform same-sex weddings on religious grounds violates the constitution. http://www.ctvnews.ca/court-refusing-same-sex-marriage-violates-constitution-1.594565'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The hell is wrong with you, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Pronvincial marriage commissioners" =/= "Religious institutions"'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't you find it odd that when half the western world's economy is teetering on total collapse, people spend vast amounts of energy talking about the definition of a word 'marriage'?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what priests are called because they have the ability to marry people legally'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'komtraya!'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i personally find it incomprehensible, verging on disgraceful'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And, no, there's no Boner on the U.S. Supreme Court. I think the Republican House Speaker is named Boener or something similar, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'There's a Boner on the N.C. Supreme Court :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Bill Clinton? :O'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and yet, I still cant find a pest control service that doesnt rip people off around here.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'While priests are marriage commissioners, not all marraige commissioners are priests.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'denmark, early june, gay couples have the right to get married in any church they choose, the priest can refuse to perform the marriage but the bishop must arrange a replacement who will. unless I misread it, which is always possible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Religion was a defining theme of the Great Depression.  Just sayin'.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Marriage Commissioners in Canada are Publicly Appointed though, aren't they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'must not be getting THAT close to teetering.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'oh, so you ignore the arguement and assume no marriage commissioners belong to churches and all marriage commissioners is therefore a nonissue'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'If they're publicly appointed, I understand the court's ruling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Majic, that's beacuse the Church of Denmark took a vote on it and they SUPPORT same-sex marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Still waiting for that $1 a gallon of gas to come back....'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, democracy there, like i said - this is what results in hate crimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, Chemosh. They are civil servants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at Princess Liathum.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I totally agree that a civil servant should not be able to refuse any valid marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not even are communities voiceless, but so are churches'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'their god has to be politically correct'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Same thing goes, btw, for an employee in a government hospital. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"That's when the provincial government sought advice on two versions of its proposed law -- one that would allow all of the province's approximately 370 commissioners to refuse to wed couples on religious grounds..."'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The case was NEVER about priests only, Chemosh.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'not going to happen, Riz.  Not until electric vehicles become just as cheap and powerful and widespread.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'I agree that churches should be allowed to say no, but if gay marriage is legal in the province, the public servant should uphold that law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at Princess Liathum.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, my natgas car runs on fuel that currently costs $1.67 a gallon equiv :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Princess Liathum is agreeing with that Dispel Majic person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'And hospital employees as well.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'scratch that, now it is $1.62'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'I pay $3.07 a gallon for my SUV :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they make commercially-available cars that run on natgas?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'honda does....the only one for non business fleets.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A marriage commissioner itnerviewed for the article is not a priest.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'more people should buy a natgas car for local driving....makes sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Chemosh, that case was never about priests vs. gays. It was always about marriage commissioners vs. gays.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'gas prices have dropped nearly 10% here of late,'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'down to $8.07 a gallon'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Marriage officials can't refuse gays: Sask. court http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/story/2011/01/10/sk-marriage-commissioners-1101.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Right, but what I can't find an answer to is -- does a priest have to be a marriage commissioner to perform marriages?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you're a 7th day adventist priest you have to marry same sex people or get your ability to marry anybody revoked'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I've been looking, to.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Marriage official is a CIVIL position.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'too.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is what comes from having a bunch of parasitic criminals in charge of the country'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so they couldn't have avoided this issue by allowing them to deny marrying homosexuals and hiring some government nondenominational marriage commissioners'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bunch of communists'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nobody's forced to conduct same-sex marriages in their churches against their will, but being a marriage commissioner is a civil position. You have to follow  the law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'In San Francisco..'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Here are the requirements to become a Deputy Marriage Commissioner for a day: http://www.sfgov2.org/index.aspx?page=48'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why must the government hire some new people to staff places where only bigots are marriage commissioners?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In some rural places, there may be only a single marriage commissioners. So gay couples are expected to travel to another city to get married?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, marriage commissioner is a CIVIL position.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"I'm religious!" does not fly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'My position on that is that the government should be responsible to provide marriage comissioners that will take anyone in.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bigot now, i think homosexuals are bigot's cause they expect society to conform to them instead of allowing them to choose to'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at HomerSimpson.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'natgas is a wonderful fuel source for producing electricity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's a democratic government they say, they should be upholding that fact before forcing their devil's law down god's minister's throat'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which is what they are doing, HomerSimpson.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'but that shouldn't stop anyone who won't comission just anyone from comissioning marriages.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Or just be like New York and allow people to marry each other with witnesses instead of requiring marriage commissioners.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Either follow the law or don't be a commissioner".'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'IIRC, in New York any marriage vows are valid, with or without a commissioner, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why, HomerSimpson?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nods liathum, all you need are witnesses'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Been awhile since I've lived in NY.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There was some fucktard who refused to marry an interracial couple in the U.S. last yaer or the year before that. A shitstorm ensued. I think they lost their job.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'I wish we'd all go to that anyway.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nods yuna, it was a conservative religious judge in louisiana'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'get rid of marriage, and make them all civil unions.....3 years maximum, with unlimited renewals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"I don't like it!" is not a valid excuse to discrimiante when you hold a CIVIL position vested to you by the government.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'and as a public official, he absolutely should have lost his job.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You mean he DIDN'T?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Where did I say he didn't?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You said he "should have", which implies he didn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yuna, that depends. If the government pays your wage, then I totally agree.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'It does not.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'if it doesn't, then I don't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It CAN imply that. I haven't kept current on the subject.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Should does not in any sense imply the opposite. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'It *can*. It doesn't have to.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Why stop an organisation from comissioning marriages just because they only turn to part of the people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Should just means that I agree with him losing his job over it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Should have" can imply "Didn't happen".'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'It can. It doesn't necessarily.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes. I interpreted it wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is there enough denominational tax-payers in your nation to justify your church civil democrat servants upholding it's church skepticism of who it administers it's civil duty on?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Organizations don't commission marriages.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what's tehir wages and your accumulated tax's of the clergy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, HomerSimpson, what if they hate black people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'churches should pay property tax.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What if they hate not-white people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'if the church doesn't agree with interracial marriage, I'd support their right to be bigoted on their own property.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What if they just hate specific people? "I hate that idiot Thomas Cartwright's face. I'm not gonna marry him!"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'doesn't mean I don't think they're a bunch of morons.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'victimising the black people now, are we?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'then let them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What if they hate people who have been divorced?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'We've established that commissioners are public servants, has nothing to do with churches or anything organized.  As a public/civil servant, they should only be required to uphold the constitution and laws in their territory.  Religion shouldn't affect that at all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What if they hate disabled people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'there will still be plenty of places for black people to marry white people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'congregation*'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Seriously, why should people who hold civil positions be allowed to discrimiante based on personal beliefs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because in a democracy everybody has an equal say in a matter'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In some places, they have to go to another city.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if it pertains to them and their freedom, if it's a free nation'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not all governments are "civil"'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'because it's a mess to have to marry twice, once in church, then again to make it count for the law'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'As long as the county courthouse (us) or similar marries anyone who shows up for a valid marriage I don't see the issue with what Joe Blow's church does.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which means they either have to have a separate ceremony for friends and family. Or have them all come with them. Either way, money, time and effort has to be spent.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'the only reason to want that kind of law is to piss off religions people'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Civil Servants need to uphold the laws and constitution of their territory, if the laws and constitution of their territory are not to their liking, there are channels they can go through to get it changed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'it doesn't help anyone to not allow them to continue marrying people'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Majic, don't all church weddings require civil marriage licenses, anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So it's really inconsequential what the church thinks and does.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(legally speaking)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Except that in many cases, the minister is the official who performs the marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, I know. My point was that they don't technically do it as part of a religious institution.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why would saint homosexual want to be married by a minister who believes marrying them is wrong, but is doing so against his own free will?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'and why does that matter?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'that's pretty arguable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'don't think the church requires one on religious grounds, so much as they're being good stewards of the community (ie, the state requires it so the church follows the law)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Chemosh, SHUT UP.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'good questions are worthy of silencers'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That bill IS NOT about forcing priests to marry same-sex couples against their will.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'In their view, they're doing it firstly as part of their religious institution, and only secondly as a civil ceremony.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he doesn't like it up him, Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's about not enshrining in the law the right for ALL marriage ministers to discrimiante.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Regardless of whether or not they're priests.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Yuna, have you any source that says that a minister isn't required to be a marriage commissioner in order to perform marriages?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Chemosh: I got my driver's license renewed the other day from someone who works in the Department of Transportation, should they be able to say they'd rather not provide me with my documents afforded to me by the laws and constitution of my territory because they don't like that I have a different color skin than they do?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'If he's required to be a marriage commissioner in order to perform marriages (which I STILL cannot find a source for), then I would actually disagree with it. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not the point, Majic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The right to perform marriages is not a religious right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Yes, it is the point. You're saying 'If you're going to marry anyone in the church, you need to marry everyone who comes, regardless of your religion.''
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They can have their symbolic religious rites and rituals all they want.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But if they choose to get the CIVIL right to perform marriages, they have to obey the law. Not discrimiante against anyone they happen to dislike.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, not in YOUR CHURCH.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'So you'd force someone who wants a church wedding to have two ceremonies. Funny, you seemed to be against that before.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'if we can discriminate based on whether you have a medical marijuana prescription or not, I don't see why we can't discriminate against other things.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm not advocating forcing priests to perform church weddings for everyone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'why is it necessary to force the extra hassle of another marriage in a civil court? It's just extra work for the government AND the couple.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But they ahve to perform their CIVIC DUTY when it comes to marriage for everyone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'blame the liberals for that, Hanslanda'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'another thing they're hypocritical about'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No I'm not, Majic. You don't need two ceremonies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Only if all of the priests in said church refuse to follow the law and do the job they are contracted to do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'No, but if the minister isn't authorized to marry you civilly, you need to go to the court as well. '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'And if he IS, he has to marry anyone who comes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'And I do disagree with that. Sorry.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's the LAW.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the department of transportation is a non-denominational institution'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And where do you draw the line, Majic?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'It's newly the law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why would a minister put himself in the position of granting a license in an out-of-church context if he knows he would disagree with it on religious grounds?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds like a bit of a tard to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'At gay people? Black people? People color (not white)? People with foreign accents? People who the priest thinks are too young to get married? Handicapped people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that'd be taking personal beliefs into a general job and descriminating based on those, which they do anyways'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Easy. If you want a marriage, no questions asked, no requirements needed, go to the county clerk. If you want a religious marriage (which may require pre-marital counselling, may require you to be a church member, may require a WHOLE LOT of other things), then go to a minister.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Where do we draw the line of who a priest can and cannot discriminate against as part of their CIVIC duty?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'why is the priest beign forced to provide a service to anyone?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'What priest is being forced to provide a service?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'we draw the line at "no one is forced to do anything"'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'marriage is usually done in a church and is a casual job of it's members, not a job done in a tax-payer office for the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You don't get it, do you, Majic? In some rural parts, priests may be the only ones who can marry people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Liathum, I can't find out whether, in Saskatchewan, a minister has to be a marriage commissioner to perform a marriage as part of his church.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'baloney'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yuna, that's the govts. responsibility'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're fare morely likely to find a civil marriage guy than a priest pretty much anywhere in western europe'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'they didn't hire the priests, so they can't demand them to perform the service'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'far*'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, I'm actaully not against a bill that allows priests to opt out.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Then we have no disagreement.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I was just questioning the heart of the matter.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Priests can opt out. Nobody else can.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I think the government shouldn't handle marriage at all, but that's just me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Not the best source, but according to ehow, "While laws differ from state to state, you must usually hold some kind of government licence or religious ordination in order to legally perform marriage ceremonies."'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The article Chemosh linked to was about ALL marriage commissioners, which is what I was debating.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nods, note the 'or''
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Sure, Yuna. But as I've said a few times, I can't figure out whether priests are required to hold this certification or not in order to perform marriages.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Starling: Then what about all of the right afforded by marriage? Or do you wish all of those rights to be covered by Civil Unions?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'And if they ARE required to hold this certification, it does force them to choose.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'nod, which it shouldn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, but they can fight their own fight. Introduce a separate bill to allow for priests to opt out.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That SPECIFIC bill was a general bill. Not one meant only for priests.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baalaeron: 'easy answer is make sure theres a certified guy to marry gay peopl in every major city ixne on the rural argument thers all kinds of stuff rural ppl dont get cuz they live out there'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which is why it was rightfully struck down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'I think if you're ordained, you should have a government exemption (separation of church and state and all that) but the couple should still have to "file" paperwork at the local courthouse for the civility of their marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'I'd rather say that one should make a separate bill for marriage comissioners hired by the govt, and force them and them alone to marry anyone'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dispel Majic nods at HomerSimpson.
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't like bills, the rent is always too damned high'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'occam's razor people, if you're having to make all this legislation/loopholes/exemptions, somethings wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So being a marriage commissioner is a right, but not gay marriage, HomerSimpson?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Regardless of HOW you get married, ultimately, you should file that marriage with the federal/state government.  That's the only part that gay marriage should affect, whether the government could refuse or deny the marriage license based on sex.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'where did I say that gay marriage wasn't a right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Unforgivable: 'no special government benefits, everything else covered through contract, then you have equality'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think occam's razor needs sharpening'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'many countries work like that Liathum. I'm pretty sure it's like that in Sweden and the rest of Scandinavia.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'marriage is a symbolic representation of two people's commitment to eachother, maybe people should protest getting married by the government if they're making your church violate it's faith'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But HomerSimpson, anyone has a right to discriminate against gay marriage in your proposed legislation. Thus it is not a right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you can be married, just on a different level than theirs, which is all about control'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'no, any homosexual is free to marry a person of the opposite sex in church, so no discrimination here ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In Sweden, unless I'm mistaken, marriage is 100% a civil affair. You go to the country clerk's office, you file the necessary paperwork, you do whatever. Church weddings are a formality. Everyone's happy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'if you marry in church (svenska kyrkan) that's official'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'learn your own law, dude'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think you still need the civil paperwork done.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'you get a paper'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'but the ceremony is official'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'you don't need to sign shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh? Didn't know or care. I'm not getting a church marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'my pens don't write on shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Always thought you needed to sign papers regardless. Not that it matters, really. Svenska kyrkan supports same-sex marriage. Priests and churches can opt out of it, but gays can get married in church.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'supposed to use them on paper, but kudos for creativity'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Baalaeron: 'get a stamp its easier anyway '
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'hey, I said you DONT sign shit ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'we're not stupid here, you know ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'well, not *some* of us at least :D'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Civil and religious weddings require the same paperwork in Sweden from what I can tell.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, no, no difference.'
T3/r7/2012-07-02.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) HomerSimpson: 'Yes, it's the same, and both also require an official ceremony.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I missed this last month "http://news.discovery.com/history/amelia-earhart-distress-calls-120601.html". Guess there's a new expedition going out to look for her plane. "http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/02/do-clues-to-amelia-earhart-mystery-lurk-beneath-the-sea/?hpt=hp_c2"'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I disagree'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US really needs to spend $10 billion or so over the next 5 years buying 70 new boeing firefighter jets.  We used to have 50 of them c-130s, but now the fleet is down to 14, and one just crashed killing 4 people onboard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Can they be used to kill tuurrrrrists?'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Conceal only works on items.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'mischan'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'ooh, a 500 mile lithium air battery for vehicles.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'An acre of corn can be used to generate 300 gallons of ethanol per year, while an acre of algae can produce 6,000 to 10,000 gallons of light sweet crude oil annually.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can grow algae on water'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '(PC) Progressive Conservative a duel meaning for Politically Correct suppression of democracy and freedom of speech communism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i hate stalinists'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'oh cool the news said there's a heat wave coming'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) VampireDude: 'oh and there's a student loan rate extension... maybe i should become a grad student'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the cost of education and availability of jobs with go up and down to cater to their inability to pay it off for imf bailout communism'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and quality of education too, that'll go way down'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're removing mathematics from grade school now, cause computers are god like the particle'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'student loans should be based on potential payout if you're going for a field that only pays out if you are the lucky SOB that gets the doctorate and actually finds one of the openings in that field... aka 1  in 10k like oh archy... you're capped at a high payback rate to deter foolish persuits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'or a masters in fine arts...'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'look at computer science, all them people getting their degree in the future of the world industries, and now yahoo/hp and others lay off 30,000 at a time'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'when voters are not educated in science subjects, they are simpler to fool with religion, bad statistics, blatant lies, corrupt politics, greedy business'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'dumb people are easier to con out of money....'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'hell even 'sciences' doesn't mean you're employed in that field... I was in engineering and told point blank 1st year, of you that graduate, less than 20% will *ever* use what you are taught, get an MBA it will suit you more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Business Administration" requires "mathematics"'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'united states military college or whatever in new york/new jersey produces alot of successful businessmen, i guess they pay for harvard and other places too - competitive job market, must work for (a) government to be the 47 million dollar per year CEO of air canada etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'That's just a lie. In any field, you need to continue learning throughout your career if you want to remain on top of it. That's true for engineering, MBA or anything that requires brains.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's my impression, i don't see ordinary people ever getting to that point without serving a government'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'What you are taught is a basic understanding of your field, nothing more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'You need 100% of it to be able to learn enough to continue working in the field.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'even the Bob Newhart school of accounting ("get the totals to within a few cents is okay") uses some arithmetic'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'north korea does that too i think, pampers certain people in high-expense paid trips through life, that's one thing i consider when i consider the reality of governments like america being different from governments like korea'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you'll never hear the republican's talking about cutting high-expense paid 47 million dollar paycheque individuals from the tax-payer, they're more focused on the peasant's social spending'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and how is that different in the US?'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I am willing to bet that the US government pampers more people than the N. Korean one :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'precisely'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'can you spell J-U-N-K-E-T?'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'maybe the Bob Newhart school of accounting ("get the totals to within a few cents is okay") shall become more popular if they no longer teach arithmetic in USA schools (version2 of similar joke)'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'they don't teach arithmetic in the US  :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'they do teach how to remove shoes to complete calculation :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'if you become an Imm the bots will revolt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-03.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do you think numbers really make all the difference in war?  if so india and china must be unstoppable'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is there even 1.5 billion white europeans on earth?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's twice as many of each indian and chinese'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Kill ratio is much more important than sheer numbers, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'tell that to the russians'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Nuclear weapons as a deterrent mean there will be NO traditional war between any deterrent or allied country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'War is by proxy, as it has been since the end of WWII'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Yeah but NK or Taiwaan could get hot pretty quick. It's unlikely, but in that case, the Chinese army outnumbers the US army by a little less than 5 to 1. So if the US had a 6 to 1 kill ratio, it'd be a long, ugly war of attritrion with a slight edge to the US.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'If the US could manage a kill ratio even higher than that, they could win faster or save more lives.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Are you thick? China vs US = nukes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Number of grunts means nothing anymore.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'land area of china's not very much though, they'd require alot more nukes fired at the usa than the other way around'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I doubt it. At least not at first. What's the fun of ruling cinders?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Nukes mean there will be no 'first' - war is all or nothing unless it is by proxy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm still trying to figure what could have persuaded the uzbekistan government to forcibly sterilize 4 women per doctor per month'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Heard of the Cold War?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I doubt killing troops would be the major use of nukes between China and US... they'd be high-altitude EMP blasts to knock out the war machine.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No, they would be ground level attacks on production facilities. Which just so happen to be cities. All of them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'why would china and usa have a war in the first place? doesn't make much sense'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'There was no mention of troops entering the USSR or the US over Cuba. It was always going to be a finger on the red button and hello armageddon.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what is the pacific military drill they're doing with russia this summer for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'they're way too co dependent for that '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Maybe. But if you can shut down a few factories, or a couple thousand square miles of electronics and vehicles, it'd be a lot easier to march your army in against a disabled enemy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and it reports on bbc putin going to china and are hand in hand on all issues, what other issues are there in the pacific besides china's korean ally?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Oath - you miss the point. The leaders have no reason to lose - all they have to do is say "get the fuck out of our country or we nuke the world"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'That is the entire point of MAD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Nobody can or will ever win.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Taiwaan, Okinawa, US vs China influence in other countries like the Phillipenes, undersea resources... it's a pretty busy area.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Yes, and it is ALL by proxy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Yeah, but the point wasn't if it was all by proxy, it was facing China's billion+ people pool.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'What do people matter? How many nukes per square mile do you need before people stop being a factor?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Here's a hint: less than we already have.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nonexistant future, versus eternal bondage under nuclear slave pharoah's leading to eventual extinction, at least the nonexistant future offers the possibility that existance will continue and the pharoah's won't be part of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i like when people just get it over with'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just imagine the asshole's who'll rule the world tomorrow, earned nothing human trash thinking they're god, being worshipped by billions'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as bad as stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'probably be the world under stalinism forever'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it seems western nations are turning into communist pig pits, and ukraine is heading back to the 1930's'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I think nu-style Putin-ism is going to be more common.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Cloak and dagger type stuff again.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'More Cold War East Germany instead of WW2 Siberia.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're doing that now with the slave-camp political prisoner railways and 80% fraudulent drug-charge allegations'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'locked up and maybe killed in prison to save the tax payer some money'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'imagine the kind of traitor you have to be to serve a government like that, coming from the general population to frame it for your government and call it enforcing the law'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder which government originally set that up, possibly the byzantines'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and you and your government's the only real crook'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'At his death, the role of the emperor as a patron of Eastern Orthodoxy was claimed by Ivan III, Grand Duke of Muscovy. He had married Andreas' sister, Sophia Paleologue, whose grandson, Ivan IV, would become the first Tsar of Russia (tsar, or czar, meaning caesar, is a term traditionally applied by Slavs to the Byzantine Emperors). Their successors supported the idea that Moscow was the proper heir to Rome and Constantinople. The idea of the Russian Empire as the new, Third Rome was kept alive until its demise with the Russian Revolution of 1917.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Really the US is probably a lot closer to old Rome than a lot of European countries. A federal republic, using a stock market to leverage arbitage, and a fractional reserve banking system.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'inven'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, i was thinking of the concept of bring out the worst in your people and paying them for crimes against themselves, like the romans setting free their slaves who choose to stay and subject others to the conditions they hated'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe making it worse and worse as time goes on'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the west at least everybody's given a fair trial, not south of america though, as long as they're not too rich - then they're beyond the law like is proper for a criminal of such high calibre - haha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cops rigging evidence get prosecuted once in awhile, sometimes they'll make evidence disappear and handle the investigation themselves though, and if they're in on it then nothing'll be found out'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're just not in on it as much there'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in canada the harper communist party makes new laws to break instead of declaring the red guard can detain whoever they want (being drafted by the obama communist party) and find the evidence after, if anybody asks'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in china recently, i think they added an amendment that after seizing sombody for no reason they have to inform the family after 24 hours'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i just really hate the government of the entire world, it's pure evil'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some places are a little worse than others though, others deteriorate over time using the rot as justification why a liberty must be sacrificed on the altar'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm never under the illusion that explainations for oppression are there for anything other than the illusion of diplomacy'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you think all the protesters in the world could touch a soft spot in somebody as evil as the genociders of the 1930's heart?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they'd just provide an easy target and future political target for future cattle-ranches by their participation'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'to those kind of people'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'imagine they live in the middle of the most disgustingly oppressed and starving area of the world in a gigantic castle and see you protesting a dollar, not being an emancipated world vision commercial you'd make him feel even better crushing you - like the woman for the IMF says about greece'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'protesting them's where it's at, not what they create/subtract from you, they won't listen'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'evil reptilians!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't know if human reptiles exist, i met a woman who claimed she knows one that lives about 50 miles from me though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'd say the humans who cause this kind of evil are in absence of any form of conscience though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read once that vlad the impaler was raised in a ottoman dungeon watching political prisoners get executed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people in cambodia are pretty strange too, from a look, even the reporters are scared to notice they're strange'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they had a pretty rough recent history though, like the absence of any form of moral guidance almost, total brutality'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'you talk like Druzil. is Druzil your alt, Chem-man?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how does druzil talk?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'long lonesome debate monologues'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'better than interactive talks about nothing isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'oh maybe'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i always assume i'm talking to the trash i'm talking about'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'one one level or another'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'you could take it like.. "all is you". and go crazy:)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'cause its the truth'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Hwuaijijal winks suggestively.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some of the things i hear here are arrived at from other places and the amount of knowledge isn't present in most common modern history and things like that, so they're possibly behind some of the things i hate in reality'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and they follow me to other internet applications, some of them - that's unusual, something a government can do'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if putin actually worked for the KGB and the kgb was disbanded in 1991, and the german stasi was the kgb's half of germany, which aljazeera says retired into 17,000+ jobs in government and industry in 1989, and their job was to police civilians and torture 'politically incorrect' people, what kind of people could be developing things like the production of the minds at this place?  which are infernal alot of them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'nice. eu parliament voted against acta'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'also, what do you mean by "if putin actually worked for kgb"? putin was in kgb and fsb'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read it on wikipedia, and am not a administrator of theirs to look through their records and verify things myself'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'said from 1985-1990 in dresden'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'yes. he was the real kgb dude'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm only interested cause of the infernal minds that surrounded me my whole life, principals, co-workers, employers etc, classmates sometimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't really care about what happens in the middle-east except if it affects me somehow'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'looking at the german stasi's job, they're a possible explaination'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'middle earth'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i like to figure out who my enemy is so i don't have to falsely accuse people, but assuming things is what the prosecution does in court'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or defense sometimes, they propose and then deprove'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GrCHctYyWA what do you think of video's like this? What is even more chilling is this expose' on how William Ayers is planning to implement their mutual Marxist ideology, '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'has some strange claims in it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'claims that communist scum like russia invented is in control though, which can be arrived at from many angles'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder if that video i just watched was from ukraine or not, possibly'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so, will the new particle found get us closer to ftl travel ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I think the new particle as it fits in the theory helps put a block on ftl altogether'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Ukraine: Blunt force: Torture and police impunity in Ukraine http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/info/EUR50/010/2011'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'don't hear about that much on the news, or the british royals going for a visit to there sometimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'geez, torture in syria! after war's in afghanistan, iraq and libya - never mind people you do business with who are stalinist devil's'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's all bad though isn't it?  i wonder if it's useful to uphold the illusion that torture is the real issue or not though, seeing as how they ignore it done by their own security council nations, ie russia and china'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and they seem to be the ones sending guns to the 'terrorist', the un, etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the next holocaust, maybe only security personelle will be burnt to a crisp'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Uzbekistan_relations america's great adjacent ally, http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17612550 Two other medical sources suggest that there is especially strong pressure on doctors in rural areas of Uzbekistan, where some gynaecologists are expected to sterilise up to eight women per week.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's a big newsworthy debate if it happens in other places though, maybe even a morality boost to war'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'They should go to China and India and sterilize women'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'far as i heard they have policy's in both places to control the population, indian's prefer male children, have poor health care and have initiative to get sterilized in the forms of material wealth'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in china recently they had an interview with a woman who's 8 month old foetus was aborted by the police'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most of the population problem is a matter of cultural values and respect though, i think, not many people are loyal partners in any neck of the woods'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if people don't watch their government closely, then they might find themselves eventually in the same situation'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like in canada, breaking all the rules harper's assured that he has 3 years left, both him and obama write amendments and legislations to remove freedom from their citizens'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read that bush did too though, so until the people who tell them what to do are dealt with then there'll only be illusion of change in that trend of going that way'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh, you talk as though you are proud of and agree with Harper'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is that how i sound?  i'm just accepting the worst and the large-scale corruption that made it happen, and making predictions based on that assumption'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't mean i agree with it at all, but like the guy on the earlier video says, 'what you think should be is not real, what is real is real''
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh, you seem to be proud of "accepting the worst"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'perhaps a demagogue with poor language skills is his own worst enemy'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'only thing there is to be proud of in accepting the worst is not being self-deceptive to cope with life, if what i'm seeing is correct there's billions of people who're wronged but don't accept the worst cause it distracts them from what they enjoy in life, would you be proud if you didn't enjoy anything in life?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and maybe there'll even be a surprise, the worst was a little worse than what is, so it's a morale booster'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a decent demagogue is supposed to speak against corruption and wickedness, not state an affirmation of the corruption and wickedness'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the odds of solving problems that don't exist are the odds of a asteroid hitting the earth in the next 5 seconds, and usually you have to comprehend or see something to be a problem before you can go about solving it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'identifying the problem is part of speaking against the proper corruption'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'identifying by affirming wickedness is also corrupt'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't know, some old cultists used to divine information from torture, maybe in a different context than the government - if the government defines corruption and gets it's information through it's wicked practice, then what's worse about discussing it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's enough though, i'll leave my amnesty find on debate -h for some random spam to enjoy'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'you make your bed of affirmed wickedness, then you die in that corrupt bed, and are rejected as an affirmative toady'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the etymology of "toady" may've come from "Mr Toad of Toad Hall" in the book "Wind in the Willows"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'more powerful than the gangsters?b The Russian paused, then smiled: bGood observation.b http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Abramovich The Russian oligarch threw a B#5 million bash for a lucky select 300 guests at his B#58 million holiday estate on the Caribbean island of St Barts, according to the Telegraph. http://travel.aol.co.uk/2012/01/01/abramovich-throws-worlds-most-expensive-new-years-eve-party-in-the-Caribbean/'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i remembered the article from the news around new years, i think of it as a symbol of just how feeble any single person on earth is (and possibly their politicians) against who really runs things'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'bleh, more (self-)defeatist tripe from Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(get your act together and grow some intelligent balls -- xchan)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not really, if one of your entertainment pieces costs 1 million bucks and survives, and 1 million bucks can pay for 100 assassinations in most areas of the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's why i remembered it, with all the other thing's i'm considering, rich russians making the news for 10 million dollar new years party (or 8)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is that defeatist or real?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'non sequitur irrelevant'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok, just a hard working guy with a knack for good times, that's fine'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how much does the average torture toy in ukraine make in a year for spending on new years?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how much does the doctor get paid for 36 uterus's a month?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'irrelevant'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's irrelevant if stephen harper and barack obama aren't part of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they all seem to be working together in some way though, i just can't shake that assumption'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they don't report every 10 million dollar yaucht they buy do they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so why did they put it in the news at all?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people didn't even know a american billionairre owned a private island that was stolen from the native american's until 2 months ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the news doesn't report anything about billionairres without their approval first'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, what part of america (or canada) WASN'T stolen from native americans?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is worse than P^hFox news'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'well, as far as i know, some white people coexisted with native american's just fine, but the others, like the communists genociding europe, came and then that's how the whole theft culture started'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aizma: 'Uh, Canada was stolen from Native Canadians. Duh.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'haven't you ever watched history of captain cook, how he treated hawaiians and others?  also tales of eskimo's in eastern greenland gone missing cause the 'adventurers' shot them all'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'were they all pretty threatening people, or were the explorers all worthless commies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not all people are like that, but people like that come in every physical appearance'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'spanish people brutalized bolivians, bolivians adopted their christianity and culture'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's one thing i like about argentina shutting down their oil company, though it's likely that some communist replaced them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'every line on the map has a bunch of homicides and rapes and slavery about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'native americans should be thankful the chinese didn't colonize them, or they'd be like the tibetans'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that doesn't mean they should be quiet about when they're actually mistreated though, blowing false whistles too often numbs people's ears'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most of them are raised without awareness of places like ukraine and uzbekistan, just how bad things can get etc, screaming oppression and things while there definitely is none comparatively to the white man they're raised on being their demons, who are fucked worse than them in europe by communist's / marxist-leninist who treat every race like their garabage'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'history isn't kind to the more peaceful cultures when they collide with the  warmongering cultures and it is unfortunate but that is life'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read that northern china was a peaceful place till genghis khan came around, then i guess china became genghis khan'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how the people like stalin managed to rile up millions of russian murderers to kill their own people while they observe stalin eating like a pig, and how so many could be produced on such a constant basis from that time - is a marvel that's worthy of a book on mind control and use as justification by atheists on why the human mind has no concept of justice'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'dumb animals foresure, that's amazing stuff, but everywhere ends up doing it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's no 'peoples armed police' in china, they're armed against their people'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the police here just ordered some crazy new assault rifles'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's understandable that police have to have weapons when there's weapons in the world, but in some of those places the police are the people's worst enemy, even the terrorists are scared of them, because they are worse - if police were as neccessary to uphold the law then that's fine, but do you think with a midget chinese child being adopted into an american family, cast out of his home because he was a flaw, that they couldn't have put up that one the woman had for adoption instead of chopping it out?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's a matter of social values and respect, like i said, they like absolute dehumanization and immorality with murderous solutions to every problem instead'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they really are like the servants of the ideological satan, except this hell is the world they rule'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and i guess even there he's probably not feeling too good either'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Meh, I don't want that defective coming to the US so I can pay for it with my tax dollars'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'The world is overpopulated, badly, nothing wrong at this point with culling defectives'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'overpopulation will happen again after they cull the herd, it's no solution to the long-term problem of having murderous people who are the absolute scum of the earth in control of the earth cause only they're evil enough to order the repeated genocide's'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'mindfulness/respect/wisdom/values should all be what's taught to children growing up and practiced in business'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most people do the wrong thing and then want to revert back to something they see as the right thing, if that's absent then they keep on their way'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and government, i mean, turn on your television and how many evil temptations are there ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's just how i see it, people seem to be un-naturally evil and incapable of governing themselves to justify their governance by somebody else'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'don't you think it'd be best if the people who ruled the failed world that has to be culled were culled first, for their bad guidance?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it'd be the greater of two evils, the teacher getting the blunt end of the shitstick instead of his product, which he'll produce again'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the soldiers and police might remain loyal to him and his guidance though, not having this introspection themselves'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'look at how they immortalized crucifying adolf hitler, under the belief he was the sole perpetrator of murdering millions of people in the last 100 years, they want him to die and die again and again and again, but would you support a new age conceptual hitler?  maybe a stalin?  cause they seen there's a job that needs to be done?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listening to the hitler speech, if it's him, in the 'hitler declares war on poland' youtube video, it sounds like his arguement was alot better than stalins'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and i didn't hear him mention jews in that speech'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but then they might follow a new genocider's orders in the future, raised on hating one in the past'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or not, since stalin's mostly missing from the modern history'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the movie 300 a mentally disabled person is stigmatized as the price of having defective people amongst you, being ruled by xerxes'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but that's not the kind of defection people should be looking for as reasons to kill'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they're going to look for one'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, that wasn't in 300, that was Meet the Spartans.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the leader of russia live in a castle eating 10 peoples share in wasted food and feasting on every carnal lust imagineable, while he declares stalin's grain must be seized from the kulak's and not distributed among their employees, who were lied to'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but they tgo on serving stalinism, cause he's not defective'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and themselves become the same kind of defective person that i'd look for if i was a world leader'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some of them people who stuffed stalin's face may have been justifying stuffing their own, seeing a simple minded man who's readily acceptible to his own mass-consumption while millions are murdered'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people's definition of 'simple' varies though, like a 12 year old autistic child might be a master in molecular biology'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they say al qaeda posted on their website they was going to burn a bunch of us forests this year, do you think they could be behind the firest in colorado?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'why assume this year is unlike any other wildfire year?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't, there's always alot of fires'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'No, of course not. Al Quaeda technically doesn't exist the way media portrays it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'except they call this one 'the biggest' so that makes me double think'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'occam's razor suggests that, just as previous wildfires, this one was started by lightning strikes OR moronic campers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod Majic'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Al Quaeda was created and is largely funded and directed by western intelligence agencies, notably the CIA'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/national_world&id=8646527'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i did see it on the news, i'm no al qaeda or nothing, i just thought of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Oh, if I were running al qaeda I'd be claiming credit for nearly anything I could just to fuck with people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Your car wrecking? I did that. '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Italy losing the Euro? Al Quaeda did that!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Burned your toast? No, that was US'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The United States burned my toast?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Kim Kardashian being famous? Al Quaeda! One Direction's and Justin Bieber's careers? Al Queda!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cia wouldn't burn themselves down at least, i don't think so'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Haha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The CIA practically created LSD. Let's not play the "What the CIA would and would not do" game.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most guns in terrorist world came from america or russia, and most chemical warfare from britain'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'at least that's what i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hmmm. I think I'd leave Russia out of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'd be wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'transnistria?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why would Russia provide terrorists with guns?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '1987 portrayed movie about america using egypt to sell guns to the enemies of russia?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they was invading afghanistan then'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'russia's recent MO is undermining the west's media propoganda, and poisoning people with polonium'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as Alexander Litvinenko and Yasser Arafat shows'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why would russia feed it to the american population though?  like in the ukraine there where they have no restrictions, they're not really about fair are they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how many european emmigrants in america?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'would what when now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how much say do they have in the actions of the government that armed the enemies of russia and things like that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I literally ahve no idea what you're trying to argue.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think russia understands mindlessness pretty good, they seem to use the media to that affect though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just saying how it is, that russia is led by traitors to humanity and itself and will be until they're replaced'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as far as i can tell'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'most of the world is'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'europe has already been taken over, so has USA and UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Africa is about to be'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'So, What, China is the bee's knees?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'south america is about the only free countries left at the moment'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's like the craziest shows on Fox News and conservative talk shows right here on Aardwolf.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Traitors"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, though there's some hilarious stuff on abc and msnbc'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Ultimately, every government is going to have problems, and like bear the weight of the disdain of the populace, because ninety percent of the time, they don't even know what they're upset about'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep, i always include other nations in traitor portrayals'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Likely*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'even my own'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, because ABC and MSNBC are totally CONSERVATIVE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't care what they are'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but i never absolutely claim nothing and stick to that assertion, only relatively until i find that absolute'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Kisumitrui, I'm upset at your mom for being so foul, I'm writing my Congressman and asking them to declare war.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Precisely.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Declaring that Europe's been taken over by traitors to the human race because... Russia is arming terrorists?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nobody said that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Actually, you kind of did.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'europe has been taken over by global banking cartels'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Hell, the US arms terrorists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it was chemosh talking about traitors specifically'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'hitler's forever demonized, stalin's legacy is honored by russia in putin and other's'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as far as i know'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Fine, then you just declared that Europe's been taken over by traitors to the human race without supporting that crazy supposition.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though you could easily argue that global banking elite who are working against sovereign nations' interest could be called traitors'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'where's the 'disdain'?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you nutbags realize that Russia is 2/3rds located in Asia?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Europeans are traitors to the human race because they drive small cars and eat vegemite.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what are you whittering on about?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Russia isn't the bad guy, it's "another bad guy"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like China'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, if you were paying $8 or $9 a gallon of gas, you would be driving a small car also.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but then again, if prices were THAT high here in the US...our business sense would take over and our large cars would become much lighter.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna can henceforth be titled "Chief Liberal Whitterer"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nothing wrong with Liberals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'canadians should be getting their fuel for free, consuming 13% of what's poisoning their land in a year'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he'll be among the first to be run over by the machine'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they pay more for it than the usa does though, like in most other things'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or more people would switch to natgas cars.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Hell are you talking about now? "The machine"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't speak Crazy. I have no idea what that means.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'pink floyd baby!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs, riz, these uncultured swines'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'll be the first to be run over by a Pink Floyd song?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'XDDD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nah, you'll likely be ground to dust in a concentration camp, or thrown under the wheels of the military police'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think it's called 'Apache Oil' who's slogan is 'whatever benefits houston''
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '3rd biggest oil in the world with multiple black flag companies (labels that they own)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's where they're putting the pipeline from alberta to'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So it's come to this now, TigerNUTS?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not yet'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Welcome to the Machine, sheeple.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Actively advocating for my death and the death of liberals?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but it's the direction of travel'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'No, just advocating the death of your mom'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'At least you're standing tall and adopting the gospel of your conservative talk show nutbag idols.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'eh? i'm advocating nobody's death, i'm just predicting it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Alas, you are already here, so killing her wouldn't fix much'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Tigernuts, while I'm completely certain that you'd be the first one to throw Yuna and I into your little happy fun-time camps, What on earth even brought this hostility out?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not hostile to anyone'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nonsense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Pure unbridled craziness?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Nod Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Of course leave it to a right-winger to instantly run down the path that Tiger did at any sign of an intelligent counbterargument.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Counter-argument*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'You'r the ones throwing ad hominems.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nice to see you're still trapped in the left-right paradigm'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and you're calling -me- crazy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'You're the one turning it into one'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Starling, he who went with the "Your mom" line of ad hominems should not be throwing stones.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'YOU originally started going off on Liberals this and that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, Yuna started it by going off on conservatives'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'ad hominens? why does everyone attack the character of the people they disagree with? this is the debate channel, stop it :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'But I'm not using the 'your mom' comments to further any argument'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'petro china installed in canada 2 years after petro canada is bought by suncore, which is a crown corporation of china who has over 125,000,000 immigrant worker at this time, while stephen harper 'streamlines' the immigration process'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bunch of communist scum, kill them while you can i figure'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Yuna only said that ABC and MSNBC were conservative media outlets'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'For someone who once critized me for turning all debates into a Left vs. Right debate, you're surprisingly fast to accuse others of "falling for the left-wing paradigm" (or something like that).'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'And they are.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'To which you said something about throwing Liberals into the machine'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because you just have to live in the ukraine or uzbekistan or one of them places to see what you will be'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Cain killd Abelinc types "debate -h yuna" and looks for intelligent counter-arguments...lots of fox news, lots of nutbags, lots of crazy
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It is your duty to revolt against the unjust.  If voting the bastards out doesn't work, then active revolt is necessary for the survival of a free people, so that the machine does not gain complete control.  The machine being that which would take away your rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I went off on right-wing nutbags. Not ALL right-wingers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not a particularly useful debating tool to selectively read the channel, kim'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, there's a huge difference between "ring-wing nutbags" and "all right-wingers are nutbags".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'now, do you have anything even vaguely useful to bring to the table?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Your mom is a nutbag'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not exxon, petro-china is afghanistan's post-war oil company'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What, like more useful than condemning people to concentration camps?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What could I possibly bring to counter such brilliant arguments such as "Russia is arming terrorists!" and "Europe has been taken over by traitors to humanity"?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'highfive Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'exxon is partly owned by russia's crown corporation though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as is india's'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're topics of debate so far-removed from sanity I'd be insane to even TRY to refute them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'NATO is arming terrorists, Russia probably does, though I don't know of any off hand right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '..'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Brilliant argument, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, all countries that can have been selling weapons to evil doers for decades.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"This is deffo. happening! I just can't remember the details! And I won't research them or anything!".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'BAHAHAHA'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'including, china, russia, usa, canada, uk, france, germany, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Syria happened in a different universe to you, Yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'rizgoth - that's exactly what russia does to ukraine and uzbekistan'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'NATO is not Europe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm guessing Libya didn't happen in Yunaland, either'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the problem is, one persons definition of an evil doers is another persons definition of a patriot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, "dictators" =/= "terrorists".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're absolutely wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'brainwashed people don't count'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'It's !=, not =/='
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'INDOCTRINATOR'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I also never saw "russia is arming terrorists"...I saw "most of the guns came from the US or russia"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'CHURCH OF THE NEW EPOCH'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'PERSUADERTRON'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Yuna, I think we're just going to give ourselves hemmorages here XD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'for example, during the american revolutionary war against the brits.....if france had not sold weapons and helped us to fight the war, we probably would have lost.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Please do'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm not familair with "!=". But "=/=" definitely means "Does not equal".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'yall should take a world geography class'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nah, both != and =/= are correct...one's a computer programming convention, one's a mathematical one'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dr. Tzara: 'or world politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: '!= also means "does not equal"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes. I never said it wasn't. I said I wasn't familiar with it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: '!= is programmer speak for does not equal'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: '! flips the value of whatever follows actually'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'And =/= only exist due to ignorant folks who don't know any better'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yuna: you could bring the kgb agent who's president of transnistria and the most wanted man in europe's his security chief who sells guns to them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Abelinc, when did I name YOU.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and various other tools, beyond the ordinary selling of helipter engines to china and stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'where did I claim to be named?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You said "Also, I never said" as if you felt the need to defend yourself.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '"I never saw" =/= "I never said" :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That doesn't even make sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'difficult to see things when you stagger around with your mind closed to everything except what Mrs Clinton says'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes, it does...read before opening your fingers'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'technobabble'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But whatever. Europe's been taken over by traitors to humanity!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'tiger, what is with all this attacking of people? does it advance a purpose? :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Likewise with Mr. Limbaugh, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep, iran didn't down them drone's with compromised telecommunications protocols, like i read on bbc'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Your mom doesn't have enough charisma to take over much more than a street corner'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'or are you a Coulter fan?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A less confusing way of putting that would've been "You misread 'saw' as 'said'".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'And even that's giving her a lot of undeserved credit'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, that wouldn't be any less confusing to you'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What brilliant paragons of debate you lot are. Ad hominems flying out your asses, accusing entire continents of having been taken over by traitors to humanity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Sigh. And the rest is "No, you're just stupid."'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if you can't understand "what you quoted me as stating" doesn't equal "what I stated", even when using your convention for "does not equal", I dunno how it'd be more plain any other way'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you could have science papers laid in front of you, dozens of media sources quoted and you would still running around in little circles going "la la la la didn't happen doesn't exist"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so why bother?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"I saw" =/= "I said" wasn't clear at all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'So don't let that stop you from citing sources'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Direktna Akcija for president'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You seem to think that Russia is corrupt = All of Europe is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'la la la! doesn't happen! doesn't exist!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'How is me saying "Show your sources" Saying "La la la"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It might come as a shock to you, but most of Western Europe is actually very critical of Russia. Russia is considered a borderline dictatorship.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But I guess since we're not waltzing into Russia and forcibly removing their public officials from power and installing a government of our own liking, Western Europe is ALSO corrupt... due to guilt by... proximity?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Must be.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'It is a borderline dictatorship, but most of western europe saying that is something like the pot calling the kettle black'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That is easily the most ridiculous thing you've said yet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What the...?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why is it ridiculous?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Great Britain is a dictatorship, huh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Please feel free to name all of the Western European countries which are borderline dictatorships.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Ireland? Scottland?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This should be rich.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'look at america, usa uses the nation's south of itself as deadly violent oppresive death states as a firewall from reach itself'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what i think, maybe they're really independent though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why would europe be any different?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who voted for the EU president?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just about made it , damn 57 mutilated dead in mass death pit'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who votes for the EU Commisars?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'So Europe is just one country, now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'answer the question'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nobody could tear down russia's dictators but their own people and police/military'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'It's a question with no answer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You don't seem to understand that "Not direct democracies" =/= "Borderline dictatorships".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'The question doesn't apply.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's because we know the answer'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and then the kgb probably predicted that, so they have to take precautious measures'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'You don't seem to understand that using =/= makes you look like a dumbass.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'EU dictates 84% of the policy of it's constituent countries, it parachuted in a leader into Italy, it parachuted a leader into Greece, it is actively dictating financial policy in 17 EU countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Starling, stfu dude. =/= is a mathematical convention, not programming'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you have anything to bring to the table except ad hominems, Starling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and even outside of those, the 'democracies' that we have are largely illusions of choice, much like in the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It... parchuted a leader into Italy and Greece?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Tigernuts, cite your sources.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What you just alleged.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Jesus.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know what you can do about that, Tigernuts? Have the voters vote parties into office which will secede from the EU.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Actually, mathematics uses a single symbol to represent "not equal to", it doesn't use =/='
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That symbol isn't on a keyboard, smart-ass'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'america the same, they're taking pre-emptive measures against that as we speak'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '=/= is the closest approximaton.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, Starling. Find me that symbol in ASCII, fucktard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'it does in fact use =/= in a sense, it uses an equals with a forward slash through it frequently'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'you just can't render that in telnet'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'No personal attacks please'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is literally IMPOSSIBLE to render that on your computer unless it's in graphics.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Depends on the font, actually'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'Actually, Yuna, I think its in unicode'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not a direct democracy is a dictatorship hands down'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it doesn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Starling saying no personal attacks when you're busy personally attacking Yuma over something that you are WRONG about'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some king's are just, others are not'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Fixedsys doesn't have it, but I don't use the incorrect and clunky =/= for "not equal", I use the shorter and correct !='
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'Starling is not personally attacking Yuna, not all disagreements about ideas are personal attacks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'he has been calling her a moron for using =/='
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I think the difference is the degree of seperation in the statement. "You're acting like a dumbass" vs "You are a dumbass".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That IS a personal attack'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hmm... apparently it is. But it's EXTREMELY limited in what fonts it works for.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'okay, yes, I agree, that is a personal attack :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I don't recall ever using the word 'moron' in this discussion'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'No, you probably said something more insulting'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'And saying 'this makes you look like a dumbass' is not the same as calling someone a dumbass :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'I apologize for censoring you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Milkshake, he's been doing nothing for the last hour but doing "Your mom" attacks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'well you did imply people were ignorant for using =/= earlier, and thats a bit leading'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He literally called for the death of my mother but added that it would be pointless since I'd already been born.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Totally not an ad hominem!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'No, no personal attack there'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: '"ignorant" is not an insult, it just means that someone doesn't know something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I agree Kis, no personal attack there :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'And sarcasm is lost on him as well'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, you know, afte ran hour of nothing but pesonal attacks (Starling has literally not added a single cogent argument to the debate), a single "Fucktard" is pretty warranted.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'Are you sure? I think Starling acknowledge dyour sarcasm and treated you seriously to twist your tail :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I'm just pointing out a clunky and silly-looking usage of symbols, and pointing out that a more succinct and intelligent-looking alternative exists :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Speaking of Fucktards, between Star and Tiger, I've reached my quota. Channel off'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'imagine how foolish people protesting wall street look like to the people who control the government in colombia, which closes rose-packaging factories so that it's women have to become whores'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'good riddance'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not on this client, Starling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Your troll attack does UNBELIEVABLE things to Kisumitrui! [108901]'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You'er welcome to try to use the single-character version of =/= on Aardwolf. Or most programs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '? <- This is it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's not silly-looking or less-intelligent-looking to people who actually possess intelligence'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I generally just use !=, which is correct regardless of where it is used :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'And in cases where I can use the slashed equal sign, I do :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So either you were/are ignorant or just willfully obtuse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Can it be, is Abelinc actually defending me?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I did the first time starling made the comment as well, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I mentioned the mathematical vs programming convention before kisu did'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I know. But you're persisting.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'Starling, I think I am not in accord with you ehre, != is good for programmers, coders, logicians, etc but most people don't understand it and they do understand =/= including the programmers.  What decides the legitimacy of a symbol if it isn't universal recognition?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And actually insulting Starling while doing so.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I didn't insult starling, merely refuted'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Depends on who you ask. You implied he wasn't intelligent.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I don't see that as a personal attack. It was an opinion about a group of people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Meh, Abelinc is irrelevant, and =/= is still clunky and incorrect :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Well, I for one am glad to see that debate is as full of insightful and intellectual conversation as always.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'what makes it clunky and incorrect? because it isn't used in academics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it isn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's understood by pretty much all children in the 5th grade and up...!= is not'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'YUH-HUH IT IS'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'compares argument to Hitler or Holocaust...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which begs the question...are you smarter than a 5th grader? }:>'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think Starling is desperately clinging on the argument that =/= is incorrect because it should be rendered as a single character.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which is literally impossible on Aardwolf.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'aard's policies make the single character version illegal'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as it says in the gospel, the worker shall be known by his work'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not impossible, merely outlawed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Not on private channels.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're kdiding, right Abelinc?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's just that the MUD doesn't use a font which includes the =/= symbol.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'The MUD doesn't use any font.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the MUD doesn't use a font at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's your client'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Your CLIENT uses a font.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jhav nods at you in agreement. 
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or rather... a system that can handle the =/= symbol so that it can be rendered back to you in whichever font you use.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the MUD supports extended characters, your client may not...because some clients may not, the MUD has decided to enact policy that they're only allowed in private'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the MUD FULLY supports a system that can handle the symbol, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Oh, Aardwolf can send unicode characters,.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So... the symbol can be used but only on private channels? Wait, why?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'help policies1, third paragraph'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'OIC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'George Bernard Shaw and "the Humane Gas" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgpaKkrZex4'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'headlines of the british newspaper mentioned mussolini, hitler and stalin in the same line - while hitler and mussolini hated stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''get things done' means what exactly?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listen to this video and look it upt:'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listen to this video and look it upt: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM1h_2ujsvs'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Not really Wrilley: 'can we get a tl;dr please'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wouldn't it be more appropriate to run around screaming "la la la la doesn't exist"? '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the video, he claims to refuse to honor a law signed with a gun to the signator's head which demands that he starve millions of german's to death, and to declare war on the basis of inhumane treatment of german's in danzig poland and poland's repeated violations of it's border'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which, if you look it up, happened in russia and ukraine'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '30 million murdered by stalin before this speech'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '6-8 million jews claimed killed by the holocaust'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'he claims britain is non-communicable and won't talk with them about the violations of poland'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and various other things, it's interesting to hear - after the video from the brit inventing zyklon b'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and people think of germany as a killer of jews, isn't that unfortunate if it never happened that way, but stalin did it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '.. What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What fresh insanity is this?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'redefinition of nazi'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listen to it, i came to that conclusion before i did'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Plz rpost link.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'plz lrn 2 history'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listen to this video and look it upt: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM1h_2ujsvs'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''get things done' means what exactly?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'headlines of the british newspaper mentioned mussolini, hitler and stalin in the same line - while hitler and mussolini hated stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is that the same speech as the one you talked about yesterday? About how Hitler didn't even mention the Jews when declaring war on Poland?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who CARES?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the Polish might'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the people who are jews probably do'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hitler didn't mention Jews =/= Hitler didn't hate and kill Jews.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'What, Yuna?  I don't know what that means.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Provided it's even a correct translation'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I don't believe the people who are jews actually DO, chemosh...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And if I were to declare war on a country for the purposes of genocide, I wouldn't include "By the way, I totally hate those Jews and plan to gas them all!" in the declaration of war.''
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fact that Hitler wasn't stupid doesn't prove diddily-squat.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I thought Kisumi was done with this channel'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'oh, he was brilliant, no question there'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Must not be able to stick to his guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I doubt any Jews are gonna watch that translation of that speech and go "Oooh, Hitler totally didn't hate us. I guess he was swell!".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'I thought so too -.-'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Actually coming back is more a result of sticking to my guns too hard rather than just giving up'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Congratulations, you've proven Hitler wasn't stupid. It's not as if that wasn't established fact already!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Call it what you will, I guess :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I call it 'lack of willpower''
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Call it what you will.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Shrug, you're the one who said he was done, but then waffled and came back ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some jews are KGB agents according to recent news on russians frauduelently collecting holocaust funding in new york and toronto'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'having family with auschwitz tattoos, the [lack of] mentioning of jews in one particular speech doesn't remove their tattoo or their memory...I did get a kick out of the "hitler was just wrong about which people to kill" part of that GBS youtube though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'By the way, from what I can tell, that video was posted by a Neo-Nazi.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'True enough. Damn my curiosity about what kind of inane things people are coming up with!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is it a coincidence that you ping my Neo-Nazi radar, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the b'nai b'rith quoting kgb supplied evidence against a 'nazi' in quebec'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't fear the kgb'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, some jews are kgb agents...like some kgb agents happen to be jewish...how does that mean anything?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's not jews as a people working with the kgb'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Dafuq, you're not even TRYING to hide it anymore, are you Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i never said it was, but some of their leaders and advisors'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'what leaders and advisors?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you don't have to be a neo-nazi to point out corruption in any group of people'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which people do you think you're discussing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're openly declaring yourself a neo-Nazi, aren't you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and if you do, then it's good that you are'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'plus, nazi germany has been gone for 70 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'at the time, france loaned the US, $31 million.....a lot of freaking money back in 1782'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "Neo" is confusing you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sewers living in hungary don't have jewish leaders and advisors, btw'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'your use of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, the fact that you're not openly stating it doesn't mean you're not blatantly using neo-nazi propaganda, arguments and videos to prove a batshit insane case.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's not neo-nazi propaganda, it's a speech made by hitler'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's like saying "I'm not a racist, but black people are fucking disgusting and need to lose the right to vote."'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it might be batshit, but unfortunately everything is batshit according to you'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And? What EXACTLY are you trying to prove with it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'does he sound like an actor, he's just pretending like these others?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, seriously, what exactly are you trying to prove with that speech, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm pushing the envelope on the USSR doing the holocaust and pinning it on their only resistance in the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What??1'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Totally safe and not neo-Nazi bullshit!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or britain'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'And that isn't Neo-Nazi propaganda?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Totally SANE"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Russia slaughtered plenty of it's own during ww2'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Except for the German death camps, that's a totally sound idea.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to the material's considered, it's not'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Oath'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to stalin's invention of modern death camps in 1929'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'WHAT materials considered?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're saying... eh... the Russians or Brits created all of those death camps in GERMAN OCCUPIED COUNTRIES and then pinned it on Germany?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I think we agree that stalin killed many jews...that doesn't make hitler/nazi germany not a bad guy, though...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You cannot even be sure of which country really killed the Jews because... it's BULLSHIT!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That doesn't mean that Russia was the mastermind and framed Germanu'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did you know the USSR made documentaries showing footage from slaves piecing together Mein Kampf?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'does that seem ostentatious, and something the justification you hear in the video would do?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd love to know if Russia were behind Yasser Arafat's death though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Did you know what we're treating every single word that comes out of your proverbial mouth with 29 kilograms of salt?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Tiger'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i guess it would be in their interests'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but then, it would be in the zionists' interests, too'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'of course, you hate me as a group, and any evidence i show can be bought to be not seen by the judge'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and the islamists'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in fact, just about everyone's interests except the Palestinians'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Chernoby- Chemosh, Can you cite sourses for your little Mein Kampf thing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's what i'm considering though - given this seemingly real speech, and this seemingly real british man i wonder..'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not now, the director died in the 70's-90's though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How do you even FUNCTION in real life?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'born in 1880's-1910'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Chemosh, if there are documentaries of the Russians putting tgether Mein Kampf, then cite sources.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the documentary was footage from the alleged nazi's putting it together'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I confess! I'm a Soviet ex-KGB spy! We built ALL of those "German" death camps back in WWII in countries occupied by Germany without their knowledge!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in slave camp's which stalin invented'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Or, in Internet Vernacular, "Post a Link to prove it."'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I don't see any of you geniuses citing sources to prove him wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'But then, that's how liberals work, they demand that all other cite this, cite that, without ever citing a damn thing themselves. :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'History proves him wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We then somehow abducted and killed millions of Jews from GERMAN OCCUPIED countries without the Germans noticing. Then we pinned it on the Germans.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'he needs to prove himself right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Muahahahahahahahaha!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'france had no occurrences of rape until the germans were deposed, by occupying forces'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'But you don't have to prove yourself right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'by the great allies'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's when the crimes started'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: '"History proves him wrong" you say, yet I see nary a citation :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'France sold Europe out'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bloody French :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who CARES who invented the CONCEPT of concentration camps?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i do, cause if you hate somebody and what he does, you don't do it to yourself, if you're a leader of your people'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That's why nbody likes the French, Tiger :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny how Wikipedia doesn't mention Stalin inventing the concept of concentration camps at all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'hitler and mussolini were both world war 1 veterans, and both had virtues, hitler's was to deny starving his people to death for occupying russia, and british fuck you's, mussolini's was to remove the corruption caused by the mafia'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But Wikipedia is run by Jews who... want to keep the world from knowing who really killed them during WWIII?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'WWII'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Mussolini was batshit insane.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not all jewish people are closed-minded'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so was hitler and his supporters according to bbc'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Well OF COURSE HE WAS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hitler was insane'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if fighting against the devil's insane, and stalin is that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sources for the claim that Stalin invented cocnentration camps?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'He got rejected from Art School and decided to purge the Jews.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'dekulakization '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'holodomor/great purge'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'concentration camps were around hella long before stalin or hitler were born'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Aye aye'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Were you homeschooled? Are you parents neo-Nazis?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they may have been, but not on such a large scale'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm nothing like my parents'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is there a history of mental illness in your family?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'So you decided to one-up them?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'being a bastard and wiping out people you don't like isn't a newish philosophy'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Thank Buddha for that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'except for fighting for what i believe in, and none of the wars in the world are that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'None of the wars are for what you believe in?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'except when somebody notices they been sleighted by their government, or glued to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'genocide is as large a scale as it gets...and yes, just as large a scale predated hitler or stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Glued to death`?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then i understand their hatred and who caused them to feel it, i'm fully supportive of destroyign them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is English your 5th language? Sometimes what you say makes no sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Smetimes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And I don't mean that in an "Makes no sense to sane people" kind of way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Who says that if someone learns a fifth language, they don't know it well?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'You got a citation to support that implication, Yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sometimes, the words you've strung together do not belong together.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Haha Star, stop being a smartass :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'no ur 2 u r lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Glued to death"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Your mom's cootchie and your dad's dick didn't belong together either, yet here you are'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'are you allowed to say that on this channel?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Apparently. He's been doing nothing but spewing that shit for an hour and a half.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'It's a cursing channel'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they may have been = concentration camps were around hella long '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That wasn't cursing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yuna inserted the allegations they want to murder my parents for'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'it certainly is when you are here starling'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'What, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you operate in an Alternate Universe, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'When did I ever say anything bad about your parents?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do you believe in god?  then why believe in alternatives?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I questioned whether they were the cause of your apparently insanity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I didn't threaten them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'neither did the joke Stasi'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, that sentence didn't make sense.-'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'Why can't you just be perfectly rational like all the other MUDders.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Gregor'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think you'd need a hammer to your face to feel anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Chemosh, why are you even TRYING to troll?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why are you working with yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Generally, trolls need to make at least a MODICUM of sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Presumably because he or she is sane?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he's not trying.  Epic troll is troll.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I dunno kisu, I think he's being quite successful without it :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sane is docile retard'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not sure if troll or just batshit insane. Or both. Why can't it be both?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'If his intent is to make people think he's stupid, and that's the aim of his troll, then he is wildly successful, yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm stupid, but i point out things all the smart people missed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i get the impression that Chemosh doesn't give a toss what you think of him'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'You're not pointing out ANYTHING.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if his intent is usual trolling, where he's got both of you foaming at the mouth trying to keep up arguing, he's successul'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Yu're spewing disjointed madness and when asked to prove what you're saying you issue more dementation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Kisumitrui, there's no need to get worked up about what he's saying. Either he's a troll and feeding off your outrage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or he's batshit insane, in which case yelling at him won't help.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'type "debate -h" and look at the two of you going full-tilt at it...he wins'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Good point, Yuna.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'How do you know they are not cannibal-trolling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Restore a Rumour: 'be careful with the personal attack folks!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'NOW you step in, Rumour?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Rumour, wrong time to say that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they've been going on all night, ru mour'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's never a wrong time to say that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What Starling keeps pulling is A-OK but if we call someone "batshit insane", that's crossing the line?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Well, let me rephrase.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Jhav snuggles up to Restore a Rumour.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'a long time ago nwould have been the more appropriate time to say that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I disagree, I find Starling to have been extremely offensive this evening.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Agree Gregor'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'this evening?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'new around here?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Krikon: 'everyone knows ad-hominem attacks are NOT okay, until you're the one using them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): GraySong Gregor snickers softly.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Twice Starling has said that it is regrettable I was born. A-OK.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Krikon: 'then they're apparently completely okay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Bahaha Krikon'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Me calling Chemosh batshine insane, not okay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Let's not forget that you should be 'ground to dust in a concentration camp,' Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'batshit is the most sought after fertilizer on earth after elephant dung'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'Batshine?  Nah, everybody knows he's NECROshine insane. ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Ok yeah, let's not forget THAT gem.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Restore a Rumour: 'I am making a general comment to all on this channel - personal attacks are not okay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we are not your nursemaid, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then why can Starling keep personally attacking me?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Well, everyone, for that matter.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you take offense at the things people say, then don't talk to them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, either Starling can't or we all can personally attack each other.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'She just said no one can.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Why do you assume that the comment means 'Everyone but Starling, stop it' ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'oh, so because rumour was asleep earlier, your master debate is that you're now ENTITLED to ignore the IMMs and the rules...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except when I asked her whether what Starling had been saying about me was OK, the advice I got back was "Put him on ignore :)"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Primarily the timing of it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm not kidding, smiley and all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'Because Starling consistently gets away with making personal attacks against other players.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Um, because, that is the usual course of action?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that is the proper advice, yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But when I called Chemosh insane, SUDDENLY, personal attacks are NOT OK, Rumour steps into the channel and warns EVERYONE off.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Don't make this about me, the vast majority of the personal attacks have been from you liberals towards folks who don't agree with your ridiculous notions. *shrug*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they don't take action after the fact for stuff like this, unless it's WAY over the top.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But Starling calling for my death and my continued existence and birth unforunate, that's totally okay!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Whether or not it was the proper advice is moot. The point is Imms are issuing warning towards Yuna, and Starling had already been complained abut'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'That's just the way things are Yuna.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'The IMMs must love Starling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: '"Oh say can you seeeeeeee.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Please cite where I called for your death, Yuna.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'rumour made it clear "I'm here and watching now, everyone (Starling included) will not be committing them", your response is "but she started it"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm not saying I am ENTITLED to insulting Chemosh. I'm asking why Starling gets free reign.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes, you are yuna, you JUST stated that you're entitled to it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'MOM!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Um.. No?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I'm asking why Starling got away with so much.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, you didn't ask why...you stated WE ALL CAN'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'The sign of a good troll is when people continue at it, long after he has gone..'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And why the response I got from Rumour was "Put him on ignore and it'll be OK.", pretty much, not a "I'll talk to him".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why bother insulting a simple minded fool like me, when you can so easily show me the flaws in my logic'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Here's my position on it:'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'ahh, but do you know that "I'll talk to him" wasn't part of it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Starling couldn't care less about your fucking problem.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Well, if she stated We All Can, that's nt saying SHE is entitled, it's saying everybody is :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I said "Either".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'IMMs won't often tell YOU that they're going to have a talk with someone...YOU'RE not entitled to that information'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I said "Either Starling can't (either) or we all can". It was my way of asking "What makes Starling so special"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Okay, so if he DID get a talk, why did it continue sans consequence?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and yes, the proper IMM response to the person who says "I don't like what someone's saying" is "put them on ignore"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): GraySong Gregor nods at Summoner Yuna.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'y u so mad?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'rumour made the statement "Starling and others can't"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'u mad, bro?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Krikon: 'so if someone gets away with murder, we should all be able to kill people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'obviously Starling's an imm alt who knows how long his leash is. :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'U jelly?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yet your response is still WE ALL CAN'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts cackles gleefully at Starling.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it really wasn't, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Yu're just twisting her words.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes, it was Yuna...you just can't read your words objectively'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's rich :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It was "Starling said this and that. There was no intervention then. Why? Either Starling can't personally attack others either or we all can."'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'tbh I'm fine if we just freeze starling for a few days and then leave it at that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in a democracy, each case is dealt with on an individual basis, by the people who are affected by the release of the prisoner'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Guyz, brah iz mad'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'when that statement is made *AFTER* the "nobody can declaration", your interpretation of it is incorrect, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'She said it just pointing out Starling's behaviour, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '1) I did not see that declaration. 2) I was HEAVILY IMPLYING that Imms were giving Starling too much special treatment.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, she stated it with an entitlement and an ultimatum'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They claim you can't personally attack each other, but everything indicates Starling can.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'You're just choosing to read it that way,.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, I have a penis.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Swiftly you jerk open your jacket, trying to get him to notice you.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Sorry, Yuna is a feminine-sounding name'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You giggle.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'i.e the summoner from FFX'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I have two.  One is for serious business, the other's a handy canvas for my artistic creation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I'm not the one screaming and bellowing on about it.  Rumour said to watch the personal attacks.  I have my own opinion as to my comments really count as attacks, but I'm I don't have enough invested in this to go ahead testing whether or not I'm right. *shrug*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I know. I just wanted to point out my "true" gender.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'grammar fail'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Did none of you finger me? I'm listed as male.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd like it known for the record that i have no interest in your gender'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Can't say as I did, lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yeah, and starling's listed as female...like that makes a difference }:>'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Krikon: 'kisumitrui is thinking "i've been defending this person the whole time and it turns out it's a GUY?!" :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yeah, but you usually don't list yourself as male with a female name if you're female.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'but.....starling told me she was hot!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'on the internet, everyone's male.  Those who say they aren't are crossdressing flamers'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Lol Krikon, his gender means little.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'I would have sided with him either way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'but a lot of people make an assumption based on the name rather than fingering.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I still want to know why brah iz so mad @ me'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'most people guess i'm male because my name doesn't end in -a :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most violent hate crimes against minorities are done by people who hate the world government and try to identify with it's only resistance in the last 100 years (8?), thinking that he was a racist'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think too much fingering of strangers is going on'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as hate groups'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'more harm is done by committing to the possibly flawed perception than otherwise'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What fresh insanity is this?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hey, deja vu.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Think about that when you look at your perception of Russia being behind the Holocausrt'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, didn't you argue this already? Like, yesterday?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they were behind holodomor/dekulakization and the great purge, not to mention various others'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'has someone mentioned about arguing on the internet and special olympics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Hahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Cain killd Abelinc wins!
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We've gone from "The Nazis didn't kill Jews" to "Hate crimes aren't committed due to hatred of minorities but due to hatred of the world government!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because it totally makes sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'XD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'So, Russia's government hated itself so much that the Jews just had to go?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'well sure, you lash out at who you think you can successfully lash out at'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'no, totalitarianism involves control of people's instincts all around - which would allow for the government twisting the perception of it's enemy for the people who don't conform to it's oppression'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you're not going to direct your hate actions to someone who's going to kick your ass'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That isn't a symptom of just toalitarianism'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i always sit down with the biggest guy in the bar'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so the school kid who's pissed at his dad is going to bully the little kids...not because he hates them, just that they're there'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And what's up with these random no-sequiturs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm a rebel'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, I'm sick and tired of that excuse. Some people are just rotten.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'wow, we've got ad hominems and non sequitors...someone's feeling latin today'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sometimes, bigots who beat up or kill someone for being gay is just a bigot. They probably had bad influences in their lives, but they aren't necessarily bullied themselves.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or lashing out at "the man". They're just idiots.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: '"come to bed sweetheart, it's late"  wife- 'I can't...someone on the internet is WRONG''
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'e pluribus uno!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Unum.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'XD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, I actually only had one card left'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I actually took 3 semesters of Latin in High School (it was part of my Major, linguistics).'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What a wasted 3 semesters. That language is batshit insane. Seriously.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Krikon: 'hey latin would not appreciate such ad-hominem attacks'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'HAHAHAHAH'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'at least you can understand what the demon says in the exorcist'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'XD'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Latin has a bajillion declensions, ways write nouns, pronouns and adjectives based on their function.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know how if there's a dog involved, in English, it's always gonna be written as either "dog" or "the dog"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Yeah, I imagine it was a beast of a language t try and learn'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Latin said "Fuck that shit".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Cain killd Abelinc votes for thinkspeak
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'I'm going to be starting Japanese lessons, son ^^'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There are SEVEN cases for nouns (and another 7 for plural).'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Soon*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Holy, Hell, Yuna! I didn't know it was that crazy'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: '-,'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'all the other romance languages are based on latin, and they're all pretty easy.  How is latin vastly harder?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There are also 3 different types of nouns, so all in all, it's 21/42 ways to write these 7 acses.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The craziest case is Locative. It's when you'er speaking of something in relation to soemthing else when it comes to their location.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'That sounds cnfusing as all get-out'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Like, instead of asying "The dog in the house is small", you'd smush "the dog" and "in" together.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And the stupidest part is that they don't have prepositions. They just express location through context and locative.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Kisumitrui: 'Well, isn't that rather common?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So if it's "The dog[in relation to] the table", you have to guess where the dog is in relation to teh table.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that's a contraction.  Like de el = del in Spanish.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's not exactly how it works. Here it is in action:'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Canis est rufus (Canis = Dog, Est = Is, Rufus = Red)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Canii est domum (the dog is [somewhere in erlation to] the house)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not sure of if "Canii" is the correct way to write "dog" in locative, but you get the point.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'By the way, I misrememebed slightly. We're talking about Ablativ, not Locativ.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Ablative, that is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And now, let's dive right back into concentious subjects.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Pope is a child molester enabling quasi-Nazi. True or false?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'obviously false, since nobody's going to seriously elect such a person as pope.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I bet he knows lots of those types of people, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The child molester enabling part has been proven.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'did you vote in the Pope elections, then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The only thing in question is whether he's a quasi-Nazi.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Yuna, can you cite anything saying the Pope diddles little boys or waves a Nazi flag?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'Well, he does certainly rule over all 200 people in the Vatican with an iron fist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the pope went so far as to claim the jews aren't responsible for jesus death, while it was a jewish clergy who was'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i can't confirm the revelation of the false prophet is not hte high priest of the jews though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'hehe, that's a very naive view of how leaders operate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Heck, he once lambasted a parish for punishing one of their child molesting priests because "It made the Catholic church look bad".'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "Child molester ENABLER" sounded like "Child molester"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'german lutheran protestants were the christian group who stormed the catholic vatican'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's differences among christianity, it's not all the same'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'For example, did you know that the US doesn't really follow Geneva Convention as much as you think it probably does?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, like that's a surprise to anyone'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm shocked and appalled. Shocked and appalled, I tell you!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'we fully follow geneva convention unless and until we're caught...then there's an investigation, and who authorized that!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'this is true of every country, though, not just the US'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the west's approach to the geneva convention is "do as we say, not as we do"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The U.S. has enshrined it into law, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Patriot Act, anyone?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'send your ass to gitmo!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the geneva convention outlawed the patriot act?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'evil doers!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'we're far beyond that, Yuna.  The public is always woefully mis-/underinformed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'More like the Patriot Act circumvents the Geneva Convention.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'patriot act is just one example of supremely dodgy stuff Obama has put through'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'gitmo has a soccer field and cable tv now btw.....thanks to a $71 million upgrade this year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, because Obama totally TRAVELLED BACK IN TIME.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'The patriot act affects US citizens, the geneva convention affects pows, so...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Obama wasn't even a Senator in 2001.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'can't pin it on Obama, Tiger.  Granted, Obama did make his own tweaks to it but it was originated by Bush.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he should not have signed it, period'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'neither should he have shoved through the NDAA'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nor Obamacare'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'and even then the activities it defined stretched all the way back to at least Carter if not all the way to FDR and beyond.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What's the thing that allows for Gitmo to actually exist?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the original patriot act had a time limit...a new one had to be signed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'patriot act was signed in under bush, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'should have been repealed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'i agree. '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not the current one'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'obama extended it, nods'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i bet i could extract more information through a terrorist with common sense than with torture, myself would give them all false information dying to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'not just extension, there were upgrades.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they never trusted their enemy in the first place'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'rofl, yeah, use common sense on the terrorist, I'm sure that'll work'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'in a few years gitmo will be a state of the art supermax camp for evil doers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but of course the government i'd be working for would be their untrusted enemy, so it wouldn't matter however i tried - and that's something they never will learn'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'probably for US citizens'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Undertaken Anaristos . o O ( of course we have to take the word of the interrogators that they are actually interrogating terrorists... )
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or for british citizens :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'government's shouldn't break their word unless they have a pretty valid justification for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as it's the 4th of July, here's a quote from Mr Franklin for you'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'chemosh, did you read The Prince recently?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'tiger quoting franklin?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he is indeed'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'that's what I was thinking, abe :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of donkeys.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Poor Richard also essentially said that if you couldn't keep hold of something then it was perfectly alright for someone to jack you for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'never read it, good book?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'chemosh, it'd probably help you a lot in your understanding of world affairs :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'The Prince is American novel published in 2005 written by Francine Rivers. It is the third novel in the Sons of Encouragement series, and tells the tale of the biblical character of Jonathan, the son of Saul the King in the Old Testament.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'll check it out'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'wrong "the prince"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'shows like dr.quin medicine woman and the mounty show me the kind of system i wouldn't mind living under in the west'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'machiavelli's was the one I was referring to...in it he mentions something about having a very good reason before breaking your word'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'of course that's ancient history and the misconception of honest government'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'well, that and the fact that they're fake...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'The only difference between now and 'back then' is the filter of fiction.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, believing things once were better, at some point in time they must have been though'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'The government is as good or as evil as it needs to be to tell a decent story.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you have to have life before you can have death'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'those two shows are to the Wild West what NCIS and CSI are to criminal investigation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok, got it open in web browser, i'll bookmark it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'personally I think that things when wrong when people felt the need to be governed. Personally, I detest the idea of having a master.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'same here, no single person should exercise control over many'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I understand and accept the idea of a structured society. I do, however, oppose the idea that an elected official (who claims to be a servant of the people while campaigning for office) becomes more equal than I  in a society of equals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'all animals are equal...some are more equal than others'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so much for the seven rules'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, if money is wealth instead of work and people's verification'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'without money you wouldn't have as much of a problem probably'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'yes, that fallacy seems to permeate "democratic" governments. At least with dictatorships there is no doubt about one's position.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's how an ancient south american culture conquered their territory'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think, they used their heads, not their money'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, romney and sanitorum or another had that happen there, one governor of the usa opposed the bill that allowed unlimited external sponsoring of politicians, but one dropped out of the republican campaign cause they ran out of money'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what's equal about having your success based on material wealth, which is governed by force paid for by the taxes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'absolutely nothing'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, open evil is something i considered superior and desireable to refute people's confusion over why they think the good government does evil'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i like to know who i'm dealing with'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'finding them out's a evil and undesireable task'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who do you think you're dealing with?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that varies from time to time'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why do you think it is that so many people appear oblivious to the loss of rights and freedoms they and their forebears once had?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'probably because we have rediculous freedoms they didn't?  Just try to get from new york to LA on a redeye in 1777'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not really revelent, you could mnake the journey, just took a while'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'brainwashed, hopeless, mindless'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they're willing to reproduce to provide soldiers to fight at the shepherds target'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and women for stalin's grain'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what i think anyways, what they're really acceptable about is beyond me though, maybe they understand something i don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how deep do you think the rabbit hole will be?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i seen the end of humanity's current trends as unavoidable death'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'most people are willing to give up their  degrees of freedom because they have never internalized said degrees. If, for instance, you tell the citizen that he no longer can cross an intersection diagonally it wouldn't bother him in the least because he had no feel for what it meant to do that to begin with. For the few taht did cross the intersection diagonally, they will bow to the new rule because they are the "minority" and therefore out of line with the public policy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nasa does too though, theirs is a drowned world'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that analogy sounds much like the cooking frogs one, anaristos'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'unavoidable with the current leaders* not if things structurally change at the top'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but they seem to be invincible mostly, though i seen that they try to install some changes now'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cause they probably see that too'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'a fact, nevertheless. If people exercised their constitutional "rights", the leadership would discard the "democracy" for an autocracy in an instant. The only thing that makes a democracy work is a docility. '
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wouldn't a system based on constitutional rights be defined a democracy in it's originally intended form?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though i understand what you say, they'd have to come out full force against it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'democracies claim that their citizens have the right to oppose the government, but we all know what heppens when said citizens exercise that right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and it's happening even today with the heavy-handed police tactics in Philadelphia'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, there's more of us than them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'times like that you have the huge bonus of being an armed nation'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah anaristos, i was saying that earlier in not those terms'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'diplomacy is an illusion'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they shut down the threat and make an excuse after, for the mindless'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, though Posse Comitatus prohibits the government from using the armed forces to enforce their rule, there is no such prohibition in the use of state militias, which amount to the same thing. So, if you actively oppose the government, they just send the troops after you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'IF they ahve to, and as a message for those who thought to resist them'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ahh, that sounds like the "pull some shit, then try and pass a law to legalise it, then pretend it was legal all along"'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'like the monitorring/recording of internet traffic and phones/texts'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Im having a hard time following this, I guess'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'If enough citizens oppose the government, they can simply vote them out of office'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Or am I mistaken?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're mistaken, quad'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Oh thanks for clearing that up'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure, you can vote them out of office, but that problem is not with the body in office, but the office itself.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you can vote individuals out of office by voting someone else into office...you can't vote out the government, however...'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'canada and the USA signed a agreement in 2005 or so that allows eachothers military (or maybe blackwater/xe's) to cross eachother's border and quell civilian uprisings'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Ahh, so you think all politicians are equiv. then'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Undertaken Anaristos rapidly nods twice to you, in complete agreement.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'posse comitatus no longer relvant'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fuck a doodle doo, someone gets it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thank god'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'If that's the case, you made the wrong choices in life'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'And you should have put yourself in a position of more power'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'But its easy to whine about it, isnt it? :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'once you empower a government you are S.O.L.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people are putting themselves on the line because they are doing something about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and people are dying as a result'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'No, I mean you should have put yourself IN government'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but thanks for belittling their sacrifice, quadf'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Then you'd have the power you are complaining about'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm sure their families appreciate it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Wait what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might have noticed that politics is a bit corrupt around the edges'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'over 8 million died in world war 2, and they might have been fighting for their enemy - they had military drafters in the west foresure'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'It's corrupt through and through... but no one's dying because of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Not directly'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the only way to really oppose a government is by the willingness to die for your cause. The government counts on implied (and sometimes explicit) threads to hold on to power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'And my point is, if you think its so corrupt, why aren't you first in line to sign up?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'threats*'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'dying for what you believe in's an honorable thing to do'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Its also pretty stupid'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you need to speak to anaristos, i'm too tired to go over it again'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, I don't know about honorable. It is certainly a choice ( a rather selfish one, analysis will show :))'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'There are many many ways to influence the government here'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'You can start a company that can throw its weight around with $$'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'You can join the government and become a player inside of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'people die for their causes for the same reason people self-terminate because their suffering from an incurable disease. They don't want to live under the present conditions.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'You can work for the media and try to shine light on the things you think need it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'psst, anaristos'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that would assume an honest media :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Or you can sit on aardwolf and whine about how corrupt things are :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'depends how sentient the threat you project is anaristos'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we have a comedian on our hands'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'My point is YOU can make it an honest media if you join it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the truth media is becoming very popular, quad'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'right'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're somewhat behind the curve'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'I guess so :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that can only be guaranteed if you are the first to join :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Have you ever heard of the Pulitzer prize?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'oh, right a non-biased award, I am sure.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'WTF are you talking about?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Its the prize that was awarded to Woodward for his investigation into Watergate'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Pulitzer prize, something to do with being the fourth of fifth media company to break a huge story'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Its the prize many people get for revealing atrocities abroad'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'No, its about good journalism'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like them suicide bombers in the middle east, they're told america is the devil (?) and maybe their family gets some money , which they can't otherwise receive (?) and maybe they lost their family to a evil death (?) and - the presumption, maybe allah told them to do it, cause the cleric said'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you say "Pulitzer Price" as if that grants a certificate of authenticity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Okay, so you're clueless'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'I'm going back to enjoing my 4th of july'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'You continue to whine and do nothing productive :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Quadrapus waves happily.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and you continue to whine about my whine, so we are even :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he must've been sniffing Yuna's crotch'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'Better than Ron/Rand Paul's :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'american military bases are still installed on japan, and whoring japanese people has been their sport for over 5 decades'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Sniffing crotches was Ron Paul's job'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(in a manner of speaking)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as far as i could tell'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they had a good reason for their kamikazee'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and i heard a survivor of underwater kamikazee said he wishes it hadn't misfired'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'As far as I can see either Paul would be a massive improvement as president'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): *Yay!*  Go Tinada!!!  Tigernuts cheers him on.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the most improvement would come from vacating the office :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'have fun with your celebrations, one might hope you read your constitution to perhaps learn what it says'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: '"The guy with the most money wins", I think?'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'speaking as someone from a country that doesn't have one, you should cherish it'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi's shifty eyes dart back and forth.
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'make your money and hide it before the govt takes it away to fund a $700 billion a year defense budget!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'remember, if you lack the right combination of background and ability to seize power, stfu and listen to your superiors!'
T3/r7/2012-07-04.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi ducks defensively.
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'hmm... via scheppele on krugman's blog, romanian democracy threatened...'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'which is a better comedian. walliams or lucas?'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i see Obama is up to it again'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looks like he's trying to sign USA up to a UN arms treaty, without congress approval, that would require compulsory gun registration in violation of the second ammendment'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'congressional approvl? who needs it'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'get with the times brah'
T3/r7/2012-07-05.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'but the explicit total limit is 400.'
T3/r7/2012-07-06.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Merck knowingly faked Mumps vaccine efficacy tests, new report shows'
T3/r7/2012-07-06.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'news flash! MD gets 10yrs in prison for giving a 75yr old almost-blind patient back his eyesight!'
T3/r7/2012-07-06.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'That Panetta guy is a joke'
T3/r7/2012-07-06.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://start.umd.edu/start/publications/research_briefs/LaFree_Bersani_HotSpotsOfUSTerrorism.pdf'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Michele Leonhart is a fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'GlaxoSmithKline faces $3bn penalty after pleading guilty to the biggest health fraud case in corporate history'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, at the start of the cold war, america had two intelligence services with diametric political allegiances'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'John Loftus is an interesting guy'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Now that god has been found, and turned out to just be a particle instead of a supernatural being, does this mean all religious institutions will disband?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Church of the Higgs-Boson ?!?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'No need for a church, "god" is everywhere.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Higgs-Boson is not everywhere'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'The whole point of the Higgs-Boson is that it is a field that surrounds everything and every where.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Oh? Did I misunderstand the higgs field thingie?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'naming a particle after some hack Higgs - tsk'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the concept of "God" is usually associated with "unigueness" and "oneness" -- if lots of those special particles are found, that does not seem " oneness unique", unless they are all the one and same'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Cern collider wastes er uses a lot of electricity'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-electron_universe <--- there's your "oneness".'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'hrm, Wikipedia is into Science-fiction as Science'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Richard Feynman was the man.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'There are lots of reference to his idea, I just grabbed the closest one. It's just a wacky theory of his, but it's something one of the greatest minds of the past 100 years spent time thinking about.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Actually, it seems the name that lederman wanted to give was goddamn particle, but his editor didn't allow that...'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'imho, Zade is one of the greatest minds of the past 14,000,000,000 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade starts to hear the faint sounds of a cricket chirping.
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I don't have enough evidence to support or disprove that claim. So I'll take it under consideration.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'marxist/leninist islamic communism totalitarian dictatorship strategy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZqdtDic000 what do you think?  ' The origins of terror ''
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't sound like an irrational and uninformed liar to me, considerable stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adnan_Oktar they call him antisemitic though, so i guess he's controversial'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but in that video anyways he makes some considerable observations, complete with quote's from marx and lenin'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they actually say on a video that several large international corporation's went to the discovery channel headquarters and demanded that they don't show an episode exposing the compromisability of the rfid chip, according to the interview with what looks like one of them on youtube'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're trying to normalize human implants, using a new mexican missing cat as an example, it was found 9 months later in chicago thanks to the amazing technology'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and they also installed one in the arm of the female costar in one episode'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'rfids put too much killing ability into the arsenal of murderous corporations and killer governments'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which is what marxist-leninism is all about'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the media itself is so communist that it didn't even ask why the signal wasn't picked up for 9 months'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the rfid cat story was a contrived publicity stunt'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're using it in some places to reason with people why they should get them installed in their children i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'install as child, remove as adult'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're getting babies fingerprinted in some places now, under the disguise of locating missing children - while that may actually be their purpose, it seems to have negative cannotations'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'install as baby, remove as teenager'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'rfids permit killer robots to hunt and exterminate targets'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'SoDAMM is developing those as we speak'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'also exported to a few us institutions'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-15893772'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'DoDAMM it's called, my wrong south korea i misremembered the acronym'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'when the hunter robot kills or infects, the scene or happenstance looks like an accident at most'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'computer glitches of mass destruction'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you ever seen the movie maximum overdrive?  it's better than terminator i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'want to get rid of a political opponent -- infect them with a debilitating noncontageous disease or poison'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'flesh-eating dieaseses '
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'DoDAAM*'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, compromised electronics in a automated military world'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'flesh-eating diseases may be a weapon of choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'How To Brainwash A Nation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeMZGGQ0ERk possible interview with an actual kgb agent discussing strategy, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_5EYicHh8 and a islamic turk talking about marxist-leninism and terrorism'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the turk's a controversial person, but considered with the other video they make a food for thought'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'contract killing may becomes more popular when rfids may be used to detect targets, detect and avoid bystanders, kill witnesses'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'to me anyways, i can't confirm they're telling the truth or not absolutely fabricated/disinformation though, the government of the 1930's might be the government of today'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i hope not, but hope doesn't really matter if the opposite is true'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah rfid's can be used for things like silencing political opponents, like they report being done on bbc news in russia.. and the police abusing hundreds of thousands of ukrainians per year'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unsubstatiated wild conjectures discredit a demagogue as a nutjob to be ignored'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bbc claimed that up to 80% of all drug convictions in russia are the cops planting evidence on no real criminal'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'substantiated by the news and your opinion on it too?  that's alright'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'amnesty international's maybe full of it too'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that just seems how things will eventually be applicated'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the unsubstantied wild conjecture that "the government of the 1930's might be the government of today" -- ych'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'especially if they're behind what they're saying in the video's and things like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'really, so stalinism just disappeared from russia in 1991 maybe, when a kgb agent became it's president'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like i said, it's possible but not definite'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and that's if the info on the wiki is correct, for dresden and him, claims he served there from 1985-1990'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Chemosh is debating again Communism/Stalinism/Marxism/Socialism for no reason again? Must be another [insert any day of the week here].'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'no reason is possibly in control of your nation'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'things like holodomor/great purge/dekulakization aren't big enough deals to consider things about'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh seems unable to tell the differences between a communist and a capitalist government in the same country -- conjectures they may be the same -- tsk'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I have free schooling, free health care and my country's among one of the countries which suffered the LEAST from the recession. I'm sure unhappy living in a country whose politics are partially run on socialistic principles.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'communist nations use money to acheive power, capitalists aren't much different'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did 1% of kulaks own 85% of national wealth?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and which yet unstated country is Yuna attempting to praise'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or was it a little less communist?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Finger me Zade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Sweden is not part of this discussion'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Chemosh JUST said that socialists are running my country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, yes, it is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is residing in socialist Canada'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, we have a history.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He's villified my home country for its socialist principles before.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because anything NOT right-wing is automatically evil, obviously.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''none are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe themselves to be free' - wolfgang von goethe'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yuna's probably one of the kgb officers in her country'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so they have nothing but good things to say about 'dear leader' north korea'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'any north koreans on to answer that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and marxist-leninist kgb's the enemy of leftists'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Obviously, we have the KGB in Sweden. Also, I still have a penis.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so you keep on praising your leftistness views of stalinism'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, the KGB operate in North Korea?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they have a museum filled with gifts from stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They also have a museum dedicated to a basketball. And?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, never mind the fact that the KGB was dissolved 23 years ago.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, and dissolved intelligence agency's becoming presidents shows the reality of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the media black - tears spanish and argentinan political opponent adoption victims, but not the german stasi's'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that was one of the kgb spawns in russia, aljazeera claims that after it's dissolution in 1991 it retired like the kgb into the administration of germany'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'germany*'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're not making sense again. Seriously, that's not proper English. I have no clue what you're even attempting to say.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's just obviously corrupt, no sense at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is babbling slightly incoherent -- likely inebriated'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'stasi education chief's live in Chile today receiving germany pension and praising the actions of the stasi that shot people trying to flee to the other side of germany in the cold war'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, yes, all countries run by politicians who aren't right-wing are evil, yaddi yaddi yadda.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and their various torture dungeons and sex slaves and imagination knows how many mass-murders'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but uzbekistan and ukraine 'the capitalist' currently are showing some information to extrapolate the unhinged numbers from, though not much comes from them anymore'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna, that looks like a support quote from you'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '... but the statisical chi-squared test indicators are subversly attempting a belated return to the median juxtaposition with a high fog-index extrapolating nonsense to new wordier directions of tenuous obfuscation'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'yep, almost unhinged'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'communist scum is the spawn of satan'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '/the end/'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'socialists are not communists'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'communists are not socialists'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zade, the "Yaddi yaddi yadda" makes it clear I was being sarcastic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'drop the "yadda yadda yadda" (perhaps indicating impatience with Chemosh for repeating "obvious wondrous dogma"), and the quote is Yuna support for Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Well, yes, Zade. The "Yaddi yaddi yadda" was tacked on to make it clear it was SARCASM.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of that is too Canadian French for you to understand?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That statement would only look like it was in support of Chemosh if you had do not know how sarcasm or "yaddi yaddi yadda" works or if you only partially read that statement (skipping the last 3 words).'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What is your point, really?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(as a grasshoper) never use reverse sarcasm in a debate -- what was said reversely may be taken as positive support (-- xchan)'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'By IDIOTS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also... "reverse sarcasm"? What part of that was "reverse" anything? It was blatant and direct sarcasm.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'by Stephen Colbert'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're either a troll or you need help.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'or possibly, English is your 29th language.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(near) perfect English as the 29th language -- i be so lucky and educated'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're either trolling or need mental help, then? Duly noted.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Possibly both.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'when you resort to personal attacks, you are obviously losing the debate '
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What debate? The debate of whether or not my correct English is correct?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's not really a debate when you ADMIT that one has to OMIT parts of my statement for you to be right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the debating style by Yuna was/is seriously flawed'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's not flawed because it's possible for idiots to misinterpret my style.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'supporters of Chemosh are likely to view the "yada yada yada" as impatience, and are likely to remove the "yada yada yada" to improve the context -- perhaps Yuna is an unwitting grasshopper disciple of Chemosh - freudian slips et cetera'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The "Yes, yes" was an indicator of sarcasm. The "Yaddi yaddi yadda" clinched.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'little grasshopper requires to learn patience and more respect for the great masters'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, you'd have to either be stupid, omit words or willfully misreading my statement to read it as a statement of support. ESPECIALLY considering what I'd JUST argued.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's like arguing against the average toddler... or Sarah Palin. Not that there's much of a difference.'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(recanting after impatiently confessing support for the opinions Chemosh-- disallowed)  xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(recanting after impatiently confessing support for the opinions of Chemosh -- disallowed)  xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you should quit acting like i'm part of your government and you're rebelling against being my cult of personality and focus on the non-soviet subject matter, you bunch of marxist zombies'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'has this channel degenerated into personal attacks again?'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'your mothers were hamsters and your fathers smell of elderberries!'
T3/r7/2012-07-07.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Read about it last year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'whats the points of having awesome set of lvl 1 eq if every mob is easy at that lvl?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'to pk people'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'oh....so i've been wasting my time collecting lvl 1 gear'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'lvl 1 aard gear'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'pfft'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fortunately, yuna's double will be paid for by a tax on your regular xp of 75% for the proceeding 50 minutse'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'll give Umari a try then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I need to stop mischanning debate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'figures show real-terms gdp growth in America has been negative for 9 of the last 10 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in other news, Monsanto is launching a massive lobbying campaign to prevent the labelling of GMO in food products'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Monsanto are evil. What else is new?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'new? nothing, they have their tendrils in the american government which is how they can get away with stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, how is that new?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only thing citizens can do is campaign at a state level to get labelling'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then watch Obama's cronies threaten them with embargo's and air strikes'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(which is exactly what happened to Texas, and similar abuses of power and threats going on to Arizona atm)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why are people surprised so many U.S. politicians are bought and paid for by corporate interests? Citizen United passed, for crying out loud!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'surprised, no, but also not happy about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just because something isn't secret doesn't make it right, or pallatable'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The solution would be to not re-elect corrupt politicians. Too bad the common man is too stupid/indifferent to even try.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in the current system that won't happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are mechanisms in the USA which means it might be possible to get around the system, but here in the UK we're pretty stuffed. It's revolution or nothing'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In Sweden, a politician was given a free trip a year or two ago in his capacity as a travel guide writer or whatever he does in his spare time and we had this huge blow-up about how it might constitute bribery and shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Two ministers had to leave the cabinet within 2 weeks of the cabinet forming because both of them had once upon a time employed cleaning ladies under the table and one of them had additionally not paid her public service tax for some time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'frankly amateurish corruption there'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we have leaders that go on wars on deliberately faked evidence to line the pockets of the industrial complex'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you create a political environment where even the SLIGHEST HINT of corruption results in politicians being ousted, they won't dare to go for "big time" corruption.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What I'm saying is: Its not impossible. It just requires a whole lot of effor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the larger the population base, the harder it gets'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna was discredited as a debater by adding the term "and shit" -- (the foul language is indicative that Yuna may believe "bribery" is okay)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it were me i'd rip up our whole parliamentary system, and have county-level democracies'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fact that education and general intelligence is slightly lower on average in the U.S. than in Sweden might also have to do something with it. I'm not saying you're all stupid. But the U.S. seems to have an abnormally large percentage of stupid people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'with the country-level parliament having policy setting power over war and certain other pan-county issues'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'having free education means more people will be able to get educated'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Direct democracy does not work. Switzerland didn't have nationwide suffrage until the 1990's, I think, due to it being a direct democract.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'education has little to do with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It wasn't 'til 1990 before the last canton in Switzerland finally gave women the right to vote.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not only do we have free education on all levels (except in private schools, for reasons which are obvious), we have MANDATORY primary education (1-9).'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'and no home schooling'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And home schooling is not allowed. Which means that like it or not, your kids are required to go to school for AT LEAST 9 years.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'home schooling should be a right'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So even out high school drop-outs are pretty not-stupid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you saw the state of some the schools here, you wouldn't be asking 'why''
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you're actually teaching your kids what the government requires them to be taught, then it makes no difference if it's in school or at home.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'if you're not, that's a problem.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'having seen some of the footage from American schools, it doesn't surprise me many americans would want to home-teach their kids, either'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But in Sweden, out schools are pretty darn good.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not up to a government to 'require' what is to be taugh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Even if some of our more ghetto-ish schools have dismal levels of English proficiency.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they should be there to advise'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's thinking like that that cranks out stupid kids who end up voting for corrupt politicians.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'who should decide what schools are mandated to teach if not the government? McDonalds?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there never used to be an issue when small communities provided their own schools, so had a vested interest in it providing good education'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'parents should, Ranrr'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If the parents are unfit parents, the kid will end up learning jack shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'for the same reason, government should be mandated to dictate to you what you eat, think, read, or watch'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And they will be screwed pretty much for life unless they take several years of remedial education so they can survive High School and/or College.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'are you suggesting all home schooled kids get an inadqeuate education?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'most of them probably do'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No. Is English your 9th language?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not even most of them don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'most of them have a far superior education'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '[[[[IF]]]] the parents are unfit parents'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So OF COURSE the government needs to have strict guidelines of what a child should be taught if it is home schooled.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so because some parents are unfit, the rest of parents must be screwed over and have their rights removed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'if that is true, your country is broken'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Whatever the parents feel like" is just stupid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How the heck are you supposed to monitor if a child is getting an adequate education, eh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'usually that's done by some form of testing'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'pisa tests?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as a rule at 6, 11, 14, and 16'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'varies from country to country'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'varies in efficacy'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, that's several years between each test.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, what's the point of home schooling, anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'and those test are only samples of knowledge'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what's the point?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, if the kids get an adequate education at home, why not do it at school? Why do it at home?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, standardized tests are not that good at judging language proficiency, among other things.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you would home school if you were not confident or happy with the quality of the schools on offer'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then enroll your kid in another school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's the point of home schooling'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'to keep your child from developing social skills perhaps'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'or campaign for the school kid is stuck in to get better teachers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'or if your religion prevented you from having contact with normal people?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so now you're saying you have to send your kid to a shit school and while they're suffering there, campaign for it to become better'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "Move" was too hard for you to understand?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or maybe uproot your family, quit your job and move 100 miles to maybe get a different school that might be just as bad'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you deliberately only reading part of my posts?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's what you do to my comments'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'School districts where you live are 100 miles large?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Well, if you have a job you won't have time to home school your kid anyways.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What Ranrr said.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they often are in the USA, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No they aren't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in the UK you don't have the option of choosing your school'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In what, rural Texas?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Get a shitty school? Recognise the importance of living in an area with lots of schools - market forces apply better there than in monopolistic environments'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Rural schools can be shit, and there's nowhere for people to go instead, so they stay shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What possible non-rural areas have 100-mile wide school districts?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the whole world is not urban, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'People who live in rural areas are generally not well-educated so the education they give their kids in home schooling would be shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '94% of the planet is rural'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's a cycle of shit. Parents get shit education, gives kids shit education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oh, now peopel from rural areas are not well educated?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'In my experience the odds are lower for rural populations.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because their schools aren't that good. And since they never moved, they got their education from said bad schools.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well it's amusing that the rural population think a similar thing about people from cities'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'around here for decades such people have been called "idiot townies"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And if they home school their kids, they'll be regurgitating the same bad schooling to their kids. In a never-ending cycle of shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And to get to a education level were you can provide a decent education for a kid, you need to go to a university. '
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Where are the universities? '
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so far, in response to the home schooling question, apart from a valid point about the difficulty in picking up certain social skills, all we've heard is a bunch of vague ideological waffling'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Home schooling was the start of this, was it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not ALL rural "folk" are stupid. But if they went to shit schools, chances are, the education they'll be able to give their own kids in home schooling will be sub-par.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Well, if that's the case, ask yourself what the importance of multi-channel education is?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'People who only get their knowledge from one source tend to be fundie nutjobs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, Tigernuts, WHY do you need home schooling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as we're finding in modern societies with the "media"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'YOUR only good argument has been "Sometimes, schools are shit"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Parents should not be the teacher as well - it's EXACTLY like the media'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sometimes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'try 'more often than not''
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And you need to be well over average IQ and education to provide a full rounded education for a child. There is a reason there are different teachers for different topics.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'in Texas, (fundie nutjob) christians decide what schoolbooks are to be approved of in Texas and thus influence the schoolbook choices of the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And the common man can provide a better education?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'most people, given a decent school, will choose to have their kids educated there, but it should be a right of a properly kitted out parent to be able to school their own kids'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'granted there should be some checks and balances, but it should be their right'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No, it shouldn't. Because again, mutli channel education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'multi*'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If youre not happy with what your kid's school is teaching them. Move. Or move your kid. Protest. Write to your congressman. And/Or provide supplementary education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bollocks to your multi channel education'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'What matters is the rights of the kid, not the parent. It should be the right of any child to get a proper education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're talking about asking permission to have your child educated correctly'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No, you are free to educate your child when they are at home.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you shouldn't need permission to bring your child up correctly'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, Tigernuts, you accuse us of ideological bullshit while you're just as guilty.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I question the validity of the average parent's views, tbh.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Oftentimes than not, schools are shit. Therefore, home schooling should be a right."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'home schooling should be a right even if schools were not sh it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'For one thing, how good schools are depends greatly on waht country you're from or even what part of a country you're from. For another, a parent's ability to home school is also highly individual.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'WHY?!?!?!??!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If the school system can give your kid a good education, WHY should home schooling still be a right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if the Swedish school system degenerated to the same bad level as the USA school system, Yuna 'd likely not be so eager to exclude home-schooling as a choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There is no law in existence that prevents parents from giving their kids SUPPLEMENTARY education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why should you have rights? well clearly you don't want any, but just because you don't want any rights or freedoms, don't act as a barrier preventing the rest of us having them'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If they wish to teach them ADDITIONAL things that the school system doesn't teach them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Why bollocks to multi channel education? It is a perfectly valid reason for not wanting either source a voice in the child's development.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how selfish are you, anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How selfish are YOU?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'words, Vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Don't you want kids to have rights? Only parents?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Home schooling is not about the kid. It's about the PARENT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'We're on the internet, all we have are words...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The parents want to decide what their kid should and should not learn.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and a parents right there should trump a governments right'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Any child who loses either one of parental or schooling education is going to be worse off for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zade: I never said home schooling should be illegal everywhere. I'm saying: In a country where the school system is sufficient, why should home schooling be a right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And the kids right should trump the parents.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it shouldn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that is also correct, ranrr'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No matter how bad the school, they will get a better education from BOTH than simply one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not true'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The parent can teach the kid WHATEVER they want... as long as the school system also gets to teach them the necessary requirements to function in society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Think the school is shit? Why. Give me reasons, not half arsed argumentative bullshit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, you can home school your kid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'my last 4 years in college was a joke. i didn't write anything up, i had to really study only for 1 subject. i think im dumber now.. cause practicing guitar scales makes you stupider!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're just not allowed to keep him from getting a government education as well.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Again, if the schooling system is broken, the solution is not for everyone to home school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wrong Yuna.  there is the law of economics, the law of bullying, the law of street gangs, the law of bad schools, the law of bad influences, the law of peer pressure, the law of drug addictions'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'government run education has a tendancy to degrade, it brings up slightly the prospects of the dullest while dumbing down the best'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why in the U.S., there exists a 16 yearold with a fundie talk show preaching about why gay people are evil and tearing up the fabric of society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Most parents would not be able to provide something close to a decent education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this is why you saw grammar schools banned by law here'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No, government education is targetted at the average student.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Idiot home schoolers being allowed to selfishly indoctrinate their kids with whatever they wish while the government has no say in it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Some might, but they probably don't have the time for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'If your child happens to be above average, you supplement the average education at home.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'also, the USA is a multicultural "war-zone", unlike the mostly "all white" Sweden'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I believe most people home school because they are religious nuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'All-white my penis.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'But again, I would call into question any parent who felt they could teach better than someone who has trained for YEARS to do that same task.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna's ideology is such that the government to legislate to make everyone identical'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Only 90% of all Swedes are at least 3 generation Swedes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know what I am? Asian.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'deviations from the standard model WILL NOT BE TOLERATED!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I was born in Vietnam to two Vietnamese parents.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'YOU WILL SUBMIT! HEIL HITLER!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Godwin. Right there, you all saw it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you nuts, Tigernuts?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts -)
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Godwin ftw'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nobody said deviation is not tolerated.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I have well over average IQ and education, and I am sure I would do a worse job than a real teacher. '
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You are FREE to teach your kids to "deviate".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They just need the STANDARD tools first.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which the schools will provide them. The parents can then teach them whatever they want.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your whole argument is based upon the government being the ultimate arbiter of what is and isn't a normal or necessary education and that home schooling cannot possibly provide anything equivalent or better'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and essentially because some parents aren't up to the job, no one should be allowed to use it as an alternative'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I could teach my children the sum total of my field better than any primary or high school teacher, yes. However, what about all the other fields? Tell me you are educated enough in all of them to be a valid source of knowledge for your offspring, and I'll call you a liar.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, my argument is: Why is home schooling necessary?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and no matter how you might want to dress it up, that is your view on it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i've told you why home schooling is necessary'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Some schools are shit".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and you came out with some utter guff about moving'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Well, I raise you "Most parents are unfit to be teachers".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'most teachers are unfit too'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I have a modest proposal... why not go further than mere home schooling? If parents wish to withdraw their children from society, and send them to "camps" in the middle of the desert for "academic" training far from external controls, and where no one can see what they are doing, is it not their right to do so? What does it matter if they should choose to teach them gunnery, or explosives making? These are healthy and productive activities after all...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'fortunately, if the low-iq foreigners are discouraged from residing Sweden, then Sweden is unlikely to degenerate to the level of the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if i were in the situation of wanting to educate my kids, i'd find some similar-minded people and set up a small-scale free school'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is essentially a communal form of home schooling'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, that's where the "How about you stop whining about unimportant shit like gays wanting to get married and petition your congressmen to better the school system" argument comes in.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which, shock horror, is how many village schools staretd'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'ALL homeschooling should only ever be exclusive (i.e. without campus based schooling) when there is a direct and unavoidable reason for it - like a violent or otherwise mentally disabled child unable to leave home or be amongst others.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Private/"free" schools are government regulated in Sweden.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'And Tigernuts, these 'similar minded people' are how we get cults.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're free to start one, you just have to adhere to our educational standards of what can and cannot be taught to kids in school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'government is incapable of delivery decent education, that's pretty much established fact given how standards have declined over the last 30 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And, shock, our free/private schools are pretty good because ofi t!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You speak as if the standards have declined globally.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Again with the single source of education - to create a critically thinking person able to operate based on a body of knowledge, which is the goal of all true educators, you MUST have them taught by different sources.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's why they're freeing up free schools from syllabus and testing, yuna, completely against the wishes and votes of the liberals and left'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Aussie standards are world class, and climbing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'idealistic, vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Your government may be, because us politicians are bought and sold by corporations, and are more interested in wars than schools'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'yes, Tigernuts, and? Are you saying the world is better off for that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sneak: 'australian education system is in complete shambles'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Syllabi exist for good reason.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Ideals are there for a reason - to aspire to. Not ignore because it's too hard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so why does that hold true in education, but not in everything else, Vakieh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Who says it doesn't?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Teach your kids whatever you want" results in uneducated drivel who end up turning to a life of crime, or worse, Fox News anchorism.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it doesn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'Fort al-suarami private school. Totally not brainwashing kids. Warning: Trespassers, including reporters and government officials shot at fence.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You're wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Care to continue?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, Syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Right, so Syria is in a shitty place - doesn't mean there isn't an ideal Syria people are fighting with blood or words to achieve.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not about what the Syrian people do, it's what the West does'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think it's pretty clear that Tigernuts just wants parents to be able to indoctrinate their kids however they see fit without the interference of pesky outsiders, such as peers, teachers or syllabi.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and it's 'ideals''
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He's basically arguing for Western-minded "Fort al'suarami"'s.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Ranrr rapidly nods twice at Summoner Yuna, in complete agreement.
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm arguing against the "El Presidente knows best"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'when it's rather clear from all the problems in the world that they do not'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You know best? What about Joe Blow next door - does he know best?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'debate EXCEPT YOU AREN'T.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you'll find that's the whole point'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'How many kids are taught the best under your system? Guaranteed less than are now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '"public schooling - worst system ever! Except for just about everything else."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi ducks defensively.
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Government schools is NOT "El presidente knows best", it's "El presidente thinks your kisd need this stuff. You can add whatever else you want to teach them."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Public schooling does NOT prevent parents from providing their kids with additional education. Home schooling EXCLUDES all education BESIDES home schooling (unless the kid seeks out additional education themselves).'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'YOUR ideal is the exclusive one!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And last time I checked, it's not the US president that makes US laws, it's congress.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'YOUR ideal is the one hostile to all other form of education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'home schooling = normally passing on the parent's prejudices to the children'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Brilliant rebuttal. "You're wrong".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Schools provide a baseline. How well kids do depends on their innate intelligence coupled with their situation at home. But a kid with a shitty home is at least given an opportunity to escape that due to the second stream of education he receives - from school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'congress writes the laws except when Obama decrees otherwise'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And Obama vetoes laws so OFTEN.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'If Obama could decree, why the fuck did the budget crisis happen the way it did?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Take mandatory school away, allow dumbass hick morons to indoctrinate their children, and you end up with brainless shits who pass that on to THEIR kids.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And why the fuck did Obama have to fight tooth and nail for a scaled-down version of Obamacare?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'USA public schooling --> passing on the prejudices, bad education, and vices, of other peers to the children'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how's that any different to now, Vakieh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Sounds like someone wasn't taught how his own government works...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts is agreeing with that Zade person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well i'm well aware of how -my- government works, Vakieh, and about the US government, Obama employs all kinds of 'tricks' to shove things through, and has been breaking a few laws along the way'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Because as it stands now, the children have a minimum of 2 sources of education. Their parents, who might very well be dumbasses, and their teacher, who has at the least passed their degree and practical assessments, and been given employment as an educator.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, TigerNUTS, you have ZERO credible rebuttals to the following argument: "Public schooling does NOT exclude home schooling. Home schooling DOES exclude public schooling."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'i'd say on average.. the intelligence/ability to teach of a public school teacher is better than the homeschool teacher (parents)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'therefore, on average, homeschoolers will get a worse education than in public school'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what about it, Yuna, why would you need to do the same thing twice?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'With public schooling, you CAN have two sources of education. With home schooling, you can only have the one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'again.. on average, not in every case'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except that's not the case in the vast majority of cases.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Your goverment is a 4 tier setup, Congress, Senate, President, and Judicial.  Your laws are made by Congress, assessed by the Senate, given a final yea or nay by the president, and assessed as valid by the judicial system.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're acting as if the vast majority of home schooling parents are better than their kids' school districts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'people often get homeschooled, because their parents don't *want* other sources of education'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'my government isn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Obama may suggest, but it is CONGRESS who creates all laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, if you think obama's broken laws.. some examples pls, with properly sourced information?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'my country's government is a make-it-up-as-you-go-along constituional monarchy'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Well, at least that's the way it's supposed to work. In practice, whoever pays the most gets to decide the laws.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'UK, is it? 4 tier also. House of Commons, House of Lords (Congress, Senate), Monarchy and Judicial.  Laws still come solely from the house of commons.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'military action in Libya, military action in Syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And yet you argue about the U.S., no the U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'what action in syria? as far as i know, they've not done anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then you're not abreast of the news, Kraken'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tell me, is the education system broken in the U.K.? Are there 100-mile school districts in the U.K.? Are parents generally bette teachers than teachers in the U.K.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Does Obama decide what laws can pass in the U.K.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'perhaps. is it recent?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna: Yes, no not typically, and depends'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you have a president``?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Nobody really thought the world police should be able to stay away from syria.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'The state of the Queen's power should suggest something to you as to the power of the President in the US.  He is 'considered' more powerful, however his legal standing is almost as minor as the Queen's.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's nonsense, Vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I believe the Queen has a constituional right to veto any law she dislikes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'she does, and hasn't used that power'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And? Technically, she has that right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'but, there's an implied agreement not to use it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, she cannot be prosecuted, EVER.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Right - she has the same legal rights as Obama does'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Obama can be.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama is not above the law, vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I also don't think you can impeach the Queen or remove her from "office".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'if the queen ever tried to actually do something like that, then things would get changed.. fairly quickly'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the monarchy is essentially powerless, and has been for about 150-200 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'While he is sitting, he is. He must be impeached to be prosecuted. The difference is the Queen cannot be impeached.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'they've got a platform to "influence", but that's about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, according to the Commonwealth's current laws, the queen holds more power (formally) than Obama.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yes. but as i said. if she ever tried to use it, that would change fast.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'if she abuses them, the laws will change. But he same goes for Obama.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except "the laws will change" can be switched out with "he'll be impeached".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://larouchepac.com/node/22423'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Obama holsd the right to veto laws, he chooses not to for the most part. The same goes for the queen.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In fact, Tigernuts, can you name me a single law signed by congress that Obama has vetoed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'At least the swedish king doesn't have veto.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yuna.. this is different.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i have never mentioned or talked about Obama vetoing congress laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'obama is entitled to by the constitution.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i was talking about Obama forcing through laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Swedish kind has jackshit in term of power. He's prosecution-immune. That's it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'about it using dirty tricks to get laws in'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the queen sorta is.. but it's also agreed she never will'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'tigernuts.. which laws, and which tactics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Asking Tigernuts to provide proper sources for ideological word vomit? Preposterous!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Also, fun trivia, the swedish royal family are the only ones that don't have freedom of religion, they must be protestants by law'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'oh, sorry. am i bring facts in when they're not warranted?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Wow Tiger...you just linked to a fundie superpac's website'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Did you actually know that before I said that on Debate a few or so back, Ranrr?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you Swedish?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'my bad. should we go back to claiming obama's a muslim?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yeah, I am swedish, so I knew that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You understand what superpac's have done to the US political system, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's a transcript from a hearing, Vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can even see the video on youtube if you wish'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, as far as i know, what he's saying isn't a settled question.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'It is a heavily editted and abridged transcript, yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is where your link loses all credibility: "Panetta replied, STILL EVASIVELY"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, yeah. larouche's not exactly an unbiased source'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is a conservative site which editorializes. A LOT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well you have the same internet resources as I do, go watch the clip'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Find us an unbiased source that merely reports the news, not edits and editorializes it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i believe if you're a citizen you can watch the whole uneditted proceedings on cspan'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna, there exists no source in the universe that does that'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You do realize that most hearing transcripts are public information, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I usually mix bbc, cnn and al-jazeera for different view on the same news'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Even in the biased drivel you linked, there was no mention of any illegal activity by any person. What 'dirty tricks' are you implying?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, how come we MAGICALLY drifted onto this subject once you overwhelmingly LOST your case for a right to home schooling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'because it's what people do when they're losing arguements'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '1) Ooooh, shiny'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'holding votes late at night on the even of a public holiday, handing out 1000page bills 1hr before voting'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2) pivot to something completely unrelated that they think will work better for them'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hiding legislation within other legislation'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you mean making legislators actually do their jobs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And it's quite ludicrous how one your arguments for why there should be a right to home schooling is "I don't want my kids to only be able to be taught what El Presidents thinks is right" and then you go on a rant about Obama when YOU LIVE IN THE U.K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You realise it is the dems who have proposed and sponsored the one-topic per bill act, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're arguing that people in the U.S. should have right to home schooling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, remember, in the senate, they can't pass a bill within about 3 days if the minority disagrees.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I live in a country where government schooling is 3rd rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'look up cloture votes'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Because it was the Republicans who tied military shit to the budget agreements.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you claiming that Obama invented the practice of tacking bills onto other bills?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why do you think I care about what part it is?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or that he's the first President to do so frequently?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'tigernuts - i'm not saying it's perfect in the UK.. but, 3rd rate, wtf are you smoking?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and again, Yuna, just because Obama didn't invent it, why does that make it ok? If you were to go around murdering children and everyone said it was ok, should I like it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, the Democrats have apparently sponsored a bill to GET RID of that practice. EVIL Obama.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna says we should all have shit schooling, because it's ok because the government mandated it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You call them "dirty tactics" and illegal dealings when it's not illegal at all and COMMON tactics.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'From ALL sies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'From ALL sides.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sides are irrelevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except the democrats are trying to get rid of it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'tigernuts - your solution is homeschooling? on average worse, and much, much more biased?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Tigernuts, you argue like an uneducated person would, with hyperbole and strawman arguments. For me, this is the best evidence anyone could have against your views on education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, kraken, i'm saying home schooling shouldn't be disallowed'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'IT'S NOT'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're just not allowed to LIMIT your child to home schooling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not. it is. it's not. iti s'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you can homeschool. it's in general a bad idea, in my view, but you can'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'says Vakieh, who comes from a country that has introduced a carbon tax and threatens to fine businesses $1mAUS if they claim price rises occur as a result of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'What you want Tigernuts isn't home schooling, it is homeschooling with NO other schooling. Which is bad for children.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, *NOTHING* is stopping parents educating their kids more when they're not at public schol'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's your opinion, Vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's the same government mandated speed limits. Wanna drive recklessly in public? Too bad, it's illegal. Wanna drive recklessly on your 100 acre farm? Be my fucking guest.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'no. what tigernuts wants is indoctrination'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'kids learning to think for themselves = bad. they might actually *learn* things their parents don't want them to learn'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Lol...threatened to fine people if they claim their prices rised under it and they actually didn't. Get your facts right before you argue with them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'really? how is personal indoctrination any different to government indoctrination?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Taxing bullshit works pretty well. Sweden has one of the world's lowest levels of alcholism because we have a special alcohol tax.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'prove it, vakieh, prove the price rises were or were not as a result of carbon taxing'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'in general, governement curriculums are more accurate than the homeschooling stuff you want people to do'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Easy to do - ever studied economics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Vakieh, he reads right-wing blogs/sites/newspapers and watches right-wing news outlets primarily if not exclusively for his news. He's half-baked at best.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Eco price hits suppliers, not manufacturing. The tax occurs between manufacture and supply, making it piss easy to trace'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tigernuts, you're obivously having problems understanding basic 4th grade English.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'List previous costs, list costs of tax, if they don't match and you've blamed the entire rise on raised raw goods prices, bingo, fine.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'With government education, you can have BOTH government indoctrination AND personal indoctrination. With home schooling, you can ONLY have personal indoctrination.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and they intend to enforce this how?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You have yet to even ATTEMPT to refute this point. Because even YOU realize it is irrefutable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'It's called the ACCC - google it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'prices will go up'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not about to fight two rabid liberals at once, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bad enough i have to be inflicted with one of you'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'because you don't want to lose twice at the same time?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I threw that argument at you 12 times in 2 hours. You didn't touch it even once.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'If you buy flour for $1 a kilo, and let's say the tax is 10%. You may raise your prices to reflect the $1.10 price of flour. If you raise them to reflect a $1.20 price for flour, you will get fined.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'so, you'll run away from both?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Don't try to get it out of it with the "I can't multi-task" argument.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yuna.. he can barely even single-task. give him a break :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't know even what you were saying, yuna, some bullshit about government education being fantastic'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the best education is generally private schools. because they can pay for the best.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why you're not a credible example of why home schooling should be a right. Your English comprehension is obviously below that of a 4th grader's.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I wasn't home schooled'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'public education isn't perfect. but the solution isn't to abandon it. it's to improve it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Who was talking about abandoning it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, NOBODY SAID THAT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Still waiting on an answer to why you weren't wrong...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you were.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But YOU would make for a HORRIBLE home schooler.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you want people to jump out of it, and get homeschooled.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we had to fight here just to be allowed free schools, Grammar schools are still illgal here'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i want people to have the CHOICE to jump out of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'they're not illegal. wanna set one up.. be free to do so'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'public schools are all comprehensive.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, they are illegal'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'private schools, can do almost whatever they want'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'new grammar schools cannot be set up'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Anyhoo, this has been an enlightening insight into just how the world is as fucked up as it is, but I am going to bed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck are you talking about? Grammar schools are legal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'Nice thing about private schools is depending on the state, you can even get state-funded "vouchers."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then vote the conservative party out of office, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the party isn't the issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though the tories historically prefer grammar schools'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's the Conservative party whose official platform includes "No new grammar schools".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the parties are homogenised these days because they all play for the swing vote'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, can't free schools function as grammar schools?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is why I said historically, they're pro-grammar schools'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'schools cannot be selective'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Well, that's a problem. Government-funded schools, however, shouldn't be allowed to run as grammar schools because where else can kids go?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'sure they can if they are privatly funded and owned'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It might interest you to know that in Sweden, free schools are free to be selective and pretty much 100% of all High Schools and Universities are selective.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is crazy, you can have selection based on finance, but not based on ability'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Uh... no?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sources for our selection being based on finance ANYWHERE?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you just making shit up as you go now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'talking about here, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not terribly interested in your country'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Private schools aren't operating on "selection based on finance" if they cannot be selective.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They cannot discriminate against a prospective student because another prospective student has richer parents. It's just that poor students cannot apply to said school. There's a difference.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Stop twisting even the most basic of facts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that distinction is irrelevant to the vast majority of the population'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's important to THE FACTS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're pretty quick to denounce others on technicalities'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I know that you have a massive problems with being factual, but I don't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'eh? you're commonly delusional'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, what part of "Free schools should be allowed to be selective based on abilities" was too Vietnamese cho may?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'should be?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In the U.K.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well they're not'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The way you want them to be?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's why they SHOULD BE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'is English your 29th langauge?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lots of things should be'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but they're not'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or does your ego allow you to selectively edit reality, too?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm saying that I'm AGREEING WITH YOU ON THIS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'good, well shut up then'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'is your ego so huge you cannot accept when people actaully agree with you on an issue?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That you have to argue as if the basic rules of English grammar and syntax do not function the way they function to SOMEHOW prove your opponents wrong?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who, in their right mind, would take issue with someone arguing "Something I agree with should be legal"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you must be using Duracell'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I got a government education. It provided me with many tools.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what was that, "It made me a tool"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'An above-average grasp of the English language and typing is among them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tell me, Tigernuts, where did YOU get your education?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'local comprehensive'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And was it horrible?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wasn't great'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But it was adequate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'hmm, it would be logical that a government education would give you an AVERAGE grasp of the English language and typing among them...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not really adequate'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'quite by definition'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not really a question that can be answered'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"could have been much better"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not according to Tigernuts, Abelinc. Accordin to Tigernuts, most schools (in the U.K. and U.S.) are horrible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i fell victim to some serious government meddling into the education system'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'type of education is kind irrelevant lol either you want to learn it or you don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'was it worse than what your parents could've done on their own?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which is why home schooling MUST be a right! Lest the world end! Or something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'kind of'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are your parents scholars, Tigernuts? Do they have above-average I.Q.'s? Are they learned in many subjects? Do they know what the capital city of the municipality of Svdermanland in Sweden is?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'home schooling should be a right, but it also should not be immune to standardized testing'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i said that a long time ago, Abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna just hates it because government wouldn't be in your pants'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Home schooling should only be allowed if the parents first undergo rigurous training, have to adhere to syllabi and their kids subjected to standardized tests in all subjects on a 6 month basis (once each semester)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and yuna, the parents don't need to be experts in every field...they only need to teach high school level'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And if they fail the tests twice, their right to home schooling is revoked.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In other words, home schooling should not be an inherent right, it should be a right bestowed upon the competent.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'students fail the tests twice in public education all the time...does the teacher's right to teach get revoked?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'dodgy ground, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Abelinc, you seem to have a pretty low opinion of what makes for a good teacher.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm guessing that Abe, like me, has suffered a sub-par government-infested education system'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not at all, my schooling was to be a teacher'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not many parents know basic qm, calc, and linear algebra though...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Just because someone has received a High School, diploma, it doesn't mean they make for competent teachers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I think that's the problem, Yuna, just because Sweden has a great system, you think everywhere is also great?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi: not many high schoolers touch qm, calc or linear algebra'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That just means they might be able to regurgitate what they learned to their kids.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Schools are meant to teach kids more than that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'we do back home! Well, some.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sure, it's not Rwanda or Mongolia, but for a major Western power, it's a fucking joke'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if the kid is bright, they should have a shot at the best schools...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Dodgy ground, Tigernuts, for requiring home schooling parents to pass some kind of tests themselves to prove themselves competent?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How HORRIBLE of me. Me and my liberal ways1'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and yuna: my "opinion of what makes for a good teacher" has little to do with what teachers currently exist'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not what you said. Having a competence test is all fine, but you were talking about not having rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, my country has a functioning public school system, so I may be biased here...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The solution to bad teachers it to get rid of them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's perfectly possible for someone to be home schooled by a private tutor, not a parent'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'can't'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sweden is currently barring all teachers without a formal uni. education in teaching from teaching.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'uni certificate in schooling isn't worth the paper it's written on here'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tigernuts, under my proposed system, the tutor would ALSO need to be certified.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'formal uni education in teaching doesn't help you be a better teacher'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts nods at you in agreement. 
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, but it it's better than no formal uni education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not always true'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If a teacher is bad, the schools fire them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I think you can teach kindergarten or maybe even primary back home without a bachelor's.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"It's not always true" =/= "It matters"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'in general, you can't be taught to be a good teacher'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts seems to think you have the right idea.
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not sure you'd need a degree for kindergarten, at least.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's not always true home schooling parents aren't religious nutbags hell-bent on making the world a Theocracy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Quick, ban home schooling worldwide!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's how governments work, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You can be taught techniques for teaching other than "Give them the facts and have them absorb them without critical thinking".'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, getting a first or equivalent will certainly give a future teacher a good grasp of the material, for high school anyway.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'graduating high school should give someone a good grasp of the material, isn't that what it was for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'apparently not, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "That'd just be a High School graduate regurgitating what they've learned back to their kids" was too Canadian French pour toi, Abelinc?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm seeing a pattern here'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you could save some typing if you just used "Ur mom"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Graduating High School =/= Being qualified to teach kids at a High School level.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It doesn't mean High School graduates can never be qualified to teach at a High School level without formal education in education. But graduation from High School does not magically grant one teaching abilities at a High School level.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In 99% of cases, it doesn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna: the part that was entirely incorrect, yuna :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So how exactly does graduating from High School magically make you a proficient teacher at a High School level, Abelinc?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'graduating high school, if the school system worked, does magically grant the graduate with the firmness of grasp of the material being taught...which was one of your and vakieh's main points'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'didn't help my grasp of English'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, having a grasp of said material does not mean one can teach it to others even close to as well as a licensed teacher can.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, from my observations, if you don't have a level up on the material, teaching quality tends to suffer'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the ability to teach is more inate than taught, licensing does nothing to change that'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'English is your 1st language, Tigernuts. You're doing something wrong if you need High School to teach you English.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'I think a person can learn to teach well'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we're taught English to 16'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'for one, you won't know where all of the stuff is leading to'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And that's where my idea of licensed home schoolers come in, Abelinc. If you're qualified to home school, you have nothing to fear.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'it probably helps to have a certain personality profile'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you can learn to teach better, if you're willing to change'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but many people in education systems never learn to teach at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'willingness would definitely be a required characteristic'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'desire'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If a High School graduate with no further education/education in education is qualified to home school, take my proposed test.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and many people with no background in education naturally teach better than the majority of those with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'back home, after they hire teachers, they throw them into their teaching school. Seems to work decently well'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If they pass, they're free to home school 'til they prove themselves inept.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'enthusiasm'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'i have been a teacher fo 7 years and i never quite got it '
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some/many of the problems in the education system here are down to goverment interference'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'if they don't, they obviously don't know how to each. Everybody wins! Except for the bad home schoolers!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In Sweden, teachers get paid to further their own studies from time to time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'the thing is that the darn students don't care to think your way:('
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'same in the US, but it's a very flawed system'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'government inferference above a certain level has an unfortunate effect on just every aspect of things they have any involvement in'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They take some time off from teaching to enroll back into teaching school to get updated on the latest in teaching and their skills. And are PAID while doing so.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the more classes you take after master's, the more you get paid, basically'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not how it works here. Here it's all about how well you teach (and also your degree, not the number of glasses, but what degree you hold. A doctorate will earn you more, obviously).'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as someone who works with people with Phd's, I can guarantee you that having one is no guarantee of teaching ability, or sadly as it seems, any form of common sense whatsoever'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm still waiting for Tigernuts to respond to the following argument: "Public education does not by nature exclude home schooling. Home schooling by nature excludes public education."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a better grasp of the material beyond what is taught also allows the curriculum to be expanded. Hard to say "hey, let's add QM since the students seem to be coping well with everything else" if your teachers never studied QM.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it does, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it doesn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're free to provide your kid with additional education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, phds were typically never really taught to teach'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A PHD means you have a deeper grasp of a subject, not of teaching. There's no PHD in teaching.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'meh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, Tigernuts, how exactly does a public education automatically exclude home schooling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the way it works in most universities is "hey, attend this two-day thing on teaching and we'll throw you at the students next week!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'a phd means you have a deeper understanding of a very specific sub-sub-field'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but when educating someone at a high school level, a phd level grasp of the subject is about as meaningless as it can get'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they occupy the same time, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'I agree. A phd is completely useless for general teaching'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You think home schoolers school their kids for 8 hours a day?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'no'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'nonetheless grad students still teach better on average than undergrads who get As in that course...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'perhaps they do, perhaps they don't, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I do like my daughter's science teacher this year...he'd been a physicist for the corporate world most of his life & started teaching pretty recently'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, a school usually teaches kids SOME useful things. Home schoolers don't ahve to teach them from scratch once they come home from school. They only need to teach them what they think the kid needs that the school hasn't taught the kids already.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if someone is teaching me qm in high school , it would be preferable for a phd to do so, as opposed to bachelor's'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'd disagree with that in most cases, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's blatantly obvious you think home schooling should be a right not because it's important for parents to be able to teach their kids what they want but because you want parents to decide what their kids CAN'T be taught.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Just a shame the argument you're trying to force me on is a pointless one. You're saying that public schooling doesn't exclude home schooling, but home schooling excludes public schooling. The second part is largely true, the first part only holds for asmuch as home schooling is used as supplementive'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because public schools can teach children things the parents would rather they not be taught.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a mere bachelor's might have gotten an A in QM and knows it reasonably well, but the PhD would probably actually have used it, and would be familiar with the subtleties and common errors.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you were using home schooling as a wholescale alternative to public schooling, then they are mutually exclusive by design and by implementation'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'essentially selecting between two product types at that point'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, if your kid is getting a public education, you don't have to teach him or her from scratch.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's subjective'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Once he or she gets home, you only have to teach them what you think the school didn't already teach them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Whether or not murder is OK is subjective, what's your fucking point?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why public schooling is essential. Who CARES what very SUBJECTIVE parents think?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the reasons for home schooling someone might, and quite often do, extend beyond syllabus coverage'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If some fucktard parents don't think their kids need maths to survive, is it OK for them to withhold maths from their kids' home schooling?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no. yuna. What if a government says teh same thing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except you can totall do that when your kid gets a public education!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What government does that, you idiot?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, let's keep the personal attacks out, kthx'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your government decides to teach Creationism instead of Darwinism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And what part of "If the government doesn't teach your kisd what you want it to teach, teach it to them with supplementary education yourself" was too Swedish fvr dig the first 19 times I said it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your government used schools to selectively teach history and propogandise?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, they definitely do that'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If your kid gets a public education and you think they're not teaching your kid enough, teach them what you think they're missing. If a kid is getting home schooling only, the government cannot provide them with additional schooling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'also, if the teachers have a level further on the course's material, it's going to be easier to field questions. Much better for the brighter students too, since the teacher can take them further.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your school was ill treating your kids, allowing bullying, or had teachers that turned blind eyes to padeophilia?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, if you're unhappy with what the public school system is teaching your kids, feel free to fill in the blanks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your school was shooting your kids up with vaccines against their knowledge?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'THEN YOU SUE  THEM.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'too late, it's done'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your arguments aren't without merit, but are solely focused on syllabus'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What if I am President Obama in disguise? WHO CARES for your nutbag conspiracy theories?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what if your school was filled with thieves and druggies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who in their right mind would use "What if schools are shooting your kids up with vaccines against their knowledge?" as an argument in a debate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then fucking MOVE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some people think it important'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you live in a bad neighbourhood, MOVE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this isn't Sweden, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not doing so can only be attributed to SELFISHNESS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'msot people can't just 'move''
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'one example. Say you have a high school calculus teacher. A student might ask - "Teacher! Teacher! But what if we want to integrate something that isn't continuous? What if we have some fractal-like pattern thingamajig?"'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If a school is filled with thieves and druggies, the only way for you to keep your kid away from them is to CONFINE THEM TO THE HOUSE INDEFINITELY.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you won't let us, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So those are your choices, move or confine your kids to the house.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you're imposing solutions on us now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'otherwise, your kid MIGHT get in contact with those thieves and/or druggies at SOME TIME. It doesn't mean the public school system as a whole is broken.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a teacher with a high school level of education has just about no chance of answering that well... a graduate might...'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It means that particular school and schools like it are broken. Improve individual schools, don't condemn the entire system.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you would rather submit your kids to that rather than having a home tutor'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I would MOVE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or protest. Or sue the school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know, what reasonable people do?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you think people don't protest?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, what part of "Home schooling is OK if the home schooler passes a test first"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then stop shooting it down'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If your chosen tutor has passed by Yuna Test of Home Schooling, they are free to home school your kid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'society is broken, withdraw from society?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'create your own, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'aka nwo'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'that's a great idea... I know of many such cases just like that!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm arguing two things: Against the perceived importance of home schooling over public schooling as systems and against EVERYONE having the right to home school.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's called multi-tasking. Some of us can do that despite having penises.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I hear afghanistan has plenty such... they call them training camps, but they're really just schools free of government interference!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I hear the State of Texas is like that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we'd all best go there, then'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I hear you can get full scholarships too, and they give schooling in plenty of practical matters!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'strapping materials to chest 101'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Where the party which holds the majority of the power in all instances of government actually campaigns AGAINST critical thinking in school on their official party platform for the 2012 election season.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, the point is, some level of intrusion is necessary for society to function. It's one of those necessary evils.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there needs to be a line, Sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the key is to determine what is optimal, not scrap it altogether'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That line would be: Proficiency tests for home schooling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Home schooling should NOT be a right. It should be a PRIVILEGE:'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if i were doing it, yuna, I'd be paying a private tutor with the correct training, and augmenting with myself'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'letting people hide their kids from society, teaching them who-knows-what, does not seem to be a particularly good idea, unless you have a strong system to make sure they have access to news and the outside world, and can reach certain levels of competency'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you pass the test, you're fee to engage in it. If you don't, too bad, you IDIOT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, Tigernuts, but your original argument was that EVERYONE should be allowed to home school kids.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which would include unqualified and unfit parents/tutors/George W. Bushes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Would you support Sarah Palin's right to home school her kids?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'absolutely'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then you're obviously nuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'how about ron l hubbard?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you would want them to pass a basic exam before exemption them from P1, and an exam every year thereafter... and perhaps attend some community self-study sort of thing once a week or something, where they would have access to news, books, information, other human beings, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if she wants to hire someone to teach her kids in her house, she should be free to'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, you idiot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '(as well as people who they can tell if anything untoward is happening at home)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sarah Palin's right to PERSONALLY act as her kids' teachers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's different'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why there needs to be standards imposed. You can only home school if you'd passed rigorous testing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'like "you say your daddy touched you? Can you point on this doll where he did" or something'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And the home schooled kids need to be constantly tested by the state to check if they're getting the necessary education. Twice a year (at the end of each semester) doesn't seem like much to ask. If they routinely fail these tests, they are immediately removed from home schooling and given a public education.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm pretty sure that the system of which you're so envious, Tigernuts, i.e. the U.S. system of home schooling, allows anyone and everyone to home school their kids.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'better if it's "score below median, watchlist. Score below 35th percentile, retest and immediate revocation of homeschool privileges."'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Exactly. Home schooling should, at most, be a PRIVILEGE, not a right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are lots of things that are currently rights that should be privileges, and I dare say things that are privileges that should be rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hah, spending 2 to 3x on education in the US should be a privilege, not a right.  Our schools rank 35th in the nations rank, but spend 2x more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'just like the rest of the bloated country.....fat people, fat budgets, and thin intelligence.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what kind of land can i get in Texas for around $5000, Rizzer?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the smaller the acreage, the larger the price.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAYlQhhocMw'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E03U00ME-s'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there was a Discovery channel documentary on how Hitler used propoganda in schools to get acceptance for his ideas'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'military are being trained to do warrantless searches, gun confiscations, and re-education camp management in the USA. They've been instructed to shoot using lethal force and ask questions in unrest situations'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://info.publicintelligence.net/USAMPS-CivilDisturbanceOps.pdf'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some of the big prescription drug dealers are MDs'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'woops mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they do here'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'In a recent study, Dr. DePinho and his team managed to shift the aging process of rodents into reverse by restoring their truncated telomeres. The little guys suddenly had fewer signs of DNA damage, more-efficient mitochondria, and healthier organs!'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So... if bail is set at 1 mil, why do you only need to pay 100k (10%) to "meet the requirement for release"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: '10% is the fee to the bailbondsman, you have to present collateral worth 1M.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'OIC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'or buy a 1M bond if you have the money :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'when you meet the terms of the bond, the collateral is released so you are out 100K.'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'but if you skip, you lose the 100K and the collateral :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-08.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A fish with its genitals and anus on its head? Intelligent design my penis!'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the empire state building is struck by lightning thousands of times each year....it is a shame we cannot tap into that free power source.'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you are free to stand at the top and hold a lightning rod...'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'Vegas - roulette $100, red or black?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=8496121'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'carbon tax levied on some poor guys burial'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how the NSA has been breeching the constitution since 2001, straight from an ex-NSA employee, http://on.rt.com/susjom'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'George Bernard Shaw and "the Humane Gas"  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgpaKkrZex4  british/irish national hero, canadian hero, public speaker praising stalin's holocaust(s) -> He is also remembered as one of the pivotal founders of the London School of Economics, whose library is now called the British Library of Political and Economic Science. The Fabian Window, designed by Shaw, hangs in the Shaw Library in the main building of the LSE.  The Shaw Festival, an annual theater festival in Niagara-on-the-Lake, Ontario, Canada'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'can the government be explained by it's national heroes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'I'll be your wife if you aren't too picky about gender'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Smart move! Harperon tries to start some discussion about the weather, hoping no one noticed his last mischan.
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'George Bernard Shaw and "the Humane Gas" - was that G.B.Shaw praising the use of Zylkon B gas'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and various other things, tough to pinpoint just what ww2 was about if both stalin and hitler were mass murderers'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '(and obviously britain and canada)'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''I want to kill them all, why should you have all the fun?' - Hitler, 'This means war!' - Stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just the kind of reasoning that comes to mind trying to conceptualize it'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think the non-agression deal signed was the one demanding germany starves 'millions of german citizens' to death, with a 'gun to the head of the signator' that's mentioned in the video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM1h_2ujsvs then there's some massacre at danzig also referred to with tread marks on some bodies - not sure if that video's a fabrication though, i don't remember seeing it on history tv - the holodomor show that's an unlikely demand of russia though'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and hero bernard shaw of course opens the doors to all kinds of unlikely scenario's'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''The minorities living within the Reich are not subject to persecution''
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'trust the version of world war 2 from the 'winners' who 'bestially and sadistically tortured women and children before he declared war, only to be killed in the end''
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the allies who went to defend the murderers'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh -- what did the 'winners' do that "bestially and sadistically tortured women and children" -- the [09 Jul 15:20:16] post seems garbled ambiguous incoherent'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what knowledge does obama have about it? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18264036 Obama angers Poles with 'death camp' remark'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'geez, maybe they're led by the same people who genocided europe in the 1930's'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'your hero bernard shaw's a good inspiration'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'do the 'poles' supply some of the rendition camps and personel where crimes against humanity are commited at the behest of the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some nay view the rendition camps run by the USA in europe as death camps'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if russia's not in charge of ukraine 'hundreds of thousands of human rights abuses by the police' per year, and doctors in uzbekistan ordered to force-sterilize 12 women per week, then who is?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'could be america'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'bandying unsubstantiated false accusations muddies the debate'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's not false, that's on amnesty international and bbc'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17612550 and http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/info/EUR50/010/2011'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you look up 'ukraine porn' on google, you'll get the indication that that's the child pornography capital of the world, i wonder if the cops are the main suppliers or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'probably in on it'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'whoevers behind the actions of ukrainian and uzbekistan's governments, neither is large enough to really be behind it's own actions, is it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i guess they don't really operate with any accountability in most of south central america and africa either though'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Why would they call it the God particle, it is not like it turned water into wine, or talked through a burning bush.'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because it is, by the model which predicted it's existing, the subatomic particle that gives things mass'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so now they can invest a matter replicator machine ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'invent even'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nope'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'who cares then, :('
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'now they can use more tax money to blow shit up'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Your tax money....I own muni bonds now. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i give nearly a half of my wages each month to charity'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's called tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'add on what they take for services, it's nearly 66%'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'muni bonds are the best invention ever.'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'rock on, shitty corporate-welfare masquerading as socialism!'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Today's wingnut whining, brought to you by the Far Right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and here is Comrade Yuna, UI'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'silver sounds more fun, bankrupt a few bankers with positions'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'woops, mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'everyone had their Merck mumps shot?'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're petrol powered'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'woops'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doubt they'd use a v8 in a diesel though, no real point'
T3/r7/2012-07-09.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what's that, 4 cyclinder?'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I know. But I don't feel like downloading a whole bunch of iffy unknown programs, which is why I decided to ask around for some good, recommended ones first.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Mischan, obviously.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Thanks. I just discovered through Google that MPC can do it. Gonna check out the results now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Hell is wrong with people? Fifty Shades of Grey - the (Fan) Musical.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'heard bad things about that movie, although they were praising that movie because of the bad things'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, over $3 million worth of 1910 extremely rare baseball cards were found in the attic of a 100+ year old home.....16 honus wagner, 9 ty cobb, connie mack, christy mathewson, a little over 700 cards in total from 1910.  Almost all the cards are near mint to mint.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hehe, the scranton PA city mayor cut all city workers pay to $7.25 an hour, the federal min wage.....the unions are going whacko there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I wonder if he cut his own pay to $7.25 an hour.....if he didnt, he deserves to be shot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what were they getting before the pay reduction'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'who knows, but it was union pay, so probably quite a bit more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the city has $340,000 in the bank, and owes $3.4 million in debts to health insurance...so the city is broke.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the beggaring of common USAmerica by the Republicans'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what is the population of Scranton PA'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'must not be that big, only has 400 city workers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '$340 million divided 400 is $850,000'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'all the police, fireman, etc, 7.25 an hour'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'where did you get $340 million ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '7.25 * 40 * 52 is $15,080 pa'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '$3.4 million divided 400 is $8,500 '
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '$340,000 divided 400 is $850, $850 divided by 7.25 is approx 117 hours or less than 3 weeks'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if the population of Scranton is so small, then no need to bother mentioning them'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'don't waste the peanut-gallery-time mentioning inconsequential crap'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'quiet tonight'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'they have people on the payroll whose job is to get SSI for the people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-10.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, secret service were called because someone had a float called "obamination" in the procession during a festival'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't you dare diss the president, it's illegal (apparently)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'someone called them...I haven't seen an article that says they came or that they did anything...'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and they were called because of the other signs on the float, not because of obamination plates'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people are actively encouraged to'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there were no signs that were illegal, untrue, or threatening in any way, it was satire'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the call, by the sheriff, to the secret service was entirely unwarranted'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Do you people have lese majesty?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it would be like calling MI5 every time an edition of "Have I Got News For You"  is aired'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, we don't vakieh'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'neither does America'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'germany, switzerland, poland, denmark, netherlands, norway, spain, morroco, thailand, north korea, china, and a bunch of arab countries do'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in most cases, the laws haven't been used for 100s of years, but have now started being wheeled out again... wonder why that is'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ridiculous law, it's difficult to contemplate why anyone would actively support it'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unless you believe such people are above the law, above everyone else, and disagree with the concept of freedom of speech/freedom of expression'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there was a term for such people during WW1, WW2, and the Cold War. It was called "The Enemy"'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the float was pretty damn funny, though :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why on earth are they even -contemplating- trialing Oxycotin on kids?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'debate is dead. Where's zade or chemosH?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not even UI Yuna vomitting socialist propoganda'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"Civilian ownership of guns threatens the power monopoly of the state"'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'GMO and biotech companies seeking immunity from prosecution'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what could possibly go wrong with that...'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sadistic & Kruel: 'its only natural they would want protection from their fuckups'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Solid: 'the first person to attack a know-it-all tier (the old barney) will get 5mil from me'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if they have immunity from prosecution, it gives them carte blanche to ignore due diligence when it comes to safety'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they already know that gmo stuff mutates over time and causes massive issues'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yay! Russia sends warships to Syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that'll learn em'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sadistic & Kruel: 'russia has their only warm water port IN syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yep, looks like they're reinforcing'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sadistic & Kruel: 'syria is a strategic port for them'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'time to get some popcorn'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'very much so, and they probably are quite annoyed at the expansionism being pushed by NATO'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Screw Youtube advertising. Every time they slap me with a 10+ second ad I cannot skip, I just turn the sound off.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What in the name of Raptor Jesus? A man sued a priest but "a Daytona Beach court threw out the case citing church autonomy". Say what?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(An appeals judge has ruled to allow the case, however)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But the fuck does church autonomy have to do with throwing cases out of court?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'jurisdiction'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What, churches count as foreign soil now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Churches have no legally binding internal jurisdiction in any western country...'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'It wasn't about a church decision.... A pastor made a comment during a sermon, a man mentioned tried to sue for defamation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'The original judge said that churches have the freedom to say whatever they like during a sermon, but an appeals court has allowed the case to proceed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'According to the article I'm reading, it was outside of sermon.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'It was both during a sermon and in discussions with other church members.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The court was thrown out on 1st amendment grounds ("Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof...")'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Exactly, so the "It was during a sermon" excuse doesn't fly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And why would you get carte blanche during sermons, anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'It falls under the 1st Amendment, but it's really based on other court precedents.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The United States of Theocracy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Still, fact that that he allegedly defamed the man a bajillion times OUTSIDE of sermon means the lower court had no legal leg to stand on.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I agree that it shouldn't apply in this case, probably. Saying that someone is gay and that their marriage is a sham isn't really what the courts had in mind when they said that churches should be free to operate without interference from government.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Almost the same exact thing happened in Bryce Vs St Aidan's, and the courts ruled in favor of the church. That case didn't have the aspect of a pastor calling someone's marriage a sham, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except that's not true.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A quick sweep of the brief for that case reveals that that case was thrown out because the comments were made a part of "ecclestial discussion", likely during sermons and church seminars or some shit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This case involves a priest who mostly went around whispering it into parishoner's ears and called/emailed people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I can't find anything about his whispering it around. He spoke to church officials and the guy's prospective father in law.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'And he mentioned it during a sermon to everyone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Personally I find it more offensive that the pastor talked the guy into letting him install spayware on his computer to see what websites he was looking at. That's like a whole new level of voyeurism.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Bad enough dragging the guy into his office for detailed discussion about his "impure thoughts" ... now he wants to buddy surf with him?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The article mentions him telling his parishoner's, the guy's father-in-law and church officials in the guy's new parish after he moved out of state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'None of which could've been done as part of "ecclestial" duties.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The pastor is probably of the closeted gay brand of homophobe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Unless they have someone willing to come forward and say he was pulling parishoners aside to gossip, the church's lawyers can say it was the sermon that spread the news to the flock. As for talking to other church officials, or talking about it with any employees or lay people.. that's what they do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'They have decades and even centuries of legal precedents on their side, unfortunately.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'New laws have to be written then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it won't happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'I could not agree more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because that's idiotic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Except you don't have freedom of speech over and above defamation in a sermon any more than you do gossiping'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'in the US, you as a company are free to refuse service to whomever you wish so long as it doesn't conflict with existing law (which currently means if the customer reveals themselves to be gay you can refuse them service for that reason).  The hitch in this whole thing, however, is that this does not actually apply to civil law and the person you refused service to can litigate you out of business for it (and either you fold or betray your beliefs).'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, freedom of speech vs defamation is a tricky thing. Newspapers, for instance, can crucify you even though it turns out they were wrong. They can claim that they did it without malice and get away with it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Churches get away with that sort of thing all the time, too. Look at Chuck O'neal. A lady quit the church, and blogged about things she didn't like. He made sermons about her, then sued her for defamation after she said that his church was basically a cult.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'That's a UK case though, and I'm not sure if it's been decided yet, but it's still the same idea. You get a lot of leeway when you're on the pulpit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In less stupid news, the Supreme Court of Sweden finally decided once and for all that Lolicon isn't illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'how is that any less stupid?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you saying Lolicon being illegal wouldn't be stupid?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, I'm saying Loli is stupid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So is Justin Bieber. He's not illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's not illegal when they're exploring!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The court still took the coward's way out by specifying that Lolicon (and Shotacon) isn't illegal because it's heavily stylized and doesn't look much like real children, which means that drawnings depicting pornography involving children may still remain illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'As well they should.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Undertaken Anaristos . o O ( Children of the Porn )
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I get it'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why do you think drawings depiction children should be illegal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Princess Liathum: 'I think pornographic drawings depicting children should be illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Enabling, and desensitizing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I do agree, enabling is bad.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If a paedophile watches pictures of children, it's better than them watching actual depictions of sexual abuse of children.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'sure, I agree, lets feed them all the virtual porn they want'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And what's next? Fictional depictions of murder should be illegal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because that's enabling and desensitizing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'there are people who would agree with that yuna :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it's not the content that matters, is the fact that the providers of the content might engage in the act themselves.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Furthermore, what constitutes child pornography and what constitutes art is highly subjective. A lot of old-timey art would be child pornography nowadays.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Might" being the keyword.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the question to be asked is why would anyone depict something that they weren't interested in when they can choose any other topic?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Add to the fact that you can depict sexual abuse against children in ANY art form besides the pictographic one (in Sweden).'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'one who likes to depict murders or child pornography might very well encourage those types of behaviors by example. '
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There are songs about fiddling kids, books about fiddling kids, etc. All perfectly legal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Might":'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'that's the video games inspire violence argument, isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'or discourage it, by providing sustenance in a non-victim way'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not to mention film. You can depict sexual abuse against children in film as long as no no-no places are shown.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I know porn prevents me from turning into a raging sex addict destined for a date with the hiv'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Some of the pictures originally classified as child pornography by the lower courts aren't even close to what some movies depict.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'not the other way around :p and although anecdote doesn't equal data, I feel like how pornography allows me to manage my sexual drive, it can do the same for paedofiles'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'a good example is how gang life is glorified these days both in the arts and in everyday life. These abstractions remove the underlying reality and allows for the uninformed to think that there is nothing wrong with gangs (or child pornograpy, or murder, for that matter).'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'One depicted girl in a pair of those jeans-jumpsuit-like things. She wasn't wearing a shirt under it, but it covered her entire body except for her collarbone and arms. Wham! Child pornography!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'anaristos post hoc ergo propert hoc, you have no reason to believe those films cause more gang violence.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'except that one can just look out the window and see the reality of gangs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why? She had no breasts and straight hips. Maybe because "she" was MALE.''
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And the picture wasn't pornographic in any way but in a true pervert's mind!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I am not concerned with whether they promote more violence or not. I will be damned if I am going to go around flashing gang signs just to be cool, when I think gangbangers should all be in jail. They have nothing good to offer society and, at the very least, they have nothing to glorify them. They are a sordid part of our environment.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'and thats the sort of thinking that gets us the USA the highest incarcaration rate of the first world, and the highest recivism rate.  Whereas, the scandanavian countries have got insanely low numbers on both and are ranked some of the happiest countries in the world.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'by having dress fashions to emulate gangbangers and have celebrities flashing gang signs, the gangs are marked as an accepted and respected aspect of our society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't think we actually have gangs in most cities in Sweden.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'not to throw a bunch of facts together to paitn a picture that supports my point of view like is typical on debate, or anything.... but I'm saying the correlations of all the numbers are quite strong, there is a hint of something there, and I'd like to think we have been doing the whole crime&punishment thing less well then some other first world societies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yes but really is that WHY the gangs exist?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'we had those fashions and suchlike during the 90s, when the suits focusing on terrorism were too busy for terror and all over gangs like flies on stinky brown stuff.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'or is that just a symptom?  Thats like saying "by having a fever we're encouraging cold's so lets bathe everyone in ice water" its just junk thinking'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'after 9-11, the highups went code brown and moved almost all resources from gang to terror.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So now, that Chemosh, Zade and Tigernuts aren't all online at once for the first time in living memory (a week)... (none of them are online)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who do you support in the upcoming U.S. elections? Obama or Mitt Romney?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that's not my point, Hanslanda. My point, tying in with child pornography depictions, is that the mainstream society has embraced gang life, at least as an abstraction. Finding it "cool" to dress like a gangbanger or to flash gang sings, or calling one's mate "bitch", etc. Gang life should be shunned. Main straeam society should treat gangs and anything related to gangs for what they are, a cancer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(3rd parties don't matter. They're essentially moot votes)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I don't get a vote :('
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're running with the wrong crowd if you think it's become mainstream to dress and act like gangbangers...'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And/or you live in a ghetto.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'just check out any high school in anytown, USA.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'votes don't matter their actions are already bought.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I think a difference in lifestyles should be established.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And percentage of High School kids run around dressed and acting like gangbangers? And what percentage of High School kids agree with their choice?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'Yuna, its completely mainstream.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'what kind of question is that, Yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'A valid one? You claim it's mainstream. Now prove it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'just go to any high school campus in the US, it will look like gangbang central.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Gangster fashion is pretty well established in most Western countries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck is "Gangster fashion", anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Though I wish they'd bring back the zoot suits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I think I might need to adjust my assumptions on the word 'gangbang'...'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and no, I don't live in the ghetto, though living in a ghetto has nothing to do with it, there are many decent people who live in ghettos.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'mine doesn't.  It's actually less so now in my sister's generation than it was when I was attending.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'Western countries. thanks oath. that's the lifestyle difference.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Baggy pants and a hoodie?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Lowriding jeans, specific styles of tennis shoes and shirts, hats worn a certain way. That sort of thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I like gangster fashion. It lets me know who not to take much time with in interviews.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yeah, kids today dress weird and act weird, not like we did when we were kids. '
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes... caps worn backwards is totally glorifying gangbanging!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So are lowriding pants!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I bet we are the first generation to say that....'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Not backwards. I'm talking about keeping the bill exactly fresh with the stickers on it, tilted at a slight angle. I'm not saying it's glorifying gang lifestyle, I'm saying it's something you see in rap videos.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'And a lot of rap does glorify gang life.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And kids who wear their caps backwards and jeans down by the lower parts of their buttocks are clearly glorifying gang violence!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'every generation has kids doing their thing, no doubt. But lately kids want to associate themselves with a part of society which has no redeeming value.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the best part of today's fashion is vagazzling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Keeps their stickers on and wears at specifying angles". What are you, the fashon police?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'they are not glorifying gang violence, I never said that. They are, however, acknowledging gang life. The point.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's spelled vajazzling'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'you asked what it was.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I believe it's a portmanteau of "vajayjay" and "bedazzling".'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Did I say it was a bad thing? Presenting factual descriptions is far from passing judgement.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I don't mind claiming that it is bad to pretend to be a gangbanger.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Being one, yeah that's not great. But dressing like one doesn't really bother me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's no different than religion'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the point is that those HS kids that go around flashing gang signs to look cool, would be horrified if they actually went into the 'hood and earned a bullet between the eyes for their coolness.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How many HS kids actually go around flashing gang signs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '0.05%?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'heh, lots'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'That's what the movie Havoc is all about. (And features a nekkid Anne Hathaway.) Alpha Dog is kind of about that, too.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, seriously, what High Schools ahve you been to?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Predominantly ghetto HS:es?'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'most high schools.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you got this thing for ghettos, don't you? There seems to be a racial bias in your position.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'most ghetoo schools'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Ghetto has nothing to do with race. It has to do with the area.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler grins evilly.
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'the black/chicano/chink family has moved up enough in the world that they are no longer ghetto-fied.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ghetto ppl suck'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'as such, while they accept and embrace certain aspects, they aren't actually into the lifestyle.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The houses are dilapidated, the locals are likely of the lower classes, with low to no education and bad jobs. That's a ghetto.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I could care less about race. I'm an Asian living in Sweden.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'right, ghetto has nothing to do with race... but how many lily white high schools do you find in the ghetto? So race is a point.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'saying we have a gangbanging problem based on all the posers throwing signs and dressing up is a lot like calling most of the Christian following perverted kiddie-diddlers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's like saying a lot of mafioso are Italian, thus all mafioso are Italian or something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're just strawmanning to win some kind of points.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"A ghetto is a part of a city predominantly occupied by a particular group, especially because of social or economic issues, or because they have been forced to live there (e.g. the Jewish Ghettos in Europe)." (Wikipedia)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'it just mean overpopulated i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'which would lead to more scurmishes naturally'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, historically, ghettos are parts of a cities into which unwanted members of society are thrown to live ostracized from the rest of society.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'no, I am not mentioning race. I simply pointed out that teenagers today want to emulate (in abstract) gang life. You pointed out that that only happens in the ghetto. Most all-white HS are not in the ghetto, I would find it hard to locate one in the ghetto, as a matter of fact. Therefore, your bring up the "ghetto" issue smacks of racial bias.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'is there a gay ghetto? OMG I want to live in the gay ghetto'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'more like a.meth ghetto'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'oh wait, we get tossed into them, make them nice, and then rich straight bastards toss out again and take over'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nowadays, the word is mostly used to describe areas with high crimes rates, low education rates (<-- ?), low wagers, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'thats not new, wannabe gangsters were around when i was in school'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'theyre just frightened, small minded people'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And you're, what, 40? (Modi)'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'im 35'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they were around when Capone was being scared shitless by all teh bullets richocheting around him.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'Once again, I say bring back the zoot suits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'I really don't think the cosa nostra is all that similar a social organism to groups like MS13'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'yea gangsters did dress better in the 50s'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zoot suits are a crime against fashion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'you only get one chance at retro, then you forever become tacky.'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'School uniforms and spanking, so the kids learn their lesson!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'ZOOT SUITS FOR ALL'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Mafia glorifier! To the ghetto with you!'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'You confuse know with make up'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-11.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'already there, buddy. buddy buddy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I wonder what Arizona is going to do when the water from colorado runs out.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'colorado river that is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'nothing, AZ gets very little, CA gets it all'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the more pressing question is what is Los Angeles going to do :) They get their electricity from damming the Colorado.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'california can buy power off the open market since they are shutting down all their own power plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'cali needs a dozen new natgas power plants.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, don't confuse California with Los Angeles :) The city may be in California, but it is a state of its own.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Texas needs some also, but they are actually building them here...and expanding the nuclear power plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it has already stolen all the water from Northern California and it gets its electricity by dmming the Colorado. That's not going to change in the near future.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Texas was going to build 7 new state of the art coal power plants, but the tree huggers caused to much trouble, so the power company switched to natgas plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'which is actually a good thing considering all the new natgas that has been discovered in Texas in the last couple years.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and I really don't blame them. Coal burning is not a good thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, I prefer natgas over coal anyday....but when the price of natgas was $11 a thcf.....it would have been murder for power users.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'all you have to do is look at the cities during the Industrial Revolution.'
T3/r7/2012-07-12.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'now the price is under $2 for natgas....it wont go much lower since some producers have slowed down on starting new gas wells.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'left or right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) An Oath: 'East, obviously.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'good deal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Today in stupid news: Democrats and Republicans alike are outraged that the U.S. Olympic Comittee has ordered uniforms made entirely in China for the U.S. Olympians.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because... China is evil? Only U.S. citizens should be allowed to stitch together uniforms for the U.S. Olympians?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'in other unheard news today, both the Democrats and Republicans secretly thanked the U.S. Olympic Comittee for giving each party an opportunity to wax indignant and distract the voters from the economy and other more important election issues.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'not debate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Yang's time in Ottawa was dedicated to securing more foreign aid for his country, despite human rights abuses and Canadian concerns about corruption. Along with other representatives of African countries, he was pleased by Canada's commitment to debt relief in 2000.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil%C3%A9mon_Yang  Power lies firmly in the hands of the authoritarian president since 1982, Paul Biya, and his Cameroon People's Democratic Movement party.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cameroon is it usually a democratic agreement that the convinced citizens of world vision charity commercials would like their tax money used bailing out foreign nations of corruption?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i remember reading about misappropriation of aid money in haiti which JFK cancelled and was later assassinated and some other places too'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Duvalier Duvalier misappropriated millions of US dollars of international aid, including 15 million US dollars annually from the United States.  He transferred this money to personal accounts. Another of Duvalier's methods to obtain foreign money was to gain foreign loans, including 4 million USD from Cuban president Fulgencio Batista.  After the assassination of John F. Kennedy in November 1963bwhich Duvalier later claimed resulted from a curse that he had placed on him - the U.S. eased its pressure on Duvalier, grudgingly accepting him as a bulwark against Communism.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'People & Power  :  America's Dangerous Game  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-eZ1x_qRAQ this video claims that american funding to syria is managed exclusively by terrorists'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'wait.. yemen rather, that's what i remember from it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'US President Barack Obama has announced a $3bn (#1.9bn) plan to boost food security and farm productivity in Africa, US officials say. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18119024 are they gonna be verifiably sure that the money is used only for what it's intended for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Great, the right-wing demagogues are back.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't trust anything to do with money being mysteriously handled and unverifiably used properly, a photo-shoot isn't a trustworthy evidence, it can be profitable to aid enough people to fit in a photograph so that you get the money to make another million pictures which are never taken'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they say right on the other link there that they bail entire nations of corruption and human rights abuses out'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read an article awhile ago that england was going to keep charities going, even knowing that alot of the money is funding terrorism, in the interest of national security'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'canada has no record on the internet of the amount of money doubled by the tax-payer in their somalia donations'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the verifiable paper trail it took'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the road to hell is paved with good intentions, like holodomor misappropriation of aid funding building up your enemy stronger, think they really verify the proper use of every 10 billion dollars they receive?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i imagine there's some fat-cats sittin in castles thanks to people's 'good intentions''
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''you think those terrorists made all the weapons they use?' http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-18827211 Reuters said that ZTE had sold Iran a surveillance system capable of monitoring landline, mobile and internet communications.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you realize that you're the only person to ahve spoken in this channel for the past 15 minutes? You're talking to yourself and essentially spamming.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nobody agrees with you. And nobody cares enough to actually engage you in another futile debate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, one person's spam is another's campaign promises and missing investigations into massive-corruption possibilities, already done in history - you must be pretty smart being oblivious to it all, evidence included - justin bieber being sued for 9 m by a woman who complained his fan's screamed too loudly, all the wisdom of yours'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck are you talking about? What does it say about yourself that you even know the details about that Justin Bieber lawsuit (I had no clue about) and that you'd actually use it as an argument in a debate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because you remind me of a communist world war 2 russian preaching the good bernard shaw of justice'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, this is why your side will ALWAYS LOSE. As soon as anyone's to the left when it comes to politics, we're automatically dirty socialists, communists, Marxists or whateverists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's what their attitudes reflect'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'At least I contain my scorn to the far right-wing (of which you, of course, are a member. Or possibly you've gone beyond even that).'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We try to engage you in actual debate using facts, arguments and logic. You counter every 5 minutes with "You're a dirty Socialist/Marxist/Communist!".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you just called my evidence with the debate a spam, why should yours mean anything?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's quite telling that I've never actually referred to you as a Fascist, yet you throw around "Left-wing slurs" every 5 minutes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, Mr. "I speak English at a 1st grade level".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I called what you were doing tantamount to spam. Spamming up the channel with something nobody obviously wishes to debate with you about.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'stupid kenyan commie fascist liberal muslim atheists!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And I know that it can be difficult for you NOT to twist people's words around. But try for a change not only to comprehend BASIC ENGLISH but not to intentionally misconstrue it to further your agenda.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi ducks defensively.
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'oh wow, here's a hole in the government sending billions upon billions of dollars into terrorists bank accounts that never reaches who it's intended for, no big deal, and the government can be lobbied to bail foreign nations out of debt who abuse human rights and are highly corrupt - no big deal, and there's no record or paper trail of the tax-payers money being used properly or even a boasting as is typical of the government?  no signs there, JFK removed funding for haiti aid because of misappropriation by it's leader and was later assassinated with the funding re-opened?  who cares, what does the aljazeera video claim?  maybe not reliable information but it's still considerable'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, unlike you, I don't have to hallucinate/invent what my opponents in debates are saying in order to "win".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and yes, all terrorists develop their own ak-47s and various other munitions and monitoring technologies, they don't come exclusively from places like america, china and russia'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the real threat's are obviously who has the weapons, not who provides them'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'michael jacksonville in ukraine is pretty good too, i read it on amnesty international'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And yet here we are, 3 weeks into your prattling on and on about this and you have yet to produce any valid sources for these claims.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how about president of uzbekistan claiming if he doesn't get his way there'll be islamic war, and ordering doctors to cut out 8 uterus's from female patients per wekk? '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, we're not interested in your conspiracy theories. There's no way to debate against a conspiracy theorist with little to no proof.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How are we supposed to prove you wrong? Make up stuff ourselves?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's not just a russian kind of place, sheriff in transnistria knows what it's all about too, persecution of gypsy's and all'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You're rambling incoherently again. And where's those pesky sources?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''conspiracy theories' i read about on the news and looked up the details of to see that theories are substantiated by investigations that the governments of the world look at'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"The news"? What news sources?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And see, you're, as usual, pinning it all on Obama when Bush Jr. didn't do shit about it and neither have any of Obama's political opponents pledged to do shit about it should they be elected President.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And what do you suggest they do, anyway? Stop all humanitarian efforts in non-democratic countries?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'who's pinning anything on obama?  one foreign aid package isn't what it's all about, i pointed to the 1950's and 60's'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and canada's possible hand in padding the pockets of holodomor communists'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh? "US President Barack Obama has announced a $3bn (#1.9bn) plan to boost food security and farm productivity in Africa, US officials say. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18119024 are they gonna be verifiably sure that the money is used only for what it's intended for?'"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'says in lenin's own book the use of terror as a neccessary part of totalitarian government, marxist-leninist terrorists is mentioned by a muslim from turkey -> (and as is likely, alot of the terrorists guns and things are imported from communist china/russia or ally america) -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK_5EYicHh8'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh hey, now all lefties are terrorists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so , does this guy have unsubstantiated idle conspiracy theory, or a world war 2 survivor government system that could be what the basis of modern conflicts are?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know who was to the far right of politics? Mussolini. So, you're obviously a genocidal fascist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna is a disgrace to the debate channel'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Your logic is the same old tired bulslhit logic right-wingers throw around all the time: SOME communists were/are evil, therefore ALL communists AND communism is evil.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'so..you're saying the problem with every right-wing person is that they believe that every left-wing person are the same?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Communism shares ideals with Socialists, so all Socialists are evil as well!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to the guy in the video, i never read lenin's book myself, but maybe i should'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I should clarify, Harperon: Far right-wingers who can't find proper ways to discredit the left.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna uses extrapolated false accusations and does not use proper logic'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so are they going to be there to verify that the money is actually used for what it is being sent for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'anyone not bowing down to Yuna is a right-wing nutjob, doncha know?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or is some elite group of welfare-peddlers going to be living the american dream on top of the world thanks to their charity?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See, this is where your credibility as a debater flies out the window.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'anyone who has spent half a minute reading Chemosh knows that he's neither right nor left...he'll spout total shit about all sides'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'One your "sources" is a Youtube video of a nutjob appearing on what appaers to be a Turkish television show with very poor production values (i.e. some kind of public access channel, probably)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'he doesn't make a lick of sense half the time, but he's hardly on one side'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sorry, Abelinc, it's usually right-wing anti-left BS when I've seen him in action.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'bullshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And we know that he's anti-left-anything. He's not noticeably anti-right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you just see right-wing everywhere you look'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Abelinc, he throws "Socialist/Communist/Marxist" around as slurs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there hasn't been ONE conversation you've been involved in on debate channel since you came back where you haven't shouted RIGHT WING!!!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's pretty logical to then assume that he's a right-wingers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'mussolini might have been far right, but one thing i remember is that he wanted to uproot corruption from italian government, in the form of the mafia who at that time (and in future times) corrupting the entire italian nation'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, it isn't logical to assume that at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to what i heard on 'cities of the underworld' or 'underworld histories' on history tv'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because neutral middle-the-roaders often do that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'only a left-wing nutjob would assume that'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so, maybe he was as evil as the victorious ussr allies claimed he was, but at least he had an eye out for honesty'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you know nothing about my personal political leanings, as I will *never* state them, yet you've already attacked me repeatedly for being right wing'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Chemosh "political position" is against corruption and abuses of humans '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And I have never once seen him rail against right-wing politics. Never once. Or a right-wing politician.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh, I'm sorry, Abelinc. You siding with the right on most issues must've been CONFUSED me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I have never sided with the right'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but I've been against stupid inane shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's no such thing as right wing politics or left wing politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'he's a massive anti-government conspiracy theorist, regardless of whichever government that happens to be the one being discussed at the moment'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh joy, the 3rd member of the Nutbag Triumvirate is here.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(Abelinc, you're not one of the three)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nice to see you to, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd missed you'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if this video is actually adolf hitler speaking, and left wing means power to the people, how come he's asking his people to care for one another and not to persecute minorities and things like that?  not very much like stalin's character brings to mind with holodomor/great purge/dekulakization '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what's Yuna spitting venom about tonight?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZG9NXmuCaE  Adolf Hitler: The Man they Call the Devil '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I must've confused Chemosh with Tigernuts for a moment here. So Chemosh is the guy who claimed Hitler didn't really hate the Jews?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'chemosh mentioned it, not sure if he agrees with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh posts links '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But you weren't the one to argue about it, were you, Tigernuts?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, Yuna, I was not'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sorry, Abelinc. I got them jumbled up. I thought Tigernuts was the "Hitler didn't hate the jews guy" while Chemosh was the guy complaining about the left all the time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i complain about everyone, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just saying, as he's given responsibility for all them evil crimes in history, he sure must have been a master-manipulator in public speech, which composed the body of his military (his people) and various other things'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So I will concede that I was wrong this time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(if you were after an accurate generalisation)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Stalin was worse than Hitler'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tigernuts, when you complained about politicians making an issue out of gay marriage to distract from the real issues, you complained about Democrats and left-wing politicians doing it. When I pointed out how it was the right who made a big deal out of by opposing it, you pretty much just went "La la la la la".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'plus, if you listen to the video -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM1h_2ujsvs   Amazing Speech - Adolf Hitler declares war on Poland  , he mentions a agreement signed with USSR under duress to starve millions of germans to death, which holodomor in ukraine was already in 1930-1932'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That, in my book is someone who's to the right of the political spectrum. Or at least more right than left.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both sides of the divide use it as a wedge issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so however much lies he's speaking in the video, assuming it is him, they at least have historic references to look up'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except the right do it more and they'er the ones turning it into an issue.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not much of an issue in this country, as it goes'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more an american thing than anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If the right would just let gay rights be passed without making a huge deal out of it, it wouldn't be a wedge issue.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a mischaracterisation'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and various other things, i just consider it because it always seemed odd to me, that any people would support a person who was a mass-murderer against another mass-murderer who was even worse, on the basis of racist national pride and things like that, when i hear in these alleged speeches of his that he didn't project that in the least to his people'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'really only the staunchly traditional christians that make it an issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know how the left tries to pass gay rights laws? By doing so through the courts and legislation throughout the years. The right? They often try to pass amendments repealing/banning gay rights on election years.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but he does refer to stalin's genocidal and arrogant nature in the speeches, almost like an absolute contrast'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, yeah, the Right, bigger twats when it comes to politicizing gay rights.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and there's stalin who had killed 30 million civilians in genocide, death camps and other things before ww2 started, which is referred to in that video'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both sides are guilty of pulling stunts like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Do you even pay real attention to American politics?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'american politics is dead'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is why i said there is no left and right, both sides are paid for by the same corporate interests'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Every single Republican Senator vote down gay rights every single time. It's considered a miracle and "bipartisan" if the democrats can get maybe 3 Republicans to side with them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they'll vote how they're told'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i never was racist, but i do respond to racists, i see common problems among all people as more worthy things to be for or against'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Staunchly Traditional Christians" make up, like, 90% of all American politicians (on the right at least).'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How is that better?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'similarly here in the UK, politicians vote how they're told to vote'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're still politicizing it and using it as a wedge issue MORE than the left.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well in truth, it has nothing to do with central government in the US, it's a State issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yet the Republicans passed DOMA.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doesn't that just prove that both sides are at it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How does the Republicans passing DOMA prove both sides are at it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's like two petulant children arguing over a toy'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'the supreme court of Iowa was almost completely conservative when it ruled to allow gay marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, I never said both sides aren't at it. I'm saying the Republicans do it more, worse and louder.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd be more worried about the civil war they're starting'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fact that when you brought the issue up, you pretty much blamed only teh Democrats is quiet telling.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'again, with both sides at it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Democrats aren't starting a civil war.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or about the raping of healthcare, which both sides are starting'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Democrats are in power, no?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'SOME Republicans are talking about a "cultural war" and telling people to "reload" and shit. Not the democrats.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'See if you can find a Democrat refer to the "cultural war" unless it's to mock the concept.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama is actively promoting rebellion in Syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh, you meant outside of the U.S.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama is actively trying to sign a UN arms treaty that will lead to the end of the 2nd ammendment'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The 2nd amendment is stupid. Every person should NOT have the right to own a firearm.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama is actively deploying troops around America and training them that Americans are the enemy, in violation of the constitution'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your opinion on it is irrelevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And before you parade the "It's in the constitution!" argument around, the U.S: constitution used to say the white man is entitled to own slaves.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then change the constitution legitimately'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't just ignore it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the second ammendment, the right of the populace to bear weapons, is extremely wise'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'The constitution never said that, it just didn't forbid it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when people have a party that's very bad and one that even worse, and they're split between them, what this says to them is that it's okay for them to get even worse, because people don't really care how terrible they are.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Hell are you on about now? Deploying troops around America training them Americans aer the enemy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though i live in a country without public ownership of weapons, zade, i -totally- agree'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and the UN let it slip themselves when they said "Public gun ownership threatens the legitimate power monopoly of the state"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'anything i have an opinion on i can explain how i arrived at those opinions, people can shape their own opinions for themselves, which is why i post links, and i don't claim absolutely one way or another, just comparatively for consideration - like you talk like mussolini was the atypical uzbekistan dictator cutting uterus's out of women back in his day, or ukrainian police-headmaster abusing hundreds of thousands of people per year - but i remembered one thing that didn't seem absolutely negative in that he wanted to remove corruption from power in italy, and he wouldn't have had much support if his people didn't agree with him'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The Constitution didn't use the words "slave" and "slavery", but unless you're being willfully obtuse, it's right there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the voters aren't giving them much incentive to be less evil there'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so they're all evil and world war's are started over who gets to have all the evil fun?  maybe'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the whole point of the constitution and bill of rights was to confer lasting protection for the people against a government becoming tyrannical'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's extremely powerful'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'I wish UK had it, we sorta did with Magna Carta, but as it wasn't a constitution, it's been eroded to almost nothing over time'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Nazi Germany was a legitimate power monopoly of the state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'now UK citizerns have 0 right'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The original U.S. constitution talked about "free persons" and "all others" and specified that not-free people who escape to another state cannot be freed by that state's laws.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'exactly, zade, so did USSR'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Kaddafi Libya was a legitimate power monopoly of the state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Assad Syria is a legitimate power monopoly of the state'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Castro Cuba is a legitimate power monopoly of the state'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'rabble! rabble rabble!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'murderous genocidal butcher Stalin USSR was a "legitimate' monopoly of the state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '1 UN spokesman once said that. In 2001.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's totally the creed of the UN in 2012!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's the same treaty they're trying to pass now, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm talking about the "Threatens the power monopoly..."-statement only.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Please don't use stale and misleading arguments. It wasn't the UN doing it and they certainly didn't do it recently.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the statement was given to justify the treaty'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'AND? It was ONE person.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'chemosh, one thing that everyone, from every side and political leaning I belive universally agrees with, is that Hitler WAS an absolute genius master manipulator in public speech.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In an interview.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not speaking for the entirety of the UN.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Adolf Hitler was ONE person'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's like arguing "oh, well only hitler said it was good to gas jews, but gassing jews isn't bad just because he said it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hey, Michelle Bachmann thinks gays can be cured from being gay and has said so in interviews. Obviously, ALL Republicans thing that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but even ignoring the analogies, it's a bad policy, Obama has no right going -above- the heads of congress to try and pull that'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Can you find us sources of the U.N. agreeing with that assessment? Or that that one person who said that thing that one time did it as a representative of the UN and their collective voice?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if he does, he'll likely have a revolt on his hands'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or that the UN has ever used that as an argument in official debate on the issue?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'well, gays CAN be "cured" from being gay...if they choose to'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why do we need to provide links for everything we say, Yuna? You don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, that's repression, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no it isn't, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the question is, does a particular person think that they NEED curing'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You cannot be "cured" from being gay "if you choose to".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's not something one can cure oneself of. Only something one can REPRESS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'Gods will, you know.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'male homosexuality is a psycho-social (mental disease) preference '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'they can get a lobotomy!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Hmm. You could swear Sonshi has been here just a second ago. You wonder where he went ...
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh hey, Zane's a homophobic nutjob. Surprise, surprise.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny how you specifically mentioned male homosexuality. So what is female homosexuality? Hot?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'indeed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'past a certain age, it's probably set. Sort of like your dominant hand or eye.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sepulchure peers intently at FrT.
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nah, so many guys say lesbians are hot...they're idiots...it's just the bi chix that r hot :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'successful politicians usually are abelinc, the thing that gets me is, if these are his speeches - how did he later convince people to go against everything he spoke to them?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is ALWAYS set.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no it isn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'some just like to watch...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Anyone whose sexuality truly changes was never of that sexuality to begin with.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi ducks defensively.
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Anyone whose sexuality truly changes was never of that sexuality to begin with.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'we really should ban the making of ethanol from corn.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'false.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, bullshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'things change all the time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Just as some people can delude themselves into thinking they are straight wen they are gay/bi, some can delude themselves into thinking they are gay/bi.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and get rid of the extra duties on imported sugar so that the price of it drops to the global avg in the US, and allow ethanol makers to use imported sugar.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bullshit has been called. Turn over - switch ends'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so, say, someone who likes Milk as a kid, and who doesn't like it as an adult, I guess they're repressing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a single rich male may overlord a harem -- so some lesbianism is okay among female heterosexuals in a harem'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Abelinc has 3 challenges remaining'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if they changed in adulthood, they are probably bi'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to the video 'How to brainwash a nation' by Yuri Bezmenov and Edward Griffin in 1984 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeMZGGQ0ERk he states that there are concentration camps in the soviet union as of the video'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny then how EVERY PSYCHOLOGICAL organization in the developed world agrees with me, then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'could be lying, but who knows what all went on in germany after world war 2 ended?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, again...bullshit'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sort of like how if you can change from left to right handedness without any problems, you're probably ambi'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I wish to declare shenanigans on yuna.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'just cuz you state it doesn't make it so'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade disagrees with Yuna
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it does, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Seriously? You're gonna disagree with all medical associations in the Western world?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, I don't need to disagree with them'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what is it you're disagreeing with, anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And you seriously don't think that the medical assosications of teh Westen world agree that sexuality is not something which can be changed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'since they're not disagreeing with me'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'yup. all of it. let's lump everything together.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'she's lump, she's lump'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And here I thought you possessed a modicum of logic, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you realise that western medical science is both compartmentalised and big pharma corrupt?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'plus if this man in this video is legit, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgpaKkrZex4 , then at least canada and britain have a national hero who advocated genocide, they named a arts festival after him in ontario and he helped found the london school of economics, avid stalin supporter - compare his personality to that of what's known of stalin's, and the hitler in the 2 video's'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I do, I'm not the one making unsubstantiated claims'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'there's no personal attacks in debate. it's issues.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'was he really the kind of person hitler was, or more like the enemy he taught to his people in those speeches, if they are legitimate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he had one ball, chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, the part of med that deal in expensive treatments might be corrupt, but the pure research part...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'rabble!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there are a lot of things that set in childhood, things like language, dominant hand/eye, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_and_psychology'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sure looks like it to me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'being able to truly alter these beyond the age which is sets is extremely rare.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'but able to be done.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'only rarely'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Dominant handedness (lol-word) is something you are born with.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you know people who've lost a dominant arm, you can ask them...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You can train yourself to become proficient in the use of your OTHER hand, but that doesn't change the fact that your body was born a certain way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'rarely equals that it happens.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I don't think it's something you're necessarily always born with... it sets through early childhood, probably.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, it's something you are born with. You can CHANGE it by repressing your left hand (because it's always about the left hand) and train your right hand.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But that doesn't change that your brain was different from that of a right-handed person at birth.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, lots of the older people in the world were born left-handed, but wouldn't be able to verify that with anything that their body or memory knows'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'things like language, for example. Most people will not be able to learn a completely different language to a native level in adulthood...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's completely different from which hand is dominant!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's more work, but the statement that most will not be able to is quite false'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And what Abelinc said.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'most will not make the effort to'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's friday 13th, time to go arrest some knights templar'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'because fluency isn't something that we really value'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, constant use sets the "connections" in the brain a certain way, and it develops along those lines...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'we learn what we need to, enough to get by on visits or at parties'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as a child the brain is much more malleable. Pretty hard to change these things in adulthood'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, it's not "changing", it's "conditioning".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and we leave it well enough alone at that...it's not that we're prevented/inhibited, we just don't see the cost/benefit in getting that extra 40%'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Your body is born with a certain preset. You can condition your body to be able to function in alternate ways, but your body's make-up (brain, chemistry, muscles, etc.) will still be hardwired a certain way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Dominant hand, that's something one is born with.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You can condition your right hand to function as well as/better than your left hand with enough training of your right hand and neglect of your left hand, but that does not change how your body works internally.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why would you want to? other than injury'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's kinda like dying your hair and getting a straight-perm because you were born with ginger curcs or something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'one way or another, there are certain things which are much harder or even practically impossible to change past a certain age...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'tigernuts, it was common practice for hundreds of years, up until probably 40 years ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because in certain parts of the world (Asia, for instance), it is an issue of great shame to be left-handed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, i know'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'to drum out lefties and make them conform'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'my father is a leftie'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as are two of my friends'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I have a prof who lost his right arm...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How's his left arm working out for him?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'my grandpa did everything left handed except golf...couldn't get lefty clubs when he started playing'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as it goes, i'm right handed, but able to do stuff with my left easier than my peers'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And this is why you should be ambidexstrous. I write and draw with my left hand. The rest I do with both hands with pretty much equal skill.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, he can write with it, and do most things, but it's always a struggle to get back in practice after the summer when he's not using it to write on blackboards so much...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, we "should"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I literally cannot use a computer mouse with my left hand. I simply can't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't you know, abe? Yuna and his global corporate cronies want us to all do as they say'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'not enough "repression"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in other news, I have gas, i'd better pay Al Gore some carbon tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I put watches on with my left hand, on my right hand. No matter how much I try, I fumble with it if I try to put it on the left. It basically set in childhood.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, lady at work switches her mouse buttons, that always screws people up when they go to touch her computer'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm still waiting on your brilliant rebuttal to "Why Western psychiatric/pschological associations agree that being gay is not something you can change.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'me? i didn't/am not getting involved in that argument'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'why would I rebut the "why" of their agreement, when the agreement doesn't exist'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm referring to the people who actually did get involved.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'who?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh? Find me a credible major association of either field that thinks you can change your sexual orientation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Keep in mind that fluid sexuality is not at issue here. It's changing your sexual orientation.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'all of them'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny then how Wikipedia (with sources) says otherwise.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'my aunt has Ph. D. as a psychologist. quote 'its all BS' '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no it doesn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Find where where it says it can be chanegd, then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I do wonder to what extent pollution, especially stuff like xenoestrogens, are affecting the number of kids who "set" the "wrong" way...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'find me a SINGLE major association that expressively say it can be changed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you could probably alter someone's sexual preference with hormones'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But that wouldn't be a part of psychology/psychiatry.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that wiki article starts with multiple exclamation points, then it goes on to state that they recommend counciling that "You're normal, you're OK, it's not a disease", then goes on to "But if you want to change, after I give you caveats, here is how we can go about it"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You can turn someone into a homocidal maniac with drugs. Irrelevant.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'only temporarily, unless you can find a way to actually change the brain's structure in adulthood.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'places won't expressively put out negative things about it's own subjeft.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no you can't, yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and if you could do that... welcome to my new (biological) robot army!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't mean "mainstream" drugs. I mean drugs specifically designed to mess up your brain chemistry to elicit certain behaviours.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'holy crap, drugs don't do that. '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Some people go nuts in response to certain drugs and can become homocidal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(Whether they're "mainstream" or pharmaceutical). That's how drugs work.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'generally medical types view a disease as something which actually causes problems for the individual...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'their own response. '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes, and still, no you can't...you can change propensity, you cannot "turn someone into a homicidal maniac"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'yuna....go read http://allpsych.com/journal/homosexuality.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'not psychologicaly.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also,. Abelinc, that's not what Wikipedia says at all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you probably could... not with hormones, but with something stronger...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they say effexor has the highest post-prescription suicide rate of any antidepressant, and is even being prescribed to teenagers now without the need for a psychiatric evaluation, by family doctors'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It does not say that hard-wired sexuality can change. Only that one's perception of one's sexuality can.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Chemosh, put "glaxosmithkline bribery" into google'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's possible that it amplifies the negativity in people, especially with developing brain chemistry'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'one of the issues we have to consider here is what people mean by a "cure"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm not gonna read 5 pages of text, Eureka. Break it down for me?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh yuna, back to pretending about distinctions without a difference'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'change topics, scattered arguements. '
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'll say this: Article is almost a decade old. Psychiastry and psychology is constantly evolving. Some organizations didn't join the "Cannot change" wagon 'til just a few years ago.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'can you cure something that isn't a problem? Does a superficial treatment of the symptoms count as a cure? etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no medical association has joined the "cannot change" wagon'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what you're suggesting is that psychology is subject to 'fashion''
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'no one knows yuna, even now. all 'experiments' can be skewed to the results you need'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, Abelinc, Master of Gay Studies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they have joined the "should not change", and "it's OK not to change" wagon, absolutely'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'quit personal attacking.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, Tigernuts, what I suggest is that psychology, like all scientific fields, can be wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And they correct themselves from time to time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'science, proper science, is almost never wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You smirk at his saying.
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'When it comes to theories? Yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sorry, tigernuts, that's total bunk'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'elvolving technology means that a lot of things that be believe are immutable may be changed in the future... The technology to change someone's sexuality will probably come in the era of direct brain manipulation...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'you were just backing the major institutions on their point to not change sexuality.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts winks at Drunk'ing Abel.
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'woops'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a frightening era with brainwashed armies, if we're not careful!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'physical sciences tend to be less subject to changing opinions'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as it's less open to interpretation, except at the meta-edges'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"All major national mental health organizations have officially expressed concerns about therapies promoted to modify sexual orientation. To date, there has been no scientifically adequate research to show that therapy aimed at changing sexual orientation (sometimes called reparative or conversion therapy) is safe or effective."'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Straight from the APA's website.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, and the world is flat, the sun revolves around it, etc...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'and you just said psycology could be wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'world's been round for 4000 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'thank you yuna, so you agree :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Let's see... they condemn "ex-gay" therapy, they say no form of "ex-gay" therapy has ever been proved to be effective. Sounds like "It doesn't work" to me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's not what they said...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they said exactly what I stated they said'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'but you said it could be wrong.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '" To date, there has been no scientifically adequate research to show that therapy aimed at changing sexual orientation is safe or EFFECTIVE."'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's only wrong when it doesn't agree with him'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'agreed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it does not say "it doesn't work", nor does it say "you cannot"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'FrT, the issue at hand is not whether or not they are right at this very instant. It is whether they agree with me that sexual identity is immutable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it says exactly what I stated at 15:21:14'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they did NOT say that it is immutable'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'personal i could care less about sexuality, who/where people choose to stick their utensils, provided it isn't in me, and isn't into a child, i don't care'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they said "we dunno"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'but you can't throw the right or wrong issue out when dealing with it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, you can "cure" free will too, for that matter. I suspect your definition of "cure" is not the usual one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which is what reasonable people would expect them to say'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'll go the PC route and not call it a cure, as nobody in this thread is calling it a disease or something which must be cured'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Fine, then Abelinc. They agree that there exists currently zero viable ways to change one's sexual identity through therapy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Happy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, they didn't say that'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we had 28 applications for a job vacancy, and only 1 was female, so you best start calling me sexist'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What? "To date, there has been no scientifically adequate research to show that therapy aimed at changing sexual orientation (sometimes called reparative or conversion therapy) is safe or effective."'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are you demanding they use terms like "Does not work"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'can legalized assisted-suicide along with opt-out organ donation legislation in some districts in england be severely abused?  who decide's who lives or dies?  with all the other streamlined processes i wonder just how good it'll be in the future, for people with moderate impairments or people with none at all who they see the organs of as being their only real value?  do you think there's safeguards against those corruptions which have happened in the past, even present day chinese prisoners?  considering the absence of safeguards against so much that they get away with?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'typically, I think a cure needs to involve two things... first, there must be an underlying adverse condition. Secondly, the cure has to address the root cause rather than just the symptoms.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they're quite intently NOT using terms like that, because they have NOT determined that it does not work, nor that it is not viable'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hospitals in England routinely euthenise patients, Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'for example, cutting off someone's left hand does not cure him of left-handedness...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Not effective" is quite telling...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but they're not even stating that it's not effective...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they're stating that they have not adequately studied it to determine if it's effective'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of "There exists no CURRENT method..." was too Canadian French pour vous?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, the part where that is *NOT* the crux of their statement'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I concede that they're not actually saying it's been proven that sexuality cannot be changed. They are saying that there is CURRENTLY no known effective method.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if a person is able to communicate a yes or a no themselves, able to move at all and therefore kill themselves, i don't see why they'd be legalizing assisted suicide for other than malevolent purposes - sure, some people live in pain, but why would they make it their initiative to change the law so that somebody will kill them?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the crux of their statement is "there has been no scientifically adequate research"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which, in scientific terms, is pretty much "It's not working... but we could we wrong."'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as a side note - "no evidence to support (blah)" is scientist-pc-speak for "it keeps failing our tests"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which is what I claimed, and goes against what you claimed'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe if the government provided the tools for a painless death and people who are able and want to die could use them themselves?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"To show".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's just infinite avenues for corruption and abuse'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's a muddled sentence, but it's pertty much saying "There's not enough credible research that proves there are effective ways to 'cure' 'the gay'".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're not saying that there's no enough research into the field.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nah, sonshi, not in the APA's case, in which case there's never evidence to support blah, particularly when they waffle on the topic'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you can't say that something doesn't work, because you can't tell if the effect is just too small to be observed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and the major part of their statement is just being PC and saying "don't fix them, they're not broken"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yeah, sure, whatever. Homosexuality and be changed. Praise Jebus!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if he's who you're relying on, and that's your belief of homosexuality, sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So you're saying... heterosexuality can be changed with therapy as well? With enough therapy, YOU might become gay?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'eg. If you flip a coin 100 times in 3 separate instances, and you get 54,47,51 heads, can you conclude the coin is not biased?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'At least you're consistent.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if the true mean is .5007, you'd need a much larger sample size to tell...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'of course I am'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Coin tosses are not 50/50.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which side you start the toss on determines the probabilities.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'indeed, so the only thing you can say is "there's no evidence that the coin is biased"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you can't say "the coin is fair"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'If you toss the coin with heads down, there's a larger chance of the coin landing heads up. Or the other way 'round (heads -> tails). I cannot remember.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'which is why scientists seem to waffle so much...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But the point is: It's not a true 50/50.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and when the topic being "researched" is psychological, the criteria being "measured" is measured by asking the subjects or observing the subjects...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You really think therapy (with the absence of drugs) can chance what attracts a person?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so whether someone's depression is "cured" by heroin or if they just don't care about their problems while high, which is the determination?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if anything, i think it'd be better for every single person who wants assisted suicide to appear before a jury of citizens and a panel of psychiatrists/psychologists and doctor's that know about their condition, and then their reason given or argued by a lawyer and questions by the jury or panel of professionals answered one by one, so they can see why assistance is required, what the problem is and not have a 'tax-cutting streamlined process' which has been severely abused in the early 20th century in america among other places'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'drugs have never been precluded in any of my statements...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Therapy".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but yes, people often change their likes/dislikes without external drugs'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cause there's probably some people who want to die for a little while and then don't really want to die after that while passes and things like that, it's good to evaluate whether or not the manslaughter is justificed on a case by case basis'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Therapy does not include drugs. That's medication.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '(1) like hell it doesn't, (2) "therapy" was not part of the discussion'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the ONLY discussion was "Yuna sez CANNOT CANNOT CANNOT CHANGE!!!!!!!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'anything less than 100% on that favors me'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Therapy was never a part of the discussion?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is as far back as I can go: "All major national mental health organizations have officially expressed concerns about THERAPHIES..."'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I also mentioned ex-gay THERAPHY.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, you did claim that it could be cured if they really wanted to...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No I didn't. I said it could be REPRESSED.''
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi means me'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'OIC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'which said nothing precluding any types of therapy...and drug therapy is THERAPY'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but you can't really call it much a a cure when there's no disease to begin with, you're only treating the symptoms, and the "cure" is worse than the condition.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm sorry, I was speaking of psychological and psychiatric therapy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'for some people the "cure" is not worse than the condition'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I must've gotten confused about how that automatically includes drug therapy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'psychiatric therapy also still includes drugs'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why do you guys figure lethal injection drugs are imported from europe, where bernard shaw was from?  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16281016 would it be maybe cheaper to have some of their military college harvard chemist graduates develop the drug as a civil service to the government their education was funded by?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And changing one's behaviour through constant medicination IS NOT CHANGING.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's still REPRESSION.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'phychologists don't prescribe, psychiatrists do'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, in those cases, it's usually society that makes the condition bad enough that they desire the "cure"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you don't like Bernard Shaw do you, Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You are medicating your your brain to alter your behavior to REPRESS it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nah, if that was really him in that video, and he wasn't acting but being real, then nah'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's not CHANGING your behaviour because the minute you stop taking the drugs, your body will start behaving the way it's hardwired to behave.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, to the person seeking help, whether it's society as the root cause is irrelevant'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, yeah, my argument pretty much excluded drugs from the get-go.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, nice try'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'probably... nonetheless, the root causes aren't addressed. It's not a cure, much like an asthma inhaler is a cure for asthma...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but what are the root causes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not until they can really fiddle around with the brain structure itself. A terrifying prospect?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there are generally not known root causes for much of psychiatry'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so nobody's ever psychiatrically cured of anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ultimately, it's due to something or the other in the brain, after all...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'maybe'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So now you're arguing that changing your behaviour through constant drug therapy is actual change and not simple repression?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is why nobody ever says you can be cured of mano-depression. Because you simply cannot. You can only learn to live with it, often with drug therapy. The drugs do not cure you, they do not change you. They repress your depression (usually).'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Once you stop taking them, they stop repressing your depression and you're back to where you started.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there may be circumstances in which it's possible though, but not really possible to do reliably with current tech.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sorry, with drug what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you pump a kid full of xenoestrogens from birth, I'm reasonably certain that's going to affect his mind significantly...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Psychological/Psychiatric therapy =/= Drug therapy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I made it very clear that I was talkign about psychological and psychiatric therapy only.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'psychiatric therapy *OFTEN* includes drug therapy'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'antidepressants are wack'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, even if we DO include drug therapy under the umbrella term "therapy", it DOES NOT CHANGE THE FACT THAT IT'S REPRESSION.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'your definition of psychiatric therapy is simply wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And I've argued FROM THE START that you cannot CHANGE sexual orientation, simply REPRESS it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'SSRi's are one of the biggest threats to public health'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Drugs do not change people unless they inflict permanent brain damage. They REPRESS behaviour.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as an aside, it's amusing that the ones most against sexual "deviancy" and those who are polluting the environment with mind-altering chemicals (and resisting regulation) are mostly found in the same party...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'at least in the us'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and yes, doctors have used even your definition of psychological/psychiatric therapy to change desires for a hundred years, successfully'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're not, as it goes'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except, you know, the APA says that they are not proven to actually WORK.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, REPRESSION.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna: not quite true'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So now you're saying you CAN change someone's sexual orientation simply through talk-talky therapy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'many methods for accomplishing it simply aren't legal or condoned'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You said MY definition. MY definition doesn't include bullshit methods that are illegal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I never said you couldn't, I just will not preclude it being supplemented'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'legality is largely irrelevent as it depends on jurisdiction'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if you lock someone in a basement and apply some pavlovian conditioning...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'might be illegal in 49 states though!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, that's repression.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'many asylums were quite successful in permanently changing people's desires, not just their behaviors, using very brutal therapies'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They brain will not magically start working differently.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'right, it's not magical'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You condition the brain to react in a specific way psychologically. But chemically, your brain remains the same... unless you damaged it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'not true'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the brain learns, the brain changes'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, it's not a cure, but it's a treatment... which is what abelinc really meant by his misuse of the word "cure"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'A moose once bit my sister'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it builds its pathways'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not for all things, Abelinc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, I've not been the one calling this a cure, and have actively refuted that word in this discussion'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you keep trying to push that, and you're quite misplaced'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you did say that it could be cured if they really wanted to...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you switched to discussing something else in the last half hour, I must've missed it...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '0h 25'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, yuna used cured, I responded'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No I didn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but sure, if you think that's what I've stated, you gofor it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Hey, Michelle Bachmann thinks gays can be cured from being gay and has said so in interviews. Obviously, ALL Republicans thing that.''
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think I used "cured" (with sarcastic quote marks) once and then "change" every single time after that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you didn't? fuck you'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'let's keep it christmassy'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes? I said that Michelle Bachmann thinks that. NOT THAT IT CAN BE DONE, you FUCKTARD.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if you're going lie, and then try claiming that I said it, then fuck off'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bowlathon Oladon: 'Quit with the personal attacks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'look oot! it's the rozzers!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, you should've used a different term in your response, because a cure is wrong with existing tech...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Quote me once where I claimed YOU'd used the term "cure".'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, which I stated multiple times during the discussion'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Except you just said that I used the term and then told me to fuck off. And then immediately followed it it by calling someone a liar.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you *DID* use the term. That's what started the conversation'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Funny then, what are you? I said Michelle Bachmann thinks you can be cured of homosexuality to mock Michelle Bachmann, not as an argument for and against it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sonshi was not saying who's used the word "cure" but who's used it as a term for what is and isn't possible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He or she believes you've argued that homosexuality can be cured.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'hmmm... (Debate) Abelinc: 'well, gays CAN be "cured" from being gay...if they choose to' I didn't see the bachmann comment easrlier, but saw it in my logs...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'To which you responded with "Yuna used that word", to which I replied with "No I didn't [use it as an argument]" as a response to both of you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And hey, look what Sonshi just dug up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna, sonshi's referring to the use of the term, not about which "side"'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'As an ARGUMENT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I wasn't using it as an argument but to mock Bachmann's inasnity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well okay, as long as no one really thinks it's a real cure.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'never use "reverse sarcasm" is a debate -- as the sarcasm shall likely be ignored, and you may be credited with supporting the that which you later attempt to deny you supported -- too late by then'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yuna: sonshi's current thread is that "cure" (whether or not change is possible) is wrong because it's not a disease/condition that is wrong to be fixed'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'While Abelinc doesn't use the term, he certainly thinks homosexuality can be permanently changed, with or without drugs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I made those very same comments earlier, yet sonshi decided to believe that I'm CALLING it a cure because it's a disease'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and also that the underlying difference in structure cannot be fixed by current tech.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and to that, I will vehemently respond with the statements that were actually made, rather than what was interpreted'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Abelinc used "cure" in quotes after Yuna quoted Michelle Bachman is support of a cure'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'by use of the Yuna practice of gainsay extrapolation: bipartisan Yuna likely unwittingly believes a cure is possible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'thanks zade, we covered that :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i wrote a lengthy email to my MP about the Draft Communications Bill and the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Bill'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'abe, go shout at your mp about the comms bill!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the bigger the noise, the better'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'what's MP?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well my MP is George Freeman, but I guess you'd need to shout at your own'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'member of parliament?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'aye'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yeah, I don't have one of those :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you guys have a SOPA replacement coming up, best bewarey of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, 2 year german bonds are now paying negative .5 %'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'denmark actually has a negative nominal rate on some deposits. Charging people for the privilege of depositing with them'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're not alone'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'start of the end'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, hundreds of years ago, banks used to charge you for deposits, not the other way around.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'that was back when people used precious metals as money, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'over 150 years ago, the first banks owned by sole props paid 2% interest to depositers to get them to deposit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when you try to make your currency as solid as tangible assets like gold, this is what happens...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the first banks in the US owned by 1 person that is...in small and medium sized towns paid interest to get people to join...the small banks then loaned that money to other people at higher rates of interest...and the spread was kept....imagine that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'banks used to provide physical safety'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, banks started paying interest about the same time as countries started using paper money'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if you didnt pay your $100 loan back, you would lose your farm which was used to secure the loan in the first place.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in hindsight, moving away from the gold standard and allowing fractional reserve banking was a mistake'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'used to be that if you wanted to keep your gold with the medicis, they'd charge you for it, AND they'd lend it out for interest.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but now, banks do not earn money from loaning out money....they make money from fees charged on holding your money, and from credit cards, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'which is why the amount of mortgages is down 50% since 2008, because banks realize fees is how they can make safer profits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the main reason why mortgages are down is because banks have stopped lending 50k to people without jobs, among other things'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, you realise that the mortgage bubble was all a big deliberate fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'merely the natural result of some measure of sanity returning to the market after that massive market failure'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, it was an uncoordinated fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I wouldn't say it was deliberate...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'actually, the mortgage bubble was intentional.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'look at what paul krugman said in the run up'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, exactly'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'he said we needed another bubble to replace the last one'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not like the banks lost out when the debts went bad, is it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the way it happened was that banks realised it could sell the mortgages to unsuspecting investors who swallowed these up, with ratings assigned by raters who had little understanding of statistics'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'and greenspan agreed - he slashed interest rates in 2001.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'so they just lent money to everyone with a warm body who walked in through their doors, then sold them to people who did not have a clue where the mortgages came from'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'you mean to o tell me that the bank ceos had no idea what was going on?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'of course they did'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'unbelievable'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'krugman did warn about this 6 years or so back, along with other major economists, but no one was listening at the time'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'too busy enjoying the bubble'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'i'm not just saying he warned about it - he called for the bubble. he said that there was a lack of aggregate demand, and that the fed needed to slash interest rates to cover the demand'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'interest rates didn't cause the bubble...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'banks lending money to people who didn't have jobs, and investors willing to buy the debt with no clue where they came from, did.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'of course they did. you think in a free banking system, banks could have given out 1-2% ARMs with no money down?'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it really didn't matter if the interest rate was 1% or 50%, if they had no intention or ability to repay the debt'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'that's not a sustainable practice for any period of time in a free market. the banks get run on way sooner. the cheap money came from somewhere - the federal reserve'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's supply and demand, you see... and the people buying the mortgages mostly didn't bother to check the quality'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'the real blowup happened when ARMs reset. people could actually pay the 2% interest rate, but they couldn't pay 6%.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'what you're saying is true'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'but it's a symptom of the underlying problem, which was cheap credit from the fed'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'people with no jobs can't even pay 2% though... the quality of the debt was really terrible...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'even with plenty of credit, if market participants do the legwork, there should not be any severe problems'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you guys need to end the Fed'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'plenty of countries have been running low interest rates for years or even decades with no significant ill effects'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'you can't build a a market on the honor system. risk is an adequate counter balance to greed, but if you try to take away the risk, don't be surprised when greed spirals out of control'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'lol. like japan? we'll see how long they can pull that off'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'low interest rates here are causing real-terms decreases in wealth, wages, and living conditions'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'japan has been running low interest rates for decades, for example, and somehow they still have persistently low inflation...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'japan, for instance, has mostly internal debt, and savings rates to support it'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'U.S. saving rates are garbage. we're eating through our seed crop right now. the u.s. is nothing like japan.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, the savings is coming largely from the upper class... they have very high savings rates'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'sure. but look at the u.s. even poor people have credit cards'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'in order to deleverage, there needs to be some transfer between the classes, but that's not going to go down too well...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'you simply can't build an economy on debt'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if there was a significant redistribution of weath, it is not likely that the poor would borrow as much... one result of an unbalanced economy is that the wealthier segments have more savings than normal, which translates into more credit available for lending...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'addressing the gap would help create economic incentives to deleverage...'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'one might also notice that countries with a more balanced distribution tend, on average, to have less of a credit problem... I suspect the causality runs that way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'this is especially true in larger countries, where it more closely resembles a closed system. Smaller, open countries can avoid many of the constraints of a closed system'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer!'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I need to stop mischanning this channel.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Buffy the Ass Slayer'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'leave my donkeys alone....:('
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Let the right one in.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, I gave two.'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Buffy can buff my vampire any time :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-13.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Buff my stake" would've been better.'
T3/r7/2012-07-14.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Amy and what's-his-face did not live in Sunnydale.'
T3/r7/2012-07-14.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'a 76 year old won the $4.6 million megabucks slots in las vegas in 1989....then at age 92, he won the $21 million megabucks slots in las vegas in 2005....the only two time megabucks slots winner ever.'
T3/r7/2012-07-14.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'he died 6 minutes later?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'a natgas field discovered off the coast of mozambique is estimated to have around 60 trillion cubic feet of gas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'hmm, makes you think that the supplied of natgas approaches infinity :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'supply*'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'another fine day'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wonder how more we'll have before the takedown'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'groan, people are thick'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'someone on BBC HYS harping on about how it is great that Tahrir Square is controlled by the workers'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they seem to have missed the fact that the Muslim Brotherhood got into power, not the workers'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'The Muslim Brotherhood will never rule Egypt while the military is still being funded by Western powers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'as diablo forums would suggest... need more authenticator on muslims leaving their "breeding grounds"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they will have power, Hiliary Mussolini Clinton is actively promoting it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they fit right in with her nazi doctrine'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'pointless view... all politicials are a failboat its very rare to see a compitent person in charge that actually goes anywhere and not gets stomped by fat old farts who think candle is a keen invention'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'politicians*'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not convinced of the whole technology argument'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'political ideology doesn't have a lot to do with technology'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'not the point'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'freedom is freedom, tyranny is tyranny'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'technology just changes the topology of the battlefield'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'alters the natures of some of the fights'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'most of our dear senate and rep house are old farts that serve no purpuse there... except maybe keeping chairs warm'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'was having an interesting chat with a friend the other night about how the descent into the police state this time is different thanks to technology'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'heh its easier and less visible'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and how the technology and it's "selling to the public" are obfuscating that descent'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'there are cameras/logs/tabs everywhere... and people dont know/care about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'you cant take a piss w/o somebody knowing about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well yeah, and you can say that to think it was planned and people say that's ac onspiracy theory'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but planned or not, CT or not, it's happening'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'drive a bus over a cliff, people die, whether you did it deliberately or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'yep... and people are either in denial thinking its for their own good or just dont care'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'i think this is exactly how it was depicted in 1984/callocain/brazil etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, useful idiots liek Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are a whole bunch of books from the 1920s through to the 1960s that accurately predicted the effects of technology on society'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama seeks to criminalise people for websites/blogs/emails that contain hyperlinks to websites containing copyright-infringing material'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Republicans in congress are already contemplating criminalising the practice of journalism'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Good thing obama can't make laws then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Dafuq. In Michian in 1999, a man was charged with "obscenity". The crime? "Swearing in front and women and children". He actually had to show up to court for that shit. He didn't even yell at them, his canoe overturned and swore into the air. The Hell is wrong with some people (the people who charged him)?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the corporate lawyers quell civilian individuality while ignoring their advertising and things?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's part of stalinism'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh, apparently, he was CONVICTED. An appeal's court saw reason and threw out the decision, though. What a bunch of fuckwits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Michigan taxpayer money at work, people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you think that's offensive, armed and dangerous monsanto henchment cross-pollinate fields of non-paying farmers themselves and then go to court where the judge always rules in their stalinism favour'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they even burn down people's barns and things in saskatchewan'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the police investigations can't link 2 crimes within a week as being corporate arson, cause russia's bottomless bank account says so'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Brilliant, now Monsato is Russian.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'watched a video on aljazeera the other day about 'putins money' which had a former city counsellor from st.petersberg show signed documents as proof of misdirected aid money and stuff, which is stalinism, and she died a week later'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'claims he's the richest man in europe and possibly earth'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that sort of thing happens across the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'happens in America too'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'happens in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'Defines African politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the fact it happens everywhere doesn't justify it, but just wanted to reinforce what you already knew that it's a myth that it's something that only happens in 'bad' countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, research stalin and look at his strategies and methods, he's not much different than the media monsters and land-grabbing corporations'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's why i think of him whenever i see things like b.p getting christmas bonuses for awesome performances the year of gulf oil spill'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or various small farmers being sued out of their land by monsanto, who the judge never goes again'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'st*'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or Merck being fined $3bn for making $127bn profit off vaccines that had their efficacy/safety tests faked?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'This is a public service announcement: Please stop engaging conspiracy theorists in "debate". It's not going to end up well for either side.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or was it GSK being fined $3bn for bribing doctors? i forget, so many bribary cases involving large corps now'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'yuna, we would have to completely remove this channel'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Libor scandal was conspiracy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you should be supoprting this, yuna, when corporations have financial clout on the same order of magnitude, or higher, than the countries they operate in, then the free market system breaks down'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as a trendy lefty you should know this'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'another fun one is the government turning the police into pimps as it turns various neighbourhoods in canada into red-light districts of amsterdam ww2 propaganda'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna got some 'relevent non-conspiracy' issues he wants to bring up?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(that are vaguely important?)'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or how about pornography conspiracy, prostitution is illegal but after they challenged the porn industry, the kgb's demoralization strategy demanded that they allow for porn'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not just a Stalinist ideal to ban everything they find objectionable (except for the objectionable things that they themselves might want to engage in)'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the people who direct and organize the industry of demoralization are millionairres and billionairres who then buy all the other industries on earth, like cocaine dealers'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ukraine's what happens when you turn the police into stalinist pimps and stuff, but the government of canada's smarter than ww2'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok, so they're just plain old trash that should have been the victims of the last 100 years of genocide, that's understandable, as is their black magic brainwashing turning somebody else into the fuel for the future furnaces'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's a shame for anyone who lives in rural USA. If you allow UN Agenda 21 to go through, which Bush and Clinton have already signed off on without Congress approval.... you won't be living there for many more years, you'll have your property rights revoked and the land essentially stolen from you'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which is what they did in the 1930's in the ussr'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'those who don't read up on the mistakes of history are doomed to repeat them'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'exhibit one'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts points excitedly at Summoner Yuna!
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '-'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"Generally, more highly educated people, who have higher incomes, consume more resources than poorly educated people, who tend to have lower incomes. In this case, more education increases the threat to sustainability"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do you agree with racism?  part of the reason why obama pledges 4 billion in african infrastructure, might be related to this article about mining companies operating in zimbabwe required to be 51% owned and operated by black zimbabwean's, not white zimbabweans'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so of course that might be part of a bribery initiative and a yearly homage to a racist nation in the future'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'is one of the reasons school curriculums are being dumbed down, especially with Maths'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck aer you talking about? It's the LESS educated who consume more. Unless we're talking about the truly rich who own their own private planes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because native there probably means what native american means, doesn't matter where you're from'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sorry Yuna, the UN disagrees with you'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and old a global social scale, they're right'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The less educated drive less fuel efficient cars because of ignorance and being unable to afford better cards. The poor and lazy (in the U.S.) also refuse to eat healthy foods.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can use the same argument to say that "more intelligent people drive new Prius hybrids because they're fuel efficient and environmentally friendly"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'china's eager acceptance of their conditions might cause america to convert to racism to compete in africa?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oblivious to the fact that the fabrication process of batteries in the Prius alone will cause more pollution than will be saved by the car in it's entire life.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Wasn't that basically what I just said, Chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'of course, if you wanted ecologically friendly products with minimum airmiles, you'd think governments would actively support and promote home-grown foods, farmers markets, food collectives, and local industry, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Are they actively taxing them more?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'actively shutting them down'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In what country?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And on what grounds?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sustainability and pollution and stuff, the whole system was intentionally worked to be unsustainable in the last 50 years - as an example, farmers used to have grain elevators within 10-20 miles of their crops, = less fuel for transport = a locomotive can travel 100 miles on 1 litre of fuel, and flour?  now they send it all 400 miles away to be processed, various other things, they found it's cheaper to move the gears of the industry further away from it's source resulting in higher fuel consumption'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'or rather, in what states?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just about anything they can possibly find, Yuna'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'predominantly California, but others too'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we already had considerable legislation in the UK that made local food co-ops impractical'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Then it's not a government problem, it's a state problem.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so you either buy the antibiotic infested crap from the supermarkets or you go hungry'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, yuna, it's being ENFORCED by the FEDS'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'locomotives can't travel 100 miles on a litre of fuel.  Maybe 100 ton-miles, but not 100 miles.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are all kinds of jurisdictional arguments going on at the moment in the US, it's quite interesting'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'right now Arizona is embroiled in a fight with the national government because the national government refuses to do anything with illegal aliens that Arizona state troopers arrest'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'on a empty load i read in national geographic CP engines can'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sounded impossible to me too, but i read it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'you read wrong, then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Texas was threatened with an air embargo when they initially voted not to allow TSA workers to grope children and women's genitals at airports in Texas'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'or they wrote wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'they meant ton-miles'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the Obamacare might push some states over the edge, and for everyone's sake over there, I hope it does'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Nice, Tigernuts.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i heard latino-american's in las angeles bleeding-heart calling for death to the white - race'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they have alot of listeners too, and with more and more immigrants, probably have more and more support from the federal government to eradicate them'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I see the Republican spirit runs strong in you. "I hope Obama fails so we can play the hero". How about you hope his policies work so you get a better country?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the states are much in the same position that the UK is with EU'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they won't work, they're not designed to work'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he only needed come and ask the Brits about the specifics of implementation of national healthcare, ask the old-guard left wing here about how things are now, and they'd say DON'T DO IT LIKE THAT!'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how come john f kennedy was the last president to notice misappropriation of aid-funding to haiti, and his successor's started it up again?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'says on papa doc's wikipedia page that he claimed to have placed a voodoo curse on jfk, after the assassination'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some say JFK was the last independent US president'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they say lee harvey oswald was a communist/stalinist black military officer'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'he defected to russian ideologies, which america was using haiti to combat'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'LHO was involved with some kind of plot down in New Orleans regarding vaccines'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a book about it somewhere, forget the name'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"Dr Mary's Monkey" by Ed Haslam'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'check it out though: http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/peopleandpower/2012/04/2012418859194318.html In search of Putin's money - if you're interested, it doesn't say how the woman died a week after talking about her documents from st.petersbourgh'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'does mention the kgb and stuff in it though, oil companies that exxon does business with/trades contracts'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i've been trying to figure out who's in charge of what i hate in the world by studying the past, and while i don't have any absolute answers i don't give it all to racists at least'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'another interesting video's about this emerald czar in colombia, it's just amazing to see like 50-100 million bucks worth of emeralds sittin in front of the guy on the video nonchalantly'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'tbh, that Putin had vast fortunes, probably garnered from fraud or crime, went withotu saying'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'he claims to have stayed away from narcotics and things though, seems like a reasonable guy from the video'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'narcotics get a bad press'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read on bbc or aljazeera documentary that russian officials extort businesses there and abroad for upwards of 200 billion dollars per year'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and that's before whatever legitimate money they make from their (non) communist crown corporations'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well from wikileaks, russia is essenially a mafia-state. I don't think anyone was surprised'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'read about shares in india crown oil corporation being given it in south america by russia too, so seems these corporations are a chain of command much like communism'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, poor russians'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and other states are becoming more and more like mafia states every day'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'apart from Sweden'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'indefinite detention without trial of 'terror suspects''
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what constitutes terrorist and why do they require no jury evaluates the situation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'easily abuseable, especially in the future with the legislation already there'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they don't give jury trials here for many local courts'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we have stop/search without a warrant'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sounds like that communist gulag going around and finding some drugs that aren't there on the political opponents/undesireables'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and they're about to start recording every txt, email, skype, web visit, search entry, for a year'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read about that on bbc the other day, they claim upwards of 80% of people charged in russia of drug-related offenses, have those drugs planted on them after detention by the police'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and then who investigates the police?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'again, that's not limited to Russia, happens in the US too'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, rotten lies for laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'with american population spending 20 dollars per day on taxes, the government makes over 25 billion dollars'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how much of all of that is readily available for sourcing and seeing exactly how it's spent?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how peoples taxes are spent seems a democratic concern, doesn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'read up on Frank Serpico for details of institutional involvement of polics with pushing drugs'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'god damn welfare bums'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, monitoring the internet's something ethiopea does pretty good, so i guess it's best that everybody else looks for political opponents on their chinese government internets, nevermind actual corrupt people'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, i do my bit to wind them up, https everywhere, use startpage not google'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'when the law comes in, i'll start using a 3rd party web proxy'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '1929-1939 stalin genocides people (dekulakization) who have moderate property, promising people with less than moderate property that they will be employes of stalin after the holocaust, then he starves employees of stalin to death in holodomor cause he had a surplus supply of them (industrialization, automation, outsourced), then he genocides anybody who has anything bad to say about his wisdom (great purge) searching for political opponents, dissidents of his glory and volatile opinions, also censoring foreign media so that his version of the outside world is the only one they see'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which is maybe not just limited to stalinism, but some older trend of the world?  i guess'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but, that's what i see in the world today, conspiracy or not it's written in history and seems to be repeating itself'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's what i picked up anyways, how come entire governments don't look for those trends in theirselves?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think it will require people like Yuna being subjected to arbitrary police brutality and checkpoints demanding "papers", and people randomly being disappeared before he'll bring himself to admitting it is happening'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the public is absolutely uneducated into stalinism, while it's taught about nazi and other things'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it isn't educated into the origins of naziism either'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'grandparents maybe included russian ww2 survivor crimes in their school curriculum's, but lately?  i never heard of it except on the hollywood movie 'stalin''
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and in 1982 or so they made a memorial to holodomor victims in edmonton'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a very good reason they don't teach origins and reasons for things like nazi germany'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it would lead to some uncomfortable truths'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'think about it, there's 5 million or so jews in america and maybe 1 million in canada, but there is probably over 10 million ukrainian immigrants in america and 3-5 million in canada, and the history of the suffrage of the jews is taught in school, and negro's to majority white european immigrant descendents who were not responsible for black slavery, but nothing to do with holodomor/great purge/dekulakization'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is that some kind of .. what exactly?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'educational history racism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'inequality measurement?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how come they don't teach it all, if it's a thing of the past?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'according to amnesty international i guess it might not be'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nice, democratic canada -> A new report says arcane rules are keeping MPs in the dark about the billions in government spending they should be scrutinizing.  http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/07/15/parliament-mp-costs.html 'memorandum of understanding' Memorandum Of Understanding On Bilateral Cooperation In Private Sector Industrial Research & Development http://www.agr.gc.ca/cb/index_e.php?s1=n&s2=2012&page=n120502 and http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/05/08/pol-peres-ottawa-cp-tuesday.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not only are the people who pay the taxes oblivious to where is the 25 billion per day spent, even the politicians they elect are'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'from their closed-source political spectrum'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, yes, Canada is a communist Hell. Be quiet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what to do, Chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nothing to do'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're the almighty god of earth'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna won't solve it, he's being paid off by them'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you could solve it by passing some gay rights legislation, Chemosh, that usually helps, or banning home schooling'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ah right, the things that really matter'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'everybody should feel affected by those issues, at least education - who doesn't want a unithink communist nation?  conform or be great purge'd'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's understandable that some home-schooling might be actually pretty negative, but i think in general parents make better teachers than strangers working for stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, Chemosh, you should be glad - spiralling unemployment, erosion of property rights, everyone to live in a box provided by the state, restricted on what they can eat, drink, consume, say or think'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but that's fine provided gay marriage is called "marriage" and not "civil partnership"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because words are important, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tiger Nuts, there's almost not a single jurisdiction where civil partnership gives all of the rights and responsibilities as marriage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'does here'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's why it was invented'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No, it was invented as a compromise.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it was invented to afford gay couples identical legal rights to heterosexual married couples'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You mean British civil partnership, not the concept of civil partnership.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, i mean british civil partnership'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, if it''
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, if it's just the same thing, why not just make marriage gender-neutral? Why make it separate but equal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because the british state is entwined with the church of england'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But you see, that's not true equality. "The church says so" is not a valid reason.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, no, they're not entirely legal. For some idiotic reason, civil partnership ceremonies cannot include religious readings, music or symbols. The Hell?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a whole different question. legally they have the same status'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if i had to guess, i would say that the omission of the word "marriage" was to try and avoid the inevitable storm of protests from religious groups, similar to what Germany is going through with it's ban on circumcisions'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 's'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if the sum total of your dissent with it is ownership of the word "marriage", then there's a far smaller real issue than you think'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Apparently, same-sex adoption rights for couples is not yet equal in Northern Ireland because of their separate laws governing adoption. So not entire equal yet in the British Isles.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a jurisdictional issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But I've never really criticized the issue of gay marriage in the U.K., now have I?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Simply that the U.K. does not yet have full equality. A gender-neutral marriage statute would go a long way to achieve that, shitstorms from religious groups be damned. The Church acts like they invented the concept of and word "marriage". They didn't, so they should just STFU.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) /2.M.F.L Justa: 'who did \'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'an intolerant attitude if ever i heard it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, aren't heterosexual couples barred from civil partnership for some reason?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not afaik'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I think I read about a British couple who wanted to  get a civil partnership a year or so ago but couldn't.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Wikipedia: "A civil partnership is a relationship between two people of the same sex"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read about a brother/sister who weren't allowed to get married in the netherlands or germany'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they found out they were related later on'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bum darts is socially acceptable but incest.. i don't know'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It is literally separate but not equal. Only heterosexuals can get married and only gays and lesbians can get civil partnerships.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're basically saying "You're gay, so you can have this thing which is JUST like marriage. But it's separate!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that's disgraceful, don't worry about warmongers stirring up ethnic/religious cleansing in Syria! Some weirdo's couldn't get a civil partnership!'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And no heteros can get it because it was specially made JUST for you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's a stupid debate. "There's this and that going on, so we shouldn't be concerned about these other things."'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you should probably listen to the people involved'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in poll after poll when asked about this, gay co-habiting and civil partnered gay people in this country said "couldn't give a flying shit" about not being "married" '
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What, they demand that every single country in the world spend all of their politician's time and power on helping them and doing absolutely nothing else?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'most considered themselves married regardless'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it's any comfort, i feel the same way about proposed reform of House of Lords'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '1) Sources? 2) if they considered themselves married, then that means they want to BE married. But they can't have that word.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'utterly pointless, nobody cares, wouldn't change or improve a thing, and is an entirely politicaly driven scheme and a waste of time'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is it a major problem? No. But the fact that it's a problem to begin with is laughable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i wouldn't want to get involved in an ongoing dispute in the real world, so i won't go so far as to call her "an embodiment of the absolutely worst stereotypes of the abuses that women inflict on reasonable men"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The heck are you talking about now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'trying to hold two debates at once'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'You're not a woman are you, Yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it would explain a few things'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how is 'madonna swastika faces lawsuit' top news?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if it's a freedom of speech/expression land which isn't a government institution?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because oddly swastikas are bad'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because French extremists are touchy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'big deal, if she was defaming stalin now, that would be news'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The lawsuit is not because she used a swastika, it's that she super-imposed it on Marine Le Pen, leader of a pretty much neo-nazi French party.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i see swastika's all over south park cartoons and adolf hitler fornicating with satan in hell, what's the touchy issue about defaming people with the swastika?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, top news where? On MTV.com and other celebrity/music-based blogs, webpages, TV channels, etc.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read about jewish people calling anybody who disagrees with their synagogue-think democracy a anti-semetic, they don't make top news for calling people who disagree with them nazi's, whether or not alleged nazi's had ancestors who fought against hitler in ww2'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, the fact that she MIGHT face a lawsuit doesn't mean it won't immediately me thrown out of court upon first review.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The question is rather: Why are you making a big deal out of non-news?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because they put it there like gay marriage is the most pressing issue in <insert nation here> for the purpose of mind-control, and that's what i think it's for'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Again, who are "they"? MTV.com? NME?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what issue would you like to bring up, then, Yuna?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'WHO is making this "top news" besides celebrity and/or music-centric organizations?''
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'mtv's actually protected by homeland security in america, part of the memorandum's of understanding'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as all the major casino's in las vegas meet once a month with israeli special forces according to cities of the underworld'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I wouldn't bring up what's obviously NOT top news and complain that CERTAIN people are reporting on it as if it were top news.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that was a productive answer. Would you like another go? :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He's absically complaining about MTV making a big issue out of something that happened to Madonna. You don't say? Shocker!'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bbc news, cbc news are 2'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i imagine if you go on aljazeera you'll even find it there'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They are REPORTING ON IT, not making it top news.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'aljazeera mostly lost it's credibility 4 yeras ago when the original news stopped coming and they began repeating after all of the others'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You don't seem to understand how news web portals operate. Oftentimes, the top listed pieces of news are the LATEST pieces of news.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'alice cooper's department of youth, and cheech marin's reference to serving 6 years in post-ww2 germany in born in east la might be real'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and bieber, what a star?  much publicity for some purveyors of public empathy'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and with stalinism running rampant in the world, why not twist the ideological significance of it's only opponent in the last 100 years to become the enemy of stalin's victims, so that people have to work away from opposition internally, as pop culture demands such things?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's why i think the mein kampf and things are getting so much media these days, in a documentary released by a soviet film-maker in the 1960's portray's slaves painstakingly piecing together hitler's book in labour facility's - stalin had lots of those'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or maybe the b'nai b'rith quoting evidence supplied by the kgb against citizens of your country, while on the flipside having russian jews fraudulently collecting holocaust survivor funding in new york and toronto according to recent media?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Government officials say rather than funding Equal Justice for All, it will give money directly to individuals who want to appeal. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/story/2012/07/15/sk-equal-justice-advocacy-funding.html not saying they're saints but, all it takes is people's unawareness of their rights and then they have none'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the government will be like a police officer questioning a minor without the consent of their parents, getting themselves a testimony that the child under duress gives, guilty or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people under the illusion that ukraine hundreds of thousands of police abuses per year is never possible where they are, like the lacrosse female team taking nude calendar photo's for a 'good cause' in vancouver'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'inherited from stasi kgb germany soccer fantatics'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''irrefutable evidence' isn't evidence in the court of world war 2 stalinism democracy lies, does logic imply some connection between here and there?  hell no, is it even racism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'movie's 'Stalin' and 'Enemy at the Gates' shows what alot of them was fighting for, if they hesitated they were shot by their commanding officer, such deep thinking heroes, but it's not all their fault if they fought for their enemy'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'can we disband the UN already?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Sure, after they declare Ben-Hur to be the greatest film to have ever been made.....the 1959 version.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the united nations afghanistan efforts didn't calculate into the costs of maintaining stability/training and infrastructure the oil resources that were given to petro-china, instead asking for all member nations to donate upwards of 100 million per year'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how much for a bunch of 'peace corps' servicemen/apprentices to set up the oil infrastructure on the standard serviceman salary and have the resource sales fund the programs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'should disband them, they're a bunch of crooks'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Afghanistan has no oil, they have gold,silver,copper,diamonds,iron ore,uranium,nickel, and lots of other kinds of minerals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they have opium'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok then, but i read on bbc news that petro china won the oil contracts for afghanistan'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'since UN took control of the opium fields, afghanistan's largest export to teh west'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It is estimated that the total ore value in Afghanistan is worth over $20 trillion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'even if they have no oil, the mineral resources could be funding the un-programs instead of given to people who are already filthier rich than 99.9% of the world combined'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GQ Bully Zibest: 'we should keep no question asked. cheney said it's good to his economy, and we do trust our ex-formal-vice-president'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'asking for un-memberstates to give out their yearly welfare salary instead of making their efforts pay for themselvs and then some'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you patriots out there, get onto your congress and senate members to tell them to stop Obama signing away your guns to the UN without even consulting congress'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that Madonna story is weird. Why would Marine Le Pen have any justification for a civil action?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'what story was that?  That intentional topless thing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as part of her show was an image showing Marine Le Pen (Far Right National Front party leader) with a swastika imposed on her face'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i guess it hurts her to be reminded that she's a nazi-alike'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'threatens to undo years spent trying to detoxify the brand of far right politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but just like when they renamed the Eugenics Society, shit still sticks'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'a person being labelled a nazi, especially at a public event like a concert, has the right to contest the sterotype of her with the ideological only-genocidal political group in the last 100 years, that's true'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but why the publicity stunt in the first place?  why is it top news instead of things like police rape and execute another 10,000 people in michael jacksonville in the soviet ukraine?  that blanket of the media's all i'm thinking of, it's not just limited to if you're interested in what kind of stunts the pop-stars are up to'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, i don't mind, the more media attention nazis get, the more chance people might start noticing that many countries are going that way right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'mainstream media is irrelevent now.  Even the Obama administration knows this and is playing to it with the masses.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'better than torpid nonsense reality tv and crap'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'listen to adolf hitler speech on youtube video's, 'Hitler declares war on Poland' look up the things he mentions, and 'Adolf hitler, the man they call the devil' - then compare to the actual devil in the world in Stalinism, which was victorious and had allied support in world war 2, including in lenin's book according to youtube video 'the origins of terror' the totalitarian control of atrocity / terrorism and the police who make it happen, remember who came out on top in world war 2, and you think the nazi's are any impact on modern politics, or just something that the allies did in the 1930's?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'calling people nazi on allied media is probably a way to make sure that the allied groups of real-ideological nazi's are never removed from power'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'like, the Obama people are all "Hey, Romney's...." and factcheck.org is "Uh, no he's not.  Stop telling lies, dude!" and the Obama people just outright ignore it to reinforce the lie some more.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or else they fit into what the people who think the common thoughts about nazi's think of what their group is up to, which isn't always 'nazi germany''
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think it's an issue if they try to undermine groups of people who aren't the genocidal nazi understanding, by likening them to nazi's in pop-culture idol's, but it's also freedom of expression if their understanding is that the surviving stalinism doesn't really exist like it killed 30 million+ since 1929 (possibly closer to 300 million), instead considering nazi's as the people who did what stalin did'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they see the soviet trends in that woman's political party, misunderstanding it as naziism, then there you go - but still it's a question why a pop-star would make worldwide international headlines (being mostly unpopular for the last 25 years) with her stunts'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but i doubt very much that anybody who's politics even resembles adolf hitlers would ever even be able to have a political party anywhere on earth'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'stalin's though, and stalin's version of adolf hitler - sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'says on the news around new years that russian men who are above organized criminals and the law order the patronage of hollywood stars and all kinds of famous people at their new years parties worth tens of millions of dollars, so maybe madonna works for them'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'says on that one video 'how to brainwash a nation' that over 80% of the kgb's effort was in ideological subversion and brainwashing people, and things like the top news story being madonna's labelling of a group of people as nazi might be part of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'who's the american hero hugh heffner work for?  the non-kgb stalinism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hugh heffnor works?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i see hollywood as a giant brainwashing factory'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'kgb's stalin invention 'stasi' in germany even retired into german government, cause obviously kgb doesn't exist as it took over russian government, and everybody knows that politically correct people will support what their kgb/stasi government tells them about, including what constitutes a nazi being all the crimes them themselves carried out, inventing nazi scapegoats without pointing out the superior politics of their stalin governments in comparison to what world war 2 was all about, it's just a genocide identifier?  ok then, but your kgb/stasi governments come from stalin who ordered the death of over 30 million people'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how come the government doesn't teach people about what the politics of world war 2 was so that people don't see a swastika and think of the only devil on earth?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'WW2 by itself can fill up an entire year's worth of credits.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as taught considering all available information including public speeches by hitler, which were blacked out of stalin's ussr in the movie 'stalin' and aren't taught in modern history studies in allied nations?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'a swastika they must have been the devil of devil's, but if stalin was pure good and hitler was pure evil, how come the victorious world is pure rotting?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i have yet to hear the speech by hitler declaring that jews are the enemy of germany'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but if it's out there, then it'd be useful to show the developments that caused the german people to undertake the actions that followed, wouldn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'including what genocider stalin was already doing and how hitler used that to justify his own orders?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'wasn't Stalin the probie in that relationship?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'alot of the history and 'proof' i seen seems far too ostentatious compared to the reasoning i heard in hitler's speeches, he didn't seem like a glory hog demanding all are his slaves like stalin did'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'assuming those speeches aren't fabrications'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why is Obama harassing people 100miles inside the border, yet closing a bunch of actual border checkpoints?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and it's a real indicator of stasi influence in canada, since i'm obviously concerned over things that don't affect me or my government, that the national female lacrosse team has naked photographs in a calendar in vancouver for a 'good cause' of hugh heffner beautiful celebrations, a year after german's female soccer team did the same under the non-direction of their kgb stasi government'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'playing the entire world for fools, and that's what they're doing'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there in their nuclear armed righteousness'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's why sometimes i wonder why they don't just get nuclear war overwith as the eventual end of the absence of nuclear war is death anyways, there's a chance of survivors if the proper warpigs are destroyed isn't there?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but it's probable that the nuclear aresenals all over the world are controlled by teh same people'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'nuclear warheads don't move fast enough to avoid vaporizing everything on the planet via mutual response.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'http://www.virtualteen.org/forums/showthread.php?t=145127'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so do you agree that circumcision is abuse if the cult-member doesn't opt-into it consciencously, or should the parents be able to continue on their way regardless of the religions their kid chooses, or has lots of health benefits (and only in the cast of) or a little of both?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they are slicing a piece of flesh off of somebody in the name of god, which seems a little barbaric, especially when considering jesus didn't advocate the circumcision of the flesh and the story of moses and rebekkah where it became standardized?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't know, i'd wonder why god requires people's genitals to be mutilated to please his holiness for one thing, but medical reasons seem ok'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'usually blood-sacrifices and stuff were for demon-worship'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I'm kind of so and so. Circumcision for religious purposes I think is stupid but only because I'm not religious. But religious or not, the parents are rarely risking for willing benefits. I guess you could say I'm in for doing better for my kid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'But doing it for religious purposes I'm just like "What that's stupid."'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'Thou shalt not worship false idols!'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Blood sacrifices? lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, they do it in nepal and africa and some other places still, (beyond circumcision), but circumcision seems like blood-sacrifice to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'You live in Africa?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'no, but i read about / heard about some of their cultural peculiarities on the news and documentaries and random searching'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Well I don't know. I may say yes to circumcise my kid but again I may say no and ask him in the later future. If he says that he wants it then that's also risking a painful recovery from it instead of only a few days if I did it when he was a baby. If he says no, he's risking more being uncircumsiced.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum shrugs helplessly.
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'What about you Chemosh. Go sign up on the forums and tell them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and as a cultural practice, if you were to remain in an city of israel or jerusalem, and were originally an outsider, then you'd get circumcised for some kind of strange bond in the bible story stemming from moses/rebekkah, but places that aren't in israel being circumcised and also jesus non-advocacy for the circumcision of the flesh in the 'gentile nations' i find the whole practice questionable'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nah, i prefer transient text like this, even though people log all my internet interactions for their own motives'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if i was screaming out my window then chances are there wouldn't be somebody with a tape recorder recording what i say for their own motivations'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'changing over time though, they'll probably do like kuwait and thailand and reference commentaries from a decade ago in new criminal thought-crime investigations'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'So you're saying that they would do that while I was a baby right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you were born in biblical israel and weren't under a church sponsored by jesus, i guess so, or if you were an outsider with a kid who decided to move to israel, your kid would probably be circumcised with you if males'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just from memory'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i didn't read of other cultures during those times doing circumcision as a standard practice of faith'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the eunuch's i guess had their entire balls chopped off, they're mentioned coming from ethiopea, servants of their queen'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most of the religious people who get their kids circumcised (in the west at least) for religious reasons go to a church of gospel, and in the gospel the circumcision of the flesh is done away with from what i remember, so that shouldn't hinder their faith any'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'my parents got mine done for health reason, not religious.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't know though, i just wonder why god requires people's foreskin's to bless them, how this arcane formula from the god of truth and justice actually works, going from my memory of the bible'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I don't have bible memory. don't want it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'judging from the evil in the world, i don't think removing people's foreskins stops much of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Which god are you referring to? If they lived you could ask them :]'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'evil is relative.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's kind of rediculous really, people all have to be circumcised in bible land to sojourn in israel, how are they able to confirm they're circumcised?  do they do like egypts military confirming their female prisoners are virgins, taking a little peek in the name of the lord?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just thinking of the kind of past-tense world the bible must have lived in, and trying to find similarities in the modern one'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'people have done worse in the lord's name.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum is agreeing with that FrT person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'if you look for something, you're bound to find something.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I worship the cotton gods.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'people put false connections in books all the time. doesn't mean they were meant for what people think. '
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'or with books. tie them to things completely seperate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xyliz: 'the christian and Judaic religions are false and fraudulent religions -- do not attribute the "blasphemous" claims of judaism and christianity to "God"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'which religion is right, then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'http://see_the_truth.webs.com/'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'You guys can bookmark that though you won't read it all right now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xyliz: 'all theistic religions are false and fraudulent '
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'at least, corrupt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xyliz: 'synonyms'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'the organizations, I mean.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but they're useful tools for spreading discord in leninism, as is racism and propaganda, according to what i heard, which is a neccessary part of society'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, 1000 talents of gold is quite a bit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I don't think they're useful at all.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xyliz: '"religious corruption" is a different concept to "false and fraudulent religions"'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I meant to bring a different concept, not that false and fraudulent aren't true as well.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'should bring back chariot racing.....much more interesting than nascar or indy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what do you guys think of the sudden change of heart the un obsevers had, that the massacres were actually violent rebel criminals suddenly, as a russian anti-submarine ship and 6-7 other warships arrive at the syrian port?  then civil war is announced the next day along with possible rounding up of political opponents into various 1929-1939 death-camps?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or they wouldn't go that low?  but if they do, does russia's presence signify who exactly is responsible for the genocide?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then what'll happen if they go ahead and set up shop in your nation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i met one person who came from syria who says that their government is very evil, only person i met from there though, so i'm not ignorant to the possibility that the un claims weren't a bunch of political lies, which i read is a common theory spread by it's supporters, but i don't deny that's a possibility too and russia's some kind of good-guy'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'lets hope there's no holocaust there though, and that there is no spreading of holocausts from there like there was in the 1920's and 30's, rio summit on global population control, meeting at wannsee vila last new years and things like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people get charged for calling 9/11 without a real emergency, but the excuse of b.c's government environmental agency is that they shouldn't have sent the email about impending mudslide fatality's to the environment people but instead called 9/11'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '911*'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they were busy doing other things than reading their emails'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which is funny cause my social studies teacher used to keep her laptop in front of her during every class, interactively communicating with others and checking her emails in real-time, but how easily they'll get away without losing their jobs'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they scorn welfare bums but there they are living in 3 million dollar houses across the world getting paid for jobs they only pretend to perform'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'who's worse?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'don't forget to read your deliberation cue-cards, you pseudo-intellectual politicians and lawyers'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'sober or no?'
T3/r7/2012-07-15.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'for me, no.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'would bombing enemy cities with racoons ruining import/export laws?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'ruin*'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Look at what  happened to Racoon City...'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'hrm... true... I was mainly thinking, however, that it would get racoons off our streets and be a nuisance to enemy countries at the same time. To the point that they wave the white flag....'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I was just wondering if it would be illegal in any way, like I unfortunately suspect it may be....'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I mean, there could be an arguement for it, in place of chemical and projectile weaponry....'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'can anyone tell me if it would be illegal for the american military to bomb enemies with racoons rather than use weapons and ammunition?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'nothing is illegal in a war... or everything is...'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'depending if you are on the winning or losing side'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'then why don't we do that instead? Less people dead, less vermin on our streets, and more lulz for the victors.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I have an even better idea. '
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'much better than killing everything in sight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Stop killing people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I'd love that, but america is no longer as democratic as it used to be. And it seems old men always want to kill their enemies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'and guess who runs the country? Old men. x.x'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Bring back the US before WWII then, we are tired of the world police running around attack everything in sight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And I bet the people in the middle east are even more tired....'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'as I said, I'd love to. But the common people no longer have choices in anything.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Sure you do. It just takes a lot of effort.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'you don't realise how stubborn these old men are, do you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I'm a grumpy middle aged man myself, so I do :D'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'But there are always ways... if pearl harbor started the current path, maybe some other event can stop it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I'd much rather there be no war, and the majority of the intelligent americans also think so, but the mix of propoganda aimed at the majority of people in the US (less intelligent people) tips the balance quite a bit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'If a majority wants a change, then there can be a change.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'and then there are the old men, and the war veterans sufferent from post traumatic stress disorder, and the people who are all "they bombed us so lets kill them" and people who distract us from the real problems in the world (conspiracy theorists) as well as the fact that a lot more people are losing their homes and thus have very little in the means of making intelligent votes, as well as the people who stay on the street regardless who think their underwear looks cool, etc....'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'the odds are kind of tipped in an difficult fashion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Nothing easy is worth doing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I agree with you there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I was just generalizing on how difficult it'll be on a whole.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yup.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'personally I'd like to form a multifaceted organisation that would help all of this at once in multiple ways, but I have neither the resources nor anyone to back me up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'thus my alternative- giving the military the idea to bomb enemies with raccoons rather than anything fatal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yo homies'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'all you americans looking forward to your health insurance premiums going up?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looks like you're going to have serious crop failure in the US this year'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there'll be more than enough to feed us and canada, but they're going to raise the price so they can send more overseas, imo'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we already import most of our food'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'plus 1 year ordinary crop production in canada is enough to feed canada for probably 20 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if we were ever cut off like we were in WW2, we'd be screwed'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more than double the population now than then'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and we needed food from USA back then'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, like with gasoline and automobiles, they're cheaper south of the border, where most get sent'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'which is bullshit imo'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'population of England/Wales increased 6% in 10 years to 2011'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more than half the increase was due to migration'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'bloody EU'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and bloody socialism'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'england/wales just needs starling, she'll straighten out your overpopulation problems :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, i like that about the french madonna nazi saying she wants to reduce immigration'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some of them migrants come with motives/sponsoring and customs of the place they're leaving and then invent a culture there that is the one they fled and do cause problems sometimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they don't need an excuse to come here, open borders and lots of state handouts'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're definitely not all bad though, there is definitely some'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like some of these latino's in las angeles, i heard a video from a certified teacher calling for the death of all the white people in america'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'even if they're not spongers, there's the room/infrastructure issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they try to convert america into el salvadore and those places where you're lucky if you're not butchered by age 12'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this country can sustainably support around 20 million'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we have near 70 million'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'at least that's some of what i found while lookin up the problem'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some cities in USA have a higher murder rate than Baghdad'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe not quite that bad but, some of the documentaries i seen aren't very good - so if they don't want to be there, why do they want to turn the place they move to into there?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'woohoo for camden'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'two big things going down right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Monsanto campaigning to get immunity from prosecution for all future GMO products they produce'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i watched a documentary that claimed monsanto stockholders were the FDA and supreme court and various other places'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and that horrid UN arms treaty that Obama is planning to use to ban gun ownership in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why should obama have any say on the uk?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd read/seen/heard much the same thing, Monsanto has tendrils well into the US government'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't hear of much of 'the terrorist' coming from there'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's a UN treaty'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it'll affect all UN members'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it'll cause massive problems in the US'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'less so here'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I thought UK had pretty strict laws on guns already'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'absurdly strict. Only criminals are allowed guns here'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'organized criminals can smuggle bazooka's into british colombia canada, where you have to sign a million contracts to buy a hand gun, and go through a arduous journey to purchase a long rifle'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what good does it do to stop legitimate people buying weapons?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they can't defend themselves against the criminals?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'exactly'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're not allowed to defend yourself against criminals in the UK. Even if you defend yourself against an intruder, you get prosecuted'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the movie "Paul" had a bit about that...a hick sheriff met the main characters (brits), asked where they're from, they said England...he's like I heard of there...they don't have guns there, right? how do the police shoot people then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Home Secretary banned a self defence expert from entering the country to give a keynote speech at a martial arts conference'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'police use taser and pepper spray instead'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then beat people to death while in custody'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'tasers can kill'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they responded "they try not to"'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they use them pretty... liberally'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nod, there's a whole attitude with tasers'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe they should start with themselves, how many gun exports to foreign nations does un memberstates do?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did them south african rapists invent their weapons in a factory they made?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'American government gun sales accounts for 91% of all the arms trade'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'we're good at it :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'i think that the legal torture with tasers attracts sickos to join the police.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, it's a matter of record that they hire paedophiles and known violent criminals to be TSA operatives'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'canadian long gun registry failed, so now they're trying to spread the wisdom?  imagine how many people became millionairres from that, smells like a con-game to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's a government mafia tax equivalent, that doesn't stop real criminals from acquiring their bazooka's'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'here though if you see 3 men outside your shop at night and are 30 miles from the nearest town, if you fire your rifle into the sky to catch their attention, they'll charge you with attempted murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think Americans need to start open-carrying'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not sure about home invasion and stuff, but usually if somebody dies the killer gets punished, even if his victim's in the process of executing or raping your family'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'long guns (rifles/shotguns) are largely unregulated in the US, it's just the handguns that are registered'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'tiger: good ol' boy southern/western states often do'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'cities/urban will never go that way'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people need to do it far more'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'use your powers or lose them'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'although was watching a youtube vid last week about a place that has a group doing an open carry garbage cleanup every now & then'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'another thing on this monsanto documentary i heard is that 2 scientists from this university of scottland were independently verifying a incomplete report's claim's in a lab, and their findings were that it was basically a bunch of lies and did have significant health risks - and one of the 2 scientists got assassinated in 2000'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'university of where?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'somewhere in scottland, it's supposedly the top university in europe'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or england'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i didn't here that'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i can't remember the name of the documentary, but it was documentary channel or something like that, seen it in the last year'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hear*'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe the world according to monsanto'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'lobbying against persecution for the 'individual' monsanto just sounds evil to me, especially when people who actually independently verify their product, which several people in the government are supposed to be doing, go missing for doing that'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe it was another reason, but maybe not too'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'German scientific research institute has warned that most condoms on the market contain a cancer-causing chemical '
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'US tax payer pays for cleanup bill for corporate individual exxon for 1989 oil spill -> http://articles.latimes.com/2008/jun/26/nation/na-valdez26'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'heard 20 billion it originally was, and that they had paid 500 million over 19 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm not sure how many welfare bums that is'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'US Navy fires at a fishing boat in the gulf, killing 1, injuring 3'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but it's possibly more expensive to allow exxon individuals to lobby your life than use your taxes for social sevices'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i bet the supreme court found that bp's oil spill was less than malicious too, and the pretending there's no oil spills in northern canada, especially since aljazeera claims they received hundred thousand+ christmas bonuses for exemplary performance that year'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's just random all these oil spills, none for 20 years and then 3-5 in a single year'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looks like DHS are getting Colt LE 901 Carbines to use on the American public'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'aren't you guys lucky'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'death camps?  it's been done before'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'watched this show on this rehabilitation centre for sex offenders in california, actual documentary, and they claim to get 250,000 dollars per inmate from the state and have over 10,000 there - they do studies such as showing erotic material to the inmates with a rubber arousal sensor strapped around their penis, for signs of rehabilitation, and have staff that looks like 18 year old playboy bunnies'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'lots different from arizona where they feed their inmates on less than a dollar per day of food, mostly donations'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'imagine how hard the mafia men who organize that demoralization centre are laughing'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'taxes hard at work'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'there are two extremes....california is the worst when it comes to overspending, and arizona is the worst when it comes to underspending.'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'hey, how can I live in a place staffed by playboy bunnies?'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '10,000 inmates x 250,000 dollars for the hard erotic material rehabilitation program'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bunch of jokes, government of california is proof there's no justice in america'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'd never be rehabilitated, but I'd have fun trying'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, fun, while real people can't afford to live'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'inmates care about real people'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most people don't make 250,000 dollars per year'
T3/r7/2012-07-16.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, the US has 1.2 million 40 foot shipping containers sitting in storage at the various ports, because it costs to much to send them overseas to be reused.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'India's Chhattisgarh state is investigating reports that thousands of women had unnecessary hysterectomies so hospitals could make insurance claims. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-18873716 don't worry, it won't come to you, it's just being greedy >- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17612550 Uzbekistan's policy of secretly sterilising women , obviously not a high command'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'especially safe if you have a bunch of foreign doctors who succeeded where most starve to death!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how come not many doctors from your hometown?  it's all unambiguous'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is that a communist chinese neuroscientist operating on the top of just about every american and canadian university?  they don't feed plastic to babies in their infant formula where they come from, so you must be very safe in their non-state sponsored successes'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it wouldn't be as odd if it wasn't next door to uzbekistan, but you know, somebody's gotta population control the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'was JFK was assassinated for battling communism, which was supported fully ever since?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'all this tax payer non-welfare money funding gets put into poppa voodoo doc's personal accounts through cuba etc, this is some good stuff, lets start up the voodoo curse again'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Israel_Lobby_and_U.S._Foreign_Policy that'd be something huh, if america wasn't even going to war for itself?  just seen the book in a link and it looks interesting - makes america nothing more than a mercenary, or a shakespear play 'king john' sending soldiers to die for the holy land'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or that xerxes in the movie 300'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'your government serving somebody 8000 miles aawy, like canada'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe more 16000, i don't know'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe the queen's a better monarch for canada, i'm not sure though'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and jews can never be kgb agents, so you're always far removed from their president of russia agenda's'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'demoralization obviously doesn't exist anywhere in america or canada, or ukraine or other places like germany - destablization?  we're sturdy and united and strong, sure of our integrity - crisis?  ah, economic hogwash, cost of living sacrifices, various war's, it's all non-marxist-leninist and kgb misinformation, normalization?  anything good'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fran%C3%A7ois_Duvalier john f kennedy shuts down foreign funding to haiti after learning of misappropriation of the money by it's leader, who used his nation as a communist bargaining card - lee harvey oswald the us military guy turned communist assassinates john f kennedy, duvalier claims to have put a voodoo curse on john f kennedy - subsequently the new president reopens the funding'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some things to keep in mind about obama's new 4 billion dollar investment in motherland africa'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder what they'll actually use it for'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'imagine how many people in america now are funded by your foreign funding eating you all for free'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or how many guns for terrorists they purchase with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nation of cowards'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'canada also bailed camaroon the anti-british country, which canada's monarch is'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'where they abuse human rights on a daily basis and are all corrupt in government, according to what i read'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in 2000 or so'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what stephen harper and them are'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and also why iran's the only nation to have reported on the 600,000 police tortures in ukraine that are mentioned on amnesty international, and they don't draw the link between uzbekistan and india for your foreign doctors to consider'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '(per year) could be higher now, maybe 6 million'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're worse than nazi's, and will be openly worse than nazi's in the future'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what i feel coming/think'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'worse than nazi's? Time to bomb them with raccoons!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's the international stalin's mafia red guard communist new world order, if they're the roots or not, i'm not sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'woman from st.petersberg died a week after showing her city counsel documents to aljazeera'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i guess russia's mafia government could be limited to itself though, and the others are just independent somehow'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they are like that, just saying what i read'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep, black african's from nations where you donate your world vision bleeding heart money to, lobby your government to give all of your money to them where they are openly corrupt murderers and starve their own people to death even without your funding, which is used for anything but what you think is good, and then install their IMF chief who compares greece against africa and tries to make it's government turn it into those starving children commercials - is one way it can appear'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you'll all be emancipated holodomor victims in the future, possibly'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cause you were so scared to do anything about it, let them do the thinking that they are obviously not corrupt'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'just bomb them with raccoons.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'oh damn, stephen harper has to send 100 billion dollars to camaroon to fund their john f kennedy anti-anticommunism rowboat full of demons while he cuts public services that could have been paid for 10 times over 10 years with the money'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do not worry, they will immigrate to canada and be a valuable asset to the economy that purches you all as whores from your own welfare cheques'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: '... since you are talking to yourself... I wonder... do you ever reply to yourself?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i talk to the communist nazi's that run the internet sometimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're always listening'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'are you afraid to have an opinion on the subject matter that they always avoid in the news and politics, but is actually real?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I think you need to take your medication now, good sir.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you seem to think you're smart and i'm stupid, i wonder where you got your thoughts'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I do have an opinion- the world is fucked up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's true, it's rotten actually'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is posting some coherent valid criticisms of various governments '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I never said you were stupid. You assumed that on your own.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'perhaps a few exaggerations and errors, yet coherent'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'well... I am surprised that the russian mafia hasn't whacked him yet. Seems like something they would do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'putin's the richest man on earth, i imagine people like me are on his future concentration camp stalin purity list of holy warrior'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Ferien is a mole coming out of some political closet, or maybe another of the NMO's "useful idiots"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I am indeed a useful idiot. Or maybe I am a mole xD'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I do know one thing, I have good english grammer for a russian mafia mole.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they care, if he read what i say and wasn't evil then he'd look up the points himself and see where i got them from, wouldn't he?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'You grammer is ok, but your speling needs work'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Putin's "useful idiots" -- they used to call them "Lenin's useful idiots"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'oh yeah, that appears to be real, how about that?  looks considerable, invalid retard conclusion or.. has some historical perspective to it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'actually, I agree with you on some levels, but if civilization is as corrupt as you say, what can the common man do about it. Especially on a MUD?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'absolutely nothing, except find it's origins, instead of believing in supernatural satan's'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'errata: NMO sb NWO (new world order/orifice)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if i want to be a real atheist i have to eliminate supernatural conundrums'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'thats odd... usually people with such strong opinions on this subject are hardcore christians o_0'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i criticize harper even more than i consider putin, i consider them all to see who's got a righteous kind of action and who's the roots of corruption, or if it's distributed who protects the corrupt from one another?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'to be effective as a demagogue, decent grammar, spelling, punctuation, and coherence, is a prerequisite, all with accurate facts (at last when starting out -- to gain credibility) '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like this bernard shaw guy, interesting isn't he?  national hero in britain and canada, yet advocated the use of zyklon b and genocide based on material wealth'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and also a firm supporter of stalin'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'to be effective as a demagogue, decent grammar, spelling, punctuation, and coherence, is a prerequisite, along with concise accurate informative facts (at least when starting out -- to gain credibility) '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'who says I want to be effective, and who says I want to be a demagogue. I just speak my mind.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what is it that putin believes IF he is like stalin, who they claim became mentally ill paranoid delusional as time wore on?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i hope he's not that evil, or worse, but that's a mystery i like to understand'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what kind of future do they expect for this world, if they secure it's hell?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'changes to societies are usually started and done by the middle class, funded by the rich, with the lower classes in (belated) support'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'speaking of capitalisation and coherence.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'looking at the entire known world as a whole, corruption absolutely everywhere, it almost looks like a japanese kamikazee airplane pilot is the captain of earthship'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'except they might not have been fighting for evil like the media said'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'german Nazis like capitals (on their nouns) '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so then, you'd expect with 7 billion people and various hundreds or thousands of countries and territories, there would be at least 1 that wasn't led by satan's servant'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Das Capital" -- sounds communist'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so, obviously corrupt people work together to make sure that satan rules the world, and they must have a utmost authority on earth'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because most people are victims from birth to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'heres a spoiler. Man destroys himself. The artifacts of man only last a few thousand years. The earth and it's habitat forget anything like man ever existed. New evolutionary forms of intelligence appears, and takes many many thousands of years to fully develop... they find any remaining ((if possible)) artifacts of man, and either worships this ancient race, or learn from it's mistakes. As intelligent as they are, they end up making the same mistakes anyways. The end. Or is it a cycle?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'the world will live and adapt even if we die. Funny isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'currently, "God" and "satan" mayhaps be synonymous -- so there is doubt whether the NWO is working for "satan"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'also, snape kills dumbledor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the gospel, jesus claimed some of the jews worshipping god were worshipping satan, in my take on the implication, 'you know not what you worship''
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"satan" conotes "adversary"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and inferrence from malachai chapter 1 and the genesis story, where 'god of righteousness and truth and mercy' honors a pact with satan equivalent esau/jacob extortion, similar to treaty of nonagression in world war 2'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and jacob deceives his father, while honest esau was out getting supper for his family 'the last supper''
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'stealing his birthright and giving the blessing of genociding righteous esau from the face of the earth in malachai'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'somebody may've been reading "the Last and First Men" by Olaf Stapledon'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'Esau and Jacob were brothers, right? It would be fratricide, not genocide.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the old testament is a christian book of judaic hype, lies, fiction, and a few historical facts'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'but it is still an interesting read, even if only to help one decide whether they want to be christian or not. I went through that stage... and found that many of the acts committed within were sorta grim and nasty for an "all loving god"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the OT lied'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'and even if it did, all the more reason to support my decision to not be christian.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some perverts prefer to reject religions that criticize their abhorrent perversions'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i believe in reality and intelligent designer, but considering my own imagination, if all of my thoughts were spent on worshipping the mind that creates them, i would get bored of imagination pretty quickly - so religious people with creator concept chanting phrases like hypnotizing a serpent god and various signs of ritual homage to the thought seem kind of odd to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't think religion's even neccessary to 'please the lord' unless the lord is satan, god probably intereacts directly with everybody if he exists'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"intelligent designer" -- that's a laugh'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'really, time existed before consciousness, which isn't required for it to continue existing'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'then there are those like me, who simply won't follow a religion that either lies about it's past or supports slaughter and murder as a means of serving any god.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'and to elaborate, I consider war slaughter and murder.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Oxymoronic: Chemosh ranting about "world corruption" and yet believing in an "intelligent designer" -- comedic'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if there is an evil god, i don't think he's very stupid compared to humans'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think it was zoroastrianism and basically every religion in history which had a creative force and a destructive force, both of which are called intelligent'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'obligatory question "but what truely defines evil and good"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"the end of dogma is the start of reality"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'not misspelling "truly" for starters'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'watch the video, 'the spell of the albino' from aljazeera, 'by their fruit they are known', the reporter is probably the most evil one in that entire video, the girl with the missing arm is done wrong to, who is good in the scenario'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'now you are just nitpicking, Zade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't mean they're always good or always evil, but depending on the situation, there is a wrongdoer and a relatively good victim'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"the end of wrong dogma is often the beginning of the strait and narrow path to truth"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'straight*'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"strait" is a synonym of "narrow"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No,strait is a geoographical term.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'indeed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'geographical* '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: '=p'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"the end of filthy perversions and wrong dogma is often the beginning of the 'heterosexual straight' strait and narrow path to truth"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'again, geographical term. Straight means forward, to move straight is to move forward, such as Straight Ahead. I do not know why you are getting sexual on us.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/story/2012/07/17/sk-cannabis-thc-1207.html Saskatchewan scientists discover key to drug-free hemp , did they really?  http://www.gizmag.com/high-free-medicinal-marijuana/23207/ Israeli company grows medical marijuana which doesn't get you high '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why would they claim credit for something they didn't actually discover?  maybe they're israeli scientists at U of S?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Strait is not a synonym for or variation of straight.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'Indeed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's funny how Zade nitpicked someone for mispelling "Truly", yet insists "straight" and "strait" are the same thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'was "Dire Straits" a rock-band with upstanding heterosexual morals or a corrupted rock-band '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wrong Yuna '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'gettin their money for nothing and chicks for free is in line with where is zog by gwar in stasi germany riding the great porno cow for general zog'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'does rock have anything to do with this situation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How am I wrong, Zade? http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/strait?s=t&ld=1032'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those that are heterosexually "straight" are more likely to be on the "strait" path'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'On the "narrow" path?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'Zade, you are fighting a losing battle.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What dictionary do you have that claims "strait" means "straight"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'cut your losses while you are ahead, like I do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You know how the saying goes "Straight and narrow"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It doesn't say "straight and straight".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Which it would be if "Strait" meant "Straight" and not "Narrow":'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'English is my 3rd language. Is it your 9th?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a "strait and narrow path" in the NT is likely a long and winding path with many heterosexual curves'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'straight and narrow has nothing to do with sexuality of any form. It is a phrase which indicates that someone is on the right path, the correct path, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The saying is "Straight and narrow", not "Strait and narrow".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You can say "Straight and strait" because "Strait" means "Narrow". I does not, however, mean "Strait".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is my BASIC ENGLISH confusing you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'no, his sexuality is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'he needs to learn that this phrase has nothing to do with ones sexuality.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So, "Straight and strait" means "Straight and narrow". "Strait and narrow" means "Narrow and narrow".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And also, it has nothing to do with sexuality, it's about (percevied) righteousness.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'Indeed, Yuna explained it better than I did.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "trouble" with esl "foreigners" is that they are "shallow', as they attempt to be "wrongly pedantic", and fail to comprehend the "nuances of the context" '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I've done it thrice now. If he doesn't get it now, he never will. Or he's being willfully obtuse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There is no dictionary in THE WORLD that says "Strait" is a synonym for "Straight".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'i say deport those esl troublemakers'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I guess they're all wrong and you're right. YOU are the arbiter who decides which English words mean what.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'neither did Zade'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Context does not rewrite the English language. And the problems with native English speakers is that they get sloppy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And the problem with arrogant pricks is that they can never admit to having made a mistake.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'debate -h strait '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And their desperate attempts to justify their mistakes just make them look dumber.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I think he didn't even look at your link. I have english as my first and only language, and I am saying the same thing, Zade. And you are being pretty damned vain and shallow with those deportation comments, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Show me a single dictionary that says "strait" can, in any way, shape or form, be a synonym for "straight".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Actually, the saying WAS originally "strait and narrow". "Strait is the gait, and narrow is the way" or something like that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'gate*'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That is not what's up for discussion Lenei.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'It was 10 minutes ago :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Corruption of saying is not what is in question. Nobody's arguing about the ORIGINAL meaning of things.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're arguing about the lexical meaning of the word "strait", which Zade insists can be the same as "straight" in the right context.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bodies without hands and heads and feet found near detroit - is the mexican mass-grave paladins moving north, or is that standard mafia practices?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think there was some in eastern canada too recently'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'perhaps Yuna flunked directional logic'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Zade was the one that said strait was a synonym for narrow, and you disagreed with him...'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'No...'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'Often, straits. ( used with a singular verb ) a narrow passage of water connecting two large bodies of water.2.Often, straits. a position of difficulty, distress, or need: Ill and penniless, he was in sad straits indeed.3.Archaic . a narrow passage or area.4.an isthmus. '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zade said straight was a synonym for STRAIGHT. I said strait is a synonym for narrow.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: '[17 Jul 14:50:20] (Debate) Zade: '"strait" is a synonym of "narrow"'; [17 Jul 14:51:16] (Debate) Yuna: 'No,strait is a geoographical term.''
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how do people feel secure when they go on vacation to mexico?  yeah, don't worry no chance that your resort is connected to the mass-grave mutilations and stuff, rest assured in your righteous vacation'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yuna:  debate -h Zade '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'whenever i hear of politicians going to mexico on vacation i wonder if they're just mafia studs going for a meeting with their boss'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'read before that, Leinei, the phrase in context was Straight and Narrow.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Fine, I didn't see that. I enter at this point: "the end of filthy perversions and wrong dogma is often the beginning of the 'heterosexual straight' STRAIT AND NARROW PATH to truth""'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'pretty much every politician near me goes to mexico sometimes, or nicaragua'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And then he spent the rest of the debate claiming "strait" and "straight" were interchangeable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'which I agree is incorrect'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I did not see that he originally correctly stated that "strait" and "narrow" are interchangeable (thought this practice is archaic).'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"nuances of context"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'There is no fucking context in which "strait" means "straight".'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I think I am going to have a cigarette, this is getting pretty damned repetitive.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'german stasi (kgb communist) set up base in chile, so it's possibly a hub where they get their orders in their takeover cold war strategy's'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'perhaps some wrongly pendantic foreigner did not yet learn of Venn diagrams (where some "straight" things intersect with some things "strait")'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fuck do venn diagrams have to do with "straight" = "strait2?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I can make a venn diagram that has "stupid" and "Zade" intersect, it doesn't mean the two words can be interchangeable.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'tsk, bad languange - Yuna loses'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'language'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's rich, coming from you, Zade.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You spent, like, 3 hours personally attacking me last week.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'tainted love, lets have a happy land and pretend that this land isn't owned and operated by death-camp communists, this is a fun mafia safety time, i feel so safe and secure being here, isn't it wonderful that the entire earth pays tax to the same people that provide the criminals it's police persecute (and eventually are) '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'you Yuna were attacking Chemosh or somebody'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'll just add "Hypocrisy" to that venn diagram.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not paying tax is a more grievous crime than all the holocausts on earth, stalin needs his grain too you know'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade joined into the fray to defend Chemosh with a direct offensive counterattack!
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'come on, world vision for starving fat stalin's, i'm just advocating a worthy fundraising event'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'adolf hitler can be openly demonized, by comrade stalin is the father of modern politics and therefore his 30-300 million voiceless genocide victims are unworthy to raise a stink'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is the modern russian government directly descendent from stalins?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder, are the nazi's really worth all the hype when the people who invented them are still around and the richest people one arth?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh, (feigning) "reverse sarcasm" is bad rabble-rousing technique -- some may accuse you of !blatantly! praising and supporting the corrupt'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you can't beat them join them, if you're into that kind of thing like most of the world is'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i got a little russian in my raped german bloodline'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's all good'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'later, when Chemosh raises the bloody "Jolly Roger", Chemosh may then claim he was supporting the "corrupt" all along and that was not "reverse sarcasm" but "loving praise" disguised as "reverse sarcasm"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't fear them any more than they fear being revealed for the liars they are behind their nuclear aresenals, all cowardly justifying absolute depravity - the calvinist ideology - as tradeoff to fullscale war'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bunch of sissy's afraid to get things done with, pretending to be different'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh went incoherent, and is "tilting at small windmills" in the distance'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'calvinists ?!?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm gonna die anyways, might as well tell the people who made life hell to fuck themselves and their future hopes'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they poison my cigarettes and tempt me for a living'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're the ones who should be rolled into death camps'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'since that's what they seem to be setting up in the world, death to the people who led it to hell'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'right?  or allow them to guide your repopulation after the future holocaust?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's wise, then in 70 years you'll have another'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the RCC are bigger than Calvinists;  tilt at the RCC, or if you are brave, tilt at the israelis (though your "who ignored" list is likely to inceaase) - go go Don "Chemosh" Quixote!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'increase'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'they ignore you to keep tabs on you, in case you change your nick again'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the average disease free dead body is worth up to $200,000.....hmm, put it in your will that your body is to be sold, and the money given to family, or the Save the Donkey Foundation.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But donkeys are delicious!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the fictional hero fighting at imaginary demons in his head versus the antihero pointing out the real corruption in the world, repetitive history and his opinion on it'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, me and quixote have alot in common'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you notice everybody hates me everywhere?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they can't stand a real person among their cartoon lives'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'jesus wrote about that in the gospel , 'the world receives its own', also 'i shall make enmity between thy seed and her seed' to the devil, now there's a conflict of jesus wasn't accepted interest'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so, which god does the world worship, god or satan?  and how does it universally conform to the bible's own words?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Jesus Christ was a fictional character'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Human skin takes on the color of smoked salmon when it is professionally removed in rectangular shapes from a cadaver.  A good yield is about six square feet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'must make them body choppers feel powerful being able to skin a corpse with impunity to the law, like donating sports brains to science is a thing of the lord'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in some places they can even make it become a corpse too'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm going to make sure that i die where vermin will eat my corpse so that science can't have any of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Dont poison the poor vermin!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rizgoth, that was sick, and TMI, and unverified '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if real independence existed, canada would have a nuclear arsenal that's larger than the rest of the world's combined, along with top of the pioneering line military hardware and satellites undetectable hovering over all the other nation's, and all the weapons the mind can invent , it'd be just as strong or stronger than america and russia'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'instead of sacrificing itself to world war 2 parasites'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Heil!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's the fact, countries like china import all of their materials they make their powerful military weapons out of'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'from traitors who run canada'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Yah, der Fuhrer was .. is! a Nationalist!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'hitler's probably a better man than you ever could be'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you never know though, stalin was a saint and hitler's speeches claimed he was no better'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(shhhhh, you want the jewish support)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(and do not praise Stalin -- a lot of Canadians "escaped" from the former USSR)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's canadians who praise communism in russia today living in newfoundland and various other places, they must be canadian and not underminers'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or maybe they're just not much of historians'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'prime minister harper and his jewish lobbiests are turning canada into russia though, communist bastards'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or ukraine rather, that's a better example'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'those communistic canadians in newfieland are part of what's left of "Lenin's useful idiots"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'by all government corruption unaccountability signs of stalinism'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Harper is (sycophantic) Capitalist (likely taking orders^H^H^H^H^H^H advice and instruction from the USA)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'capitalism is communism in the end, and there is no competition among businesses'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'suncore owns petro-canada which is part owned by communist india's russian investors, etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'all hidden behind a myriad of corporate owners which trickle back to the king of the pile'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there is no capitalism, it's all lies'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Capitalism" is not "Communism", though "communism" is compared to "red capitalism"'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'non-communist monsanto owns over 120 seed companies, which keep their name'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there is "absomax" and there is "Capitalism" -- although "absomax" is not yet in the official widely-distributed dictionary. -- But maybe if Stephen Colbert used the term "absomax" !:)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'more competition for the highly-paid tax payer funded 'competition bureau''
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'non-communist microsoft liscences out the patents panasonic uses through a patent company which makes 30 billion + per year in royalty fees, which it invests in other non-communist venture forces which keep their labels'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and nokia and others'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they even got into the agriculture business through singapore, those amazing dos programmers'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the amazing family name rockwell, of american dream denial artistry diversity is the leader in automation innovation, while another offshoot of his amazing family is probably all the fuel and taxes that will pay for the replacement of future death camp volunteers'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'jews are guiltless, in general, but a subset of them .. RECALLING the Memorandum of Understanding on Economic Cooperation between the Government of Canada and the Government of Israel of 31 March 1992, the Memorandum of Understanding on Bilateral Cooperation in Private Sector Industrial Research and Development Entered Into by the Government of Canada and the Government of Israel of 16 August 1994 and the Agreement on Bilateral Cooperation in Industrial Research and Development between the Government of Canada and the Government of the State of Israel of 27 March 2006 (the bPrevious Agreementb) http://www.treaty-accord.gc.ca/text-texte.aspx?id=105299 what's this exactly?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'wow, so that's why capitalism is communism and the business competition bureau doesn't do their job?  possibly'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'here have a private island in the carribean for your treason'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/eic/site/cb-bc.nsf/eng/h_00125.html yep, keep on paying them your taxes, it's obvious that they have a nonracist, foreign unbiased evaluation of the competitors'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'lets pay homage to the great illusionists in israel, or is it russia?  amazing grace'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why does monsanto always win every court case against the slandered farmers?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'could be the jewish lawyer in las angeles called shapiro?  maybe not, gonzalez the mexican sees no transgression of gmo boundaries'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nothing that fits into the memorandum of understanding there'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'The Competition Bureau, as an independent law enforcement agency, ensures that Canadian businesses and consumers prosper in a competitive and innovative marketplace.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'independent how exactly?  it says there that it's not allowed to regulate israel's amazing investments'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'bunch of lies, god must have really hated me to spit me into this evil nation'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Canada is a more benign and friendly country for the expression of "novel" opinions than either the USA or GB'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, but harper's cracking down on that now'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'indefinite detention of 'terrorist suspects' without trial is also a stalinist dictator law, as any jury of citizens would be able to evaluate the suspect and the proof themselves to determine if they're legitimately being detained'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they also signed a agreement between harper and george bush to allow military forces from both countries to cross the border to quell civilian disobedience'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '2008 i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or around there, if what i read was real, they're getting right on ready for the death camps of the future, and fully adhering to stalinism as considered from the past'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and if the lying canadian government is the purest and fairest government to live under on earth, than this world is definitely hell'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like i said, i'd be killed by the age of 5 in most places cause i see through liars and don't believe they have the right to walk all over me'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if you want to defeat "Harper", then you require to be accurate eloquent and hard-hitting with actual facts (not unsubstantiated paranoid conjectures) -- but what is the replacement to "Harper", (there is the "lesser of evils" option, and "the devil you know" option versus "the grass is perhaps greener elsewhere" option)'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'facts don't harm the harper government, any more than women don't go missing in russia for showing city counsel records to aljazeera'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or die, i guess that's different than go missing - aljazeera could have been full of it though?'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'being a successful demogogue is a lot of hard work'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'so you are using the Aardwolf debate channel as kindergarten.  eventualy, you may require to go to primary school: IRC '
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'not sure where demagogue high school is'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i provided millions of facts and my opinion on it's what you call flawed, because i don't repeat after the scope of every article and instead point out common denominators and possibilities from judging them all collectively'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sort of like the 'lie delusion of paranoia' of india chopping out womens womb's for insurance greed versus the phenomenon in uzbekistan where the government orders it done'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'obviously they're not similar and they're just greedy instead, like the news pointed out'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'eventually'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i remember reading on an aljazeera article about 1-3 years ago too, that an israeli said that if america didn't do according to the interests of israel, israel will destroy it from the inside out'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'palestine might have been mentioned in the article too, i tried to relocate it after, it's in their archives somewhere'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so, you see what kind of 'memorandum of understanding' competition stuff they have set up, that's probably how they'll acheive it'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and probably why you'll be at war in the middle east until it's all israel'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or maybe russia gets involved with china cause you had to go against one of their governments'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just something i consider anyways, i'm sure a million or 2 others read the same article on aljazeera'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Creekside Mushrooms Ltd. is the world's largest single site mushroom growing facility and the only underground mushroom farm in the United States.  It has 800 acres of underground limestone tunnels growing mushrooms, and as business grows, they dig more tunnels.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'The only thing holding them back right now is labor....They can't find enough people willing to work underground for 8 hours a day picking mushrooms.'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'evening patriots'
T3/r7/2012-07-17.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i notice my lazy mp hasn't responded to my email yet'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sit like a Trurien: 'Are we permitted to eat animals? Discuss.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'here's a news story for Yuna: "American Scout Movement upholds ban on gay scouts and leaders"'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Rizgoth Oil is back in business!'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no oil for you! the banks are rigging the price'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'They can rig it all they want, I am getting 14% !'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: '14% of fat girl is still a fat girl.... just saying...'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: '14% of a fat girl is likely to be a skinny girl.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Unless she was REALLY fat'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Current price - production cost - taxes = well price x 14% = my retirement!'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) CheeZy Bot HiSaZuL: 'then it wasnt that much of a fat girl'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'cool, a beer can boat.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'a beer can fly, too'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I haven't seen a beer drive a car, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so if in 1984 miami the murder capital of america was a result of excess supply of cocaine and decreased value, did they really win the drug war by decreasing the supply to reduce the violence?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'things like moving walmart south of the border provides a pretty stable route for 3 tonne shipments of cocaine i guess, however much they look it over, they have companies that get clearance on their semi's and crates'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the drug dealers then still purchase every business in town, they actually praised the process in miami'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cocaine's probably worth 425% more now than it was in 1984'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe it's good cause there's just fewer cocaine investors now than there was?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'making 500 million dollars a week it probably wouldn't take them long to purchase america'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'The avg wealth of a canadian family is now higher than the avg wealth of an american family.....$363,000 for Canadians, to $316,000 for Americans.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'americas'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that probably takes into account property not paid for and stuff though'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not impressive - the average wealth of an american family isn't too high these days, among "advanced" countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's alot of families below even 20,000 dollar per year incomes too, they outnumber the ones who aren't by probably 50 to 1'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'places where there is work, at 12-20 dollars per hour, to rent a place costs 1,500 - 5,000 dollars per month, and to buy a little shack costs over 750,000 dollars'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so that's very little chance at progress, even if you eat garabage'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'racist indians in canada pay no taxes, get exclusive 500 million dollar profit margins from casino's that are almost exclusively owned by them, get contracts with energy and other companies that indians are their exclusive workforce first choice, etc'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and they use the highways paid for with taxes and other things, i don't like canadian indian treaty's much'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'multiculturalism doesn't work'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like trying to get a job at a taxi company owned by pakistan'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or if korea buys every restauraunt and hotel in town, you'll be lucky if you can be a dishwasher'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'yeah, those indians ought to insist that all non-indian descendants of the genocidal land-thieving europeans and thieving peers leave Canada'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then i guess europe has to insist all non-white european and racist jews emmigrate to their points of origin too'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'besides kicking out the europeans, kick out the asians, africans, mexicans, and south americans'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if only there were an effective "God" to enforce fair play -- darn, no effective "God"'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'most people's god is the breed of human the city of god jerusalem is inhabited by, and the hope that maybe some day they too can be the proper breed'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'btw, the above posts by Zade were stated in a form of sarcasm'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'mine might be sarcastic too'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"positive sarcasm" is not "reverse sarcasm"'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'everybody hates a cynic'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'idk, Don Rickles is popular'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'sometimes during peter popoff religious rituals they play commercials where jews ask for 300 dollars to save russian jews from captivity, so that the donator can have a tree planted in the garden, his son asks how come there's not more trees?  while he mentions the gentile contribution to defeating the nazi's in world war 2, wasn't enough to deserve a tree'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'seemed like a pretty low scam to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i guess in russia money is god though, maybe the same thing there - you ever heard of oppressed jews in russian captivity before?  i guess it's possible'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'peter popoff is obviously doing comedy'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'on the commercial though, they use people's faith in god as a hook to reel in money, contributed with world war 2'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and the symbolic tree of life i guess, in the new jerusalem'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah , his miracles are probably given some cash to every few donators'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'seen it on BET tv though about 3 weeks ago'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unless (or even if) that is a fruit tree planted and taken care of in israel, that peter popoff is attempting to scam jews'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're extremely rich nation, i wouldn't doubt israel being the richest nation on the planet'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'israel depends on handouts from the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so what're they asking ignorant christians new jerusalem for their money to purchase a tree that world war 2 wasn't worth doing it for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe, i got no problem with helping people out when they need it, i just figure they should be more straight forward about things'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Not to mention Israel is sitting on top of a 300 billion barrel shale oil field, and about 50 tcf of natural gas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and if they are wise, they continue to sit on those reserves without using or depleting those reserves'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unlike that (expletive deleted) nation to the north of the USA that is squandering resources for a pittance -- xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's politicians are stockholders in the foreign companies that they sell it to'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, the price of oil sands oil would go up if Canada allowed a westward pipeline to the west coast to ship oil to Asia.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"its" not "it's"'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but as long as you rely on exporting the oil to the US, it will stay cheap.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if canada quit sending iron ore/potash/oil to america they'd call it iraq and weapons of mass destruction it'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh, wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'American and canadian oil companies are happy to buy cheap oil sands oil, convert it to oil products in the US, and then export it to other nations for big bucks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't like the idea of communist china becoming canada either though, they don't give two shits and a fuck about the environment, except maybe panda bears'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'though, china actually is the only nation that tries to make it's vehicles and things more environmentally friendly'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'plenty of countries do actually!'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'china isnt the only asian country that would buy canadian oil if it was available.....Japan would also be a big buyer.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'just not where you live, probably'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'unsubstantiated ramblings are not worth reading, and are invalid in a debate'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It wouldnt surprise me if oil companies could double oil sands production within 5 years if a western pipeline was built to supply Asia.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It would also increase the price of oil sands oil exported to the US by about $15 a barrel.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'along with the oil pipeline to west coast, stephen harper 'streamlined' immigration and work visas - which will provide 125 million or more immigrant workers from china if they want'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they did that in africa'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, it looks like we've completed basic preparations for climate change, as long as the sea level rise does not exceed 2m, so if canada wants to kill everyone else... well, hope they have a good military for the decades ahead.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '(we recently bumped up the required level above sea level from 1.25m to 2.25m)'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '(for reclamations)'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'in a couple years, Brazil is going to be exporting 500,000 barrels of oil to the US....but the US might be self sufficient in 10 years, so who knows.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'shale oil has rewritten the supply book for oil.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US went from 20% self sufficient in natgas in 2006, to close to 98% self sufficient today....from shale natgas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'IRC is the proper location for a high-text-volume political debate -- replete with date-timestamps, links to websites confirming edited predigested posts, and accurate concise summaries of posts, all in flawless irc english (unneessary capitals and unambigous punctuation may be excluded)'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I sure wonder what the look on the faces of those fundamentalist types will be when they realise they'll have to eat artificial vat-grown sins-against-nature to survive. heh heh heh'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'Okay Riz the shale gas has saved them in that respect... what is the US's current nat gas reserves?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the only consolation to a pyrrhic "victory"...'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'soylent green is algae'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'supposedly a 100 + year supply of shale natgas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'you realize that's basically what plants are, Sonshi?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'based on current consumption rates.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'soylent green is sewage digested by algae'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'I assume you heard of the mammoth nat gas hit in the utica layer in Ohio. Previously that shale layer was assumed to be oil.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, but they don't regard plants as GMed vat-grown monstrosities...'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and that is current reserves based on extraction technology today....which is about 20% of known reserves.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'alter a few things here and there and they'd go all up in arms about playing god'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'who knows how tech will improve in extracting more of that gas over time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, and the 3 huge shale natgas fields in Texas....'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or the one in Arkansas, 2 in louisiana'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the huge one under the appalachian mountains'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or the 5 in wyoming, utah, montana and colorado'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'Riz, has anyone revisited the older horizontal supposedly played out fields and tested them with horizontal drilling to see if they have anything left?'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'err vertical played out fields'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, some of the old stripper wells in Texas have been showing signs to be refilling with oil.....at a slow rate...so they expect that the oil is coming from deeper shale deposits under those known fields.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Oil shale is still to expensive for widescale production, but some deposits are feasible like the ones in North Dakota for drilling....ND will be a major supplier of new US oil in the coming years.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'ND was producing about 10,000 barrels of oil in 2006, and today produce almost 300,000 barrels a day....one of the reasons why US midwest oil is $16 cheaper per barrel than oil sold in Europe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'We need a new pipeline to bring canadian and midwestern oil to the gulf coast, so that we refine it into oil products to export overseas and raise the price of midwest oil to the global avg.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'that isn't how the US operates, I figure their next move to drive up internal oil prices will be to invade Iran due to weapons of mass destruction.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'no, this is definitely one of those situations where nerf is appropriate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the price of internal oil in the US is dropping like a rock because of overproduction and limited pipelines to move that oil around.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'But drivers are still paying gasoline prices based on the full price of the oil. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'so they need more feeder pipelines, those are the oil company's responsibility not a massive export line'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It isnt helping that Texas is starting to produce more oil again, feeding the refineries on the gulf coast with cheaper texas oil. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'more oil from Texas or Brazil means less oil from canada or the midwest shipped to the gulf coast.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the world is flush with oil supplies right now, even as production drops from Nigeria, Venezuela, Iran, and other opec countries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'doesn't seem like a great argument for more exporting.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'As the price of domestic oil falls, the oil companies need to export more oil from the US to make more profits from the oil products.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'northsea oil is now the benchmark price for world crude oil...not texas intermediate....ti oil is currently about $17 cheaper per barrel than northsea intermediate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'you know, we call british britfags, and they call us americunts. I think they are just jealous because they can never handle a cunt '
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sit down, relax, have a pickle.'
T3/r7/2012-07-18.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'sorry, I do not do anal masturbation, and especially not with vegetables '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the oldest confirmed orangutan in a zoo has turned 51, at the brookfield zoo in Chicago.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the National Ignition Facility, home to the worlds largest laser pulled the trigger on a laser consisting of 192 beams of optically amplified, electromagnetic radiation-emitting light, all fired within a few trillionths of a second of each other, to deliver 500 trillion watts (or terawatts) of peak power and 1.85 megajoules of ultraviolet laser light.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'That is more power than the US produces in 1 second.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It is a step in the right direction to fusion power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why is Israel blaming Iran for that bus bombing when they guy that did it was an Algerian-Swedish Islamist?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'American woman pulls a gun on an Electricity Company worker after he assaulted her to try and force entry to her property to replace her electricity meter with a smart meter she didn't want'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'boy, 7, dies from flesh eating bacteria infection hours after swimming in a South California lake'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wow, horror movie planned, faux new at 11'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'wow, horror movie planned, faux news at 11'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'kudos to Russia and China for standing up to Herr Clinton today'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Flesh-eating Showers", coming from a lake near you, soon'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"Death from triilions of nibbles -- the Flesh-eating Lake Bacteria"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"The Trouble with Nibbles"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"The Day of the Triilion Nibbles"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Bill Clinton was a great President of the Usa'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hasn't been any great presidents since JFK'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '.. and unlike those closet nazis G.W.Bush and D.Cheney'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'JFK was a rake and whoremonger'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama's closer to Stalin than to Hitler'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'jfk took us to the moon....we haven't dont anything great like that ever since.....so all presidents and congress since then suck.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'done even.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'i dunno al gore invented the internets lmao'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'JFK was planning to scrap the Federal Reserve and return to a currency printed by the state'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the moon-landing was filmed in 1969 (some say in a desert somewhere in the Usa)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, and your mom was the moon.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'my little countries president is good for dirty yellow magazine pages:('
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'at least your obama has a face'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'your president is larry flynt ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'obama has two faces'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but it's ok, if you have a business, you didn't make it, the government did'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(according to one of his latests tirades against capitalism and pro-communal (government) ownership)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'straight out of the communist handbook'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who would win in the upcoming war of Europe and USA vs China, Russia and the Middle East?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'General Dynamics.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who is he?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'not a he, but a big weapons corporation'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the largest maker of weapon systems in the world.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the cockroaches ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'probly no one most those countries have nuclear weapons and after we get done fireing them at each other a nuclear winter would ensue'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'think you'll find any war will be fought via proxy'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no one is going to use nukes, there is no money in it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the flesh-eating and corpse-eating bacterias'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or in a proxy country like Syria or Iran'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'now a neutron bomb...that would be better.....kill all life, but leave the buildings intact.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'Akuri you are forgetting about global warming, it would be nuclear late fall at best!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'human induced climate change'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'difficult to get excited about something that doesn't exist'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nature caused climate change.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Just wait to see how cold it gets once the ocean currents shut down because of the influx of fresh water.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'too cold, already too cold and wet here thanks to that'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'with most major pollutio-belching industries shut down after a hot-nuclear-world-war, that nuclear-fall is likely to turn into a nuclear-winter'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the freaking jet stream is in Canada now.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rizgoth is obvious a republican in truthdenial'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if anything...the extra co2 we added to the atmosphere and postponed the next ice age....and that is a good thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd be more worried about the destruction pharma/aggro corps are wreaking on the ecosystem'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ixle: 'It is agroculture isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ixle: 'Er, aggroculture'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'with the extra CO2 in the air, the republican may enjoy all those extra tornadoes and hurricanes devastating some rgions of the Usa'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"aggro-culture" ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'so far we haven't managed to establish much of a connection between co2, global warming and tornadoes etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'right, and tornadoes never happened 100 years ago, or big hurricanes for that matter.....you do realize there hasnt been a cat5 hurricane since 2005 right ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'cat5 in the atlantic that is....not counting the pacific, cause most of them are cat5 anyways.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'say Tinada attempting to mimic the stereotypical "ostrich"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada shrugs in response to Zade's question.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'the amount of bad science coming out of the believer camps is staggering'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nogs'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'republican "ostriches": they stick their heads in corporate lies and avoid deducing the truth'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'when the co2 levels are 3x higher than now...then we can worry...but it will never reach that point because of us...power generation technology is improving way to fast.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I'm not a demopublican'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'democrip? rebloodlican?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'or a republicrat'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'US co2 production is actually dropping now because of technology efficiency.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'that and moving all the factories to china :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mostly the being paid to move them to CHina'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then wondering why nobody has a job'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Tinada obviously did not study science logic in school'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'factories produce little co2 compared to homes and commercial buildings.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'when the official limit for this.. radiation thing rised too much after chernobyl the politicians cured people with rising the approved limit.. 10x or so.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'most coal plants have modern co2 scrubbers now, and the ones that dont are closing within 5 years to be replaced with natgas plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I am quite stupid and ignorant, yes. This does however not make the AGW-science any better.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'climate change is just a thing the UN jumped on to try and make a grab for power and resources'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US is close to 61% oil independent now....up from around 40% in 2000.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'number of people on food stamps in the USA doubled in just over a year'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'only because they allowed more people to qualify.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'irrelevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: '1 in 4 people qualify for food stamps now, compared to 1 in 8 a few years ago.....it was made easier to qualify so that people who need it can get it easier.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'still irrelevent, more people on food stamps means higher costs, bigger debts'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'and perhaps since JPM makes big $ from managing the programs and Walmart etc. make lots of money selling the food'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the republicans want to turn the Usa into a country of poor and disenfranchised'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'just like the democrats, then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's pretty much what Obama wants, too, you mnight notice a pattern'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'left/right, they're the same'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama and Romney are even funded by the same company'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they agree on pretty much all major policies'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so where's your choice?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '"Obamacare" isn't a major policy then?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obamacare was written by Romney'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Sometimes it's better to vote for a good candidate who can't win, instead of the bad candidate who might defeat the worse candidate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'while governor of massivehugetits, written in conjunction with the health insurance corporations'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Yes, but Romney, the flip flopper that he is, has publicly stated that should he be voted into office, he'll start the repeal of Obamacare on day one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'd believe a flipflopper?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Either he's lying through his teeth or he intends to go against his own agenda to appease the right.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'possibly both'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Either way, liar or flip-flopper with no principles. Or both, yeah.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Having everyone covered by health insurance is good, and it seems pretty barbaric and crazy that the US hasn't gotten that far yet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but i doubt he'd get rid of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So if Obama and Romney agree on most things, Obama's still the better candidate.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'since it's written for the benefit of the health insurance companies and pharmaceutical corps, NOT the public'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'At least he's not openly lying to people's faces about major policy stances.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Nevertheless, the Obamacare way really looks set up to benefit insurance companies and large corporations again. I'd be willing to bet pretty much any amount of money that Obama didn't read the thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US provides universal healthcare for some people....just not all....I guess those programs are good enough to exist...but not good enough for everyone....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'and I need to learn to type faster than Tigernuts..'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The U.S. provided free healthcare to a very select number of people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Alaska natives have free universal healthcare ever since statehood.....paid for by the US govt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And trust me, Obamacare is a setback for the medical corporations. Could it have been better? yes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But the Republicans fought tooth and nail to wear down the original proposal to its current state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And ANY step forward is better than NO step forward.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how can it possibly be a setback?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it guarantees them profit'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it guarantees them a monopoly'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They cannot continue the bullshit practice of denying people coverage due to pre-existing conditions?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they can'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Healthcare insurance should be a public/gov't/tax thing, if only for the greater pooling effect and eliminating profit- and rent-seeking middlemen'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not if it's the public option.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there is no public option'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh yeah. the Republicans made sure to kill that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you'd studied the Uk model, you'd see what Obamacare is, is the absolutely worst of both worlds'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if there had been a public option....everyone would have joined except the people who have private insurance already.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if he wanted social healthcare, he should have fucked the insurance companies and given everyone social healthcare'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They tried?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, they didn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The republicans and several turncoat democrats voted it down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, they didn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Or filibustered it, I think.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there was vested interest involved from the very beginning'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada nods at Summoner Yuna.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'always look for the vested interests :-0'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'US politicial system/processes are so messed up, it's almost pointless to try to assign blame to either party.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'agreed, Tinada'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm off to bed, maybe you should discuss the US Boy Scout associations' decision to uphold a ban on gay scouts and scout leaders'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It's quite easy when 100% of a party votes a certaim way whil 5% of the other party votes the same way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I rather liked the 2 term limit for all politicians, don't recall who suggested it'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Yuna loves talking about that'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: '1 term in office - 1 term in jail'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What about George Zimmerman going on Fox News stating that him shooting and killing Trayvon Martin was "Part of God's plan"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And how he REGRETS NOTHING of what happened that night.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'lol he said that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eZxpwb0UYuk'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'So he's a bit crazy, then. That doesn't mean it wasn't self-defence.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'It couldn't POSSIBLY have been self-defense. If some random loon (who's OBVIOUSLY CRAZY) is following you in a car WITH A GUN when you're just walking home, it is not self-defense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade blames the callous greedy republicans and tea-party douchebags (aka "unamerican" traiters) for causing some/many of the troubles in the USA
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Even IF Trayvon Martin walked up to Zimmerman to ask what the FUCK was wrong with him, HE had the gun. And he SHOT TO KILL.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'it is if you attack him....this will probably end up being negligent homicide'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Negligent homicide is if you ACCIDENTALLY injure someone and they die.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He's either innocent due to self-defense or he's GUILTY of murder in the 2nd degree.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'it is also when you instigate circumstance'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You don't seem to understand the Stand Your Ground law allowed Trayvon Martin to attack Zimmerman.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'If it did, why is he in jail and under investigation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And why the FUCK would Martin attack Zimmerman when he was unarmed and Zimmerman was armed?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'not negligent - premeditated purposeful homicide '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I can't claim to have followed all the details in this case, but originally the police closed the investigation because the only available eyewitness supported Zimmerman's self-defence explanation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's not true at all, Tinada.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, don't forget that Zimmerman probably planned on skipping town once he posted bail originally.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'and, if someone has you down on the ground, banging your head into whatever, then shooting him, even shooting to kill, is self-defence, I'm afraid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Well, FUCK aside, he maybe attacked Zimmerman because he thought he was being robbed and could wrestle the gun away...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zimmerman self-incriminated Zimmerman'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'at least it was when I studied law..'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'he and his wife used code when talking about his 2nd passport and their extra money and then they lied about how much money they had so they'd have to pay less in bail.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why? The only reason for what must've been that they planned on leaving the country. I'm surprised he was even allowed bail after that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'that doesnt imply guilt to the original crime, just their knowledge that they  might not get a fair trial'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why are you believing a KNOWN LIAR, Tinada?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zimmerman LIES ALL THE FUCKING TIME.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'AND he's a religious loon.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So why take his word for it? We only have his word that Martin banged his head on the sidewalk. No DNA or blood spatter proves that claim AFAIK.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Whut? I read the original accounts when released by police, and stopped there, since whatever really happened, there's about 100% probability that someone is going to make a career out of trying to convict Zimmerman.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zimmerman deliberately stalked provoked and killed the "nigger" -- a premeditated murder and also a premediated hate crime'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Hell, if it had taken place in Texas......there wouldnt even be a damn trial.....self defense....end of story!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Why wouldn't he think he'd get a fair trial?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because the evidence disproves his accounts?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Texans are blatant racists (?)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I wouldn't expect to get a fair trial in the US.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'moral of the story...make sure you shoot someone of your own race...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'lets see, a guy protecting his neighborhood from a goon trying to steal from the neighborhood.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The fuck are you talking about?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Trayvon Martin LIVED in the neighbourhood. He was on his way HOME.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'haha, this debate is boring, lets go back to co2 production destroying the world.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'So why is their no evidence that shows trajectory analysis?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'yes, Rizgoth. It's boring because you just told a BLATANT LIE.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Rizgoth sank to another low -- support of hate-crimes against law-abiding "niggers"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'in reality, zimmerman probably told him to stay and get on the ground, martin probably tried to fight him, got upper hand, zimmerman pulled out gun'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He had NO RIGHT to tell Martin to get on the ground. For all martin knew, Zimmerman was a robber.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'Surely just because Martin was found with apparently stolen goods, drugs and whatnot, doesn't prove he's a criminal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The stand your ground law allows Martin to attack Zimmerman in that circumstance. Zimmerman had ZERO authority to do what he did.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'he had stolen goods? that wasn't what i heard.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'He might, for instance, have been an off-duty Goldman Sachs employee.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'For all Martin knew, Zimmerman was a loon with a gun lying about being a neighbourhood watchman.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Rizgoth is LYING, Kraken.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also Tinada, apparently.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'That was on another occasion, while at school, iirc, he had a bunch of jewelry.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And who CARES if he was a criminal? He wasn't doing anything criminal AT THAT TIME.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, what authority does a neighbourhood watchman have anyway?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'most of em just seem like busybodies to me.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I don't personally care about the Zimmerman case and as such have no particular interest in lying about it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'That's like saying you've been caught shoplifting, Tinada, thus, if I stalk and kill you next week, it's OK.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'ZERO authority. The dispatch officer Zimmerman talked to told him to stop stalking Martin and not to get out of his car.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Because, you know, he had no authority.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'you dont have to listen to dispatch'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I didn't say you had to.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I don't care if Martin was a convicted famous bank robber. He wasn't doing anything illegal on that night. Zimmerman had no right to stalk and kill him.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'they will NEVER tell you shoot someone, even in your own home'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I was merely expanding on Rizgoth's suggestion that Martin might not be a saint. Construing my statement as implying anything else is somewhat disingenuous.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Uh... yeah they will.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In the states where it's legal, they can and will tell you to shoot intruders.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'they should outlaw murder so people don't do it...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Aterius, desist from the flawed conjectures:  if "zimmerman probably told him to stay and get on the ground", that was a "mugging" and when Martin's death resulted as a direct result of this "mugging", Zimmerman is (automatically) guilty of murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'conjecture or take zimmerman's word for it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Tinada, i wasn't even referring to you when I said "HE had lied". I was referring to Rizgoth. Didn't even notice your little statement at that time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'one of the two....i asked for analysis of bullet trajectories'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'God, this is a riot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada tickles Summoner Yuna.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Rizgoth's statement: "lets see, a guy protecting his neighborhood from a goon trying to steal from the neighborhood....."'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He claimed Martin was actively trying to steal that night. I said he wasn't. Then you jumpe din with "Surely just because Martin was found with apparently stolen goods, drugs and whatnot, doesn't prove he's a criminal."'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So even if I HAD read your statement first, it seemed pretty clear you were agreeing with Rizgoth, implying Martn had been stealing ON THE NIGHT IN QUESTION.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'That's ok, I shouldn't really mess with this since you actually care.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada apologizes to Summoner Yuna with a very sincere look on his face.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Rizgoth: Martin was trying to steal from the neighbourhood! Me: No he wasn't. Tinada: Stolen goods was found on him!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'A case of mistaken identify means it cant be 1st degree murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What reasonable person would not assume you meant he was trying to steal on the night in question?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'OF COURSE it can be.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'they really found stolen goods on him?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'NO.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And who the heck did Zimmerman mistake Martin for?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'The school decided not to puruse the jewelry case, apparently.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'or pursue..'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'one of the black youths that was burglarizing that neighborhood for over a year'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He ALLEGEDLY stole some jewelry or whatnot at school. You know, minor locker theft or whatever. Nothing violent. ALLGEDLY and NON-VIOLENT being keywors.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And it's inconsequential seeing as how he wasn't doing anything illegal on the night of the shooting.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'regardless, even if he was a thief, zimmerman couldnt shoot him...but what if zimmerman was patrolling and he was attacked, THEN he pulled out his gun'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'BUT HE WASN'T.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'how do you know ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'the main thing they teach you in concealed carry class is that brandishing is a MANDATORY 3 year sentence'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Where you a fly on the wall watching it happen ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'were even...sheesh.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'According to Zimmerman's OWN testimony, this is not what happened.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Conceal carry people don't pull out their weapons...i am scared to death of someone seeing mine'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'According to his OWN testimony, he STALKED Martin while Martin was simply walking home for NO REASON other than that he thought Martin looked "suspicious".'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'I just have a hard time believing Zimmerman walked over and shot him just like that...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'chances are someone will try to steal your concealed weapon if they know you have it....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'So unless Zimmerman is LYING to implicate himself, Martin did NOTHING wrong up until the moment they amde contact.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Aterius, have you read ANY of the information avaialble on this case?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'I wonder how many cases almost identical to this happen every year but garner no attention because they don't involve 1 white and 1 black person.  People are so racist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Enough to know i don't have enough facts to convict him of first degree murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Who's said anything about first degree murder? It's second degree murder.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there are enough facts, from Zimmerman, to convict Zimmerman (of second degree murder, perhaps first degree murder)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'This is why neighborhood watch, real ones anyways should always use digital recorders in their pocket etc when 'patroling' the neighborhood.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'By his own admission, he's guilty of AT LEAST second degree murder, UNLESS Trayvon attacked him for ABSOLUTELY NO REASON, for which we only have Zimmerman's words and Zimmerman is a KNOWN liar.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zimmerman is a loon. He probably wanted to play the hero, wanting fame and whatnot. And he made all the wrong choices. Bottom line is: What happened that night was entirely his fault.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Yes Rizgoth and eventually we will have gun cameras that will be affordable for consumers'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zimmerman commited a crime by aggressively stalking and mugging the victim, then directly subsequent to the mugging, the crime of murder'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What the flying fuck...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Apparently, Zimmerman's cousin has testified that Zimmerman has molested her for years since she was a teenager.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'was that under oath?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'But, hey, Martin probably attacked Zimmerman without provocation because he stole some jewelry at school... maybe.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '(honest question, i don't know)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Zimmerman (paraphrased) "this is a stickup -- hand over your freedom, or die, or both." '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'i was wrong. She claims it began at AGE SIX.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Really?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'And it was under... something? Apparently a taped witness statement,.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'he was 8 at the time, or something like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Zimmerman is 28. We have no clue what age the cousin is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'would give decent odds he was abused by his parents'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'How could you possibly know the cousin is 29?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I mean 26.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it was in the article I saw'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh wait, I missed that. She's 27 now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'In the traditional case of Zimmerman Transparency, his lawyer filed a motion to keep the allegations under wraps. Denied!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Zimmerman is guilty of making other concealed carry people look stupid, that is for sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I wonder if it might've been a case of "but my father touches me there too"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'or mother'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The scumdag lawyer also tried to seal 145 of Zimmerman's phone calls, many of which included calls where he and his wife talked in code about their finances.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'According to the cousin, the molestation continued for 10 years, 'til she was 26.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and now, for something completely different! Rebels advance in syria!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'is the end near?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'wait was she living with him?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and where's assad after that suicide bombing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I prefer Wendy's because they get their beef from the US and Canada, while the others get theirs from south america.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it started at age 6, continued until 26, went for 10 years, and she's 27 now?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'from 6 to 16'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Not every single day, obviously.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and is US/canadian beef really better than south american?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The last time it happened, he was staying at her parent's home.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Sorry, that's a typo. 'Til she was 16.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'Not the best guest'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Yes it is.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Australian beef is good also.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'which ones have higher incidence of mad cow?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'british'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I think back home we get the aussie stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'some countries banned us beef at some point over the mad cow thing...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'I can't wait to read Massad Ayoob's take on this...that and Gutsmacher (sp?)...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not sure what the status is now, I think they threatened skorea with all sorts of things to get them to reallow imports'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'only Japan has, but they have banned pretty much all imports of beef unless it has been tested for madcow disease beforehand...which the US will not allow.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, and the US banned european beef for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US FDA banned the pre testing of cattle for madcow.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, the testing of ALL cattle that is'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'they still do testing on like 1 in 1000 cattle.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'Japan does that? I wish we'd do that too... ban it all unless it has gone through screening...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'unless it costs way too much'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'it would add pennies per pound.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'why would they BAN testing?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '$&# american politicians'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi ducks defensively.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Money. From food corporations. That's fucking why.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '#*$&#* american voters'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They didn't simply make it not mandatory or ban mandatory testing. They banned it altogether. Yay!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Hmm. You could swear Sonshi has been here just a second ago. You wonder where he went ...
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'They say it would be impossible to test all cows in the US because our industry is so large....but that is bs, most smaller beef ranchers would love to test all their cows and proclaim their beef to be madcow free...but the govt wont let them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it'd be unfair to test all cows just because some cows got sick and died.  That's like searching all Muslims because some Muslims hijacked a plane.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they won't let them, or they don't want to do it out-of-pocket?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'we eat cows... we don't eat muslims.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no, the ones against the testing are the big factory farms, because their cattle are the unhealthiest.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, and if they allowed testing, I guess it would force them to test too, or lose market share.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and it would make them spend more on actually passing the testing'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'lower profit margins just so the peasants can have safer beef? Oh no, can't have that can we?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'safe water? Psh, that's for those communist europeans? Clean air? Bah, socialist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but because of that rule....Japan stopped importing over $2 billion in beef each year from the US. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Japan also banned the exporting of kobe beef outside of Japan....so any 'kobe' labeled beef in the US or anywhere is not real kobe beef, so dont pay the high price for it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi sticks a "real kobe beef, freshly smuggled from japan!" sticker on another package of beef.
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Japan has NEVER allowed the export of Kobe beef. And there's absolutely no regulation of what can be called Kobe beef, no.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'on a side note, I'm still amused that smugglers can make money smuggling sugar from canada.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a country that doesn't even produce sugar...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'sugar prices in the US are artificially high compared to world prices. :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah... and the average consumer doesn't care, because sugar's pretty cheap. It's only when they realise that sugar in processed stuff is replaced by hfcs...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, the US used to produce sugar....lots of it....in Hawaii and other US territories in warmer climates.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and US companies owned big ranches in sugar producing countries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'there is a celebrity named "Kobe" -- he dead yet, and is he doing cameo reappearances in cans of "Kobe beef"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'now most sugar grown in the US comes from sugar beets from utah, idaho, and some other western states.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'to make that sugar compete....the US put a tariff and import controls that basically doubled the price of sugar in the US.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'it also didnt help that Monsanto had created a new process to extract sugar from corn.....hence hfcs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'without that tariff, that land could be used for more productive purposes'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, the import restrictions are now used to keep cheap brazilian sugar out of the US.....otherwise the corn farmers would get hurt when the ethanol refineries stopped using their corn, for the cheap brazil sugar.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if the "madcow test" were inexpensive, less than a dollar, then testing all the cows is possible'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'they could switch to some other crop...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or corn could be used to feed people instead....imagine that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, imagine that...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'corn is for alcohol, end of story'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'corn manipulated human genes to produce more efficient distillers'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the cost of ethanol would probably drop by at least $1 a gallon if we stopped using corn, and switched to sugar from south america.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'feed corn used to feed animals, is hard to cook. and tastes terrible (-- the mildew and mold does not improve the flavor either --) compared to the taste of sweet corn sold for human consumption'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'but a 50 pound sack of feed corn in cheap -- mayhapse Rizgoth may "enjoy" eating a few sacks of feed corn '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'making ethanol from the farm waste is the holy grail though.....then we wouldnt need to use corn or other grains to make the ethanol.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I dont eat corn...it is bad for you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'off of rizgoth's bucket list: wander alone in a corn maze after dark'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'yet Rizgoth suggested other humans may be fed with corn -- double standard here'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'with 20 naked playboy bunnies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as long as voters think there's little difference whether they vote for very corrupt guy 1 and even worse guy 2, and split between them, the politicians will continues thinking that there's no harm in getting even worse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '*cough*republicans*cough*'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and that "insight", Sonshi, does not improve the situation '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'make it clear you'd vote for the slightly less corrupt guy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'or at least, slightly less likely to screw over the country guy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Yes, other humans should be eating corn, and feed the grass and corn to the cattle so I can have my steak....and a few leafy vegetables on the side.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope Sonshi, more likely to depress the voter so they do not vote at all, as any vote is a vote for corruption'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'see, that sort of attitude is why corruption keeps winning.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'Be clear. Any vote that puts anyone, anyone, in power is a vote for corruption. You have to decide for yourself what kind of corruption you can best tolerate. Not being super-rich, I choose non-super-rich corruption, generally.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'exactly, multiply that one vote with millions more that do not vote...and that is why nothing changes.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope, depressing fatalist comments bludgeoning the voters is what is supporting the corruption'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'on a slightly related note, a couple of high govt officials back home, department heads or something, got arrested for allegedly screwing employees of contractors...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and one got arrested for allegedly inflating travel claims'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'having fun with interns ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'nah, interns are fine'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'unless they work for the contractors'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you've got to vote for the slightly less bad guys, if you want to punish corruption. Doing nothing just enables it'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'once it becomes clear that there's a strong preference for clean govt, the next batch of candidates will be cleaner'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so, this year we shot 17 wild pigs on our ranch......lots of ham this year!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as it is, us politicians don't care too much about corruption because the voters don't care enough about it at the polls, no matter what they say.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'it would help if the polls even included anything about corruption in the government.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'wild pig is tasty.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'did Dru improve to offering happy advice, is the Dru description of world politics offering signposts to the straight and narrow happy path, or does bitter doom and gloom offer incentive to world improvement -- xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'for example, if romney wins, that's going to push the limits of conduct somewhat in a certain direction...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'you mean zippers will be superglued?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'see, even if the polls don't say anything explicitly about corruption, the fact that the polling numbers hardly waver when one candidate is much worse than the other says something about the average voter's priorities'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'could there be corruption of the polls?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'more information on what the candidates are actually going to do helps a lot too. A lot of us americans are rednecks who just think "zomg patriotism!"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the "logic" shown in this debate channel may be an indication of the "logic" shown by the lowly voter (or maybe not)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'rephrase Is there any doubt of corruption of the polls?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if the capital gains tax goes back to the regular taxrate....there will be a huge rush of money being transfered to tax free bonds.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, even if they rig the polls, it can't be rigged too much without being too obvious...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and if there's widespread rigging, regrettably, there's only one way, historically, to solve that'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'REVOLUTION!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and yeah, sadly, most voters don't care enough yet to see what the candidates are about'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'widespread investment by citizens in national tax free bonds, displacing foreign interest cannot be a bad thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, more people should put their money into tax free muni bonds.....start rebuilding this country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, there are already such bonds... and you can't force people to buy them...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, if the capital gains tax goes back to what it was before the bush tax cuts....people will downsize their income from stocks and put it into tax free bonds.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'The so called free market makes such bonds more accessible to large baks and foreign interests than to the average citizen'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'tak, another of "*****'s useful idiots" calls out for revolution -- as though prior revolutions were not a lesson in massive bloodshed and further worse corruption'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if romney wins and successfully cuts taxes on the top bracket, I can't help but predict a budget disaster... next time there's an emergency, there'll be nothing left'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nah, anyone can buy tax free muni bonds using any online broker...and the min investment is blocks of $5000'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'very few revolutions work out okay, and those that do are usually bloodless'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the libyan one hasn't fallen apart yet...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'there we agree. The next big dip is likely to be a disaster. and sequestration courts that dip/disaster'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'encouraging news from the latest elections'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'muslim brotherhood crushed in their first elections in decades'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'syrian govt on defensive...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, sectarian violence and retribution is a big worry there'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'reducing your taxable income is always a good idea....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I dont think tax increases will happen anytime soon though, considering democrats are about to lose control of congress in the next election.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'currently, Democrate are preferable to Republicans'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'regrettably, a republican victory will push the acceptability needle yet another notch in favour of corruption...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'so... any opinions on the impact, etc., of the syrian suicide bombing, or the recent offensive?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'woo, the current salary of congresspeople is now $174,000 per year'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not too much, really...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'only a fraction of what they really get!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'politicians - what you don't pay them, they get by screwing you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'just like an NBA player.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the salary of congress has been frozen since 2009.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'heh. Some syrian rebels are saying, essentially, screw you, looks like we don't need your help now'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the avg perk given to congress for office workers is $1.5 million'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'more border checkpoints seized by rebels, govt forces in apparent disarray, judging from reporting by reuters'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the max amount the congress person can pay a staffer is $150,000 per year, out of the $1.5 million per year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'refugees fleeing en masse following the forced openings of the borders by the rebels'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'so 10 "friends", eh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Outside Employment Income is generally limited to 15% of member pay. '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'specify per politician or total, since 1.5m total divided by several hundred politicians is econimical'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so they can earn another 15% on top of the $174,000 per year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'economical'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no, it is $1.5 million per senator or house member.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'All investment income of senator or house member must be put into trust until they are out of office.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'back in 1789, the salary for senators or house members was $6 per day.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: '6 dollars per day? Greedy bastards.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'is that more or less than it is now, I wonder...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'in 1855, it went to $3,000 per session.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'during the great depression, they made $9,000 per year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'while the avg american made about $2 a day back then. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ferien: 'I'd like to counter your point, depression isn't great, it is sad :('
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: '1965 is when the pay of congress started to go up quickly....went from $22,000 to $35,000'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'astronauts made $18,000 that year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'not the base pay, though. That's extra.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no, that is base salary.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'not if they are in the military. They also get their grade pay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'in 1991 the salaries went from $96,000 to $125,000....the largest increase in congressional history.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'that was base astronaut salary, not including hazard or flight pay.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and grade pay'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'oh, and with the recent release of this year's IMO results, I can't help but note once again that iran seems to be educating its women better than the US. Iran. I mean... Iran.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'astronauts also made around $12,000 a year from Time magazine for articles, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it's a good job :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'considering how often they actully work :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you'd think it would be easy to do better on that measure than a repressive theocracy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'actually*'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'more training than anything though'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and public appearances, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and the training to be an astronaut is brutal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'especially back then.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'given how hard they work, and the skills they have, they're probably underpaid, if anything.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'That is why military test pilots were used.....highly skills, and underpaid. :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'so if the training for ranger or seal. But once the training is done, the level of stress is greatly reduced.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'so is*'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'astronaut training is never "done"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but they did ok.....most of them became millionaires after leaving NASA.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there's always some new piece of eq, some new delivery system, some new interface...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'eh, for people of anywhere near that kind of education and skill, millionaires are a dime a dozen'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'corvettes at cost for life is a nice perk though.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure there is always something new, but something new for an expert doesn't mean the same something new for an neophite.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'speaking of which, I wonder what's the latest with the china program...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'neophyte*'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'rarely are there major improvements in avionics.....it is usually just a small improvement.....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'it is when a new person learns the avionics that it is a struggle to learn it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'the scramjet program is going places, and that looks to be a giant leap forward'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'mach 20 ....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the china program is really the only thing that can give the us a kick in the behind now...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the question would be why would they need a pilot, since a human can't react fast enough to do anything at mach 20.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'its not piloted'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a kick they need if nasa is going to do big things again.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, scramjets are not piloted...the g forces would kill you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'it certainly employs more people thought'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, perhaps njot kill you, but it would suck I think.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'of course, they could spend all their R&D money into ways to improve society, but let me put down the hookah and get real.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'shrugs, someone has to be too big to fight for there to be "society"'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the US wastes a lot of money on stupid things when we could be spending it on a new moon mission...and a moonbase. :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha. Ninjas in iran? http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/shortcuts/2012/feb/19/irans-female-ninjas'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'the moon is a harsh mistress'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, there are at least 2 records of military personnel having been exposed to 45 Gs. The sled they used to test for the X15s and once somone had to be bail out of a supersonic jet at 90K ft.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the us will think about a moonbase when china looks like it's serious about getting there first.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'this was in the 1950s'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, China is being smart, why duplicate all the work everyone else has done already?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'john glenn when he bailed out of that silver rocket ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'no, not Jonh Glenn, this was before even the Sputnik.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it was a test pilot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'was it me?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, it could have been :) You are old enough :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'here is the stuff on the sled: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stapp'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Caramel Milkshake: 'did he end up looking like a resident evil monster?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'connect 2 atlas rockets to my donkey......Donkey in Space!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: '1 small asteroid that is 2% gold/silver/platinum group and mostly iron ore would pay for the moonbase, and mars base.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure, if you can guarantee that the gold+ would not go to the "contractors".'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, considering they wouldnt be allowed to 'own' it, it would be in the contract to salvage the asteroid of where the ores go :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I think that China's efforts to go into space will end up in warfare. The US has dreams of owning the universe so it will try to swat down any competition. The Japanese and the Europeans don't count because they would not take a military force into space.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'most likely the salvage company that went to get and mine the asteroid would get a % of the ore mined.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'why not all? The rock doesn't belong to anyone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'or do you actually think the US has jurisdiction over the Asteroid Belt?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the legality of it is beyond me, but pretty sure there are laws against a private company from owning an asteroid, or another planet, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and extracting the ore to bring back to the earth and then eventual sale would go against the long arm of the US govt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if they can get it, they'll own whatever they can get from it. "Use" is permitted.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'just incorporate it somewhere else, and land in a neutral country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I am sure the US is arrogant enough to have enacted those laws, but they don't have jurisdiction. Anything they do out in space can easily be labeled piracy. The international maritime laws already cover the issue adequately. '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Just like how private companies need govt permission to launch rockets into orbit.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'US companies'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the most preferable equatorial country to land for such a shipment would probably be mine, really... Would be easier too, since they can headquarter there too.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'no corporation is going to fund an expedition to find a suitable asteroid to mine it without extensive govt funding.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'just build them in the us, and ship the rockets and systems over to us!'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'don't bet a SpaceX spinoff won't'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'SpaceX has a $700 million NASA contract :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'only because people in government are already involved with the company, even if collaterally. So, the government "oversight" is just another way to insure that those in government get their cut.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if it's done completely privately, it would not be surprising if they decided to launch from an equatorial country.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you already pointed out that space operation are self-financed. Private enterprise need not get government funding, but they do risk government reprisals if they attempt to cut them out of the deal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, most mining companies do business with multi national banks.....unless they want to be blockaded, they will give the govt its share. :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'history is already full of examples of how empires deal with their colonies :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but chances are, they wont be able to get complete private funding for such a thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and I doubt a privately financed moonbase will ever get off the ground without govt help.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'the fourteenth colony was Great Britain'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, maybe not now, since many corporations are controlled by old foggies who still believe that space is a fantasy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'perhaps someday we could use nanites that could mine the asteroids, and separate the different ores, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or use them to build solar panels on the moon.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'certainly beats using them to defy the political pressures preventing development of productive fusion power'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'should I fart on my mom or not?  thats the real debate here.........'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler lets off a real rip-roarer ... a greenish cloud envelops Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler!
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'methane wasted to the atmosphere'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler sulks in the corner.  Baby!!
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'If we stopped using coal to produce electricity.....what could we use it for ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'hold up the ground above?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'barbeques'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'dirkdigglers mom could do that......FAT.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, charcoal is for bbq's :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'barbeques are a great use of coal'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'hmm ok i suppose'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'coal would add a nasty taste to bbq.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'and you could tell how?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'non open fire! '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'we might as well keep using coal to produce power since there is nothing else to use it for....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'except holding up mountains'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'mountains are overrated....they will erode away eventually anyways.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'which is the best use of coal, keeping the ground from collapsing on itself.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'flatten mountains so we can build cities on them! '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'equality'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'we need the coal tunnels for when the asteroid hits.....need a place to live.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sound like you've been to Pittsburgh :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'wouldn't want only some people too drown when sea levels rise'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'or my uni'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hah, the sea levels are not going to rise THAT much.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sea levels are not going up, land is sinking :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'stop being reasonable'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'wrong Chan to be reasonable'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: '(try gclan for logic) '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'gclan is far from logical.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'yes it is'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'using coal for power when you have a 200 year supply is logical.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'coal power is down to 40% of the national production now though...and continuing to drop.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'there were thousands of years of oil when they first started using it too'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure it's logical, always set your technology for stuff that's temporary. Who gives a crap about the future generations that have to scrap the junk and stasrt all over? I mean, look at what happened to gas lights :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I would have no problem giving up coal power for natgas power plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'or more nuclear power plants.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that jsut postpones the problem.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'there are no alternatives that can replace them right now, or in 20 years.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the problem being that all that crap comes in a finite amount.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'not to mention that the crap also shortens the life expectancy of everything except amoebas.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'solar power is a nice dream.....unless you enjoy watching tv or using a computer when the sun goes down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'batteries...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'nanotechnology will make the dream a reality'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'suppose we could cover every roof with solar panels, but that would cost 100x more than using nuclear power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'battery tech needs to improve'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it is only a "dream" because it's an emerging technology. I am sure you are not saying that it is impractical in the long run, because you are you'll have to explain how we will keep from sinking back into the stone age when all the fossil fuel is gone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and emerging technology that is 60+ years old  :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'an emerging'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, do you think that those getting rich from oil have not done anything to impede the research?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, fossil fuels will never be gone, because we can create it from algae.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and it would be carbon neutral.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'it's a matter of cost efficienc'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'perhaps you should read about how perpetual motion engines don't work.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'oil price will keep rising'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'what does pm engines have to do with algae ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, I dont think oil prices will go all that much higher for a long time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'considering there is so much supply now.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you said that fossil fuel won't ever be gone, because of algae. That is subject to the law of diminishing returns for one, and for another, unless you have a perpetual motion engine, that source will be gone because at some point the amount or algae required will be too great to produce the necessary fuel.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'and the sun is going to burn out at some point too i think we need to throw money into researching that too how to keep it burning'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'a $50 profit is still a really good profit even if the $70 profit oil is gone.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'by the time the sun burns out we better have terra forming tech and space travel'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'or do you think that the algae supply is inexhaustable?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'inexhaustible*'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'as inexhaustible as lettuce'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'you can grow algae, just like you can drill for oil, algae produces more energy than it takes to grow it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'maybe you should also read how eco systems work...'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you can't get something for nothing, everything requires energy, so the algae to fossil fuel thing is a perpetual motion engine.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Redryn: 'algae is really low in the eco system, easy to isolate and grow in farms'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'or, but it isn't, so it means that eventually the algae either will be gone or it won't  be enough, same thing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure you can grow it, at the expense of something else.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'We are not exactly getting oil for nothing......it takes energy to get it out of the ground, well the same is for algae....I do not see a problem with using energy to produce algae when the energy produces from it is larger than what is put into it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you have to pay the piper, always.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'besides, algae by itself isnt the answer...we will need a variety of energy sources.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but algae oil can reduce our dependence on fossil fuels.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'just like how electric hybrid vehicles can reduce our dependence on gasoline or diesel.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'but raise our dependance on coal fuel cause we have to plug them in at night lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, coal shouldnt be providing so much of our power needs.....20 to 30% is good enough....'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'more natgas power would be nice.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'would like to see solar and wind get at least 10%'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: '10% combined, not each.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'what blow my mind is that you rather spend all that effort on producing oil rather than in harvesting the gigawatts of energy landing on the planet daily and basically for as long as the it exists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'would rather do both, if you could figure out a way to provide it at night.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'except for natgas power plants....you can't just turn off a baseline power plant and back on each day as you need power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'natgas power plants are mainly used when you need extra power....and turned off first when you dont need the power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'amazing :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'solar power production in the daytime is great.....but at night the natgas power plants would need to run to produce the power lost from the sun.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and of course, the output from the Sun is so minimal that storing energy for use during the dark hours is out of the question.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, if the problem of storing that power could be solved. :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'we have moved from flint axes to solid state circuity. I think that we can solve that problem too.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'We could turn the extra solar power into hydrogen, and then use the hydrogen in a fuel cell.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but that would cost much much more than a natgas plant.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you do love to burn things don't you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'come up with an alternative that works, and I am sure people would do it. :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I can't, I am not trained for it. But I am sure that there are those who are either trained already or can be trained to solve the problem. That's how humans have moved to this point from the stone age.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'pump water uphill'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'also, fuel cells do not burn hydrogen to produce electricty.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you must hate them, then :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'if it doesn't burn, it's not worth having :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so using extra solar power to produce hydrogen through electrolysis and then using the hydrogen in a fuel cell would work, except that it would cost 3x as much as other power sources.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nuclear power doesnt burn anything to produce heat, and I am all for nuclear.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'or, you could have horses moving in a circle turning a wheel around a magnetized pole :> I mean, we don't want to move forward scientifically. We want to still use the same basic technology that launched the Industrial Revolution. If it was good enough for them, well, it should be good enough for us :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I suppose I could put a couple horses in front of my natgas vehicle, and tow it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'but until that wonderful utopia when all power comes from solar panels and wind turbines.....I will keep using natgas, nuclear and coal.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you sound like an "old foggie" :) Just think that there are still people alive that didn't believe once that airplanes would work :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and spite of them, we were discussing earlier about planes going at mach 20. '
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'fogie, ffs. :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'whatever :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'hydrogen fuel compressed storage is too dangerous and expensive'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'not to mention barbaric :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'how is compressed hydrogen dangerous?  It would explode up :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the people on the hindenburg who jumped would have survived if they had ridden the damn thing down as the hydrogen burned upwards.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'pre-assuming they were not already broiled and barbecued while riding down'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'what's a little heat anway :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade suspects that somebody did not actually watch the film footage of the Hindenburg
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, I sure there is someone who hasn't watched the movie :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I like disasters :) Was fascinated by the sinking of the Andrea Doria :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'singers ruin their reputation singing about disasters'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'they wouldn't have survived.  Maybe they wouldn't have burned (then again, they were actually only a few feet away from a 12-alarm fire), but they likely would've gotten killed by the fall or the fact that a whole lot of support superstructure landed on them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, there are 2 things people will always sing about :) getting laid and getting killed :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'gordon foot-in-mouth'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'he's got another cd out recently'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you mean gordon 1-nonsec?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: '1-nanosec, that is :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'hey have any of you ever gotten the fruit-basket? I haven't'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'The Fruit-Basket. Is when your woman cups your privates into her hand & stuffs them between your legs to suck you from behind.'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Undertaken Anaristos goes, "Hmmmm."
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'just what I wanted to discuss :) Should she use her left or right hand?'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'rofl'
T3/r7/2012-07-19.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'academic, actually. In my case she would have to use both and might require help anyway...'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the career of ozzy osbourne....actually dazed and confuses....he can't remember a damn thing of his musical career. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'such it was'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'evil doers are trying to weaponize ebola virus....'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'weaponized smallpox kills up to 40% of the affected..'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'an outbreak of influenza H1N1 in mexico spread around the world in a week, and killed hundreds, it could have been worse.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'govt researchers managed to reconstruct the spanish flu virus that killed 25 million people in 1918-19......'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Over 80 cities in the US now have biologicial sensors on buildings to detect bio or chemical weapons'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'kinda surprised he used a shotgun, and not a p90.....a multi shot shotgun has 8-12 shots, but a p90 has 50'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tzadkiel: '- how are you not the mech?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'evenin folks'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'really should get rid of the UN'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'UN declaration on human rights Article 29 section 3: These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the UN'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'read as: Do as we say, not as we do'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can always rely on the good people of Colorado to pull out a gun massacre whenever an important arms control treaty is about to be signed....'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, the denver shooter was part of a neuroscience/mind control program'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sounds vaguely familiar'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NMr2VrhmFI&feature=plcp&hd=1'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'He died due to using up all of his remaining Ki.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'how nice, the avg mortgage rate for multi millionaires is 1.7 %, and the avg rate for billionaires is 1.05 %'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'why would a billionaire take a mortgage?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'OPM'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'other people's money'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'not sure what that means'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'because, they can earn a bigger return on their money if they are using it, and not handing it over to a bank up front.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'it means if the billionaire uses his own money to finance a house he loses the future opportunity of that money'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'so they use stock as colateral to back up a low interest loan on a house.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zomfg Zoranth is agreeing with that Rizgoth person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'simple example: if you buy a house for 100k rather than 2k (bank financed) you have 98k to buy future houses with, which could be potential sources of cashflow'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if you had the money to back up the loan, you could get also get a low interest mortgage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'in other words, the billionaire already has the money, and the bank has all the assurances they need, therefore allows this risk-free loan to have a low interest rate?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'yup..having the cash on hand also gives you the opportunity to persue other opportunities, rather than having all your cash locked up in one deal'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'you're saying this like it's a bad thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'nobody wealhy has a lot of cash, it's all in assets'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'It isnt, that is how multi millionaires become extremely wealthy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'you mean it's how really wealthy people become even more wealthy, according to the original statement, they didn't get low interest rates when they were not wealthy'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if you had something to back it up, you did.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'think about it, lets say duplexes in a certain city cost on average 100k each, and you have 100k on hand and the bank will finance you for the 100k with 2k down. would you rather buy 50 houses, all bank financed increasing your cashflow, or would you rather buy one house outright'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if you had a house paid for, you could easily use it for colateral to back up a new mortgage on another rental investment'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'if you're willing to lose that house in case things don't go as planned, why not? some people prefer to have some certainty and buy just one'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'the problem with leverage is when the underlying asset falls in value, hence the current financial meltdown'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'that is the diference between the middle class and the rich.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'sure, but its a slower bus to wealth...how the rich get rich is velocity of their money..making it work harder via financing (good debt)'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'still don't get what is the problem about wealthy people getting lower interest rates'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'well, my house has a 2.8% mortgage rate...thought that was pretty good at the time...and I put 50% down.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'still, you probably ended up with negative total balance after you signed the deal'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'How do you figure ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'just guessing'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'market tanking?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'not in north Texas'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'its good'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: '?'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'clandonate 300000'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Texas didnt experience the high runup in home prices like other parts of the nation, or the high unemployment.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'woops'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'nice'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I paid $160k for my 4 bedroom 2.5 bath home with 2 car garage, pool in backyard, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zomfg Zoranth: 'wow deal'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'and plano texas is ranked #4 in the best places to live in America.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: '3 of the fastest growing economies in large cities are in Texas....the Austin area, Dallas-Ft Worth area, and the Houston area.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Who knows, in the future, Austin might even replace silicon valley as the tech center of the US.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'kind of annoyed that E-surance sold out to allstate....after the sale happened the jackasses raised my insurance cost by 20% for the next year....so I switched to farmers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'mmm, pepsi max.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'mmm, poison'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'I have some pest control chemical if you need a good drink.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'i know, you said so'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'pepsi max is good for you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-20.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'sure...'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'There is a ranch in Mexico for sale.....98,000 acres for $20 an acre.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scurvy: '2 mill for a slice of what they mean when they say "middle of nowhere"'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'nod, the ranch is located in north central mexico, with rolling hills, grasslands, 16 water tanks, a ranch house, corrals, and water rights.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'but no infrastructure...'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'it is a ranch for cattle....what more do you need ?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, I am sure the cattle will enjoy it :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'john wayne it :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'ah, to late....it just sold to someone....it was listed for a whole 62 minutes. :p'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'the ranch didnt have electricity from a grid, but it did have 3 wind turbines, a 15,000 watt solar system, and battery backup.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I guess that would work. Put in an earth station and I am set'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the place is enough far south to hit the equatorial satellites with no sweat :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'build a nice adobe home with 2 foot thick walls, and you wouldnt even need AC.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'true enough. A lost art.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ixle: 'www.calearth.org'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and don't forget the floor about 2 feet below the surface :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'so, any takers on this james holmes' fellas motiviations? conspiracies? cover up? experimentation with mind altering drugs as a neuroscience student?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'What did he do?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'he's the guy that shot up the batman premiere in aurora, colorado'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Ah.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Xei: 'allegedly, i should say. guilty until proven innocent or whatever, right??'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'forget that, make him watch the movie all the way through, I say. No mercy, none.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Dunno, could it be racial, that seems to be a common theme for insane people (refer to norway).'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Faceater: 'test.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'hmm, the Vatican owns about $8 billion in real estate around the world.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Faceater: 'And they make about 316mil a day in tourist ticket sales.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'uh, per year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'The Vatican lost $6 million last year, but the Vatican Bank made over $400 million it is estimated, on deposits of $20 billion or so.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'at least Catholicism is profitable with all those subscribers -- xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Faceater: 'Yea, I was mistaken. I was thinking 40k visitors per day at about 25 a head. The average was around 39k visitors per day when we were there in May. The 300 mil was what I remembered talking about, and I got it mixed up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'The survivors of the Colorado Batman shooting are strangely calm. They must still be in shock, not yet comprehending what they just went through.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'I'm watching interviews with some of them and they're just strangely detached. One guy talks about his friend who didn't make it in a calm manner. Two people (possibly a couple) look and sound as if they're discussing the weather.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if they are not told that they are (supposed to be in) shock, maybe they won't go into shock'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'and who knows sometimes it takes a little while for it to fully sink in and they could be denying it some too'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'if they are not told that they are (supposed to be) in shock, maybe they won't go into shock'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(maybe the unscathed "knew" that their "time" was not yet up)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(the nonexistent) god works in mysterious ways'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade trolls: seems that some of the vultures^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H peanut gallery are more in shock (from disappointment) than the "survivors"
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'BABY KILLING....good or bad?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'uh'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'good.  Ever had veal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'come'on i'm trying to get a very long debate....'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler nods at the soul of Hans.
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler nods at Hanslanda.
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'but that soul of Hans had a good point too'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'consider that these 'babies' you ask about are mere constructs of your mind's interpretation of what may, or may not, be sensory phnomena.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'my mind just blew up'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) YnysMon: 'i win'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'think i'll go eat a baby'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'according to Schroedinger, there's an infinite number of babies in an infinite number of states.  There's no way you're going to thin the herd, but that's no reason to not try.'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that's not actually what he said...'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'what he said was that the baby was in all possible states until the wave function collapsed (by observing the baby).'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'who was it that said Shroedinger didn't have it quite right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the cat, the spca, peta '
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scurvy: 'Shroedinger made up the cat as an example of how ridiculous quantum uncertainty is'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, you could say that anyone who agreed with the Copenhagen interpretation :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'wait are we still talking bout killing & or eating babies?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'my bad'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'im all ears'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'we rub them onto us too, Dirk.  What did you think they made baby oil out of?'
T3/r7/2012-07-21.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the point of Schrodinger's experiment was to show that the Copenhagen interpretation was wrong :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha. Krugman once agains complains about (many) economists' obsessions with assuming perfect rationality'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '"Well, if the assumption of perfect rationality breaks down even in the most standard of micro settings  if consumers behave in a way inconsistent with full maximization even when doing something as mundane as choosing which type of gas to put in their tank  how absurd is it to insist..." - http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Is a three day suspension from school considered harsh or lenient in the U.S.?'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '(In general, not for any specific offense.)'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: '.-h'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i see police have been terrorising the public in Anaheim, Ca'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'it's CA, who really cares?'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the women whose kids are being mauled by police dogs probably care'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'stuff like that will ultimately result in the public revoking permission to the police to be policed'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'For some reason, I don't think so'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'But thanks for sharing!'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yeah, well we can expect you to be the last to stand up for liberty, Quad'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you have a vested interest in the status quo'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'I know, I'm all about dictatorships'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Quadrapus: 'So that means I hate freedom'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lets just hope it's not you the police come and shoot in the middle of the night because "they got the wrong house"'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it'd be terribly unfair were they to kick the practice of bribing MDs to prescibe more/specific pharmaceutical products if you haven't managed to ride on that gravy train in your career yet'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, James Holmes was wacked out on Viocodin when he shot all those people'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well since he was a democrat and on viocodin, we should ban both of those, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what does Vicodin do or fail to do -- pain relief? --- failed pain relief,  perhaps leading to homicidal rage at those that caused the pain, or homicidal rage at human vermin, or ...'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who knows, we only have the feds' news release, and you know how 'reliable' they are'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'some believe that pain-relief manufacturers deliberately put irritant substances in pain-relief meds to cause longterm chronic pain and increasing dependence on pain meds'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'xchan'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'couldn't say, all i can say is that pain meds are genuinely worthless and shouldn't be taken long term'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but given the track record of big pharma in ripping off the public at core level, i wouldn't doubt it'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'after all, they bribe doctors to overprescribe, even when it's not safe'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they also fake vaccination safety and efficacy trials, knowing full well that the government immunisation program provides immunity against prosecution'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'when corporations become financially as large or larger than the countries they operate in, then you have massive problems'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'woo, a solar powered hat that runs a fan to keep you cool.'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'I hope it's not bladeless, those things are so dang loud!  I got a tabletop version and to get any breeze going it ends up being as loud as my radio.'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'anyone up for a debate on baby killing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'I'm for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Wakita: 'lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler nods at you in agreement. 
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'debate is closed! :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'go.'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'nah, that was the debate'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'sorry'
T3/r7/2012-07-22.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler gives you a BIG high five!  Way to go!! 
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'In 2000, the average worker was making 58 cents an hour in China. Today, it's a little over $4.  By 2015, if the pay scale keeps growing the way it has been, the avg pay per hour in China manufacturing will be $6 to $7.'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Good.'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Armer: 'well that's good, that means they'll probably be living better off than americans by then :^'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'They're a true riot those Palins. 4 year-old Tripp Palin called his 18 yearold aunt Willow a "Faggot". His mother Bristol Palin just laughs in response. I wonder where a 4 yearold learned that word...'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'BTW, Willow chastized Tripp repeatedly to telling them he hated them, telling him she'd rinse out his mouth with soap. In response to the "Faggot" comment, she also just kinda laughed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Apparently I was wrong. He's still 3 years old.'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'what the fuck! Belanie!'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'miss'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Willow -is- a faggot'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'typically using an offensive word to cause offence is the point'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Oh yeah, dual wield...'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Faceater: 'Hrm'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Faceater: '?'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Mischan.'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Fukashima cleanup team employers have been getting their employees to fake the radiation readings so that the cleanup could go ahead despite many times higher radiation readings than they were allowed'
T3/r7/2012-07-23.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'since Yuna always screams "sources", https://rt.com/news/fukushima-radiation-fake-readings-763/'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'sexism!'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'debate whether a joke is funny?'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'gun sales in Colorado up 43% since Aurora shootings'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Mayor Bloomberg should be arrested for treason'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or at the very least, inciting civil unrest'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'kill'em kill'em all make an example out of them'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I don't think I agree with you, but since he banned large drink cups and then supported the hot dog eating contest I'll go along with it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, need to ban welfare since that's what allowed James Holmes to buy guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, Malkar, I was referring to his statement "Police should go on strike until guns are banned"'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people have been arrested and put in prison for publicly saying stuff like that here'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'interesting suggestion, I would like to see a computer simultaion of that, (the reality doesn't seem like a good idea.)'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but I guess being a Mayor, and a democrat at that, he isn't subject to the rules he inflicts on the rest of us'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'dumbass, bleach-drinking witty comments went up about 4000% in the same span.  I mean, really, how stupid do you have to be to be standing in line at a MOVIE CONCESSION STAND, get mad about how long it's taking, and then ask the crowd in general "Hey, anyone got a gun?"'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the shooter was let in a fire door by an accomplice '
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'violent gun crime went up 40% in the years after UK banned handguns'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'didn't he also ban sugary drinks?'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he banned large sugary drinks, and is about to ban popcorn'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he'll ban breathing if he thinks he can get away with it, the guy's a cook'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he's Obama secret bum-lover'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they share a love of collectivism and everything Marxist'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'did you hear about the copycat guy who tried to go colorado?'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you always get copycats trying it on at events like this'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sign writers in London in preparation for the Olympics wrote some signs in arabic'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and rather helpfully put "N O D N O L O T E M O C L E W" instead of "Welcome to London"'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hanslanda: 'is it one of them signs where the letters go all the way through the structure so that they look correct from the proper direction?'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nope'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just a regular banner that some spack didn't realise that arabic writing had to be joined up and written right-to-left'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'can't be too hard on them, it is London, and their education was most likely free'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yay, syrian jets have started bombing the rebels'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) <3 DJ Matty: 'A victim of the Aurora shootings will have medical bills amounting to 2 Million.'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'should have had insurance'
T3/r7/2012-07-24.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): <3 DJ Matty falls down laughing.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Statistics abuse: If current trends continue, the US diet will be 100% sugar by 2606'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Also, if current trends continue, 100% of all americans will be obese by 2056'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh, now that's interesting'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looks like Barrack Obama's birth certificate has turned up on microfiche in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i hope the police listen to Comrade Bloomberg and go on strike'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then you'll see what happens'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'If you're talking about in the US, I believe that'd be illegal for them to.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then he should be prosecuted, as a person in a position of power, for calling for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what a carefully co-ordinated and timed false flag '
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it wasn't unspeakably foolish and against the best interests of joe public, i'd have commended the strategy'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'still, Scotland parliament allowed gay marriage today, so Comrade Yuna will be happy'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'rofl, VA state senator blames racism for Romney gains'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'look out, the lefties are getting desperate....'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'what is leftie'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'well, if you oppose the chosen one, this must be obviously be caused by your own moral flaws or ignorance'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, i'm not American and don't support Obama, so much like Larry Pinkney, I must be racist'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you guys see this on the news about 95% of greenland melting yesterday, from satellite images not captured since 1885.. probably core samples, then today they're saying antartica is melting cause of the grand canyon http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/ what do you think?  are they making it up, is it normal or are people like the characters in nintendo's worms armageddon?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'even that article says it's not global warming'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but the fact they posted the article is UN agenda 21 propoganda'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'were you aware Michael Moore was a fat smelly faggot?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'was? did he finally die?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'unfortunately not'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he's still there polluting the airwaves with his ill-considered crap'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'shame on you for getting my hopes up'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'rofl'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no doubt that fast food will catch up with him soon enough and he'll get diabetes'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'i don't know, i'm kinda skeptical here, bad things rarely happen to people who deserve them'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Randor: 'and if he doesn't get it soon enough and die, they're probably going to develop a cure, the only chance we have then is him getting treated in cuba'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'KILL BABIES'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'but not the white ones *grin'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I'll kill all babies.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'you just eat them after i kill them for u'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Ever suggested cannabalism, Dirk?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i'd eat human flesh if it were fried or cooked right'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'just sayin'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler grins evilly.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I agree.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'especially if it were from a baby!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Kill a female and bake her ass lol.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'nice!  have me over for dinner sometime :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'With bacon strips across her cheeks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I'll hit you up man no doubt.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum bows deeply.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'in that case make sure she IS white LOL'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler grins evilly.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'LMFAO.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'What about a black bitch.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Probably taste like shrimp.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler falls to the ground and rolls around, laughing hysterically.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'you guys have no class...'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'you mean "schrimps"'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I'll just try the meat on her fingers first. Start out small.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I have 4  actually.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'tastes like crack'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum bows before Undertaken Anaristos.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler rolls on the floor laughing at Undertaken Anaristos's antics!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'whatevs.....u guys have no humor like me and Dakrum! '
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum enthusiastically high-fives a cup!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum enthusiastically high-fives Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): What a loser. Dakrum has the dumb and a new EPIC FAIL record!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'now GO FRY ME A WHITE GIRL'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'GET TO IT, ANAR.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I am sorry, I just don't find racist jokes funny.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'you're racist'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Since when were these racist jokes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'im mexican'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler giggles.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'jk'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum walks around in the room, looking very confused.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that crack about crack was certainly racist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'my friends say i look chinese, mexican, & italian....but im totally white ( look on the aard FB page)'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum peers intently at Undertaken Anaristos.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'That's all Dirk xD'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'youre racist for thinking only black ppl smoke crack'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum is agreeing with that Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ive smoked it b4.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum goes ooOOooOOoo.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'no, you are racist for saying that after you mentioned "black bitch".'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum raises his hand.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'that wasnt me but i did LMFAO'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I mentioned eating a black chick.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ROFL'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'How is that racist?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum laughs out loud.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i've screwed a black girl once....therefore i cant be racist *grin'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I am black.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ok she was a fatty but sitll'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'no it is sexist'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, if you explain why the skin color has to be mentioned, maybe I will understand.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'How is that sexist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'you would eat a black chick?!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'ew..'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'So talking about skin color makes us racist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'holy shit its 2012 stereotypes are ALLOWED nowdays'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I understand.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'whats wrong wif ya maan'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'What about you Bigman? '
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Really R. Bigman: 'I wouldn't eat a black chick & I am black:P'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i've gotten used to ppl calling me mexican my whole life so i dont care'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'When you turn 13 you may begin to understand hahahahaha'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, stereotypes arouse from racist attitudes, so using them is racist.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler rolls on the floor laughing at Really R. Bigman's antics!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum yawns at Arnica.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler slaps Undertaken Anaristos in the face with a fish.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'again...its 2012 get over it'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum falls to the ground and rolls around, laughing hysterically.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'again, it's 2012, grow up'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'you hear about that olympic triple jump chick that got banned for her 'racist' tweet?  that shit wasnt even racist in my opinon'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'no, will never get over it. It is that kind of attitude that keeps the people of society separated like oil and water.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'What did it say?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'anaristos...are you from america?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'bc we're sooooo used to it here'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'and only other countries dont understand why we hate ppl on wellfare :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'They can't, their hormones prevent it. Doesn't make it right. (Or tolerable.)'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'From eating a fresh human, to racism, to sexism, to hormones.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum gives a round of applause.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler enthusiastically high-fives Dakrum!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'we're all over the place :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'can't keep us down '
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I'm still on cannabalism lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum cheers and sings... he is just BURSTING with joy!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'no, I am not. I've lived long enough in the US to know what stereotypes are, I just don't understand why they need exist. All people are the same, at least elsewhere.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'im on baby eating'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'how about baby raping?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'like 2 months'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Is that possible O.o'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"All people are the same" is malarky'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'The same in what way?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'his dick is small enough, it's quite possible for him to rape a baby'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i rape babies, kick them up in the air, then shoot them with my shotty like the dude at the batman theater.....what too soon?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum goes ooOOooOOoo.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'Eat some more sugar, Cornholio '
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Not soon enough lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler falls to the ground and rolls around, laughing hysterically.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'yea...id be silent after hearing that remark too'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i think theres something wrong with me *grin'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'I graduated high school in the nude.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'so did the girl I walked up with'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Epic.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'lol i had to hurry and throw weed out of my pockets during my graduation....didnt know theyd have cops with dogs there'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Oh shit I forgot dirk. Chck out documentingreality.com'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'You will def want to sign up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'first glace at that website....yes im in :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'I knew putting sugar free sweets in the White House was a good idea.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'my roommate is from colombia and hes always showing me crazy shit on the mexican news they wouldnt dare show in america'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum enthusiastically high-fives Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Haha yeah!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'like some dude the drug cartel interrogated then they chainsawed his head off'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Saw that one.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'you would lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Also saw another chainsaw beheading but it was 2 guys. 1 chainsaw, the other a dull knife.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'lol "2 guys, 1 cup"'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'is it wrong i kinda got a stiffy watching the "2 girls 1 cup"?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'yes'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Never watched that one. Seen 1 man 1 jar? Gay dude lol.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'hi'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'while im on debate...is it wrong that i just got my dealer to bring me a quarter bag of some dank ass nugs and i forgot to the bag in my car so now its stinking up my pockets and im afraid my coworkers r gonna smell?'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'forgot to leave'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Swallow it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'fuck that!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'LOL'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'Hi Jim, friend of bigmouth Bass'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'wha strain dirk'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'what*'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ive been 3 days without gettin high!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i dunno...i hate weed names'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Arnica: 'cannot tell'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'ive been 4 months :('
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum falls to the ground and rolls around, laughing hysterically.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'im calling this one smurf piss'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum laughs out loud.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'no really though...3 days is a long time when i've been like high for 10yrs straight'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i did do alot of coke the other night though'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler grins evilly.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'You need some baby meat.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'glad im still considered a 'responsible person' as far as i have others fooled *grin'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'BABY MEAT INDEED!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler enthusiastically high-fives Dakrum!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum begins to sharpen an enourmous butcher knife.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum grins evilly.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum enthusiastically high-fives Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'oh lord im even babysitting some lil black kid in a few days....man i wouldnt trust me lol jk im good with kids'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i might put this kid in the oven though'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'just to taste baby meat'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): TadpoleJim lets off a real rip-roarer ... a greenish cloud envelops TadpoleJim!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Dude...you could.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'yea well his mom is friend with my girfriend so that would mean she woudlnt give me anymore vagina im sure'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'i love dark meat!!!'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler rolls on the floor laughing at a tadpole's antics!
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Oladon: 'Take it to grouptalk or echo. This has gone on long enough'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'well wrong tadpole but u get it'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dakrum: 'Roger.'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'HATER'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'i gotta get some work done anywayz ...ttyl'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Dakrum bows before Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler.
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'ima look up some baby killing jokes in the meantime....'
T3/r7/2012-07-25.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Mr. Dirty Dirkdiggler: 'and the jizz has to be mine'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'It amuses me that these hippie dippie people want to take fluoride out of the city water supply "because it's poison and bad for you".  These are the same hippie dippies who were having unprotected sex, dropping acid, and smoking drugs when they were young, and now they worry about "poison".'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'lol smoking drugs.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'What's just as amusing is that many decades ago, when fluoride was introduced to municipal water systems, it was the right who vehemently opposed it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'By smoking drugs, I mean smoking drugs other than weed.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'It's ridiculous, all these hippie dippies bitching about organic food and whatnot, 30 years ago they were snorting coke and heroin, smoking PCP, eating peyote, and generally getting fucked up anything they could get their hands on.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Nothing wrong with getting fucked up btw, but worrying about "poison" ?  Does not compute.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'the dippie word might be what's throwing the seriousness for me. lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I just refer to them as hippie dippies'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Because they're hippies, and they're rather dippy, as in, stupid.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Typical Obama-voting idiots'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'ok. understood. never heard dippy before. Rgr'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'George Carlin had a character called the hippy dippy weatherman'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Then when they all have rotten teeth, assuming they have any teeth left after their drug binges, they'll be bitching about that and demand that the public utilities/government/etc. "do something" about it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'can't help stupid people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'They'll bitch and moan about it, "but not fluoride, maaaaaan, that shit is poison" ... all while popping nitrites and taking turns fucking each other in the ass.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's not just poison, it's mind control :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Hmmm. Problem is, people change their minds over time. If that weren't allowed, then the right wingers who so vigorously opposed the introduction of fluoride into municipal water systems decades ago wouldn't now be allowed to regard it as a valuable public service. What's good for the goose...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Poison in the water, that sounds like a good idea'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, on the one hand, water has been fluoridated since something like 1947 without mass deaths due to poisoning. On the other hand, dentists haven't gone out of business :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there's this lake about 120 miles from me, they claim it's more polluted than the great lakes were in the 1950's and 60's, treated sewage and agriculture, it's kind of scary to think of, if people caused that where people used to drink the water out of it, what else can they cause?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, Chemosh, considering that it was humans who created Chernobyl, I'd say we're capable of causing all sorts of regrets.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and if they do that in their own land, claiming it's just too expensive to listen to any advice how to deal with the problem, then how will they do any good for any other land?  i am a pessimist, but unfortunately that problem seems real'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i hear the government saying 'bring energy company to this place', royalty's for the government, not how they'll use that money to clean anything up, that's not even included in their austerity measures spending cuts'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'death's not even their common enemy anymore, it's too expensive'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there used to be alot more animals on earth, and they shat and pissed wherever they shat and pissed, and also more plant life, and they survived - but now with only human animals in the majority and all their advanced sciences and their lesser mass of bodily waste generated they're poisoning all of the lakes and rivers and oceans for progress and have never survived their own destruction to prove that they are on the right track'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but something beyond biological life calls the humans onwards, but is it god?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's just how it looks to me, if they're atheists not doing it for religion as a whole then are they collectively suicidal, self-hating, prejudiced idiots, deceived by their own invention?  demanding to be right in the face of their own destruction?  what illusion's more important than reality?  only live so long though and the rest is unknown, it just doesn't look too good for the long run cause i'm a pessimist'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and for me, trying to comprehend the type of person who would get rich by killing vast swathes of land's survivability while monopolizing the compromised population within it isn't very conceptually different than those devil's from the 1930's sometimes, i only have so much faith in human ignorance and what they claim to have knowledge about shows me that's probably correct, of course nobody wants to think about genocide and death all the time, but what's gonna happen eventually?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'are they going to avoid that forever, cause they show themselves to be responsible shepherds?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they go and fight on war's on terror across the ocean and thousands of miles of land, but don't confront the destruction within theirselves'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cause there's just no economy in that, it's too expensive'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is it sustainability to exhume the guts of your nation and send the minerals to china?  who's the long term philanthropists who picture the world of exhausted resources or the ways their exhaustion will take your nation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is that a long-term productive industry that guarantees a future for yourself and your family?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''they say' 1000 years or more, that's like eternity to us'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'have they ever lied?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'damn rights and lots of other things, just stuff that makes me crazy to think of but is hard to shake from thought, what matters to me most people can comprehend but accept they can't do nothing about it, even though they think it's wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i just like to see why so many people comprehend death and what takes their mind off of it long enough to pretend it'll never happen, at least not in their time frame - this is caused by humans, not god'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and human inaction too, i can look up alot of research and technology that has been rejected by the leaders of society, sometimes they say it's too expensive, others they don't say anything'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and that illusion of the atheist resembles a religion to me, and they resemble the devil's of the 1930's conceptually because of what i learned'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, atheism requires as much faith as theism, so I can see your point there.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people used to save up all year for a trip to the national park, that is now a toxic industrial generator of work opportunity and national wealth for instance, so all of the slave's puny dreams were destroyed because of the higher calling of their collective master who's will be done on earth as it is in heaven, amen'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is talking like a 'communist' by refering to the populace as "slaves" of the "collective master" -- also bad dialogue but perhaps typical marxist-leninist, is misquoting and adulterating the NT scriptures so as to insult the christians'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's figurative perspective speech, my perception of the light in which i see them in'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and it's opt-in too, if they fit into my perception then that's what they do, i talk to be proven wrong sometimes'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope, that was bad speech poison pill designed to ruin your political chances'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i never wanted to be a politician and the only lawyers i ever liked were in john grisham novels and matlock'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh is a temporary 'puppet' of some sublimanal override'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '"subliminal"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i was referencing my earlier speculation that the world is ruled by atheists who probably don't follow a illusion more important than reality'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so adding in my comparison of 'his will' was alright'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i considered stuff like that before even reading the story of bel and the dragon, but that one's pretty interesting to consider'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''lest i come as a thief in the night' is included in the gospel, and the priests and their families came out from under the table 'the dog is worthy' to consume the offering to bel every night, and the king of babylon was upset at these deceivers, and the babylon whore is mentioned in the gospel - i remember these parts of the story and wonder if the story was somebody's historical perspective of the gospel and the church/bible, or if it really happened like that if it influenced the gospel story later on'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they're human in that story'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i can conceptually place things like governments getting rid of the filth from areas of interest to other nations being like the 'painted lady' you're warned about from the bible too'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'except you insulted the christian god by misusing that "done on earth as .. above" scripture  -- that is how some christians are going to interpret that misuse'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's a chain of words not even in their original language, i don't see what's insulting about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'insulting might be like allegations on bbc news of the vatican funding the adult film industry since the 1950's'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemosh says he uses words but disclaims to know what they meant .. tsk tsk'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Akuri: 'ignorance still doesn't make it right lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what's wrong about it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they make jokes with serial killers, adolf hitler, religious figures, races of people and all kinds of things on south park cartoons which air on general audience teletoon at night, what's worse about non-flagrant contextual usage of what they include in their offensive humour?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wow, stuff on debate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'again without congress approval, why doesn't that make him a dictator?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I'm not up to speed on this, how is Obama "signing away" the second amendment?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'UN treaty on gun control'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'we get on just fine here in the UK without guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'all that aside, I wonder why one party insists on treating it as some sort of self-evident, ironclad right, when the guys who wrote it didn't, and shouldn't have.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'most people just use knives instead'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, gregor, we do, only the criminals have them'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what guys wrote what and shouldn't have what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I believe we are still allowed to own swords in the UK'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you believe wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it's a blade where blade + handle is above 6 inches, it is illegal'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'You are just not allowed to take them out into public'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if they thought it was an absolute thing, they wouldn't have bothered to add all that stuff about a well-regulated militia'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, and you can't use it to defend yourself'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'How did I believe wrong then? I mentioned nothing about handle length.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you misunderstand what they meant by militia, Sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'You've just confirmed we ARE allowed to own swords so long as they are within certain specifications'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I'm not making any assumptions about what they meant about militia'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'It's pretty clear that the right to bear arms comes from the belief that revolutions are a natural and necessary part of maintaining a democracy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Bode: 'and for bear meat!'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'allowing civillians to carry guns is stupid imo'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes, that was the core of it, it was to give citizens protection against tyranny'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's that if they wanted it to be an absolute right, they would not have mentioned anything else. They probably thought (hoped) that people in later ages would use some common sense in future amendments'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is why when a dictator takes power, the first thing they do is remove guns from the population'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a constitution isn't a place for writing trivial things, after all...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I'm going to invest in a gunblade'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you would all be in a very dangerous place if you pissed away your constitution, which is what is happening'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'll get what you deserve if you let it happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i just feel sorry for the people that you'll be screwing over'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'some countries prefer lower violent crime rates at the expense of not fulfilling certain... fringe desires. Some countries want to express those desires more strongly at the cost of more death... to each their own, I guess.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, sonshi, not at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you seem to be under the illusion that gun law is related to incidence of crime. It has more to do with culture and poverty than law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'guns don't mean more murders or crime :P Canada has more guns per capita than the US by a large margin without them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'certainly, but incentives do matter'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'exactly, fates'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the highest gun-crime countries have strict gun laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and counter to that, among the lowest gun crime countries are some that have full public ownership'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it would be kind of odd to argue that lower access to guns would not decrease violent crime'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, it wouldn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's self evident'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it would be kind of naive to argue that gun laws changes access to them'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'lower access would.  stricter gun laws may or may not significantly change access.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lower access makes no difference, Criminals don't care about the law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'they used to make "Polish" jokes during, at the end of WWII, and decades after'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the only reasonable question, really, is how much it would decrease it, and under what circumstances... and how you can effectively control access'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'or questions, rather'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'Hmm what's switzerland's rankings for gun crime and murders I do believe that adult citizens there are required to own and prove they are proficient with automatic weapons.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'switzerland is bottom 10, fates'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'as is Vermont (if it were considered a country)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you look at gun crime hot spots in the US, always poor places, Chicago, LA, NY, Louisiana'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the whole "criminal don't care about the law" betrays a lack of understanding about incentives... a sweeping generalisation that has no place in policy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'gun crime clean spots, Vermont, Texas'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh it's illegal to own guns in NYC'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you are in no position to talk about sweeping generalisations'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the Polish government pre-WWII disarmed the populace -- and Polish paid dearly during WWII, and after as the target of Polish jokes'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and in Chicago, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'spot a pattern?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twisting FatesDagger: 'that just means the people being hit are not likely to be able to shoot back.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'incentives for violent criminals are to be able to continue to be violent criminals...hence not caring for the gun law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and a few points on the militia part...(1) it wasn't drafted with the constitution...(2) many of the drafts of the amendment made it MUCH clearer that it was designed as an absolute right and did not include the militia part...(3) those writing the constitution were NOT a militia when they had their guns and used them...(4) the militia clause is about the why, not the what...at the time of the writing of the constitution, it was thought that guns would have continued relevance...pretty much the only reason that [if the founders were here today] they wouldn't consider guns to be a right would be because they'd realize how little guns would matter in an overthrow of a modern government'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'unfortunately, piecemeal legislation within a country does very little, as guns can be brought in from other places too easily... unless restricted at the federal level, access would not change significantly'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'they should outlaw murder because of all the people who get killed...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'I don't think Obama would be stupid enough to torpedo his campaign by 'signing away' the second amendment'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the way things are going in the world, you'll be glad you were allowed guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'guns can be brought in from outside the country quite easily as well...plenty of entire countries where it's illegal to own have very high gun crime rates'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'so youre supposed to rent guns when you go hunting or what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yes, they left their justification in, so that future generations can see what reasoning underpins that "right"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'He might sign the thing after the election, win or lose, though'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'nah, you're supposed to be a vegan just like a responsible little greenie'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yes, the reasoning is to be able to have guns when you decide you need them'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'again, the revolutionaries were NOT a militia'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't think it would be unreasonable to ban people carrying out fully automatic/heavy weapons in public outside of state emergency situations'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they became one...when they took up arms, they were not...they were able to take up arms because they had the guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but really it's down to the states, not to Barry Sotiro'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'fully automatic weapons are illegal everywhere i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, these days it's pretty simple enough for entire populations to gain access to small arms pretty rapidly when they do need it to fight a government, gun laws or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and they wanted to ensure that it would continue to be possible in the future'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I reckon they should just take the bullets out of everyone's guns, that'd get them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Anyway, the way I see it, even if Obama did somehow "sign away" the second amendment, the voters would just overturn it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you can't overturn a UN convention without leaving the UN'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'and charge Obama with treason '
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'that "right" isn't really relevant anymore when it comes to defending national rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which personally i think you should do, since it's a wack place'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'it costs like 10,000 a year to have a class 3 (i think) license which is fully auto'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'No, but you can abrogate the treaty'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, it was *NEVER* about defending national rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'There are no voters, there is no president, and no political system'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the revolutionaries were NOT a nation to defend'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The excuse is to disarm everyone so FEMA can take over'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Malkar: 'I don't feel comforted that other people are able to overthrow the government.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'pretty much it, dosset'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'We're the US, nobody can make us do shit that we don't want to do, and good luck to the rest of the world enforcing jack shit on us if the general population turns against the Obama administration and whoever supports this measure.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They use MK-ULTRA slaves to commit terror acts against people as a pre-text to scare you into giving your rights up'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, the rights of the people, I mean'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'works pretty well, dosset, it's why they use the same tactic over and over again'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'People will violently oppose having their rights taken away, so the illuminati scares you into giving them up'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'the difference between a peasant and a citizen is often, a gun'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, starling...while it's fun to be all "we're the US"...the US does in fact need the cooperation of a good portion of the rest of the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'corrupt governments run by corrupt greedy miscreants prefer to disarm the populace'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Starling, sadly, the US is simply a factory for the U.N., which is proxy for the illuminati/New World Order'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Our "America" no longer exists'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'Even if the US can't just ignore the treaty, we can make hell on pretty much anyone else's proposals/treaty ideas/etc. and strong-arm them into giving in to us.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'these days revolutionaries can make much worse than small arms in their backyards... that "right" really isn't relevant anymore...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd be more worried about Obama taking you to war than anything else right now, though'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the USSR under Stalin committed mass murders'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'There are certain perks to being the most powerful country in the world, and the political strong arm happens to be one of them.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'wow zade, you sound like chemosh ;-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Those actions are not to serve Americans, but rather to serve the CFR/U.N.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'So, would taking small arms from criminals just incentivize them to make bombs in their backyard, instead?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We're mind controlled with predictive programming by the media so we blindly support what we think is being done for us'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you really wanted to, backyard mills the government can't keep track of can churn out some pretty powerful stuff. The main reason why they don't, is because there's no uprising.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We're really sheep in the yoke of a government that cripples us with fiat debt to churn the mills of the illuminati war machine'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Sounds crazy, but watch what happens this upcoming Olympics'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doubt anything will happen at the olympics'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Zade was a rightwing hawk when younger, mellowed into a socialist, yet a hawk 
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'A nuclear false-flag to terrorize the world a la 9/11, so the U.S. can pin it on the target of choice'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Like Syria'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'restricting access to guns, putting aside how you could effectively do that, will reduce violent crime with very little impact on the population's ability to resist an authoritarian government.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Look at all the symbolism Tigernuts'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it will not, Sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's covered with their one-eyed Eye of Lucifer shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you want to reduce crime, deal with poverty'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They are very arrogant'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, dealing with poverty will reduce it even more...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'personally think that's all there to wind people up, Dosset'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's marking it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Chemoh does not yet know where Chemosh is heading'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but restricting access makes it much harder for violent crimes to be committed'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi: bullshit, as has been repeatedly shown across the globe :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'agree, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The mentality is "we told you this, and you sheep were too stupid to listen"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no it doesn't...AS HAS BEEN SHOWN ACROSS THE GLOBE'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'I disagree with everyone'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'It would reduce violent crime, but it would take a good 25 years to do it. The US already has 250m+ guns, do you think the government can just go collect them all?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'you are all wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i disagree and agree with Gregor'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'restricting access has NEVER restricted the access of those whom never would've had legitimate access to begin with'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'hell, I probably personally know a half dozen felons with weapons :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, claiming it doesn't is tantamount to arguing that normal laws of incentive does not apply to criminals, that criminals are somehow... ENTIRELY random.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'If people are innocent until proven guilty, then a nonfelon citizen should have no problem owning a gun'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'making guns illegal is not an incentive to criminals, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nor is it a disincentive'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'sonshi, no, it's claiming that what you're CLAIMING to be laws of incentive don't apply'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'making guns LEGAL is a disincentive to criminals'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'id you want to claim that it has been "shown across the globe", I will point to singapore's low violent crime rates'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'among others'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'again, that's down to culture not down to law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'same principle as Japan, which has low murder rates period, guns or not'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'career criminals follow another set of laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'in half of the middle east, it's illegal to own guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and making guns illegal isn't the same as restricting access...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'did their gun violence drop?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'they have a high suicide rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you actually have to get the guns out of the system'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'exactly, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you won't get guns out of the system'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'making guns illegal does *NOTHING* to restrict access'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might as well say you're going to get sugar and fat out of the diets of everyone'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'take the blue pill'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) GraySong Gregor: 'mis'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'Sonshi is either clueless and or a troll'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're going to stop underage pregnancies and std's by getting sex out of the system'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there is no solution, in any country, anywhere on the planet, to removing access...including sporeland'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'cain false, it restrict access to guns from people who obey the law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The gun control debate is really about disarming the populace from defending against a .0000001% tyranny'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Has nothing to do with stopping homicide'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I was talking about restricting access, not making them illegal. Making them illegal is only the first step in a long and tough road to restricting access. A road that a country may find too exhausting.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'thanks for the update, aterius :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Sonshi, criminals do not follow laws.  A gun control law is thus circumvented by criminals'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'for one, you'd need better and cleaner enforcement...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It is only crippling the law-abiding citizen from suffering from the bottow-dwellers'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'hey, did I say it was easy?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The government does not want better and cleaner enforcement'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it's not not easy...it cannot happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'here's a suggestion, how about you leave guns in the hand of the public'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They have their own agenda, and the wellfare of the people is not on it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'happened for us...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'this isn't Legoland...quit PRETENDING that what you're saying has any pretense of truth'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no it didn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Modi: 'it should be , without the people they are weak and vuln'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'granted, it's easier for us, but it wouldn't be impossible for you guys too...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'a corrupt government is likely to become more corrupt and arrogant when that government does not fear the people'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The truth is that all the weapons and drugs/narcotics come from the combined intelligences of CIA/MI5/Mossad etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's proliferated by organized crime'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '6, dosset, 6'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '5 is internal'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Ok'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the last time there was a gun related crime, some guy was found dead in a public toilet.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'mi5 = fbi, mi6 = cia, in US terms ;-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'witnesses heard a gunshot, police did not suspect homicide. Turned out to have been a security officer...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'CIA is a piece of shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'must've been years since an actual criminal used a gun back home...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'the middle-east is a bad example -- the ignorance and religious intolerance of the populace may be turned into a murderous frenzy by religious zealots'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'we do have a lot of stabbings... but the victims very often survive them, unless it was premeditated'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't think we need to take any lessons from Singapore in freedoms and law, since gay sex, pornography, chewing gum, and failing to flush a toilet after use are all illegal'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ho hum...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some of us actually would like to live in a free society'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, there is that'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'in the middle-east, the warlords are heavily armed'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '...by America'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but it does demonstrate that it is possible.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'of course some of us would like to, tiger...that's why sonshi doesn't live there :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'at least Singapore is getting a few things right'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'To live in a free society, we must protect ourselves from all enemies, foreign and domestic'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and many of us would argue that we are a far freer society than the us, at least'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We have made-up foreign enemies, which leaves many many domestic ones'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'which are trying to disarm us, take away our rights, and pit us against each other'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i would rather live in a free country that has an vanishing, practically zero gun-homicide rate rather a tyrannical one with a lower, but still vanishing practically zero gun homicide rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it depends on your priorities with respect to freedoms...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, I'd prefer that too'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and I'd say that's possible. Just wait till we're done reforming our way.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it won't happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and see how much luck you have with that homicide rate!'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well given we're going to see a slow descent into civil unrest through much of the western world, no, we won't have much luck with that homicide rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'an educated populace may be free with lots of guns and a low-homicide rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and on the other hand, we're making a lot more progress in terms of political and civil freedoms'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'better to be armed and free and strong, than disarmed as slaves waiting to be slaughtered en mass'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when you think about the right to shelter, food, healthcare... the bottom half probably doesn't regard chewing gum as a big deal in comparison...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and almost all our men know how to use a rifle...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well you have the benefit of having seen all the mistakes everyone else has made'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lets hope your country doesn't just remake them'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, sure...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but no one seems interested in following our example...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'especially china'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'we keep telling them stuff and they smile and nod'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: '(traitorous) cowards that prefer to be disarmed deserve to be euthanised'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why would they follow your example?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're quite happy with their one-party state'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think i've spotted the issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'their currency needs to be loosened, their one child policy is a disaster waiting to happen... they aren't making progress with corruption...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'did WW2 not happen for you, Sonshi?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, and the us doesn't listen either, for the same reasons'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'oh, we had our ass kicked by the japanese'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but we were a british colony at the time, so no count!'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are people out there in power that want to control their people and have the people serve them, not the other way around'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the world isn't full of purely nice benevolent people'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Vladimir Putin is a strong leader, he's also not the nicest of people out there'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'probably the most humiliating defeat of a brit army to date, that was...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there are not many true democracies out there'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'certainly isn't one here'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'isn't one in the USA'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, we can only elect our leaders and keep a close eye on them for any funny business...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Sonshi, where are you from?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the fucking moon'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but if you keep voting out your incumbents for a guy that's worse just to punish the incumbent, you'll never get a good candidate. Not in a two party system.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'singapore'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'although I'm studying in the us at the moment'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Not too familiar with it, but the functions can't be extrapolated over larger CFR-held bodies like China and U.S.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Basically, it's small enough to be run like a country, where larger "countries" are merely posing'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a lot of people back home are complaining that all the billionaires fleeing to our island is driving up the car and housing prices'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'if anything were to get too out of hand, you'd be lobbied and embargoed'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'the U.N. would politically/economically gangster you into compliance'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'singapore is basically a city of 5 million...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the only real city-state left in the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'created from an accident of history'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'so in a sense, yeah, we do have a small advantage in that there's a bit of a stronger incentive for the leaders to actually run the country decently...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Politics here is a charade to make the people think they have any sort of input'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but when I talk about policy, I prefer to talk about what policy ought to be, not what's politically feasible'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'what's the point? that's sort of like me talking about how I'd prefer to fly a winged unicorn that farts rainbows to work.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I wish people could force through a better agenda...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'If theory cannot be manifested into reality, then it serves little purpose'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'This is coming from a theoretical thinker'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, sure, but if you banded together to demand electoral reform?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'naive'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Electoral reform? Break the box'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'There is no politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'I can't speak for Singapore'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'that would change what is politically feasible. A first step'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The system is a sham'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'take the US for example, two party system, both parties bought/paid for by the same global power. They control the media, the army, the police, the government. Any attempt to start a third party brings down the full weight against you'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'DoesseT speaks the truth. Ask Ross Pirot'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and you have to remember, that many things are not politically feasible simply because so few believe that it is...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'and the insurance companies, and the health-care industry'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'Or because people genuinely disagree for reasons of your own.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'err, their own'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there is that'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the only thing that works in situations like that is revolution, Sonshi, which is why you don't want guns removed'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we're way ahead of you'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'which is rather hard to accept as a young and bright person, that other people can look at the same data and come to a different conclusion without being a congenital moron.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but what I said is true about many things, like the emergence of a thrid party'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Sonshi, as you may be aware, the U.S. tried to pass SOPA/PIPA'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'anyhew, bedtime GMT'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'demand instant runoff?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It was a shitty pre-text to stop information flow - they don't want us to be educated'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Education is dangerous'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Which is why, in the U.S. especially, they dumb you down with fluoride, bad education, and all sorts of pharmaceuticals to poison your reasoning ability'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you can get enough people behind instant runoff, like the movement against sopa/pipa...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Disarming is the next step'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'they made us study books like animal farm, to kill a mockingbird, etc. in school. heh'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'fun times'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '1984, Brave New World, The Giver'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Well, it's happening...right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'we would need campain finance reforms before any third party would stand any chance, and the people who benefit from the current system are the people with the power to change it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Exactly Harperon'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you introduced instant runoff, multiple parties would naturally emerge'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Just like the government-backed big corporations squelch the little guy with prohibitively expensive regulatory measures'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'even without any other reform'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'and why would anyone currently in power be in favor of instant runnoffs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and there'd be a huge incentive to moderate views'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'No Sonshi - too much financial pressure, you'd be slandered by the NWO run media owned by Rupert Murdoch'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'and if you became too large a threat, the CIA would kill you'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'with piano wire, and say you killed yourself because of embarassment for some tax scandal that never occurred'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if enough americans got together and said - we'll vote for anyone who will vote for instant runoff, regardless of other policies, it will happen.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'which is why the voting system is rigged'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'old video from the 90s that has someone testifying at a Congressional hearing about that'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'that's not just speculation'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and if you tried and failed in that effort, as least you can say you tried...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'many have'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'People are waking up'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'many of the current movements aren't so focussed though'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Because we fight ourselves'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'that's cuz people don't agree with each other...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'you really just need to ram through this one thing, and the political landscape will open up upon success...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'everyone may agree that "current sux", but nobody agrees on what they want'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I suspect most would support instant runoff, once they understood the implications'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You smirk.
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, the second part may take a bit of doing...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'most even won't support "more money for everyone"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, people would argue that leads to inflation, blah blah blah... I think the case for that, while good, isn't quite as good as that for instant runoff'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Inflation isn't an issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'you would think so...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Here in the U.S., there's a private cartel that makes money out of thin air'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, inflation isn't an issue in this economy. Wish they'd have more sense.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Harperon: 'in the us it would be more of "the rich don't deserve that money, they have enough already" and "the unemployed don't deserve that money, they don't even pay taxes"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They are starving us out, and that NWO puppet Bernanke keeps playing the same record'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They want us to squirm and get desperate, go riot in the streets'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'back home, I suspect that they think "it's cheaper to help the unemployed than it is to jail those that turn to crime"'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'So they can declare a state of emergency and have FEMA take over'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Unemployment here is induced'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'You're told to get a higher education, else you won't be hireable - when you graduate, you're 200k in debt and don't have a job'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's more inaction than induced'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Now you're reliant on Big Daddy Government'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and that's more a (tragic) comedy of errors than a plot'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's induced'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '40 years ago, a semester was something like $5k at Stanford'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's been made prohibitively expensive by the universities, which are businesses, in tandem with the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and 40 years ago, a new car was 1,500'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'having some sort of training does make it easier to get a job... and a degree is one form of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Their goal is no longer to educate and invest in the next generation's human capital, but rather to saddle it with debt for a buck'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We're oversaturated now'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '30 years ago, having a juris doctorate, or being an account and whatnot was baller'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Now, every "bro" has a JD and CPA'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's the blue-collar fields, ironically, that are lagging'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'account = accountant'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if it were up to me to reform the tertiary education system, I'd pump in a bit more money into it, with two objectives.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nobody wants to be blue collar'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'and yup, noone wants to be blue collar'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'world will always need ditch diggers tho :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '1. Hire more lecturers based on teaching ability rather than intelligence/research. These also tend to cost much less'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Sonshi, we are in agreement'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'how dare you insult him like that }:>'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'You would be defeated by senior board teachers, whom hold seniority and would fire you because of a perceived threat'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'universities get more funding for research'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '2. Take the researchers and reduce their teaching and admin duties substantially, so that they can focus more on discovery'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Cain killd Abelinc waits for it this time
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, if they wanted to teach, that would be nice too, but...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, nod, I know hella lot of 'em who teach the absolute minimum they can get away with'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Teaching is made out to be low-status, and doesn't pay enough to attract those suited for it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's deliberate'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the faculty would be really happy if you did that, since they'd generally do less stuff they don't want to do, and get paid the same (or more). The downside is, of course, that it costs the govt more in the short run.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Well-educated kids are dangerous'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'they don't want that'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but you'd get a lot more research done, and more teaching too'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Grants are a shitshow - it's all posturing'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there's no plot... they don't do it because there's no money for it, so researchers mostly have to do double duty. As researchers, and as sub-optimal lecturers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'what are the researchers researching?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'out of curiosity'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and there's no money for it, because of the usual incompetence'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Because we've likely discovered it in the last 100 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, in physics there's that whole ongoing fusion thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Tesla discovered zero-point energy'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'the CIA killed him'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You smirk.
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'DosseT and Sonshi are the "new" trolls in tandem, with horridly flawed suggestions and observations '
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'in math and cs there's the ongoing effort towards increasing optimisation of various things...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, I don't always agree with sonshi, but he's no troll'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and you never know when there'll be a big breakthrough in something random.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'MUCH less so than zade or xyliz :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'they extracted the useful information, leaving us with gaping holes'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'so we will forever be on the search for zero-point energy, cancer cures, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'information suppression'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the more hours talented researchers put into it, the higher the chances you'd get something out of left field like the internet revolution, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'It's epicycle theory'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'they hide important bits to throw us down the wrong track, and then you continue further down that wrong track'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a hundred years ago people were saying that we were basically done, that we had found pretty much everything it was possible to find...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We did'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We had zero-point energy and cancer cures'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'they hid it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'The Nazis had UFOs'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi sighs.
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You groan loudly.
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and yet no computers'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no intertubes, no MUDs'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'True - necessity fosters invention in that sense'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'And yet, that all started from DARPAnet'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'no nukes. No nuclear power. No QM. Satellites.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'run by the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'You're right that we have progressed, but progress has been stifled by them taking out key points of knowledge'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'but it was all new research...so we hadn't finished 100 years ago...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the big, unforeseen breakthroughs tend to come from government funding.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'I was thinking in conext of governments vs. people'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'context'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'largely because no company in their right mind wants to fund research in areas that don't seem to have any benefit anyone can foresee'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'there is no governments vs people research'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Of course there is'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nope'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'You know why we drink Fluoride?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Program F'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'here we go again...'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Yes, real history'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'groan kheftiu...maybe I'll catch you ready for real conversations tomorrow...tuning out now :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'we have fluoridation back home too... and our students are some of the best you can find'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'what about the fractal-pattern aerials that permitted small cell-phones to exist -- was that government-funding'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it allows special forces communications to exist'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'not familiar with the background'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Do know that Fluoride rots your teeth and gives you osteoporosis'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'nope'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Because a book told you so? Engage the empircal evidence'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Fluoridation started because they didn't want to pay money to dispose of post-Manhattan Project waste'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'druzil renamed again?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'heheh'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, just alt'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '1. Denial 2. Opposition 3. Acceptance'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'hmm. seems that he logged in half an hour before chemosh logged out'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: 'D.O.A.'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Zade: ''1. Denial 2. Opposition 3. Acceptance'  -->  DOA  -->  Dead On Arrival'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Which is what happens following that algorithm - how a propos'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'The report by the five-member Federal Maritime Commission points out that Prince Rupert isn't a "CSI" port. CSI is an acronym for the Container Security Initiative, a program implemented by U.S. Customs and Border Control to pre-screen more than 86 per cent of U.S.-bound container cargo. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/07/26/us-canada-port-security-report.html ok so they want security, i imagine they spend a billion+ a year on the resources to offer what security exists, maybe it costs less if you get a certificate of pre=approval, but that also adds a security hole because american organized criminals with friends in the CSI program will never be detected'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'unless they have some measures against that, but what do you think?  i remember a history tv show last night where a fbi agent had a governor and a organized criminal cleared of any investigation'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe they should lower taxes so that people don't get paid for not doing their jobs?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's just what comes to mind when i looked over it, like the faith they have in pre-approval programs for mexican american companies'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yep, this here has a electronic device on it so it must be legit'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '5 member federal maritime commission, what's so special about 5's?  it's a pentagram?  there's also 5 permanent members of the un security council'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you'd expect if the government wasn't involved in organized crime itself, it would like to not preapprove anything, but offer some of the 50 million unemployed people a job sniffing out evil cargo'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i would anyways, maybe they have a justice in mind'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the world is evil, so the richest people on earth's businesses must be preapproved of being 'archons of radience' so that they don't have to go through pesky issues of surveillance and law'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'we have so much faith in our own integrity that we had to fire the independent scientists who verify your food isn't laced with agent orange for your consumption and stream line the trusted process for you'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it costs too much to watch what we do'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'that is the purpose of their existence'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they sure monitor me and you though don't they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they can afford to watch me, but not people who really are up to no good'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '.. possibly'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Noone is up to no good except them'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They erect phantoms to goad society into giving up their rights, voluntarily accepting surveillance'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, effective measures maybe they call it'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the law couldn't be that cruel, that's horrendous, lets listen to it's advice'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '"national security" seems to be the favorite'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'making problems and offering solutions'
T3/r7/2012-07-26.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think that's what i heard some criminal groups did in the past'
T3/r7/2012-07-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'olympics are packed full of illuminati imagery'
T3/r7/2012-07-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Gonna have to turn 'em on tv to understand what you mean.'
T3/r7/2012-07-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'hey'
T3/r7/2012-07-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) TadpoleJim: 'atheists +1'
T3/r7/2012-07-27.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i hope you guys watching the olympic ceremony aren't blighted by the british commentary'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you're American and want some money off your prescriptions or medication, you can download a free discount card here: www.infowarsrx.com'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'will you guys do me a favour and call up your local senate guys and register severe disapproval if they vote for the UN gun treaty'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nobody ever bothers, so anyone who does call has huge weight as it's a barometer of public opinino'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scurvy: 'contact my local representative to voice my support of the UN gun treaty, gotchya'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts THWAPS Scurvy for being a moron.
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Why not support it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Seems like the US has too many guns'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scurvy: 'because DEY TUK ER GERNS'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Of course, they're mostly retards who don't understand statistics proving it is safer to make them illegal...'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nah, it has about the rigjht amount'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tigernuts is agreeing with that Vakieh person again...
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'although that's almost a side-issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I would say it's the main issue with this treaty'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'main arguing point'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there a number of very good arguing points for, and very few against'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think all those who are against guns should just show their convictions by not owning them'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I am against guns in homes or streets - I own 2 which never leave the range.'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm pro-gun ownership and own none'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'And tbh, it's not my gun which concerns me, it's other peoples'.'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'over here i wouldn't be allowed one'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though i'm keeping an eye on the situation and might get a xbow if stuff starts really getting dodgty'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'assuming they don't then outlaw those too'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'will also arm up with tasers and pepper spray'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Nothing wrong with taser/pepper spray.  Something very wrong with gun/xbow'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it's good enough for the Statsi, good enough for me'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'elaborate'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Never a good enough reason for civvies to be carrying lethal weapons during everyday tasks.'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I barely trust Average Joe with a car, let alone a gun/xbow/knife.'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'assumes the situation remains everyday'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the occupants of Anaheim, Ca probably disagree with you right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'The guns were purchased legally.  If they were illegal, guess how many peopl died? none.'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Anaheim isn't Colarado, btw, different event'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not aware of it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'not in the US, I see high profile from you guys only'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not American :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You talk more of them than UK, so you may as well be'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well you have to be world aware'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the UK media is pretty insular, they don't want people to know what's actually going on outside of the borders'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'besides, they've already created the framework for an authoritarian surveillance state in the UK under the radar without people noticing'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we don't have a constitution to protect us... which is why i'm so utterly pro-constitution in the US and go to huge efforts to try and point it out to Americans and why it's important'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because they WILL lose it, and once it's gone, your protections are gone'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'you do realise the system of government in the UK is a constitutional monarchy, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Kinda assumes you guys have a constitution\'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're wrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_United_Kingdom'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're confusing constitutional law with labels for government types'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Being uncodified doesn't mean it doesn't exist'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, the courts disagree'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or to put it a different way, an uncodified constitution basically means Parliament saying "We have a consitution which we abide by unless we decide not to"'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is also how the UN declaration of human rights works, which similarly makes it worthless'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Eric Barendt has the right of it'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'an uncodified constitution without seperation of powers is merely a facade to confer validity'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't like hot sex'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only hot coffee'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '.pipe(gclan)'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'God, those fucking vuvuzelas'
T3/r7/2012-07-28.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Starling: 'They need to throw those people out'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mner mner'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Scurvy: 'I disagree'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ok, that's it, i'm declaring war on people in their 20s and 30s with kids, the fat slappers with hordes of screaming bratts that MY tax pays for, that for some inexplicable reason completely lose track of their being other people in the world outside of their little shits, who, along with their festering offspring, swim in the section of the pool labelled "Strictly lane swimming beyond this point", and then steal my fucking towel'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's enough! them and their little shits can burn in hell'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'So breaststroke, only make fists.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oh, i did, i swam straight at em'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they soon got the idea'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Assault, officer? nah, just my swimming style'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'still down a towel though'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Locked lockers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's the almost militant selfishness that gets me'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'They're kids. It's in their nature to be fuckwads.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not the kids, their parents'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'same sort of problem as people who drive like dicks on the highways'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'never ceases the amaze me how much people can just be complete arses to fellow man'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'do you have a mirror? Use it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'exhibit b'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yes...?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're the same sort of people that park their shopping carts sideways across the entire aisle, then stand beside it, gassing'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'You should be on one of those 'grumpy old men' tv shows.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a reason those shows exist and why they're popular'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's because with age comes wisdom, what they say is largely spot on'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it wasn't, people wouldn't relate to it'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'they exist because they are funny and sad people'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a misconception'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'even if it's true, it's not the most important thing in the world'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Seltsimees Dagnir: 'old age doesn't bring wisdom. observation does'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and shows a lack of understanding of the way media works'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it is the same reason observational comedy works'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'most of us get a little annoyed, but then we just ignore those things. Some people just don't have the ability to let little things go.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'then you misunderstand the anger'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the anger is not of the slight, but with the attitude of the people that allow those slights to occur'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Yeah, because everyone agrees with you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if everyone agrees with me there'd be no argument, and therefore no tv program about it'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'Oh, you are right. Those grumy old men are very wise. And so are you. You should run for president.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if our leaders were wise old men with experience instead of young, inexperienced 'faces' that have been put their by lobbyists and other powers, just possibly maybe the world wouldn't be in the entirely shit state that it's in right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a very good reason that throughout a huge number of cultures, isolated from each other, through history, the concept of an "elder", or "council of elders" endures'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'That was because 'back in the day' stupid people didn't get old'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'yeah, but not the concept of "grumpy elder"'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'They died'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well i can't comment on that :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'It was an achievement to hit 50 years old without someone cutting your throat while you slept'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'might be why people were a little more polite to strangers in public'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Grumpy people were unlikely to survive the ol' throat cut'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'They were? When?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And, BTW, what's the average age of the US presidents throughout history? 50, 60? That's not exactly young.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'both the US president right now and UK PM are inexperienced'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Public 'politeness' beyond simple class servitude only existed after Rennaissance'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'before that, good freakin luck :-P'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'before that people didn't move around, so people knew others in their communities'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'different type of society'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Exactly. So why reference it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'So Bush was a better president than Obama?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"less worse"'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'wtf?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but bought and paid for by the same people'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'You seriously rate Bush over Obama?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'continuing the program set by his predecessor'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I mean, he is a pushover, but at least he knows the way to hold a book'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're asking me to choose what's best "labrador shit or alsation shit"'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're both shit, man'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'I think you overestimate the political gumption of the presidential arm of the US government'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just that bush looked stupid, whereas obama's a slick, divisive fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'same shit different day'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'If there's no state of emergency he is little more than an ideological figurehead'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's why there's been a state of emergency in the USA since 1944'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or had people forgotten?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'No, there hasn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'err, yes there is'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'I'm saying that _ALL_ US presidents, (at least in the 20th century) were insane terrorists that did things that would make you wake up screaming. No matter what age.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a decleration of a state of emergency has been renewed every year in the US since WW2. They've needed to legally be able to maintain the army'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and continue many of the powers in place'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your most recent renewal was here: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2012/05/16/executive-order-blocking-property-persons-threatening-peace-security-or-'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he now has to renew it every 2 years because of the National Emergencies Act passed in 1976 where congress tried to pull back presidential overreach and stop potential abuses of powers'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'during a national emergency (which you're under right now) they can revoke habeas corpus, and remove the right to grand jury for the national guard. All manner of other things that he's pulled under the NDAA (imprisonment and execution of American citizens without due process) also come into play under national emergencies'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'By you, you mean the US?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'By definition, that is then a police state.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'And also not a democracy anymore.'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ranrr: 'What's the emergency? People are too fat? The oil is expensive?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the emergency is fabricated in order to maintain the status'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wouldn't it be nice to have governments report the real inflation rate'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'According to Zerohedge, the 2012 olympic gold medals are 92.5% silver, 6.16%copper, 1.34% gold'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that is correct'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'maybe they should call it a silver medal..'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no different to all modern currency coinage'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada beams a smile at Tigernuts.
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'mind you, the silver is still valuable, which is more that can be said for coinage'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'as long as governments force us to use their currencies, they have to have some value'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Tinada shrugs helplessly.
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'at least, the sum of currency will have to have some value :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more likely, for as long as people USE the currency, it'll have value'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'I'm pretty certain the value would drop to somewhere around firewood without gov't enforcing the use'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well they don't enforce the use now, do they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'though they're trying to outlaw cash'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'were you aware that in the USA, people who buy things using cash are considered a a terrorist threat?'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you know they've given up even trying to hide the fact that they're owned by the same people as the democrats when the Republican party comes out in favour of harsher gun controls, despite almost their entire vote base being against it'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twyst: 'maybe it's a reasonable request'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're trying to sneak the semi-auto gun ban in through the Cyber-Security bill. You'd best go check it out'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so i guess despite the polls, this will guarantee Obama gets back in'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thanks, America, that consigns the rest of us to death'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sepulchure: 'pfft Americans'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'our best bet now is to support Putin'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'talk about having to dance with the devil...'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twyst: 'lol seriously'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sepulchure: 'lol'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sepulchure: 'you should be a political analyst'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well currently Putin and the Chinese Communit leadership is all that is stopping America from invading Syria and Iran right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Twyst: 'I thought it was the crippling debt and 2 ongoing wars'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'political analyst is a bit like "military intelligence"'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"social science"'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) ElFeneri: 'rap music'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'meh, not much wrong with rap music'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's going to get brutal over here where we have no public gun ownership'
T3/r7/2012-07-29.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're even all using the same talking point. How stupid do they think everyone is? (and yes, they're right)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'NSA boss, General Alexander wants government to centralise the internet and force users to use a system analogous to EZ Pass so that all of their Internet activity can be tracked'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Oregon man faces 30 days in jail and $1500 fine for collecting rainwater on his own property'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'all sounds a tad marxist to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'is he breeding mosquitoes?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, Eureka'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sustainable farmer on 170 acres'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'then what the hell? '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well it's the latest in a long line of clampdowns on small landowners across the states'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'your central government really doesn't want people being self sufficient'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'That is why you put it all in your garage, if you have cistern outside, the county can whine.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'nods, put a barn out in the middle, collect it in there ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you'll probably find that the issue is: You shouldn't have to. Ponds are part of the landscape'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'a cistern is not a pond though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'And you usually need a permit if you want to dig a new pond.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Archimedes Eureka nods at Rizgoth.
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'he had a permit which they then revoked a few years later'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and it's daft to need a permit, imho'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's land management'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'Well, the main reason for a permit is so that the govt knows how developed your land is, for prop tax reasons.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rizgoth: 'if you have an authorized permit for something, it becomes grandfathered in, even if they change their mind.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'apparently not there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i disagree with property taxes, as it goes, here as well as there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'since property benefits from a lot of services like policing, the justice system, fire services, etc., all of which cost money, it shouldn't be surprising (or wrong) that it would be taxed...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'no, properties don't benefit from services, people do'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'property taxation is just a way of forcing people onto the 'grid''
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the people owning the property... and the people are the ones paying the tax...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'they'd be on the grid merely by virtue of property ownership'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm with the old LD policy of replacing property taxes with a locally administered income tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's about the only thing i do agree with the LD about'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'zero sum difference to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'I prefer charging for use, whenever practicable'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'charging for use would be preferable to property taxation'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'property is no measure of consumption or income'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'one significant difference between income tax and property tax is for commuters, though...your house gets the benefit of services in your living town...are you taxed by residence or employment location?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'property taxation is charging for use to a certain extent, use of certain services tied to the property'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'residence, abe'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but it isn't, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'what services?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the already-mentioned services...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a property worth more benefits more from protective services than a shack, for instance'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'none of the aforementioned services scale with property size or value'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, like hell'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure it does. Try buying insurance for a 50k property versus a 2m one...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if you have 5 acres of land, it does not cost any more to police than 1 acre of land'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'putting out a fire at a mcmansion doesn't save more property than putting out a fire at a trailer?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'taxes don't pay the insurance'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the fire department don't pay for the damage'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, they prevent the damage'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the service they provide gives value'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the value of the insurance is similar to the value you get from the services'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you shouldn't be attaching value to a service provided by a government, you should be attaching COST'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): You smirk.
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'it has both'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might be able to evaluate both, but both aren't relevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'if you're only attaching one of those things, then yerdoinitwrong'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, both are quite relevant'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not in the emergency services debate they aren't'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'in your opinion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'otherwise you're suggesting the level of care you should get should depend on how rich you are'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'whereas the point is that you don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and also note that better services in poorer areas also benefits those in richer areas...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'the level of care != the value of service provided'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'fires, epidemics, crime, etc. has a habit of spreading when uncontrolled'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'sure sonshi, then the same effect can be reached through income tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'sure, so wealth can remain in families for generations while the heirs sit back and do nothing?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'property taxes unfairly descriminate against the elderly, against people who've seen their areas develop around them, and against people who've put their money into property rather than spending it on other things'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that has nothign to do with property taxes, soshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're thinking of death duty'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, it's partially a tax on wealth too...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a very bad one'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so they're a very crude method of taxing wealth, they're a crude method of gauging consumption'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and with reverse mortgages and such, there's no reason it discriminates against the elderly. If you choose to buy more property than someone with your wealth does, well, you should pay for the services that come with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'an elderly person living in the same home for 50 years does not consume more services than the same property with 5 people in it, in fact they consume far less'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, reverse mortgages, there's another can of worms'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not for fire, judicial, etc. services'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah, reverse mortgages may need better regulation...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Archimedes Eureka: 'depends, how sick is that elderly person? how many times is an ambulance called vs a normal young family?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'make sure they understand what they're getting into'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'considering all of the other problems, there are far better ways of taxing for the purpose of paying servicse'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'ends up being zero sum...each method is harsher on a different fringe segment'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'bottom line, gummint neads so much money to exist (leaving off for now the debates of how MUCH service should be provided, how expensive government should be), and they need to take that money from the people there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looking at the opposite absurd side of the argument, i don't pay a penny in property tax. Does that mean I use no services?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'unless you live with mommy, you pay property tax...it's just indirect for renters'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if you live under the bridge, your services get paid by others'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'none of the socialists/democras pay property tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and if you live under a bridge, it gets paid by others because it would be worse for them if they didn't, you're sort of unintentionally holding society hostage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a lot of european governments are ultimately going to need a serious discussion about which services government should provide, since it can't be afforded atm'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if a service is worth providing, they should tax for it. If not, might as well scrap it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'simplistic argument'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how it is provided is as important'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'certainly here, public services is a cover for corporate welfare'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if it is inefficient but worth providing, then they need reform...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'largely speaking, UK taxpayers taxes go to pay for fat people to have kids'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, that's a problem with your country, not taxation in general'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '(if true)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oh, we have plenty enough problems with taxation'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the ultra rich don't pay tax'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the working classes get crippled'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, again, that's a problem with your country/govt'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yup'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it won't change'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and many other countries/governments...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'plenty of countries where they stick it to the rich instead of the working classes'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how come people are always quick to criticize the poor, breeding or not, as a drain on the lack of employment opportunity and affordable living nation, but they typically look away from multibillion or trillion dollar tax-payer funded wastes of money?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'those countries don't HAVE rich'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'so it becomes the same thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'certainly not anywhere near the majority, but...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'class thing, chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i understand why but i always look at where the blame comes from before where it goes'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, those countries don't have so many rich people, because a larger share of their income is taken, sure...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'with a few exceptions'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more likely they hide it in havens'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'no, they don't have rich because rich won't stay where they're not the advantaged...that's usually how they got rich'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'globalisation has brought the end of fair taxation'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: '"Internet money" has brought lots of less-savvy rich tho'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a number of rich people have moved to my country... although the burden of taxation falls mainly on them, taxes are still lower for them than in many places'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'yup, sporeland is a haven :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'great for living it up/partying too :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'yeah... main problem with all those rich people though, is that it's driving up property prices for the poor working locals'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the govt might need to put in more money into infrastructure...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so rich people complain about having to pay more taxes, but they get rich by outsourcing the rest of their country who they decide shouldn't receive social services for their rich services'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it just seems like the kind of psychology you'd expect from the 1930's'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'most (wealthy) countries don't try to tax capital income/gains as heavily as income from work, so you might argue that once you are reasonably wealthy, you are favoured'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'of course once you include inflation, the picture looks less awesome for rich people, unless they are willing to take stock market-level risk with their wealth'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the risk can be greatly reduced though, for those with a lot of wealth'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's not a great deal that can be done about big corporate tax fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tinada: 'certainly once you are rich, you will have (easier) access to investments outside of the traditional cash-bonds-stocks trinity'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'there sure was something that could be done about those evil people in the 1930's though, at least some of them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'as long as the company finds it viable to do business in the country, you can do something about tax fraud...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'and if this were the 1930s, that would be useful :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i guess they like the immortality of lawyerly diplomacy instead, understandable i guess, but the result is death either way for their victims'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well the first thing they could have done was let those banks go bust, then ban casino banking'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'end fractional reserve banking'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'isn't it?  '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'fractional reserve banking is an important monetary tool though... compare with the situation without it - firstly, the govt has to provide more currency to maintain the monetary base. And when there are fluctuations in the necessary base to keep inflation within desired bounds, what do you think would happen?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'because of sticky prices (downwards), you'd get more inflation over time. Either that, or worse recessions, depending on which the country (govt) prefers'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so that's better than the current situation of banks deliberately bankrupting entire countries in order to take them over?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, that only happens to corrupt countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'like half the western world?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the thing about global banking corporations, right, they're global, you see......'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, you pick your poison... even with all that, economic performance is still better in the long run'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you might have noticed the slow motion economic explosion that's going on in europe/usa right now'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'for all the terrible crises we've had, they're no match for what came on the gold standard...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and the current crisis is in large part due to the questionable "wisdom" of a currency union without a fiscal one'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'fractional reserve banking will never be safe while you get round-robin leveraging'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'eh, it's less risky than what came before...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'doubt that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i don't remember seeing anywhere in the history books where banks effectively pulled coups in countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and dictated policy in others'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's a moot point anyway... if a country is badly run, it wouldn't switch from it. And if a country is well run, they have no problems with it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'countries are no longer run'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i read about on in england in 1500's but it could be fictional hate-propaganda'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and as for historical banks manipulating countries... there are the medicis and others of their ilk...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the population rises, so the scale increases'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'america thinks china buying calgary offshore oil drilling operations is odd for the wrong reasons imo, canadian companies should be owned by americans and not chinese people'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's going to be an almighty fight coming up to stave off the return of communism in one of it's many constumes'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what i think they're about, i'm not really sure if either is really better'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'don't forget fascism, the right wing version of communism...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think things like oil should be nationalized, and uranium and gold because of the amount of toxic waste generated'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'no private industry in that stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'both sides are winning ground in parts of east europe'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'first thing you've said tonight that i agree with, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'collectivism, in all it's forms'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and so what if a government is corrupt, and probably most are, heh, if the people who suffer for their rotten master's will have no say in their master's actions then their foreign bank hosting country has no justification for the treatment of the people of the usurped rotten government that they hated'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'fascism isn't collectivism though... it's sacrificing the people for the "nation"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's largely done through monopoly collectivism'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think that movie 'even the rain' from bolivia was interesting, and a history of a south american people who prospered while others left by doing things themselves, money's the thing that does thing even though there's millions of unemployed people who do things themselves, and then the government brings out the riot police because they're getting things done - what happens when people actually take action is the government becomes their killer'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'collectivism is when (in theory) things are being done for the benefit of those contributing to it... not when the people are just directly exploited for the benefit of their "betters"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's why you see the feds raiding all kinds of farming collectives in america, chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they don't even take violent action, in that movie they were claiming the water that the government was selling to a foreign private corporation, but they dug the well and it was theirs'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'but exploitation is the only way that ends up, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the way fascism went, there was not even the pretense of banding together to do stuff for the direct benefit of those doing it...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when it ends up in exploitation is when we call "collectivism" communism'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'in everday parlance, anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not sure what can be done about it all'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'US has the best chance of overthrowing it since they're still armed (notice that the government and lobbyists are going all out for gun controls atm)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when it sort of works, and doesn't send people to siberia, it's called socialism'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha, being armed at the outset does very little for those chances'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it does a shitload'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'being well-industrialised does...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'without public gun ownership, the threshold required for revolution is much higher'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'small arms are remarkably easy for a population to produce, once an uprising has begun... and there's usually no shortage of countries/organisations willing to pump in weapons indiscriminately'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only thing we have is numbers'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'having an armed population merely means that the factions that started with the most guns are likely to dominate society later on, as the revolution coalesces around them first'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'good'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'great, if you want to replace your government with what will probably be a tyranny'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it wouldn't be a tyranny'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'revolutions dominated by a faction often don't end too well... there are exceptions, but there's little incentive for a group to relinquish the power they gained through their blood'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's not a faction when it's about half the public'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'hopefully i'll have found somewhere to bug out to by then'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'one way or another, if you look at current/recent revolutions, how much of their arms were legally procured prior to the uprising?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'only two armed uprisings of late the fighting has been mostly done by terrorist groupds'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'funny how those "terrorist" groups seem capable of holding democratic elections'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'where the liberal alliance crushed the muslim brotherhood buy more than 2 to 1'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the rebels in Syria are a part home grown, partly Al-Quaeda, using their own arms, arms stolen from defections, and arms provided by Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Turkey, and USA, all funneled via the northern border with Turkey'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'where?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'libya'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the country that looks like it's going to split into 2?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that seems odd to me if america has a war on al qaeda 12 years ago and then all of a sudden they've found a new figurative demon to slay, when i read the news i wonder about things like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not much wars prior to 1900'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'USA were never at war with Al-Quaeda, they OWN Al-Quaeda'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'in both cases, they needed a certain period, sure, in order to arm themselves from defections/foreign support/manufacture, but that's going to be true anyway. Rifles and handguns alone would never cut it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'oh, i thought bin laden on may 1st was in that, my memory might be wrong though, i heard al qaeda mentioned alot in the news'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm just waiting for for that bitch Clinton to itch her testicles sufficiently enough to dare interfering in Syria and watching Russia counterattack'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the "improvement" in threshold for revolution when a population is armed is really pretty small. And in fact, the additional policing that the govt justifies with it probably more than cancels it out.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you look at the us, the police seem to be everywhere...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the extra work they put in because of it makes it more difficult for them to sneak in'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i just like to understand what they stand for, how they recruit their followers, how honest their promises are and things like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like, i'm greedy and protect my fortune and you might get a promotion or is there something deeper?  i like to beat on people indescriminately, and being the law is the best way to acheive that?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they must have some kind of simplistic fundamental theories about them right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if you could eliminate all civilian arms, there would likely be a corresponding decrease in the number and weaponry of the police'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that isn't the case, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'our police have considerably more arms and armour than they did 20 years ago when they banned handguns'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'in fact, they didn't used to be armed or armored, they had a baton and handcuffs'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'in my country, despite often being referred to as a police state, you hardly see police around, except at airports, accidents and such'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'now they have a baton, a high strength taser, pepper spray, and bodyarmour'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'and I think the last time a security officer shot a gun, it was a suicide.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'last time police shot a man here, we had 2 weeks of riots that caused $2.5bn of damage, which resulted in over 3000 arrests'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'without guns in the population, there're no need for police to be heavily armed. If it is true that they are in your country... why aren't people doing anything about it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because people are fucking stupid'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they've been controlled by laws and by the media'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if people could be trusted it's alright to have guns around for the scenario when they're actually needed to protect the innocent'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'societal engineering on a grand scale over 70 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i heard they had weapons cache's like that in norway until 1999'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'people here are largely dependant on government to live'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's a bloody island... it shouldn't be too difficult to get rid of all the illegal weaponry over time.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'or almost all, anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the illegal weaponary isn't the issue'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'never was'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'guns were never the problem'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'enough so the police don't feel like they have to walk around with lots of weapons'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what i think, if even 1 police officer passes screening and then goes on to be a serial killer or abuse of power kind of person, then they need some better screening programs before they can trust themselves to not be homicidal maniacs imo'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the armory of the police was not because of a perceived threat'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'then why did they bother?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it is to bring in an authoritarian regime'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'expensive, no benefit?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i can usually sniff out a bad person, i don't see what their hinderances are'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'they had to have given a reason...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why do they have to give a reason?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're still under the misconception that governments here are the good guys, that they do everything the populace's best interests at heart'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'newsflash!'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they don't'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'projected threat isn't necessarily perceived threat...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if there's no reason and the average voter let it happen... well... I have some choice words, but I should refrain from speaking further...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's a good point.... why did the fbi take over the Aurora investigation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not their jurisdiction'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Dispel Majic: 'so they can hush up that it was really committed by the illuminati.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'They can probably make a case that it's at least potentially terrorism'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'except that their cover story is that it isn't'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, I guess I don't know how the fbi got involved. But once they're in, they're tough to evict, heh.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm expecting some colossal scale voting fraud this november'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Why? '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'definitely not a fan of this coming EZ-PASS compulsory internet ID tracking everything you do'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why am i expecting voting fraud?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'because it's already been going on, and both sides are desperate'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'prove it's going on please.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'in any number that's even remotely significant'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'In a country as large as the US, there's almost always some sort of irregularity, which isn't necessarily fraud. And the States don't have any history of 'colossal' voter fraud.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/7tu25do'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/cuenrrs'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/77yoya2'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/d2wg32d'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://tinyurl.com/d8dw8lz'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'some examples of stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'subversion of process, selective enforcement, all kinds of dirty tricks, really'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'let's see. first one : total conspiracy theory, no evidence at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2nd one. yeah. vote rolls may not be accurate. no evidence of any of these dead people actually voting'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '3rd one.. republican presidential selection only.. who cares in terms of vote integrity'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'erm'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '4th.. same as the first'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'erm, 3rd'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'do you really need anyone to point this out to you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'voter fraud in primaries barely matters. it's not a government problem'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's part of the process'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'it has no real legal significance'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the parties can set whatever rules they want for their primaries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'And that web site is an authoritative source? Or is it a source that conforms to your suspicions?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'give me any *actual* incidents of multiple ineligable people voting in federal/state/local elections. then, it may be a problem worth solving'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'rhavage - most of the base facts there are accurate. the inferences are utter crap. first by the website, and then by tigernuts, who's taking it even further'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how can i prove to you of fraud in an election that hasn't happened yet?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'evidence from past elections perhaps?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'why don't you go outside and say "don't run, we're your friends"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, just prove fraud from past elections.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'as it seems republicans want to implement it, it's a solution in search of a problem'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'which happens to hit democratic-leaning vote blocks (young, minority, etc) much harder'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'they missed an important step if you're gonna implement it fairly'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'step 1: get the rolls right'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'step 2: make it *incredibly easy* for anyone on the rolls to get the required id'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'step 3: make it hard for anyone not on the rolls to get the right id'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'oh wait.. they missed all 3 of those steps.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if what you've described is your interpretation of free and fair elections, then you're claiming the zimbawean elections were free and fair, as were russia's'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'those are necessary conditions to use the sort of photo id people seem to want'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'they're not sufficient'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'powers can bend or break the rules to a huge degree to throw the results'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yes. they can. '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and do'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'provide evidence that they DID'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'use google'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'don't just jump down the rabbit hole of "my party lost, the other side must have cheated"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'eh? the party i voted for last election is in power'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'no. that's not how it works. my position's the default one. you're making the extraordinary claim'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the burden of proof for voter fraud is on the people claiming fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'but, you don't have any evidence'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/007922.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/06/world/europe/observers-detail-flaws-in-russian-election.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yeah. they probably do have fraud/etc. i'd figured you were talking about AMERICAN elections'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/widespread-allegations-of-electoral-fraud-in-tower-hamlets-7682075.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'oh right'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i forgot'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it's voting fraud anywhere else, it's ok'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if it's voting fraud in America, it's a conspiracy theory'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'it's called evidence. is there any for the states?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'go back to sleep, Kraken, there's nothing to see here'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'i'm actually interested.. is there any evidence of mass voter fraud in the states?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nothing constitutes evidence in your eyes'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you've provided evidence from 1) republican primaries'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2) other countries'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '3) total conjecture from alex jones.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://thehill.com/video/in-the-news/232099-florida-governor-to-sue-dhs-in-voter-registration-battle'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'better. correct country this time :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm not even american, you realise'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.usnews.com/debate-club/is-voter-fraud-a-real-problem/voter-fraud-is-a-proven-election-manipulation-tactic'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"As the Supreme Court said, vote fraud has been present in our elections throughout our entire history"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'dunno which court judge said that, he must have been a conspiracy theorist'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'd have him arrested if i were you'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well then, we're just going to have to be more vigilant, aren't we?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'florida one.. who knows what's really going on. they're either purging legit voters, or illegitemate ones.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'purging legit voters is bad.. very bad'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'purging illegitemate ones is good.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'i don't know who's right. neither do you.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we had voter fraud in the UK last election where people were barred from the polling stations because there weern't enough staff on'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'but, judging by the racial make-up of the list of people they want to remove, it doesn't look good for the purge list'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'so voting fraud almost certainly will happen, and dirty tricks will be employed by both sides because times are hard, and it's going to be a close race'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, quoting hans van spakovsky? his track record of telling the truth isn't high'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Obama already has a crack legal team lined up to try and sue anyone who says anything bad about him'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, again.. evidence for that please?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57376463-503544/obama-campaign-launches-truth-team/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/02/obama-campaign-launches-truth-teams/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/02/team-obama/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://mittromneycentral.com/2012/05/11/obamas-enemies-list-continued-obama-truth-squad-intimidation-revealed/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'To have a legal team doesn't actually seem unreasonable, does it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'What part of what states that Obama will sue anyone who says anything bad about him?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'read it and you might find out'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'none of it mentions suing.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Also, the first link doesn't even mention any lawyers.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'is says "we'll tell the truth". which, seems perfectly fine to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'expecting politicians to tell the truth?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'no. but, i expect the other side to call them out if they lie'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'Don't change the subject. Sources for that Obama has a crack legal team standing ready to sue anyone who says anything bad about him?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'You made that claim. Now source it.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'about as much evidence as his earlier fact-free assertions'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'to be fair.. this vote-fraud thing, he's getting evidence-free assertions from other websites to work with'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'there's a way to solve vote fraud. the republicans aren't trying to solve vote fraud... except voting by the "wrong people"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fax2lFzkRTQ'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why would a politician running for presidency in his nation go to a foreign nation surrounded by other foreign nations, both with immigrant voters in his point of origin, and then make controversial statements that one side or the other views as racism?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'really hard trying to track down 4 yr old news story'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i look at this stuff in the news and it looks odd to me, why not just not bother?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'who/what, chemosh?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2012/07/30/romney-israel-jerusalem.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'heh'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that's pretty easy'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'going there and doing whatever's fine, but why make any un-neccessarily controversial statements at all?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'his owners have told him that he needs to peddle the position on supporting Israel against Iran'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'because he wants to be president, and either figures it'll gain him votes, or he doesn't care who he offends?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as a public official'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'this is my favourite though'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp2VFN-w9d0&feature=relmfu'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think he cares who he offends, but maybe they see offense where there is none intended or else he thinks by offending certain people he'll gain the support of others'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'seems kind of bigoted to me if that's the case'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'if he didn't realise those remarks were insensitive and likely to cause controversy, he's not ready to be president'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'i'm guessing he calculated it'd be beter for him to do it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'neither of the candidates are ready to be president by that calculation'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't particulalry care though, it's just one of lots of things i see on the news that i have a question about, and thanks you for your explainations'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'apart from the guy who's been president for 3 1/2 years already and hasn't done that sort of thing much, if at all'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lol, right'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'ok.. i'll bite. which foreign speeches/meetings has he gone to and done something like that at?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'apart from telling all business owners that they didn't build their business, or tell all patriots that the 2nd ammendment is about hunting and fishing... or having a truth squad to clamp down on anyone launching character attacks on him... then accusing Romney of being a felon'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the guy is a class 1 major hypocrit'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'oh, look at that. 0 for 4 again'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '1) romney took a quote out of context.. almost everyone, except partisan republicans sees that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2) actually, dunno. may have to look it up'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it wasn't out of context, it was what he said, he made a mistake in saying it, it's not what he meant to say'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '3) what's your problem with someone CORRECTING LIES OTHER PEOPLE SAY ABOUT THEM'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how is saying "Nobody is allowed to lie about me, but i'm about to lie about them" ok?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, 4) i think the short form was "you said X on form 1, and not-X on form 2"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, it's a felony to lie on either form'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'lie about obama all you want. he'll try to show the truth.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'if you think obama's lied too, do the same. SHOW the truth'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just like he'll show you a fake birth certificate'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'meh. if you're going birther, i'm out'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you were out from the start'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'if your head was up obama's arse any further it'd come out the same colour'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'seriously?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'seriously'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or would you like some sources?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'i always like sources. delicious, truthy sources :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'true ones are better, but truthy ones will do for now. more fun things to shred'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're not interested in true sources, you're only interested in sources that either match your view of reality, or that you -cannot- shoot down'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'and, you've provides so far, the following:'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '1) Sources saying different things to your claims'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2) evidence-free sources'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '3) one or 2 interesting ones, i'm gonna look into'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'prove it, give us some sources'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'prove what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that they say different things to my claims and are evidence free?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you provides sources about american voting fraud, by showing 1) voting fraud from russia/zimbabwe, places we know to be corrupt'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '2) problems with republican primaries, which show  *nothing* about federal/state election fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well i disagree with you there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: '3) conspiracy theories from alex jones --- X happened, therefore Y/Z which has no evidence'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'republican primaries are part of the process'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yes. but the rules for them are set by the republican party, not by the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it would be the same problem if here in the UK there were problems with candidate selection'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's irrelevent'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it's subversion of the system'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'perhaps, but it's not something a law is needed to correct.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i never said a law was needed'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'a political party can select whoever they want, by whatever rules they want'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'all that was said was that i predicted voter fraud this november'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'nothing wrong with saying that businessmen didn't build the roads and bridges their businesses use. I don't see why there's an uproar over that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you didn't write that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if people are offended over that, perhaps they're feeling a bit too entitled'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if the party's are believed to represent a common ideology resembling democracy though, then selecting however they want is like lying to the public isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just in general'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'modern democracy is an illusion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'the governement sets the rules for who can get on the governement ballot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'well, if people keep repeating the lies they feel like believing, it's no wonder...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'however *any* group wants to meet those rules is up to them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the nazi party won their elections by the rules'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'a strong democracy needs a conscious effort by enough people to figure out who is lying'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'tigernuts.. what's your point?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i think it's remarkable how much emphasis they're placing on ways to streamline and automate the voting process in canada and mongolia and other places now'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people should know how hard it is to track down fraud hidden behind 10 million lines of machine language instructions'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the massacre of 10 million jews, romani, and various other undesirables was done under government rules'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ontario's one, they're bringing automated voting all over, i think even facebook'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yes, they won by the rules. then, they changed the rules.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'to keep themselves in power'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'when the rules don't meet the desires of those in power, the rules get changed. See Iraq War, see Libya'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'wouldn't people feel better if people from their own community were there to manually count the votes before the people who voted?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '"reasonable" people didn't believe that the nazis were that crazy, and nutcases believed the nazis' conspiracy theories...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or is it just too expensive or not very secure for.. somebody?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'lie, cheat, steal, do whatever, it'll be national security and redacted'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'yeah. i actually agree with you for once :) that's total crap, whichever side does it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is why the Chilcot enquiery still hasn't been published'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'you play by the rules, if you don't like the rules, you democratically, and openly change them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is why Obama has spent a record amount trying to prosecute whistleblowers'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'without effort from the people, that's how a democracy can be dismantled...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'again. that sorta thing's wrong. you won't find me disagreeing there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a reason why Russia and China are now repeatedly block-veto'ing all calls for any military action'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'twice bitten thrice shy'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'iran's gonna happen, unfortunately.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'too many powerful people want it to.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'strange how the governments make them out to be the bad guys'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'perhaps if you include "misdirection, propoganda, obfuscation" within definitions of fraud'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'll find that most governments of the last 50 years have done fraudulent stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'but, why would the government do something like that, which, lessens their power.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it doesn't lessen their power'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'it does if they're not allowed to do those things :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they have a very well oiled machine that conditions people to accept it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they use laws, they use media, they use culture'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're even using the church, ffsd'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it appears that more republicans now believe that obama is muslim'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i feel sorry for those girls in russia who were sent to prison for 7 years for blasphemy'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'get used to it, you'll be seeing a lot more stuff like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i thought most of the world's an atheist now, christianity there i think comes from the roman byzantine empire and was politically installed, so that's probably why their political views mixed with religion sent them to prison'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'someone here got 3 years for tweeting "let's start a riot"'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't like the concept of worshipping a human being as god myself'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'when one side consistently lies and gets away with it, and honesty is punished, eventually the democrats will follow suit. It's almost the will of the people.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or humans punishing me for not worshipping their version of holiness, which is repulsive often'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'eventually? they're all at it already Sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ALL'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'not all the way yet...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes way'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the democrats may be evil and corrupt compared to your average guy, but they're still saints compared to the alternative. It's not going to last forever though...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a reason gun sales have gone through the roof, recent polls show a majority of americans don't trust their government'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course they don't trust their government, when they're on the side that lies...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '3 years for a tweet?  what do they think he's a general or something?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're stuck in a right-left paradigm. They're both at it, neither side is worse nor better than the other, they just have different markings'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there IS no alternative as yet'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not until something cracks open the two-party system'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some gnu open source should start up a non-logged non-political repression chat and messenging/email service'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'wrong. one side's definately worse'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: '"neither side is better" is how we get hitlers and stalins.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'immune to stuff like 500 million dollar investments from multi billionairres'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and both sides will throw -everything- at it to make sure that doesn't happen'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'but, yeah, i'll agree the choices right now are bad and worse'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'if the majority gives up, the country's future will be dictated by radicals'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) A Giant Kraken: 'maybe ok-ish and much worse, on a good day.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'will you be saying "ok-ish" in a year's time, i wonder'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're gearing up for something big'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'even when both are corrupt, there's always a better side. If people consistently fail to reward the better side, what incentive do politicians have to get better?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'might as well lie even more...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Summoner Yuna: 'We're still waiting for sources for your claim that Obama has a crack team of lawyers standing ready to sue anyone who says anything negative about him, TigerNUTS.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well that's when you say screw 'em, sonshi, and you start off a fresh at the local level'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'ha, you and what party?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'unless you manage to push through instant runoff, a third party is a distant dream'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you stand as independants,'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or a local party reps'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'plenty of people do stand as independents'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you'll notice that they've been clamping down on local democracy though, sticking federal troops at state level'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'but by the time the election comes, even mother theresa would be viewed as a violent muslim crack addict, without backing funds, because the average voter enjoys repeating lies'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'lies like "obama said business owners didn't buil their business" *cough*'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'build'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2008/09/missouri-sheriffs-prosecuters-form/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well he did say that, sonshi'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'he said they didn't build the roads and bridges the businesses use'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there's a big difference there'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's what he meant'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'that's not what he -said-'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you think this know nothing party was real?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how dare he be quoted out of context. that's outrageous, nobody ever does that!'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'do you really want your politicians to speak in self-contained contextless one liners, like some idiot savant?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'next you'll be saying corporate media doesn't edit interviews to spin a policy point'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well, now that you come to mention it, sonshi, most of america's media has 'voluntarily' agreed to pass any stories and quotes to obama's team for vetting before airing them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'at the very least, the media needs to stop spreading lies...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you look on bbc news you'll see links to countries and their media, and they don't mention any repression in what the news reports and things like that in america or canada or some other free places'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm not sure if that's really the case or not because when i look at the news often it seems to follow a gameplan and flipping between agency's they seem to be following the same one'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nods, i try to get a view from a couple of different countries, too'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'more you do, the more "propoganda" just shouts at you'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'best to have a variety of sources...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'rather than propaganda, lies sell copies and pageviews'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'before kraken pipes up:'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/16/us/politics/latest-word-on-the-campaign-trail-i-take-it-back.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'it's only propaganda if it was made with the intent to sway views. For major news outlets, at least, it's with the intent of peddling their articles.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'thats why people are switching off corporate media in droves'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if some of these news agency's were really independent, they would be looking for big stories that aren't in any of the other's, and doing the investigating and having their own opinions added and stuff'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but unless they localize content for ip addresses, aljazeera, bbc, ctv, cbc and lots of others always find the same top stories and the same thing to say about them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well 30 years ago there were dozens and dozens of news agencies, now there are like... 6? in the USA?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you have a lot of vertical integration in the media, and they're all meddling in politics'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'the ones which survived are the ones that sensationalise (lie) the best, without making it appear that they lied completely...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'of course, the dumber the target audience, the more you can get away with...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i got fed up with the BBC over their pro-war, pro-authoritarian, pro-agenda21 take on absolutely everything'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'they report very happily on american abuses...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not a fraction of what it deserves'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like show me a news agency that figures the typical political coverage and foreign tensions is covered enough by all the others, and they can look for something else to talk about'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i look for it, i went and look on russian times once or twice even, just for a different perspective of what matters to them and how they present it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'there's also http://www.channelnewsasia.com/'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Sonshi looks around and whistles innocently.
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it'd be nice if they'd report something like... how we've actually been in recession for much of the last 15 years, only 'avoided' because they changed the way that inflation was calculated'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'that's clear rubbish, at least for the us...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Sonshi: 'unless by much you mean a third...'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, i read on cbc news yesterday that researchers in http://ns.umich.edu/new/releases/20649-sexting-may-be-just-a-normal-part-of-dating-for-internet-generation this place found that sexually explicit pornography is healthy for teenagers to share with eachother'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '18 24 was their sample group, it seemed pretty odd to me, wouldn't they have found that out themselves or it adds a degree of more normal to it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'when you say stuff like the media gettin away with how stupid their audience is, stuff like that comes to mind'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's what they study in university huh, interesting people'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then last night there was a commercial on where they're at some kind of gathering and a woman receives a rape whistle for a present, cause 1 in 2 women will be raped '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'It shows that even in recreational amounts over a relatively short time period, ecstasy users risk specific memory impairments. Further, as the nature of the impairments may not be immediately obvious to the user, it is possible people wouldn't get the signs that they are being damaged by drug use until it is too late. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/07/120725200258.htm but.. "But barring that, it appears it can be safely administered, certainly through research," said Halpern, who has studied MDMA for 15 years and advocates for medical, prescription-based use of the drug. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2012/06/14/bc-ecstasy-adults-safe-health.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Jhav: 'tl;dr'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'srsly'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'Saved by ignore once again :-)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'can tell you all work for a government of some kind by your reaction to that observation'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'no opinion, really?  you sure are ordinary'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'lets share your opinion of my observation with me'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'my opinion is that your wall of text was too ugly for me to waste my time on'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'my opinion is that you have a protocol underneath your version of mush client that lets you into people's computers, and you piped up to feed your ego'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'that's cute'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'if that were true, I'd use it to limit how long your channel posts are'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what do you call it when you can tell who somebody is by the feeling their soul gives your soul?  is that in religion?  psychology?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i can read alot into people without ever seeing them, and then watch as my expectations are met'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did they ever used to sacrifice human beings to animal god's so that the animals see their master killing threats to them in front of them, and see their master as a enhancement to their own survival?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i imagine they tried stuff like that before, still do in some places i imagine'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'at least it has some sentient meaning to it, like the cat's eyes in constantine'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'they still do human sacrifices :) 500K Iraquis and about 5K US soldiers is a good example :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they obfuscate whatever purpose you see if it's there though, so it's not an openly practiced procedure like the kind i'm thinking of'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe they did the same back then too, and it evolves into religion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'like modern culture in canada most people would assume indians (wore) feathers purely for mysticism ritual, but they signified the status of a person in a tribe by how many and what color and stuff, also were used like a baseball cap to keep the sun out of hunters eyes and to identify tribemembers'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so it started as something sentient and turned into something oblivious'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'possibly, from what i heard'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'humans, their climb through the evolutionary chain notwithstanding, are still basically animals :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't mean teachings of shamanism and stuff never existed and stuff though to be legitimate, i still believe that stuff to be possible'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the point is that what separates humans from the rest of the animals, higher thinking, is used as little as possible. So, most things get ritualized (read that turned into a reflex) to spare one from having to think before one acts. So, let's take the case of getting trichinosis from eating pork, rather than retain the awareness that under cooked pork can be hazardous to one's health, we make pork eating a religious issue, i.e we ban the eating of pork and make that a ritual. That spares one from having to worry about trichinosis since "religious" people don't eat pork :) The fact that properly cooking the pork would have the same result matters very little :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you think that's how pork got demonized with jesus demons in the gospel?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'he said it's alright though, even had a bite himself in the story'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i understand that though, just choosing no becomes a issue from the creator so that people are less likely to try it out themselves'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the same reason superstitious people don;'t walk under ladders. Not paying attention to what's going on above one's head is the danger, not actually walking under the ladder. But don't tell them that. And, in a sense, they are right. If one religiously avoids walking under ladders, one will have a lot less accidents :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and if they explained that , if it was the case, people would question alot more things'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'how about salt over the shoulder or breaking dishes brings good luck?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if you think about it though, ignorance is all that's required for anything to happen, so it is kind of supernatural, i heard on shatner's weird or what about a theory of quantum mechanics that ties two beings or circumstances together at a unperceived level, when they were considering a woman who saved a boys life, who later saved her life'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so maybe with the expectation something bad can happen if you walk under a ladder, some kind of anomaly is feeding the superstition from time to time, if it's reverently believed'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'labeling something as supernatural assures that one doesn't have to understand it. That's the point :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the book daemonology with king james mentions the devil in similar ways'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, i understand that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'governments create religions, too. We know that a policeman will issue a traffic citation to one caught crossing a street against a red light even if there hasn't been a car going by in hours. The ticket is issued because the pedestrian violated a religious rule :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Vakieh: 'jaywalking is not illegal here :-P'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'sure, different areas have different religious beliefs :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the point is still valid, though. The government doesn't want you to understand why the rule exists. It was you to obey it, regardless.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'wants*'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what i mean by all that's required is if we didn't know how ice was formed and the temperature was warm and we seen some ice, we wouldn't defy there being ice in the heat, because we're ignorant and it's possible - at least to our thoughts, in reality we see that's not usually the case though, so almost anything can be possible in superstition and ignorance'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but just because ignorance can disprove the unlikely being most likely not possible, doesn't mean it is impossible still ultimately'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, the idea is to have people follow one blindly. That's the point of religion. The Catholic religion is full of weird rituals. Thankfully, I was educated by Jesuits, which are not the paragons of religious dogma.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't try to define the delimiters of possibility, i leave almost everything up for grabs and weigh it all in degrees of certainty, and most likely source, instead of saying a rock is god i might think that god put the rock there, possibly'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'You ask a Jesuit if God created everything in 7 days and they will give you a long winded explanation that turns out, when reduced to its most basic form, to be "NO" :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'well 7 days, then there's a verse in one book in the bible where 'one day to god is as 1000 years to man' still, so alot of things are possible in 7000 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'carbon dating might not take into account every possibility that how they measure could have been structured'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'even 7000 years would be a very questionable amount of time if we consider that back ground radiation is about 4 GYears old.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but still, even 7000 years seems like a short time to form the entire sky and all the bodies in it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'make that 14GYears.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'since Man was created on the 6th day, that would make the human race around that age, 14Gyears. A demonstrable absurdity.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just because the bible might only be a story in some places doesn't mean that there is no such thing as spirituality though, to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Ol' Dirty Fiendish: 'in some places'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'spirituality has nothing to do with religion. You can be rationally spiritual.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'to the unquestionable, Everyone must submit to governing authorities. For all authority comes from God, and those in positions of authority have been placed there by God. http://bible.cc/romans/13-1.htm'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'one of the reasons why Existentialism fell out of favor so quickly was because it demanded that people thought about the what it meant to exist (!). Too much hassle for most people. It's a lot easier not to cross the street and avoid getting a ticket :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'http://bible.cc/matthew/4-8.htm'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so, they might have alot of confidence in people's fear of questioning their political religion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'because.. those two verses can conceptually contradict one another'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, it seems that what most religions have in common is that if you break the rules you are going to be in a hurt locker :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, killed usually, to keep anybody else who questions quiet'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the stories at least and some places in the modern world'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, political dissent is usually punished by death, imprisonment or both :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'don't mess with religion!'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the devil is the embodiment of the enemy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'not Bush's Axis of Evil :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'note*'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Regan's Evil Empire, etc.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'and the guy that just wanted Camelot? They killed him. There is no evil in Camelot.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, devil is embodiment of the foe of the government's religion that makes it in unquestionable authority by genghis khan's scourge of god kind of psychology'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's something i considered, and if their god is a lie that mocks everybody's life, and indignation at this immortal treatment of their temporal time-frame is the devil, then what'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'is the devil righteousness as defined by the natural law, or ..?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'instead he's seen as a degradational cancer on the earth in most cults and people who claim to act in his name'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'without a devil, a religion can't survive. Nor can a government, or any other institution predicated on militarism explicit or implied.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe just a decent ideology, i never was under the belief absolute that the devil was the enemy, even the church of satan claimed to hail satan, hail thyself on their webpage, so they might have thought of it like that'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Buddhism seems to survive pretty well without a devil.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that did cross my mind, but Buddhism didn't start as a religion, but a as  modality of thought. It's basically a rational religion, which is actually an oxymoron :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Salraes: 'One of the few if only 'religions' that says if science proves it wrong, it has to change.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Aterius: 'its more of a rational spirituality than a religion thought it too has its dogma'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Buddhism turns your focus inward, you are the temple.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Not sure I agree with you about the oxymoron, Ana. You'd mentioned rational spirituality earlier, but what's rational about that? What spirits? '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, to me, rational  spirituality is just another way of saying "pure thinking". The analysis of what is.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Ok. Then why attach the world spiritual to it? And I'm not either pro or con religion, fwiw.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I see it as an oxymoron not because of anything intrinsic but because of what religions have become. Buddhism has not degenerated as much as other though I am sure that by now it has its allotment of rituals.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'spiritual, to me, means "of the mind". It's abstract thinking. Thinking about thought is a spiritual endevor.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I perceive thought as coherent electrical impulses. You can't get anything more "spiritual" than electricity :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'I think that in a world that condemns us to death from the very moment of birth, it's neither irrational nor unreasonable for people to somehow try to find a way out of that unpleasant certainty. Religion offers hope. I can sympathize.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that's a cop out, in my opinion.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'The need for reassurance that one's life has meaning is not necessary. One lives then one dies. The end.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'A cop out of what? People should just grin and bear it? Most of us really deplore the notion of dying. I know damned well that I do.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what kind of ignorant things they do instead of just acknowledging their ignorance of the future and it's possible continuance after their departure is the main problems with religion, either you think there's a god there and a continuation of yourself to be possible (or not) or you don't, adding whatever else you don't know about to the mix and then forcing it to be real is what i don't agree with much'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'god says this and that, but in the bible says 'no man can hear the voice of god and survive', ok then - what did he say again?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok, now you have an angel that heard it for you instead'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it's a cop out because humans don't want to accept that their life is no more meaningful than a dog's, for instance. They feel that because they are higher in the food chain, their existence is a  symptomatic of  higher strata of being.   '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Maye it's ok to read the voice of God ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Jeez, Ana, how do you know that humans aren't more meaningful than dogs? Are you certain?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and i don't see any problem with non-obstructive or pervasive rituals towards respecting the possibility'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but i think before people go on killing sprees claiming god told his angel to tell a dead man to write this down, people should require that god verifies that fact to them personally'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'The Copenhagen Interpretation is very much like the idea of God. It explains what we can't understand. We face an immense machine we call the Universe and we think that we exist to rule it and therefore, while don't understand why it all came about, there must be someone out there that has tagged us as his deputy rulers. '
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cause that's just a evil kind of line to cross'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'a much easier explanation is that we were a happy accident (happy for us) of physics.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, good chatting. Gotta hit the rack. Early day tomorrow. Later, you guys.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you know, if people have to kill as a last resort they know that, it's instinctual survival, going against your instincts for god doesn't seem right'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Undertaken Anaristos waves goodbye to Rhavage.
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but there's the word 'faith', and 'proving yourself' becomes a religion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'there is nothing special about faith, though it may motivate us to by lottery tickets :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'reading through the gospel, it's possible to extract a non-violent and good advice religious practice, that doesn't require idolotry and ignorant ritual'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so i thought that's alright, i'm not antichrist'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'why would there be an antichrist? (Though the antichrist would have to be, per force, made out antimatter :))'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I rather prefer the Chinese view, Ying and Yang. Neither pole is good or evil, just opposed to the other pole, but working in harmony.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Egyptian mythology tends that way also, though it came to them from the Assyrians. They must have really have had it together :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'Western Religion, derived from the Middle East, wants to polarize existence. If you are not an obedient servant of the God, you are evil. So, in other words, don't oppose the ruling party.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder how many muslims today became muslims just because their government is cracking down on them, as a rebellion kind of thing'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in the west and europe'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they want change or something i guess, maybe not understanding the entire situation, because religion is mysterious'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and i also wonder whether or not that was intelligently designed'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i imagine alot of the people in places where muslim is the de facto standard religion of authoritarianism would like to have it another way, but just the happening of muslims being persecuted might attract people who themselves felt wronged by their government who forget about what it's all about, or don't learn, just for the hell of it - and authoritarianism isn't something their government is against, i think'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so that's why i wonder if it was intelligently designed or not, totalitarianism requires complete control of human nature, including their rebellion'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and if their closest ally of conceptual freedom rebellion is itself a dictator where it is dominant, then they're double fucked conceptually'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'as i see it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'humans became religious because the other usual alternative is dispair.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'despair*'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah, most religious people seem despairingly religious, some against their own will - waiting for the after-death kingdom of god to appear, and wondering if they were good enough to reach it'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'some seem more sentient though, their god is this world's caretaker, and they're spreading his will underneath of their administration'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so the only punishment they fear is in this world, they have no spirits haunting them if they are evil, but they teach others that they do'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'the spirits are in their minds :) The point.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'thinking that god is repsonsible for the evil in this world, while satan is your enemy, now you have the reversed battle in heaven where satan won, sort of, don't you?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'did the angels ever find out if there was god, by faith he was there, or was satan right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'personally, I believe that the fight between Michael and Lucifer is evidence that there were extra-terrestrials here at some point :>'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what do you think about totalitarianism anaristos?  sounds kind of ordered chaos doesn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'do you see any incarnations of it in the world?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and is it against the law, which is above the law?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'totalitarianism might even be in stuff like computer software, if this operating system was built correctly, there might not be a antivirus industry, and without somebody writing viruses they might not acheive that industry'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but they wouldn't get in trouble, maybe somebody who uses the viruses they provide would'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just something i observed, i don't know if it's real or not, but i imagine they're billionairres by chance'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'women can't be billionaires'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in 1986 or 87 they invented a computer that had dynamic opcode's and byte sizes, all fully programmable, for instance - that would get rid of alot of the corridors that hacks rely on'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'just around the time the mass-consumer pc became sensationalized'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they discontinued it, but .. considering the profit margin of mass-production of secure computer systems versus the monopoly of 100 trillion dollars, they chost the monopoly, right?'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: ''remember folks, god put them there''
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'of course.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'operating systems are hackable because the companies that publish them are concerned more with paying as little as possible to produce said systems than in protecting the user. There is very little reason that virus attacks could be successful if the hardware that comes with modern computers were put to use.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it's ironic that the largest anti-vairus software company is owned by Intel :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'God is great.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'that's what he claims ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) FrT: 'I liked typing debate before I wrote that.'
T3/r7/2012-07-30.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'we aim to (dis)please :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'The novel non-deformed energy storage phase change material (PCM) has the unique advantage of possessing a larger energy storage capacity with faster thermal response than existing materials and could be cheaply manufactured. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/08/110802113610.htm The building material was recently awarded a patent application approval in China and patent applications are in the pipeline in other countries.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'what you think, it'll happen?  it looks good from the article'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'can be put in paint or whatever, linoleum and wallpaper'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'probably be useful in places like india where it's hot, they mention energy problems there - or anywhere where temperature has to be kept relatively constant'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'it looks promising, I wonder how much resistance there will be to it widespread usage.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'I suppose it could also be used to defeat IR sensors :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'nice one!  i never thought of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Undertaken Anaristos: 'well, there still has to be a way to bleed the excess energy otherwise the container will be just like an oven when the material saturates :)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not only is obama the first african american president of the usa, he's also the descendent of the first ever american slave -> http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-obama-related-to-legendary-virginia-slave-genealogist-says-20120730,0,3463156.story ~Chief Running Eagle'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'real or political?  quite the campaign strategy if political'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'in one place they make controversial statements regarded as racism, in another they embody racism as a conquering genaeology'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if it's only political, maybe they should question the legitimacy of the scientists who provided the double checked material to the media's credibility, and investigate their other ventures more scrutinously, possibly charging them for racketeering'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'assuming the evidence isn't how they say it is, but imagine how few scientists could ever attain it'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they won't though, they'll probably get over 10 million votes just because of people's identification with the nonexistant conditions of the past'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that and the alternative looks like a scoundrel to some people, which is most likely intelligently designed'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'maybe they should make a campaign rule that no racial influence at all can be used in a multicultural political campaign'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then they have to use more of their brain skins than their brain skin to beguile people'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'otherwise they get automatically veto'd'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, so how do you hide the fact that you're black/white/hispanic/asian, to take it out of the equation?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'hmh. why there is sports.. still. evolution has turned humans away from physical stuff, human is weak and slow by nature. why we pursue those limits.. 9.40 100m. pointless'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'oh shit. you started talking first'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and anybody who's promoting the racial qualities of a campaign member could be investigated financially to see if any link can be made between them and their subject matter's glorification'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Oh. Ok. So we should just abandon sports?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'doesn't matter what color person you are in a multicultural nation, how you gain the support of the voters does though'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'not all. just the weight lifting and running around the circle'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Well, I think I disagree. A dog or a cat couldn't beat a human being in a 400 meter race, I'd bet. They'd run out of gas too quickly. And forget something like a mile.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'but no chic is going to bed with Bolt because he runs fast..'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Actually, humans are remarkably versatile. We can run, swim, jump (which many other animals can do, of course). But we can also throw, catch, kick, do astonishing gymnastics. A baseball player has to be able to run, throw, catch, hit a ball with a bat, and show lightning reflexes. What other animal is so versatile?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'a basketball player is good when he... or she.:) can predict what happens in a few seconds'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Fleas can jump like 100 times their body length.  An ant can carry like 100 times their weight.  Humans can't come close ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm thinkin of the racism inherent, or reverse-psychological racism inherent in romney making racist remarks in the perspective of the palestinians who see jerusalem as a occupied territory to gain support of those wealthy lobbiests, in the news, and then obama is now non-'birther' the 11th generation great grandson of the first african american slave in las angeles psychological vote for me's'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'No chick is going to bed with Bolt because he runs fast? Holy shit. The man is a national hero.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'or was it 13th?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'yes, but fleas can't throw a slider.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: 'yeah. but not because he runs fast. the chics go to bet with him because he is fastest. thats a huge difference'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'two racism's in one presidential election'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i wonder if anybody keeps track unbiasedly of the count'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why mention it?  do you inherit greatness from your genetics, proof of your good leadship ability?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'not saying his election people had anything to do with it, maybe it was a independent strange study'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nah, sports figures don't need to be number 1 in the world in order to get chix'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'look at how that blood sample from the us president in britain was leered over and banned from auction'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate): Rhavage agrees with Abe.
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'They just need to make 7-8 figures a year.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'You can be a utility infielder for Seattle and be miles ahead of the average guy.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'nah, even minor league and college kids making crap get plenty of tail'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: '"get tail"? when was the official release for this?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Having your 8-figure salary public I'm sure doesn't hurt, though.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'If you walk into a bar and can say you're a major league baseball player (or nfl, nba, nhl, mls, you name it), you've got one hell of a leg up.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'Well, maybe not MLS'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Hwuaijijal: '"leg up" what is that. '
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'even MLS...just say "I work with david beckham"'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'yeah, even MLS, I'd bet. In an MLS city, at least.'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Leinei: 'I can't even name the closest mls team to me, tbh :P'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'people who feast on others because of how great they perceive others as perceiving themselves seem low to me'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'heh, only US one I can name is the galaxy, and that's just because of him...used to know some indoor soccer teams when buffalo blizzard was around'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'cult of personality isn't really isolated to north korea or russia or africa or haiti, it's everywhere, i'd wager there's not a single influencial person on earth who doesn't use a cult following to acheive his goals'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'one cult of personality points out the other's seemingly obvious methods to give themselves a superior perspective in their own cults eyes'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's kind of like magic, except it's all mental'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'american security government is now letting google, facebook and amazon write your telecommunications policy's according to the news'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you think they'll ever write one that doesn't benefit themselves and their main stockholders?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and that's great cause people like royalty in saudi arabia donate random 500 million dollars to twitters, which expels people from the olympics, silences criticism of 1.3 billion dollar broadcast rights, death-sentences people in kuwait, monitors political opponents in russia and throws people who comment their thoughts on the king of thailand into prison '
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so google and facebook and amazon are incorruptibility gospel very good and viable security choices for democratic freedom of americans'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'also gets people off of murder charges a couple times'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: '(twitter) or at least causes a mistrail cause of a straying juror, like rockin robin from jackson 5'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'whoever's running the cia must either be not very intelligent, have a master plan that's obviously appearing very totalitarianly 'upper echelon' fbi style corrupt but is actually good in disguise, or else working for a foreign government, possibly linked to the cold war or world war 2'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that's how it looks to me, far too many unanswered questions and isolated incidents'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and trends, weighed against what's known'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'everybody already knows that after google and amazon and facebook become the new government, there'll be computer glitches of mass destruction, dictatorship not unlike saudi arabia and various other things '
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'but they sit back and accept that there's nowhere to hide, so it's best to hope their name isn't pulled out of the hat for the next holocaust'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'they already know they will be that, they always get their way'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'it's like god, unchanging forever, evil is the eventual outcome of any political organization'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Rhavage: 'Yer a ray of sunshine ;)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'silly chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'google and facebook are both NSA fronts, silly boy'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'looks like they might use the excuse of al-CIAda in Syria to put boots on the ground there'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'funny, since western powers sent them there'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'moscow's offering asylum to it's leader, so it doesn't sound like they're going to do a ww3 yet'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'from the news'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.rand.org/blog/2012/07/al-qaedas-war-for-syria.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/04/18/syria-united-states-backing-wikileaks.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://wikileaks.org/gifiles/docs/1671459_insight-military-intervention-in-syria-post-withdrawal.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i'm not so sure that the new people will be any better than the old people in charge there'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'so i don't see what they're fighting about if that's the case, except who gets to have all the corrupt fun'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if they are corrupt like they say'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/8917265/Libyas-new-rulers-offer-weapons-to-Syrian-rebels.html'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'hopefully if they do get replaced like in libya, they go ahead and make things less oppressive, since that's what they claimed to be fighting over'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'isn't it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'there's a murky web of CIA being involved in venture capital in silicon valley, they helped set up google and facebook, chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and are certainly in bed with them'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'ok, so it's basically communism disguised as capitalism'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yep'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'power hungry evil maniacs, nogs'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'when some corporation always gets their way, something odd's going on'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'did you hear about the scraping exercise google did with their camera cars?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i didn't look into it much, but i remember hearing of them illegally obtaining data from compromised personal wifi networks'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that and about facebook allowing bots to socially engineer their way into people's friend list and collect data, not informing the deceived that they were deceived afterwards'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well facebook you get banned/barred for the slighest political infraction, but paedophile rings thrive on there for ages despite being reported'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'of course, they wouldn'te ven have to go to that length to watch whatever they want on there, but it was a 3rd party government/education that did it'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'a high-up figure in the NSA once said something like "We don't need to spy on people anymore. Since Google and Facebook, people provide us all the information willingly"'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which is entirely true, people blurt their whole lives onto facebook'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i like the days of the search warrant, having pre-approved warrants of being so special isn't very useful, like their detainment without any trial or scrutiny by a jury of 'terror suspects''
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if a person is a terror suspect, a group of random non-terrorist civilians could listen to the sane-evidence and judge for themselves the legitimacy of detention, couldn't they?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and of course, you're a terror suspect now if you pay for things in cash'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'why make a measure about that process being skipped?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or if you're a constitutionalist'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or if you're a veteren'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i'm a terrorist because i speak out against the government'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'you're a terrorist because you study conspiracy theory'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how does it make you feel to know that you're a terrorist, or didn't you know?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'yeah that's true, i don't have anything to hide about mine, i'll confess it before whoever and they can confess theirs when comparing relative evils'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'don't be silly, governments don't have anything to confess'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't use facebook though, only places ic ommunicate online are like this and chat rooms'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they never did anything wrong, slightly shady, manipulative, evil, or illegal'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and you're a maniac if you say otherwise'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(and you'd need to provide sources)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(sources I like, else i'll call them unsourced or conspiracy theories)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'just think, if you were spanish or greek, there'd be a 1 in 4 chance that you'd have the rest of the week off work'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i bet those folks who're off work there are thankful that their governments colluded with the banks to totally fuck their country up'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the definition of terror exceeds 9/11, but if they want to accuse me of being a radical islamic psychopath then i'd like to see their evidence'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not every day that corporations will go out of their way to screw people over in such a fashion'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'considering scary things, like the directors of the movie 'the killing room' on superchannel'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'fictional or has a grain of reality in it?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i haven't hurt a single person in over 8 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'ok, well here's an interesting one for you, this should tell you just who the radical islamist is'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'if that's terrorist then what isn't?  i don't run a cult either'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}You debate: 'well, it is every day that they'll go that far out of their way, it's just not every day that they're sooooo successful at it'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=0wwv9l6W8yc'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'watch that, very short'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'and tell me what that implies'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'apparently a whole bunch of people in Gdansk in Poland welcomed Mitt Romney's visit with banners saying "Polish Choice - Ron Paul Konres Nowej Prawicy" '
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'wonder how late the GOP will realise they're backing the wrong man'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '(of course, they don't actually care, they've got THEIR man)'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'threats against someone or criticism of a certain proven fraction of the religion they belong to?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'freedom of thought limited, i think it's strange that he's afraid to outright lie and say yes, maybe that's planned'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'we already have those laws in the UK, you can't speak bad of religion'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or the state'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'or anything, really'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'not publicly, anyway'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'united nations did that mandate thanks to islamic lobbiests, why do free people think limiting their freedom is ok?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'from what i remember'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'UN don't give a flying shit'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'UN is just world police'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'then there's the allegory of gettin circumcised to sojourn in israel to their god pact, and austria's asking muslims to obey it's laws before their own religion's laws'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'they're communist and interested in police states, just the same'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'that got scoffed by a whole bunch of people, and why?  they don't scoff at the bible'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'the presentation maybe was all that made it undesireable, maybe they could apply it to all religions'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'where there is a conflict between religious law and sovereign law, sovereign law must win out'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'should apply to all religions, really'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i guess it affects Islam more because of the factions of it that interpret sharia law that way'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'world police state is maybe sort of like china and russia which are 2 of it's permanent members, france is pretty stingy too'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'and britain's the other, and like you say '
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'well it was founded by Nazi's, so what do you expect?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'of it's security council'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'nazi's and communists'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'World Police State is NWO baby'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you'll find that the west didn't win the war'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'my favourite thing about the UN is the UN decleration on human rights'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'which comes quite highly ranked on the "declerations that aren't worth the paper they're written on" high score table'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'reading on aljazeera that east german stasi, which was communist occupied post-ww2 cold war germany police, took over it's government after the cold war is a indication of that'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Article 29 section 3: These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the UN'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i don't see no good guys in the world, only relative evil's and have something to hide, but it seems that america would have been usurped before ww2 if they went on to defend their enemy for the next 60 years'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the purpose of the UN is to centralise all, in deed, or control of all world resources and power'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Bush family funded the Third Reich'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'it started earlier than ww2, chemosh'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'Prescott wasn't it, DosseT?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'We absorbed all the Nazis in Operation Paperclip - gave them all succor'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'correct'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Renamed Mengele, who did the MK-ULTRA programming on concentration camp victims'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'They perfected it, and now they use it to pump out mind-controlled celebrities and Manchurian Candidates to drive terror into the people'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i think you should stop ranting like a conspiracy theorist, Dosset, and go watch some TV'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'joint Coney 2012 or something'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'maybe watch some intellectually stimulating soap operas that will teach you family values and how worthless you are as a human being'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'lol Coney 2012, just watched some youtube vids'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'i've got to get a light replaced in my car tomorrow, but i'll pay cash, so no doubt that'll cause a flag on mi5's books'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Ain't no theory - all conspiracy'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'although, it's ironic that the public is turning off from the Kardashians'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'the osbournes was worth seeing for an insight into their lives, but most of the rest of that sort of genre is rubbish'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Don't really follow it, but heard that the son is terminal, and the daughter did a turn-around'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: '"television personality and socialite", meaning "media programmed eye-candy with no discernible talent"'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Yea, but their main target, females, don't really care'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'you ever wonder how they get all of those people together to do their humuliating media content? is that normal?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: '$$$'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Chemosh: 'i do, i think of north korean art school as one allegory'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Anyone from England?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'yes sir, why?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'Dat Olympics'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'how is it'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'how is it what?'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'in general'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'dunno, it's down in the capital'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) DosseT: 'other than the fact that noone here can re-watch the occult opening ceremony'
T3/r7/2012-07-31.txt.gz:{chan ch=debate}(Debate) Tigernuts: 'was crap, nogs'